Johnson faces perilous Brexit ratification after deal vote blocked

[DannyCarlton]

1 minute ago, Jip99 said:

Then he should jump into bed with Nigel Farage and guarantee that outcome.

 

Unlikely, as he has brokered a deal already.....over to you HoC.

Farage doesn't have a single MP in the HoC. He's completely insignificant.

 

Yes the deal he's brokered sees us crashing out on more ore less the same terms as a no deal brexit if we don't agree terms for a trade deal with the EU. Something Johnson has as a plan B.

[transam]

5 minutes ago, DannyCarlton said:

And remainers can see where Johnson and his backers want to go.....out without a deal and then off to their offshore havens with their winnings.

 

[Forethat]

46 minutes ago, tebee said:

Ah - democracy - a term many use without knowing what it means and some use as a means to impose their will of the populace

Ever considered looking up the term 'oxymoron'...? No..?

[Jip99]

6 minutes ago, DannyCarlton said:

Farage doesn't have a single MP in the HoC. He's completely insignificant.

 

Yes the deal he's brokered sees us crashing out on more ore less the same terms as a no deal brexit if we don't agree terms for a trade deal with the EU. Something Johnson has as a plan B.

 

Farage potentially attracts 5-10m voters....... and his party has a head start in election campaigning.

 

Dismiss him at your peril.

[Rookiescot]

20 minutes ago, Jip99 said:

 

Farage potentially attracts 5-10m voters....... and his party has a head start in election campaigning.

 

Dismiss him at your peril.

Farage and his Brexit company will take vote share off the Conservatives. We will end up with a hung parliament again.

[Jip99]

Just now, Rookiescot said:

Farage and his Brexit company will take vote share off the Conservatives. We will end up with a hung parliament again.

 

Quite possibly .....

 

I predict a Brexit majority though.

 

Labour could be decimated, ironically they are probably better voting Boris’ deal through and retaining their current seats. Brexit will, to a degree, go away, or at least lessen in political importance - then what do the Lib Dems have?

[transam]

1 minute ago, Jip99 said:

 

Quite possibly .....

 

I predict a Brexit majority though.

 

Labour could be decimated, ironically they are probably better voting Boris’ deal through and retaining their current seats. Brexit will, to a degree, go away, or at least lessen in political importance - then what do the Lib Dems have?

What have the Lib Dems ever had.....Hmmm, just a nice salary...????

[sandyf]

5 hours ago, transam said:

Very funny, very funny.....????.......

 

But....Yee of no faith in the UK...

It is not the UK that will put the population at risk. Quite obvious that to some leaving is more important than protecting the population. Only 35% concerned about their own well being, a sad byproduct of brexit, no one will believe anything until its too late.

 

Asked how concerned they were about the impact a future trade deal with America could have on the NHS, 35 per cent said they were “very concerned”.

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/boris-johnson-nhs-us-trump-trade-deal-brexit-poll-a9173761.html

[transam]

3 minutes ago, sandyf said:

It is not the UK that will put the population at risk. Quite obvious that to some leaving is more important than protecting the population. Only 35% concerned about their own well being, a sad byproduct of brexit, no one will believe anything until its too late.

 

Asked how concerned they were about the impact a future trade deal with America could have on the NHS, 35 per cent said they were “very concerned”.

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/boris-johnson-nhs-us-trump-trade-deal-brexit-poll-a9173761.html

Scare mongering about the NHS....Even BJ said in the House the NHS was not up for grabs........

[Jip99]

5 minutes ago, sandyf said:

It is not the UK that will put the population at risk. Quite obvious that to some leaving is more important than protecting the population. Only 35% concerned about their own well being, a sad byproduct of brexit, no one will believe anything until its too late.

 

Asked how concerned they were about the impact a future trade deal with America could have on the NHS, 35 per cent said they were “very concerned”.

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/boris-johnson-nhs-us-trump-trade-deal-brexit-poll-a9173761.html

 

 

Straight out of the Project Fear text book........ no substance.

