Biden clashes with Warren, Sanders on healthcare in Democratic 2020 debate

[webfact]

Biden clashes with Warren, Sanders on healthcare in Democratic 2020 debate

By Tim Reid and Joseph Ax

 

Senator Bernie Sanders, former Vice President Joe Biden and Senator Elizabeth Warren debate during the 2020 Democratic U.S. presidential debate in Houston, Texas, U.S. September 12, 2019. REUTERS/Mike Blake

 

HOUSTON (Reuters) - Democratic presidential front-runner Joe Biden clashed with progressive challengers Elizabeth Warren and Bernie Sanders on healthcare in a debate on Thursday, defending Obamacare and accusing them of not being honest about the cost of their plans.

 

Biden, who served as vice president for eight years under Barack Obama, said he would build on Obama's landmark healthcare law and accused Warren and Sanders of wanting to tear it down with their support for Medicare for All, a government-run healthcare plan that would eliminate private insurance.

 

"I know that the senator says she's for Bernie. Well I'm for Barack. I think Obamacare worked," Biden said. "This is about candour, honesty, big ideas."

 

Warren, a U.S. senator from Massachusetts, who has moved into second behind Biden in opinion polls of the Democratic race to face Republican President Donald Trump in the November 2020 election, praised Obama's healthcare efforts.

 

"Now the question is how best can we improve on it," she said, adding that under Medicare for All, those at the top would pay more but the middle class would pay less.

 

Sanders, who sponsored the Medicare for All plan in the U.S. Senate, said the plan based on the existing government-run Medicare programme for Americans 65 and older was the most cost-effective approach. Some analysts have estimated his plan would cost $32 trillion over a decade.

 

The battle over healthcare has been the biggest area of disagreement in the Democratic race, with candidates battling on how to improve on Obamacare.

 

Biden said his plan would give Americans more options, including staying with their plans if they like them.

 

"I’ve never actually met anybody who likes their health insurance company," Warren responded.

 

Former U.S. Housing Secretary Julian Castro accused Biden of flip-flopping in his description of his own plan.

 

"Are you forgetting what you said two minutes ago?" Castro asked Biden, 76, who is known for being prone to gaffes and has faced questions about his age.

 

When Mayor Pete Buttigieg of South Bend, Indiana, noted the exchange was what people did not like about politicians, Castro shot back: "That's called an election.”

 

U.S. Senator Amy Klobuchar of Minnesota also tried to calm things down, noting: "A house divided cannot stand," borrowing from a famous speech by Abraham Lincoln.

 

The debate featured the top 10 candidates for the party's presidential nomination sharing a stage for the first time. The previous two Democratic debates in June and July were split over two nights.

 

Entrepreneur Andrew Yang opened the debate by promising to give $1,000 a month to 10 Americans for the next year, calling it a "freedom dividend." The offer drew laughs from a few other contenders.

 

"It's original, I'll give you that," Buttigieg said.

 

The first two rounds of debates also were contentious, as Biden came under repeated attacks for his record on race and criminal justice reform and his views on healthcare.

 

But several of the candidates tried to emphasise their areas of agreement and turn their criticism towards Trump. Biden praised former U.S.

 

Representative Beto O'Rourke for his work after a mass shooting in his hometown of El Paso, Texas, drawing a sustained ovation from the debate crowd.

 

The sharp bickering during the first two rounds of the debates dismayed some Democrats, who have urged the candidates to rein in their attacks and focus on laying out their own affirmative agendas.

 

(Reporting by Tim Reid and Joseph Ax; Additional reporting by Ginger Gibson and Doina Chiacu in Washington; Writing by John Whitesides; Editing by Peter Cooney)

 

-- © Copyright Reuters 2019-09-13

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[Puchaiyank]

From my perspective...Andrew Yang, a non-politician, is best candidate for the young democratic base to get excited about.  Successful, articulate, with desperately needed fresh ideas to save a party that is being moved far left of average Americans...

 

Watching the old school Democrats sparring is painful...

[Tug]

Joe is right we can’t afford Medicare for all as much as I wish we could I’m still thinking it will be joe Biden and Harris on the ticket smart practical experienced tough and appealing unifying race and gender

[DeaconJohn]

1 hour ago, Puchaiyank said:

From my perspective...Andrew Yang, a non-politician, is best candidate for the young democratic base to get excited about.  Successful, articulate, with desperately needed fresh ideas to save a party that is being moved far left of average Americans...

 

Watching the old school Democrats sparring is painful...

Agreed.

Old school Dems have become dinosaurs.

They buried the term "Liberal" in discredit and derision.

Now they're doing the same thing to their new name "Progressive".

[Basil B]

Pity in such debates people look for the negative aspects, at least the Democrats are looking for the best candidate to run for president... 

[elmrfudd]

and the "woke" clown show continues.....

