Just how important is Free Speech?

[kellersphuket]

7 minutes ago, soalbundy said:

China has advanced a lot in 30 years

Debatable.

 

If you call not being able to speak your mind openly, being denied access to social media, not having the right to vote for who you want to govern and being watched from all angels 'advanced' then yeah, I guess you are right.

Edited August 29, 2019 by kellersphuket

[soalbundy]

Just now, kellersphuket said:

Debatable.

 

If you call not being able to speak your mind openly, being denied access to social media, not having the right to vote for who you want to govern and being watched from all angels 'advanced' then yeah, I guess you are right.

Well I don't vote anyway, social media is mostly childish <deleted>, and in London they have almost as many CCTV's as people. The Chinese seem happy enough to me and they are free to travel abroad.

[Chazar]

57 minutes ago, kellersphuket said:

Neither was the "N" word considered offensive till about 40 years ago.

Ah but its  ok to say it  if  your'e  black, Ali G was  always hysterical.

[Memento Mori]

2 minutes ago, kellersphuket said:

Debatable.

 

Not debatable. Chinese people have more money to spend than they ever had. Lots of Chinese inlanders visit Thailand. More freedom than ever for our Chinese brothers and sisters, also on the internet. In the end it's about money and comparing China with the European or American way of living is unfair. A little bit of knowledge about Chinese history won't hurt. 

[kellersphuket]

1 minute ago, Memento Mori said:

Not debatable. Chinese people have more money to spend than they ever had. 

It's not all about money, you know.

[Chazar]

30 minutes ago, Memento Mori said:

Wow, You Americans are still obsessed with the word <deleted>. Being Dutch that's a word from ancient times

Its  not that ancient, I can remember 20  years ago a 95  year  old customer of  mine stating they wanted the  colour "<deleted>  Brown"

I see the THAI VISA swearometer  wont even allow me to say that, great example of pc  world  gone mad

Edited August 29, 2019 by Chazar

[Memento Mori]

1 minute ago, kellersphuket said:

It's not all about money, you know.

So if it's not all about money where is it about?

[JamesBlond]

Don't know if anyone has mentioned Singapore so far. Very little FoS there, but as with China nowadays, the people are in a narcotic haze of consumerism - the true opium of the people. Give them enough stuff and it will keep them quiet. They don't even have to think. Their smartphones do the thinking for them.

 

Free speech has no competitive advantage in a society that doesn't want to think. If you have ever tried to have a conversation with a Singaporean, you will know what I mean.

With Hong Kong, I suspect the uprising is fuelled by subconscious resentment that they have actually fallen behind China in living standards. They are still living in rabbit hutches. Must be very frustrating for Hong Kongers to see their free-speech values being out-competed by fascist conformity.

 

 

[kellersphuket]

16 minutes ago, Memento Mori said:

So if it's not all about money where is it about?

Free speech.

 

See the title of the topic.

[Memento Mori]

2 minutes ago, kellersphuket said:

Free speech.

 

See the title of the topic.

Read my contributions on that that subject in this thread. A good thread bye the way.

[NoshowJones]

5 hours ago, Thomas J said:

I am not sure which is worse.  The people in the USA particularly in California that are intent on destroying the country that those in WWII fought to protect by allowing it to be consumed by every third world migrant who wishes to come in, Great Britain whose boys died on the beaches of Normandy and Dunkirk to save it from the Germans but voluntarily gives the country away to those who desire Sharia Law or for that matter Germany who fought for the fatherland but now an astounding 25% of its population is foreign born.  I commend the Thai's for their laws to protect their culture.   

Your last sentence, so do I, but they have to understand that us retirees and also tourists are human beings and not criminals, and we should not be treated as such with reporting whether it's every 90 days or the TM30 nonsense.

[NoshowJones]

5 hours ago, OneMoreFarang said:

But how about politicians who complexly ignore scientific evidence?

When i.e. some people want that kids learn in school that some old guy with a white beard created earth and everything on earth about 6,000 years ago.

It's crazy, and all evidence is against it, but so called authorities are still allowed to publish such BS ideas.

And lots of people still believe that if the authorities say something then it must be true...

Your last paragraph, are you not one of these people? Going by your posts I get the impression that you are in agreement with all this reporting for TMs etc. If I have got it wrong then I apologise.

[rumak]

6 hours ago, kellersphuket said:

Funnily enough I don't feel for you.

My heart goes out to the young kids of tomorrow growing up in a society where speaking your mind has restrictions and is generally frowned upon.

how can thailand advance without free speech?

just look at China.

