UK's Johnson again bids for snap poll as Brexit delay bill to become law

[tebee]

9 hours ago, PerkinsCuthbert said:

Here's one take on how:

https://www.zerohedge.com/news/2019-09-08/did-boris-johnson-just-rope-dope-his-way-hard-brexit

Bit late for that seeing as how she has already given it royal assent.

 

[AlexRich]

Johnson attempted to con colleagues into believing he was serious about obtaining a deal and gaming Parliament by prorogation in order to force through a no deal Brexit. It backfired on him, he’s lost his majority and he is no longer in charge. It’s not a cunning plan, it’s a major strategic error. 

[soalbundy]

He is going to play the court jester to the end

[webfact]

UPDATE:

 

UK lawmakers reject PM Johnson's request to hold an early election

 

Britain's Prime Minister Boris Johnson is seen after Britain's parliament voted on whether to hold an early general election, in Parliament in London, Britain, September 10, 2019, in this still image taken from Parliament TV footage. Parliament TV via REUTERS

 

LONDON (Reuters) - Britain's parliament on Tuesday rejected Prime Minister Boris Johnson's call for a national parliamentary election, voting against the government's request for a national ballot.

 

Full story: https://forum.thaivisa.com/topic/1122642-uk-lawmakers-reject-pm-johnsons-request-to-hold-an-early-election/

 

[kamahele]

Crash and burn? It's funny when I hear or see people referring to those opposed to Boris Johnson as the "elites". You don't get much more elite than Boris Johnson unless of course you are a royal.... Trump supporters say the same of those opposed to Trump who was born into a wealthy family, went to all private schools and was gifted almost a half a billion dollars by his dad.

[TopDeadSenter]

4 minutes ago, kamahele said:

Crash and burn? It's funny when I hear or see people referring to those opposed to Boris Johnson as the "elites". You don't get much more elite than Boris Johnson unless of course you are a royal.... Trump supporters say the same of those opposed to Trump who was born into a wealthy family, went to all private schools and was gifted almost a half a billion dollars by his dad.

They call them elites both in the UK and the USA because of their arrogance in insisting they "know better" than the electorate. It is a concept having nothing to do with how much money in the bank account or eating caviar etc. Trump and Johnson are trying to implement the express wishes of the public/voters. That makes them men of the people. Labour/democrats consider voters uneducated fools and smugly consider their own opinions superior - hence why they are called elites.

[nauseus]

5 hours ago, Victornoir said:

One more reason to speed up your departure.
We Europeans, want a common defense.

Good. Don't shoot your own foot off then.

[nauseus]

3 minutes ago, Victornoir said:

No risk.
Nobody wants to imitate you in what is and will remain for a long time the most stupid vote of our contemporary history.

Within the UK, you can see by the referendum result that that statement/guess is untrue.

 

Within the EU, well we will see in a few years.

[Nigel Garvie]

41 minutes ago, nauseus said:

Within the UK, you can see by the referendum result that that statement/guess is untrue.

 

Within the EU, well we will see in a few years.

 

47 minutes ago, Victornoir said:

No risk.
Nobody wants to imitate you in what is and will remain for a long time the most stupid vote of our contemporary history.

Logic failure alert. You cannot possibly see from the referendum result whether it was "the most stupid vote of our contemporary history" or not. Only further down the line when the results are clear to all will you see that.

It could just be that a vast number of stupid people voted for it. I'm not saying they were stupid, only saying, that is another logical explanation.

[nauseus]

4 minutes ago, Nigel Garvie said:

 

Logic failure alert. You cannot possibly see from the referendum result whether it was "the most stupid vote of our contemporary history" or not. Only further down the line when the results are clear to all will you see that.

It could just be that a vast number of stupid people voted for it. I'm not saying they were stupid, only saying, that is another logical explanation.

Yes you are. Of course you are. Same old remainer line and insult. 

[billd766]

16 hours ago, tomacht8 said:

What is so bad about a common European army? Could help prevent wars on European soil between European countries. Would also save a lot on costs and bring more efficiency. Europe must secure its borders externally. After all, the Frontex project is already a start.

 

 

A nice idea but how to carry it out?

 

What language will be standard throughout the (unified) command structure?

Are all the participating countries using the same standard of equipment?

Are they all trained to the same standard?

Who will be in overall command, and same for the deputies?