 

Add to this the upcoming unfounded impeachment circus, the forthcoming indictments of the upper level FBI and soon, some DOJ staff once the IG reports are released.

 

Another 4 years of the current POTUS and another 4 years of vacuous, unfounded, emotional, irrational narratives being pumped out by the DNC/Media machine.

 

 

[Saint Nick]

A Biden-candidacy would be the death- blow for the Democrats hopes!

Trump will go onto a wild ride with Uncle Joe and mop the floor with him!

(And I am not saying this, because I would like that!)

IMHO the only way, Democrats will win, is a Bernie/ Warren- ticket (maybe Bernie/ Beto or mayyyyybe Warren/ Beto)!

And please spare me the crocodile tears about the idea, you couldn't pay for universal healthcare or free college or both and more!

The money is there, you just need to reshuffle: tax the superwealthy, take a bite out of the military, end one or the other war...

The US- citizens are behind the progressive ideas on gun-control, Climate change etc!

The Democrats need to seize those sentiments!

[JHolmesJr]

Im loving this %^$%show.

 

Bunch of clueless dolts who all but guarantee a Trump victory speech in 2020

[Boon Mee]

What a passel of clowns. Not one of them have a clue. Trump is going to roll right over any one of these far left socialists like a Mack truck. 

[oldhippy]

1 minute ago, Boon Mee said:

What a passel of clowns. Not one of them have a clue. Trump is going to roll right over any one of these far left socialists like a Mack truck. 

Far left socialists?????? Yes sure from where you stand......

 

[riclag]

35 minutes ago, Saint Nick said:

A Biden-candidacy would be the death- blow for the Democrats hopes!

Trump will go onto a wild ride with Uncle Joe and mop the floor with him!

(And I am not saying this, because I would like that!)

IMHO the only way, Democrats will win, is a Bernie/ Warren- ticket (maybe Bernie/ Beto or mayyyyybe Warren/ Beto)!

And please spare me the crocodile tears about the idea, you couldn't pay for universal healthcare or free college or both and more!

The money is there, you just need to reshuffle: tax the superwealthy, take a bite out of the military, end one or the other war...

The US- citizens are behind the progressive ideas on gun-control, Climate change etc!

The Democrats need to seize those sentiments!

Like Mr. Trumps says the on;y thing the dems are good at is sticking together! They loose at  the marketing aspect of stealing money from Americans to pay for their radical plans of taking away people's rights through gun control  , what amounts to stealing from the rich hard working people who create jobs.  And most of all a climate change policy that would cost trillions for the USA! 

Wall Street will defeat this attack on American values 

[mikebike]

5 hours ago, Tug said:

Joe is right we can’t afford Medicare for all as much as I wish we could I’m still thinking it will be joe Biden and Harris on the ticket smart practical experienced tough and appealing unifying race and gender

Yep. Darn hard to afford healthcare which is billions less expensive and covers everyone. Join the developed world USA!!????

[alex8912]

Those 3 are 224 years old!! There is just something wrong with this picture. 

[wwest5829]

9 hours ago, Tug said:

Joe is right we can’t afford Medicare for all as much as I wish we could I’m still thinking it will be joe Biden and Harris on the ticket smart practical experienced tough and appealing unifying race and gender

And I'm thinking we can join the rest of the "developed" nations by having a national healthcare program ... if we stop spending so much on killing others.

[wwest5829]

5 hours ago, Saint Nick said:

A Biden-candidacy would be the death- blow for the Democrats hopes!

Trump will go onto a wild ride with Uncle Joe and mop the floor with him!

(And I am not saying this, because I would like that!)

IMHO the only way, Democrats will win, is a Bernie/ Warren- ticket (maybe Bernie/ Beto or mayyyyybe Warren/ Beto)!

And please spare me the crocodile tears about the idea, you couldn't pay for universal healthcare or free college or both and more!

The money is there, you just need to reshuffle: tax the superwealthy, take a bite out of the military, end one or the other war...

The US- citizens are behind the progressive ideas on gun-control, Climate change etc!

The Democrats need to seize those sentiments!

And it all relies on motivating them to vote ... to do that the Democrats must present a candidate the working middle class believes can make a difference.

[Nigel Garvie]

4 hours ago, oldhippy said:

Far left socialists?????? Yes sure from where you stand......

 

It's clear they haven't a clue. Not even the faintest Idea what a Socialist actually is. 

4 hours ago, riclag said:

They loose at  the marketing aspect of stealing money from Americans to pay for their radical plans of taking away people's rights through gun control  , what amounts to stealing from the rich hard working people who create jobs.  And most of all a climate change policy that would cost trillions for the USA! 

