Why all the discontent?

[thaibeachlovers]

PS

There are thousands of farangs living in LOS, and only a few hundred at most post discontented posts on TVF.

Fact- happy people don't normally go on forums to tell everyone how happy they are.

[Gecko123]

On 11/4/2019 at 8:21 PM, kenk24 said:

I think many of the complainers here would not feel as discontent and 'discriminated' against if they had more income. If the posters here put their income levels and savings, I think it would tell you the story... 

Kenk24:

 

You do realize that the corollary to your half-baked theory that the only discontented people here are financially challenged is that those constantly proclaiming their delirious contentment here only do so because they are financially stuck here, couldn't return home even if they wanted to, and only tell themselves how happy they are to soothe themselves from the reality of their lives, right?

 

Like @AlexRich, my sense of discontent has nothing to do with finances. It is the TM-30 requirement which has destroyed my sense of feeling welcomed here. I find it deeply offensive and dehumanizing, akin to being on parole, and reminiscent of apartheid pass laws and slavery era laws requiring slaves to have papers when travelling away from the plantation. It deeply offends my sense of freedom of movement and my sense of privacy. Now, it is no longer enough for me to report my address every 90 days, I have to have a Thai person vouche for my whereabouts whenever I go anywhere, or return home.

 

But for the record, the requirement that sums be on deposit year round and a portion be on deposit for 5 months, which effectively deprives one of access to one's property, is a further encroachment of civil liberties.

 

Finally, I am deeply offended by the so-called clampdown because it appears to be very corruption driven, and ignores the key role corrupt immigration officers played (and continue to play) in circumventing these regulations. According to scuttlebutt on this forum, ways to circumvent these regulations can readily be found, only now the fees are higher. When is the last time we've heard a report of an immigration officer being relieved of duty for taking bribes or violating regulations?

 

As you can see from the below printout of my bank statement, I have ample funds to meet immigration's requirements. These funds are only a small fraction of my net worth.

 

Savings DAILY 263,492.10 263,492.10   Fixed 3 YEAR 2,005,100.00 2,005,100.00   Fixed 3 YEAR IMM 893,520.73 893,520.73   Fixed 6 MONTH 1,278,037.88 1,278,037.88
'So why don't you just go home?', I'm sure will be your next question. The answer is that quantitative easing has grossly distorted asset values in the West. As central banks have slashed interest rates and pumped printed money into the banking system over the past 11 years, housing (and rental prices) and stock prices have become grossly over-inflated, way above what historical trends and income levels would suggest were sustainable. An expat who only retired recently, or stayed in Thailand for just a short period of time before repatriating, or who was still young enough to be able to find well-paid employment upon return home, or was lucky (or smart) enough to have retained a residence in their home country would probably be able to navigate a return into this distorted economic environment. But somebody who retired early, has lived in Thailand for an extended period of time without working, and/or lived off of savings during this time, or did not retain ownership in a residence during his absence will likely struggle to return home due to these economic distortions.   In my case, I could return home tomorrow and be reasonably comfortable. I feel really blessed to be able to say this. The only reason I don't is in order to build even greater financial security as a hedge against all the financial uncertainties I see lurking out there: entitlement program unreliability, fiscal debt bombs, interest rate and stock market volatility, and potential future USD weakness. Were the USD to weaken dramatically, for example, the price of imports into the US would go up considerably, having an outsized impact on the cost of living. There are also concerns about the political direction the US is heading in, but I won't go into that here.   So I am in financial health building mode now in preparation for eventual repatriation, the pillars of which are delaying social security until age 70, enrolling in medicare part B immediately (in order to avoid late enrollment penalties down the road), practicing frugality (eating a plant based diet, freeze on durable good purchases, getting ample production out of vegetable garden and fruit orchards), focusing on my health and fitness (walking, mountain biking, intermitent fasting), and finding no and low cost forms of leisure activities and entertainment. I believe that thru this combination of reduced expenses, delayed enrollment in social security, and, put bluntly, fewer years of remaining life expectancy, I will be able to return home comfortably in less than 4 years.   Prior to moving to Thailand, I kind of was living in the future, planning and dreaming about moving to Thailand, not really living in the present. I am really trying to avoid making that same mistake again; i.e., spending the next 4 years planning and dreaming about returning home. I am trying my best to make the most out of my remaining time in Thailand, and not dwell on negatives. It is only in response to unfair claims that financial woes are behind any discontentment that I feel I have been forced to rearticulate the root source of my disenchantment with Thailand.