[sandyf]

1 hour ago, nauseus said:

we can see where the EU wants to go.

Certainly not under the duvet with the US, but the leavers have convinced themselves it will be a bed of roses.

 

According to a 2019 study, opposition to ISDS is the single most important factor motivating opposition to TTIP among Germans.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Investor-state_dispute_settlement

[sandyf]

2 minutes ago, Jip99 said:

Straight out of the Project Fear text book........ no substance.

As I said, blind until too late then find someone to blame.

[sandyf]

7 minutes ago, transam said:

Scare mongering about the NHS....Even BJ said in the House the NHS was not up for grabs........

You conveniently ignored this point from the previous post.

"The great US trade deal, but what if the US insist that any trade deal must include ISDS, where does that leave the UK?"

 

The US are pushing ISDS into their deals so it is a real threat, irrespective of what Bojo may say, so it is irresponsible to claim scaremongering - but that is the brexit mentality, avoid reality.

[transam]

1 minute ago, sandyf said:

You conveniently ignored this point from the previous post.

"The great US trade deal, but what if the US insist that any trade deal must include ISDS, where does that leave the UK?"

 

The US are pushing ISDS into their deals so it is a real threat, irrespective of what Bojo may say, so it is irresponsible to claim scaremongering - but that is the brexit mentality, avoid reality.

You don't know the future, you and others are just scare mongering remainers, spouting cr_p thinking leavers will start "wondering".

 

It is very tiresome.....????

 

[vogie]

3 minutes ago, sandyf said:

You conveniently ignored this point from the previous post.

"The great US trade deal, but what if the US insist that any trade deal must include ISDS, where does that leave the UK?"

 

The US are pushing ISDS into their deals so it is a real threat, irrespective of what Bojo may say, so it is irresponsible to claim scaremongering - but that is the brexit mentality, avoid reality.

"The economic damage caused by leaving is likely to be fixed quicker than the political damage caused by not leaving" Philip Collins. But remainers "Brexit mentality" may not understand this, or even care.

[sandyf]

7 minutes ago, transam said:

You don't know the future, you and others are just scare mongering remainers, spouting cr_p thinking leavers will start "wondering".

 

It is very tiresome.....????

 

Of course it is all fake news - till the head comes out of the sand.

 

The process of the UK leaving the EU (known as Brexit) may generate ISDS cases against the UK. For example non-EU financial firms, that based themselves in the City of London in the expectation of continued participation in the European Single Market and subsequently having suffered adverse consequences of the loss of such access under different arrangements, may have an actionable case against the UK Government.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Investor-state_dispute_settlement

[transam]

1 minute ago, sandyf said:

Of course it is all fake news - till the head comes out of the sand.

 

The process of the UK leaving the EU (known as Brexit) may generate ISDS cases against the UK. For example non-EU financial firms, that based themselves in the City of London in the expectation of continued participation in the European Single Market and subsequently having suffered adverse consequences of the loss of such access under different arrangements, may have an actionable case against the UK Government.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Investor-state_dispute_settlement

Can you sleep at night.....?  ????

[Forethat]

May I just point out that IF the average 'Limp Reaminer's' ability to change the mind of a 'Hard Brexiteer' is what we discuss - a potential 'People's Vote' will become a serious disappointment from the 'Limp Remainer's perspective'.

 

By my reckoning you haven't convinced a single 'Hard Brexiteer' to reconsider.

 

52/48 again if you ask me

[Jip99]

38 minutes ago, sandyf said:

As I said, blind until too late then find someone to blame.

 

 

Blind ?? ........... but open minded.

[david555]

3 minutes ago, Forethat said:

May I just point out that IF the average 'Limp Reaminer's' ability to change the mind of a 'Hard Brexiteer' is what we discuss - a potential 'People's Vote' will become a serious disappointment from the 'Limp Remainer's perspective'.

 

By my reckoning you haven't convinced a single 'Hard Brexiteer' to reconsider.