Wall Street will defeat this attack on American values 

American values,  that appears to be an oxymoron from what was said here. So if the Dems tax people it is stealing from the rich, when the GOP tax people what do we call that. What a wonderful value keeping assault weapons in the hands of nutters so the can commit mass murder of civilians.

3 hours ago, mikebike said:

Yep. Darn hard to afford healthcare which is billions less expensive and covers everyone. Join the developed world USA!!????

US healthcare, over twice as expensive as anywhere else in the OECD. Insurance companies and Hospitals making an absolute killing, to achieve what, the same life expectancy as Cuba. Join the civilized world USA and stop profiteering from human misfortune and misery. 

 

Reading some of the right wing (Right of Attila the Hun in fact) comments here it's hard to believe that the US is on the same planet. It has been taken over by the Farengi. The idea that people should have the right to profit from every form of another person's human activity, is obscene.

 

Warren/Beto sounds good, I don't think Warren/Harris would work, it is still a thinly disguised misogynistic society, IMHO.

[Jingthing]

The thing itself. Set to start when the debate started:

 

https://youtu.be/2UWVO0Trd1c?t=10759

[Cryingdick]

Everything they promise will never happen. Beto is going to take your assault rifles, really? You can't change the constitution with an executive order, this simply won't happen. iF he can get a super majority of both chambers and 32 or so states to agree to it then he can do what he says. 

 

As far as taxing the rich for all these programs that money will be moved and disappear well before they can even debate passing the bills in congress. Tax Wall Street? Watch it crash as people flee. If any of this even comes close to happening trillions of dollars will go poof and up in smoke. Hundreds of billions come and go in a single day over something as stupid as 5% tariffs or a single tweet. 

 

By the time they get even close to passing a single bill the DJIA will be down to 10,000. It can remain that high because the believers will keep their money in. It will be the middle class and retirees that lose their money. 

 

Do they honestly think that the rich are going to stand on the tracks when a very slow moving train wreck on a very defined path blowing it's whistle as loudly as it can is coming? They are the coyote with an Acme kit of taxes and stupidity trying to stalk the roadrunner.

 

I thought Biden came off pretty good out of this debate. I didn't make it all the way to the end but noticed on the healthcare portion I did catch not a single word was said about paying for illegal aliens. 

 

 

[sirineou]

12 hours ago, webfact said:

Entrepreneur Andrew Yang opened the debate by promising to give $1,000 a month to 10 Americans for the next year, calling it a "freedom dividend." The offer drew laughs from a few other contenders.

Must be a misprint, "give $1,000 a month to 10 Americans for the next year, "?????

Or is he a big spender?

[bristolboy]

27 minutes ago, Cryingdick said:

Everything they promise will never happen. Beto is going to take your assault rifles, really? You can't change the constitution with an executive order, this simply won't happen. iF he can get a super majority of both chambers and 32 or so states to agree to it then he can do what he says. 

 

As far as taxing the rich for all these programs that money will be moved and disappear well before they can even debate passing the bills in congress. Tax Wall Street? Watch it crash as people flee. If any of this even comes close to happening trillions of dollars will go poof and up in smoke. Hundreds of billions come and go in a single day over something as stupid as 5% tariffs or a single tweet. 

 

By the time they get even close to passing a single bill the DJIA will be down to 10,000. It can remain that high because the believers will keep their money in. It will be the middle class and retirees that lose their money. 

 

Do they honestly think that the rich are going to stand on the tracks when a very slow moving train wreck on a very defined path blowing it's whistle as loudly as it can is coming? They are the coyote with an Acme kit of taxes and stupidity trying to stalk the roadrunner.

 

I thought Biden came off pretty good out of this debate. I didn't make it all the way to the end but noticed on the healthcare portion I did catch not a single word was said about paying for illegal aliens. 

 

 

Such nonsense. Taxes used to be way higher and the economy performed better for the middle and working classes.  Remember the doom that was predicted when Obama imposed tax increases on the wealthy? How the stock market was going to crash? How did that work out?  Anyway, the stock market's performance is mostly irrelevant to middle class and working class people. Remember that it was predicted how the lower tax on dividends was going to fuel a capital expenditure boom? How did that prediction work out?  Most of their savings lies in the value of their homes. As for earned and unearned income, how are the wealthy going to make that disappear? The economy didn't do too poorly during the Clinton years, when taxes were much higher. Now that I think of it, didn't all the right wingers make similar predictions of doom  when Clinton and the Democrats raised taxes? How did those predictions work out?

[Cryingdick]

30 minutes ago, sirineou said:

Must be a misprint, "give $1,000 a month to 10 Americans for the next year, "?????

Or is he a big spender?

 

He is being completely dishonest with this. He says it will prove his plan will work. He is saying look at all the great things they will do with the money. However his tax regime won't be in place so it won't be accurate at all. A person would have to be pretty dim not to see right through this. I sort of liked Yang but lost all respect for him pulling such an ill thought out stunt like that.