IMFO    (in my free opinion)   you are the classic case of Farang " think too much".

The people on this forum that are not bothered as you are about the many questions of the universe are

most likely engaged in activities they enjoy and do not  "think to mutt"  about what society is up to.

I do suggest that people like you that have shelter and food without slaving away just to exist should wake up every day and thank whatever lord you believe in.   You truly are one lucky Dude 

Edited August 29, 2019 by rumak

[kellersphuket]

2 minutes ago, rumak said:

I do suggest that people like you that have shelter and food without slaving away just to exist should wake up every day and thank whatever lord you believe in.   You truly are one lucky Dude 

Maybe it is due to the fact that I don't thank any lord that I have all what I have today.

I certainly didn't get it all by praying, that's for sure.

[cmsally]

1 hour ago, soalbundy said:

Well I don't vote anyway, social media is mostly childish <deleted>, and in London they have almost as many CCTV's as people. The Chinese seem happy enough to me and they are free to travel abroad.

Are you sure about that ??

China bans 23m discredited citizens from buying travel tickets

[rumak]

1 minute ago, kellersphuket said:

Maybe it is due to the fact that I don't thank any lord that I have all what I have today.

I certainly didn't get it all by praying, that's for sure.

you take things too literally.   lighten up .  oh,  never mind.  Just be whoever the good lord intended you to be   55555

 

[rumak]

3 hours ago, poohy said:

IMHO

Thailand and a forum hosted in Thailand wishing not to offend its hosts and protect itself fiscally Is not the best place for free speech

well now.....we definitely are free to talk about free speech on this forum !  Just gotta watch what you say......

Edited August 29, 2019 by rumak

[grollies]

7 hours ago, CharlieH said:

If its so important to you, why do you choose to live and participate in a country where you have restrictions, cant vote, and have no say whatsoever ?

Well yes, but 'free speech' isn't just defined by what you can or cannot say/do in Thailand on a daily basis. Try expressing your views online on any form of social media and if it doesn't conform to the national LGBGT, racial, religious or any other doctrine you'll soon find yourself banned, moderated or (especially if you are posting from the UK) prosecuted. I don't know what it is like in the USA but in the UK there is less FoS than Thailand, or so it seems. This is pertinent to another thread on Cultural Marxism where one poster aggressively attacked the OP and those who agreed with him as 'White Supremicists' without acknowledging everyone is entitled to their own point of view, however much he disagreed with it. This is how 'Free Speech' is curtailed in an illiberal society by labelling people racist, homophobic, anti-Islamic, et al and is anti democratic and opressive in the extreme.   Free speech is an illusion, controlled by the leftist elite and heavily regulated.

 

EG: A bakery in the UK was prosecuted for not taking a commission to bake a Sesame Street Bert & Ernie cake for a 'gay couple' as it went against their (Christian) religious beliefs. The 'couple' actually didn't want a cake, they were just pushing their agenda.

 

Personally, I'd love to see a gay Muslim trying to obtain the right to worship in any mosque in the UK and taking it to court.

 

Free Speech in the west is dead and buried.

Edited August 29, 2019 by grollies
spelling

[IraqRon]

7 hours ago, NCC1701A said:

it must be REALLY hard coming from Tennessee.

I am from California and it is a cesspool of Marxist Communists that hate America.

My father killed Nazis by the truck load in WWII so that I could be free.

 

 

If you think that places like Tennessee, really all the se Usa support free speech, then I suspect that N.Korea does also in your eyes.  Only if you speak and act like they do are you allowed to speak freely.

[OneMoreFarang]

1 hour ago, possum1931 said:

Your last paragraph, are you not one of these people? Going by your posts I get the impression that you are in agreement with all this reporting for TMs etc. If I have got it wrong then I apologise.

I accept reality. And in Thailand reality is that we have to report every 90 days and other regulations. It does not matter if I or anybody of us likes it and it does not matter if any of these regulations make sense. I think we have to accept them and we have to live with them. For me this means doing what has to be done and that's it.

 

Coming back to free speech: Sure, we could complain about these regulations. But what's the point? It's like complaining about the weather. The weather doesn't care and it won't change even if we would all complain. So yes, we can complain, if we want all day, but it won't change anything. So I won't waste my energy on complaining - even if I agree with you that many of these regulations don't make sense.

[Berkshire]

2 hours ago, cmsally said:

I think Farang actually means white person to a Thai, as in white European. Thais generally don't assign much interest to colour unless it goes to the very dark end of the scale. Colour is not discussed in the same way as in the west and that is probably because the local population has both very light and dark. It could never be perceived the same way as in the west.