Does the unified command rotate between the countries and for how long?

What happens if 1 or more countries decide that they need their own military back for a period of time to do a specific job?

 

And that is just for starters

It won't save any costs at all and it will be less efficient that it is now.

 

[soalbundy]

17 hours ago, billd766 said:

All the time that some 650 elected people called parliament keeps faffing about the more it costs the UK. Being elected as an MP does not give them super powers and it really doesn't matter if they think it does.

 

They were elected by, and are paid for the people of the UK to represent those people, but most of them should be charged with dereliction of duty and taking money under false pretenses. 

 

For a couple of years the opposition have been shouting and ranting for an election and now Boris has offered them one.

 

Do they want it, will they take it now?

 

Not a fracking chance because, if they did, many of them would not be returning to the cushy life they have now.

Not just to represent but also to lead otherwise all their highly paid and highly skilled experts who guide their decisions are for nothing if you are just going to listen to the experts in strong ale.

[Baerboxer]

7 hours ago, Victornoir said:

One more reason to speed up your departure.
We Europeans, want a common defense.

 

No. Most seemingly want someone else to defend them and pay the bill, in monetary and human lives when necessary.

 

Now the US is pushing them to pay their way they all clamor to support the federalists dream of a federated EU state with its own military.

 

Gonna be some lovely arguments about who commands, whose equipment is used, whose military traditions are absorbed etc etc. 

 

 

[soalbundy]

Just now, Baerboxer said:

 

No. Most seemingly want someone else to defend them and pay the bill, in monetary and human lives when necessary.

 

Now the US is pushing them to pay their way they all clamor to support the federalists dream of a federated EU state with its own military.

 

Gonna be some lovely arguments about who commands, whose equipment is used, whose military traditions are absorbed etc etc. 

 

 

Well Trump has shown us that we can't rely on the Americans, 'Johnny come lately' will be even more sluggish than than last time.

[evadgib]

13 hours ago, evadgib said:

Bercow will stand down on or before 31 October.

Good riddance!

Someone's nicking my line ????

 

[sawadee1947]

21 hours ago, snoop1130 said:

Johnson said he was bringing ideas on ways to resolve the Irish border backstop but that

Unfortunately he didn't explain his ideas, so I suppose there aren't any but staying as PM. 

The only truth comes out of his mouth when telling his name. ????

[Caldera]

Lock him up.

[natway09]

What he wants to say is

"I actually have no idea what I am doing nor any idea on achieving a deal"

Suggest he go talk with May or is she having a well deserved rest.

 

[billd766]

17 hours ago, Basil B said:

Motion: Mandating the government to publish documents relating to Prorogation and Operation Yellow Hammer.

 

Passed 311 to 302...

 

Another kick in the goolies for BoJo

And an even bigger and more expensive one for the UK.

 

Investors and business don't like uncertainty which is why the UK under the stupid MPs who voted it down don't seem to think past the end of their noses.

 

Every day that there is a delay costs the UK money, taxpayers money at that, and while those 650, overpaid, self important windbags keep acting like kindergarten children and ignoring the wishes of their constituents, (who they consider as unimportant oiks) there is little hope that the UK, EU and Brexit will ever be concluded.

 

The only ray of sunshine is that come the next general election there will be a major clear out of ALL the political parties with new, younger and far more intelligent people will replace these mindless morons who are masquerading as "The Peoples Representatives". Who are taking their very large salaries and equally large expense accounts as well as taking the p1ss.

 

I am sorry about this rant but I felt it needed saying.

 

A quote from Oliver Cromwell on 20th April 1653 (which I believe applies today).

 

"It is high time for me to put an end to your sitting in this place, which you have dishonoured by your contempt of all virtue, and defiled by your practice of every vice; ye are a factious crew, and enemies to all good government; ye are a pack of mercenary wretches, and would like Esau sell your country for a mess of pottage, and like Judas betray your God for a few pieces of money.

Is there a single virtue now remaining amongst you? Is there one vice you do not possess? Ye have no more religion than my horse; gold is your God; which of you have not barter'd your conscience for bribes? Is there a man amongst you that has the least care for the good of the Commonwealth?