 

If his basic campaign strategies involve stuff that is this stupid he has no place in the WH. Does he think he is talking to 6 year olds? 

 

Also he is giving $1,000 a month to ten "families". However his campaign promise is $1,000 a month for every person not family. So not even he is willing to make good on his own offer and give every person in 10 families $1,000. Why? Because that would be too expensive. Especially if he has to pay for it.

[Silurian]

These debates probably won't move the markers much. Candidates will fall by the wayside when funding dries up and the donors consolidate around 4 to 5 candidates.

 

At this point, any random Democrat can beat the Reality TV Con Man in an election. As long as the Democrats consolidate behind whoever wins the nomination, this election is in the bag.

 

What Trump’s horrific polling actually tells us — and what it doesn’t — about 2020

 

Quote

Trump keeps polling really badly against all the major 2020 Dems.
The polls du jour show President Donald Trump trailing basically every Democrat in the 2020 general election, both nationally and in individual states — even in Texas.

 

Republican voter fatigue is setting in. They will stay home during the 2020 election as they don't really care enough to vote for a second term of lies and corruption.

 

[sirineou]

1 hour ago, Silurian said:

These debates probably won't move the markers much. Candidates will fall by the wayside when funding dries up and the donors consolidate around 4 to 5 candidates.

 

At this point, any random Democrat can beat the Reality TV Con Man in an election. As long as the Democrats consolidate behind whoever wins the nomination, this election is in the bag.

 

What Trump’s horrific polling actually tells us — and what it doesn’t — about 2020

 

 

Republican voter fatigue is setting in. They will stay home during the 2020 election as they don't really care enough to vote for a second term of lies and corruption.

 

I had lunch with a dye in the wool republican friend , elected to the NY Orange county legislature. Though  disagree politically we respect each other. She is IMO other than the obvious fault, a very intelligent person of high moral integrity, because of that, as the conversation turned to politics I remarked that  knowing her, I could not believe she voted for Trump. Her reply with a troubled look on her face was "I know. he is a d i c k". She did not say so, but I am sure she will not be voting for him again. 

I suspect there is a lot of that going on in the country.

 

Mods , sorry for the obviously banned word, I needed to quote her exact reply.  

   

 

[lannarebirth]

14 hours ago, Tug said:

Joe is right we can’t afford Medicare for all as much as I wish we could I’m still thinking it will be joe Biden and Harris on the ticket smart practical experienced tough and appealing unifying race and gender

I could accept there not being Medicare For All so long as the alternative was Medicare For None.  I mean, that's fair, right?

[lannarebirth]

2 hours ago, sirineou said:

Must be a misprint, "give $1,000 a month to 10 Americans for the next year, "?????

Or is he a big spender?

It's a UBI trial.  That's one of his 100ish policies.  It's inevitable.

[sirineou]

1 minute ago, lannarebirth said:

It's a UBI trial.  That's one of his 100ish policies.  It's inevitable.

I am a progressive voter but

I don't understand it though, what would giving $1,000 a month for a year to 10 america's accomplice?  Am I missing something?

[Cryingdick]

10 minutes ago, sirineou said:

I am a progressive voter but

I don't understand it though, what would giving $1,000 a month for a year to 10 america's accomplice?  Am I missing something?

 

He is using a small sample size to show off how wonderful his idea would be for everybody. It is idiotic and meaningless. They aren't going to pay his tax increases or have their capital gains taxed differently so he is simply just using campaign money to give 10 families $1,000 a month.

 

It is mind baffling coming from a guy whose slogan is "MATH: Make America Think Again". 

 

Essentially he is using a sample size of $120,000 to account for the trillions he wants to give away without accounting for any of the impact it would have on the US economy.

[sirineou]

4 minutes ago, sirineou said:

I am a progressive voter but

I don't understand it though, what would giving $1,000 a month for a year to 10 america's accomplice?  Am I missing something?

Ok I get it, did some more research and it seems to be a marketing scheme to direct traffic to his website. I guess in the hopes that he gets emails, gets people involved in his campaign and perhaps receiving more in campaign contributions than the $120,000 he spends. 

I agree that a basic income is inevitable, but IMO we not there yet politically, and a ten people pilot program will not change that. 

[sirineou]

2 minutes ago, Cryingdick said:

 

He is using a small sample size to show off how wonderful his idea would be for everybody. It is idiotic and meaningless. They aren't going to pay his tax increases or have their capital gains taxed differently so he is simply just using campaign money to give 10 families $1,000 a month.

 

It is mind baffling coming from a guy whose slogan is "MATH: Make America Think Again". 

is it even legal? 

[Cryingdick]

1 minute ago, sirineou said:

is it even legal? 

 

That is currently being debated. That's for the lawyers to sort out at this point.