 

52/48 again if you ask me

51/49 would be more fun 

[tebee]

46 minutes ago, transam said:

Can you sleep at night.....?  ????

no, but that's more about the necessity of old age ( and my prostate) meaning I need go to the toilet every few hour than worrying about my veracity. 

[tebee]

39 minutes ago, Forethat said:

May I just point out that IF the average 'Limp Reaminer's' ability to change the mind of a 'Hard Brexiteer' is what we discuss - a potential 'People's Vote' will become a serious disappointment from the 'Limp Remainer's perspective'.

 

By my reckoning you haven't convinced a single 'Hard Brexiteer' to reconsider.

 

52/48 again if you ask me

I'm sure we won't change many hard brexiter minds since cognitive dissidence prevents them from accepting facts now, but there must be many who are not so entrenched who will see that what vote leave promised  is significantly different to what you are saying we must accept now. Those people we can convince - do you just think that you repeating manta like project fear without having any real arguments will not go unnoticed by those people ?

 

I see 44/56 now !

[DannyCarlton]

2 hours ago, Jip99 said:

 

Farage potentially attracts 5-10m voters....... and his party has a head start in election campaigning.

 

Dismiss him at your peril.

I don't dismiss him. He will split the Tory vote in 2, paving the way for a Labour victory. Why do you think Cameron called for a referendum in the first place?

[DannyCarlton]

2 hours ago, transam said:

Scare mongering about the NHS....Even BJ said in the House the NHS was not up for grabs........

 

2 hours ago, Jip99 said:

 

 

Straight out of the Project Fear text book........ no substance.

How did project fear begin? It was originally used by the remain camp then highjacked by Brexiteers to explain away some of the negatives in Cameron's leaflet, like the possibility of a no deal Brexit. Very selective memories you Brexiteers. So far, everything condemned as "project fear" has come true.

 

Project fear, Cummings' propaganda to mug off the great unwashed. So BJ said he wouldn't sell off the NHS? He also said that we'd leave on October 31st.

 

BTW. The tories have already been quietly selling off the NHS for years.

[DannyCarlton]

13 minutes ago, Forethat said:

"cognitive dissidence"...? Is that an intellectually liberal version of the word or should it be interpreted as "I read something in the Guardian that sounded cool. I have no clue what it means, but I'll use the word anyway"...?

It's "dissonance" as you would know if you had half the brain you claim to have. 555.

 

No one likes the grammar police, least of all the mods.

[tebee]

3 hours ago, DannyCarlton said:

It's "dissonance" as you would know if you had half the brain you claim to have. 555.

 

No one likes the grammar police, least of all the mods.

And neither do us dyslexic people !

 

[SheungWan]

14 hours ago, vogie said:

"The economic damage caused by leaving is likely to be fixed quicker than the political damage caused by not leaving" Philip Collins. But remainers "Brexit mentality" may not understand this, or even care.

Is that the Phil Collins, singer of "Something In The Air Tonight" fame?

[SheungWan]

15 hours ago, transam said:

You don't know the future, you and others are just scare mongering remainers, spouting cr_p thinking leavers will start "wondering".

It is very tiresome.....????

Talking of the future, how's the Oct 31 prediction coming along?

[SheungWan]

14 hours ago, Forethat said:

May I just point out that IF the average 'Limp Reaminer's' ability to change the mind of a 'Hard Brexiteer' is what we discuss - a potential 'People's Vote' will become a serious disappointment from the 'Limp Remainer's perspective'.

By my reckoning you haven't convinced a single 'Hard Brexiteer' to reconsider.

52/48 again if you ask me

Don't need to convince Hard Brexiteers of anything, only others that it is a dead-end cult.

[DannyCarlton]

2 minutes ago, SheungWan said:

Is that the Phil Collins, singer of "Something In The Air Tonight" fame?

The Philip Collins referred to is a a "righter than right" columnist with Murdock's Sunday Times. Brexiteers do pick their sources!