Ye sordid prostitutes have you not defil'd this sacred place, and turn'd the Lord's temple into a den of thieves, by your immoral principles and wicked practices? Ye are grown intolerably odious to the whole nation; you were deputed here by the people to get grievances redress'd, are yourselves gone! So! Take away that shining bauble there, and lock up the doors. In the name of God, go!"

Edited September 10, 2019 by billd766
edited for bad spelling after I had posted, again.

[SheungWan]

And an even bigger and more expensive one for the UK.
 
Investors and business don't like uncertainty which is why the UK under the stupid MPs who voted it down don't seem to think past the end of their noses.
 
Every day that there is a delay costs the UK money, taxpayers money at that, and while those 650, overpaid, self important windbags keep acting like kindergarten children and ignoring the wishes of their constituents, (who they consider as unimportant oiks) there is little hope that the UK, EU and Brexit will ever be concluded.
 
The only ray of sunshine is that come the next general election there will be a major clear out of ALL the political parties with new, younger and far more intelligent people will replace these mindless morons who are masquerading as "The Peoples Representatives". Who are taking their very large salaries and equally large expense accounts as well as taking the p1ss.
 
I am sorry about this rant but I felt it needed saying.
 
A quote from Oliver Cromwell on 20th April 1653 (which I believe applies today.
 
"It is high time for me to put an end to your sitting in this place, which you have dishonoured by your contempt of all virtue, and defiled by your practice of every vice; ye are a factious crew, and enemies to all good government; ye are a pack of mercenary wretches, and would like Esau sell your country for a mess of pottage, and like Judas betray your God for a few pieces of money.
Is there a single virtue now remaining amongst you? Is there one vice you do not possess? Ye have no more religion than my horse; gold is your God; which of you have not barter'd your conscience for bribes? Is there a man amongst you that has the least care for the good of the Commonwealth?
Ye sordid prostitutes have you not defil'd this sacred place, and turn'd the Lord's temple into a den of thieves, by your immoral principles and wicked practices? Ye are grown intolerably odious to the whole nation; you were deputed here by the people to get grievances redress'd, are yourselves gone! So! Take away that shining bauble there, and lock up the doors. In the name of God, go!"

"Sordid prostitutes" Is he playing to the expat crowd?

Sent from my SM-N935F using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app

[puipuitom]

On 9/9/2019 at 12:13 PM, snoop1130 said:

Johnson: I want a Brexit deal but parliament doesn't daunt me

 

Britain's Prime Minister Boris Johnson gestures as he speaks next to Ireland's Prime Minister (Taoiseach) Leo Varadkar (not pictured) in Dublin, Ireland, September 9, 2019. REUTERS/Phil Noble

 

DUBLIN (Reuters) - British Prime Minister Boris Johnson said on Monday he wanted a Brexit deal on Oct. 18 and that he was undaunted by attempts by parliament to block a no-deal exit.

 

“I’m absolutely undaunted by whatever may take place in parliament,” Johnson said. “I think what the British people want us to do is to deliver a deal and to get on and take us out on Oct. 31.”

 

Speaking in Ireland alongside Irish Prime Minister Leo Varadkar, Johnson said he was bringing ideas on ways to resolve the Irish border backstop but that a breakthrough was unlikely on Monday.

 

“I have one message that I want to land with you today, Leo, that is I want to find a deal, I want to get a deal,” Johnson said. “Like you I’ve looked carefully at no-deal, I’ve assessed its consequences both for our country and yours.”

 

“And yes, of course, we could do it, the UK could certainly get through it but be in no doubt that outcome would be a failure of statecraft for which we would all be responsible,” Johnson said.

 

“So for the sake of business, for farmers, and millions of ordinary people who are counting on us to use our imagination and creativity to get this done. I want you to know I would overwhelmingly prefer to find an agreement.”

 

-- © Copyright Reuters 2019-09-09

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So.. present YOUR ideas of a correct deal, especially an open border between N and S Ireland. Till now, nobody heard anything. pfiffle wiffle, pfaffle waffle… 

[puipuitom]

On 9/9/2019 at 1:01 PM, billd766 said:

All the time that some 650 elected people called parliament keeps faffing about the more it costs the UK. Being elected as an MP does not give them super powers and it really doesn't matter if they think it does.

 

They were elected by, and are paid for the people of the UK to represent those people, but most of them should be charged with dereliction of duty and taking money under false pretenses. 