I just said that farang means Caucasian to the Thais.  In the west, we also refer to Caucasians as white people, but the Thais don't.  Are you agreeing with me?  Because I agree that the Thais don't look at skin color in the same way as westerners. 

[emptypockets]

8 hours ago, kellersphuket said:

That is exactly what free speech means.

If it offends people then that's too bad.

Go check out the emoticon thread. People are stressing over a laughing, confused or smiley sticker in response to their post and calling for Big brother to take action. Jesus Christ!. The worlds gone mad. This artificial reality, social media, has become reality for many people. And the media, especially politicians are milking it for all it's worth.

Some girl with silicone breasts now becomes an 'influencer'...what's that all about??

Mass communication has allowed the looneys to take over our lives. Not only speech but everyday interactions.

Open a car door for a female work colleague! Practically sexual assault these days. Compliment her on her look - scream rape!!!

[kellersphuket]

10 minutes ago, emptypockets said:

Go check out the emoticon thread. People are stressing over a laughing, confused or smiley sticker in response to their post and calling for Big brother to take action. Jesus Christ!. The worlds gone mad. This artificial reality, social media, has become reality for many people. And the media, especially politicians are milking it for all it's worth.

Some girl with silicone breasts now becomes an 'influencer'...what's that all about??

Mass communication has allowed the looneys to take over our lives. Not only speech but everyday interactions.

Open a car door for a female work colleague! Practically sexual assault these days. Compliment her on her look - scream rape!!!

It's a mess for sure..

I saw that thread, I get confused and crying emojis on my posts all the time.

 

Doesn't bother me one bit (it is their right to do so!)

Edited August 29, 2019 by kellersphuket

[NoshowJones]

3 hours ago, OneMoreFarang said:

I accept reality. And in Thailand reality is that we have to report every 90 days and other regulations. It does not matter if I or anybody of us likes it and it does not matter if any of these regulations make sense. I think we have to accept them and we have to live with them. For me this means doing what has to be done and that's it.

 

Coming back to free speech: Sure, we could complain about these regulations. But what's the point? It's like complaining about the weather. The weather doesn't care and it won't change even if we would all complain. So yes, we can complain, if we want all day, but it won't change anything. So I won't waste my energy on complaining - even if I agree with you that many of these regulations don't make sense.

I take your point, and you are right, we can't change anything, but speaking for myself, if I don't like anybodys rules, I will try to find a way around them.

[Chazar]

8 hours ago, OneMoreFarang said:

The weather doesn't care and it won't change

oh but it is, check any global warming site and we did it "apparently"

[Chazar]

6 hours ago, kellersphuket said:

It's a mess for sure..

I saw that thread, I get confused and crying emojis on my posts all the time.

 

Doesn't bother me one bit (it is their right to do so!)

I take deep offence at it not  bothering you????????????????????????????????????????

[simon43]

Some girl with silicone breasts now becomes an 'influencer'...what's that all about??

 

Yep, pretty disgusting really...

 

You don't happen to have a link to this 'influencer' do you? ????

[ukrules]

There's no such thing as free speech, even in places where they pretend there is.

 

[amykat]

12 hours ago, JamesBlond said:

You're rather wrong about all of this. It's not called politically correct for nothing. It's social competition. It's the meek's way of controlling the strong by simply not allowing certain ideas to be expressed - and the number of things deemed 'offensive' is growing as victimhood is increasingly being used for social manipulation. I can see this trend taking hold of society day by day on the mainstream media. Maybe it salves the nerves of society's weakest, but it is dragging everyone in society down to their level of weakness, and it's creating an atmosphere of terror (the word is not too strong).

 

And those who criticize political correctness are, by definition, those who will not take offence so easily. You can say what you like about me, I will not be offended or 'hurt'. I'm not so insecure.

Can you give me an example of this please?  When I think of PC language I think of not calling gays fags, and other things, not calling grown woman at work, girls, blacks, the N word, etc ...how does that drag down and socially manipulate you unless you are an <deleted>???  I need an example ...thank you.

[amykat]

Wait, all society’s rules are a form of social manipulation you could argue.  So are you feeling that some years ago, all white males, who were mostly heterosexual I suppose, were in charge of the rules, and now they are not as much ....so you are now being manipulated instead of being the manipulator??

 

You were the strong and you feel we weaker people got control but we don’t deserve this respect because we are weaker?  So that dragged you down?  Are you now in the victimhood area?  But you don’t like it there?  Hmm I wonder if other people like it there?  You don’t want people to control you right?  I wonder if anyone else ever felt that way ...or only you??