 

For a couple of years the opposition have been shouting and ranting for an election and now Boris has offered them one.

 

Do they want it, will they take it now?

 

Not a fracking chance because, if they did, many of them would not be returning to the cushy life they have now.

So, for what "Leave" the British voted for with an overwhelming and landslide majority of 51,88% ? ( and 48,11 % for only ONE alternative: "REMAIN" )

A Brexit with no deal, a Boris Cummings deal -whatever that might be - , a May deal, a CEPA ( Canada) deal, a Norway deal, a Swiss deal, or … 

Do all understand and accept the consequenses like import duty of British products into the EU according WTO rules = for instance 10% on cars, but a LOT higher for agricultural products like confectionaly, meat etc.

The only thing I gave seen is a 350 mln pounds a week for the NHS ( = 18,2Bn, while the NET UK contribution to the EU  is less than 7,9 Bn, so inclusive all what is done now together, in my - food - field: EFSA, RASFF.

[puipuitom]

On 9/9/2019 at 3:12 PM, welovesundaysatspace said:

What is so bad about a common European army?

Nothing is bad about it, they’re just clutching straws while at the same time enjoying NATO. 

Why to be dependant of a guy in a White House in Washington DC- USA ?

Time Europe ( with or without the English) is able to defend itsself.

Remember Bosnia/Kosovo: the Europeans were able to nothing. Needed the Yanks for everything. 

[puipuitom]

21 hours ago, nauseus said:

An EU army will give military control to the EU over its peoples. It won't have the capability to challenge any existing superpower. You are so blinkered! Why should the UK hand over years of capability, investment and expertise to the EU? This is the prime reason to leave! 

Which expertise the EU member states do not have yet, but will need ? 

[puipuitom]

21 hours ago, Loiner said:

What’s so bad about an EU army? Guess you think your offspring would be safely at the back somewhere.
Theres always the strong possibility that they would be pushing British regiments to the front of any EU manufactured dispute with Russia or anybody else.

When the British are a member of a - by far not existing European army - yes.. just like the Portugese, Spanish, Italian, Maltese, Danish etc regiments.

Same when the Argentines want to repeat to get the Malvinas/Falklands again, as the Royal Navy now by far does not have the capacity of then, so French, German, Italian, Dutch etc naval ships have to join.

This medal also has two sides.

[puipuitom]

11 hours ago, nauseus said:

Within the UK, you can see by the referendum result that that statement/guess is untrue.

Within the EU, well we will see in a few years.

Yes, an English delegation on horseback -as cars they cannot afford anymore - knocking at the EU and begging to be associate member again

[puipuitom]

9 hours ago, billd766 said:

A nice idea but how to carry it out?

 

What will be standard throughout the (unified) command structure?

Are all the participating countries using the same standard of equipment?

Are they all trained to the same standard?

Who will be in overall command, and same for the deputies?

Does the unified command rotate between the countries and for how long?

What happens if 1 or more countries decide that they need their own military back for a period of time to do a specific job?

 

And that is just for starters

It won't save any costs at all and it will be less efficient that it is now.

 

language : German. Worked the last time also.

[Scott]

Troll post removed.

 

[puipuitom]

12 hours ago, Baerboxer said:

 

No. Most seemingly want someone else to defend them and pay the bill, in monetary and human lives when necessary.

 

Now the US is pushing them to pay their way they all clamor to support the federalists dream of a federated EU state with its own military.

 

Gonna be some lovely arguments about who commands, whose equipment is used, whose military traditions are absorbed etc etc. 

I agree, it's a big shame the most powerful economic block in the world has no military muscles at all.

But questions like: who commands, whose equipment is used, whose military traditions are absorbed.. are already since the start of NATO. Slowly but surely there is more and more cooperation.

When we finally can get rid of the British this will develop a lot faster.

 

[beautifulthailand99]

Farage quoting Peston and alleged inside no 10 tittle tattle that Johnson preparing to abandon DUP and ERG for a tweaked May WA2 to fulfil his promise. I'll buy that BRINO. Will be a big pound surge if he got that through by the deadline. You No Deal nutters will have to vote Brexit Party then and let Corbyn in !

 

https://www.itv.com/news/2019-09-10/will-boris-johnson-end-up-dumping-the-erg-and-dup-asks-robert-peston/

 

Edited September 10, 2019 by beautifulthailand99