Edited November 6, 2019 by Gecko123

[thaibeachlovers]

On 11/5/2019 at 12:14 AM, mauGR1 said:

A bit harsh imho, but it's true that some 20 years ago the place was happier.

The populace, IMO, has become unhappier in direct proportion to the increase in wealth of the people.

Same in western countries. We are mostly more wealthy but unhappier than 50 years ago.

[1FinickyOne]

5 minutes ago, Gecko123 said:

the only discontented people

I am pretty sure that i said, "many" not "only" -- I have known some extremely wealthy people who were bored out their gourd... 

 

and that is probably a world-wide phenomena, that people now feeling poorer than they expected, are going to be discontent and if I were victim of one of the more seriously reduced currencies, then, sure, it might have an impact...

 

as to your other points, well taken - - though they do not effect me personally too much... seeking total fairness in any country is probably not going to happen... 

[mauGR1]

3 minutes ago, thaibeachlovers said:

The populace, IMO, has become unhappier in direct proportion to the increase in wealth of the people.

Same in western countries. We are mostly more wealthy but unhappier than 50 years ago.

Uhm, it depends how you do measure wealth, in the past decades people seem to have time to enjoy life, nowadays most of the people seem to be in a rush.

Wealth is relative, if a have a bicycle and everyone is walking, i am rich, but if everybody has a car, i am poor.

 

[thaibeachlovers]

7 minutes ago, Gecko123 said:

Like AlexRich, my sense of discontent has nothing to do with finances. It is the TM-30 requirement which has destroyed my sense of feeling welcomed here. I find it deeply offensive and dehumanizing, akin to being on parole, and reminiscent of apartheid pass laws and slavery era laws requiring slaves to have papers when travelling away from the plantation. It deeply offends my sense of freedom of movement and my sense of privacy. Now, it is no longer enough for me to report my address every 90 days, I have to have a Thai person vouche for my whereabouts whenever I go anywhere, or return home.

Did you move to LOS before TM 30 was a requirement? If not, how can something that has always been a requirement make you unhappy.

It is NOT required that a Thai person vouch for you, except in that an hotel employee reporting TM 30s will be Thai.

 

10 minutes ago, Gecko123 said:

But for the record, the requirement that sums be on deposit year round and a portion be on deposit for 5 months, which effectively deprives one of access to one's property, is a further encroachment of civil liberties.

LOL.

You live in a country that pays scant regard to civil liberties and then complain because you perceive that yours have been encroached.

There are plenty of people in LOS that have their civil liberties violated constantly, but you, IMO, are not one of them.

You, unlike them, are completely free to withdraw the visa money in its entirety and depart for a place you would prefer to live in.

14 minutes ago, Gecko123 said:

When is the last time we've heard a report of an immigration officer being relieved of duty for taking bribes or violating regulations?

I have never been asked for a bribe while renewing an extension. I know of no one that has been asked for a bribe.

I used an agent on my last extension because of the process, but not because I feared being asked for a bribe.

The only people paying bribes to my knowledge gained from TVF is those that do not have the required documentation or money.

[thaibeachlovers]

6 minutes ago, mauGR1 said:

Uhm, it depends how you do measure wealth, in the past decades people seem to have time to enjoy life, nowadays most of the people seem to be in a rush.

Wealth is relative, if a have a bicycle and everyone is walking, i am rich, but if everybody has a car, i am poor.

 

I measure wealth by how content people are, not by how much monetary success they appear to have. I say appear as many are maxed out on credit and poor monetarily.

 

IMO a poor person can be wealthier than one trying to keep up with the Joneses. 

The Bible tells us love of money is a sin, and it is certainly the downfall of millions that will never have enough of it.

 

My personal wealth depends on my proximity to Thailand. At the present time I am exceedingly poor.

[thaibeachlovers]

11 minutes ago, mauGR1 said:

in the past decades people seem to have time to enjoy life, nowadays most of the people seem to be in a rush.

When I was a child, my father earned enough for my mother to stay home and take care of her children, a simple car was sufficient, a simple house likewise.

Now everyone has to work to afford the expensive car and the exceedingly expensive house, so children have no parent at home after school. None are happy.

[mauGR1]

3 minutes ago, thaibeachlovers said:

I measure wealth by how content people are, not by how much monetary success they appear to have. I say appear as many are maxed out on credit and poor monetarily.

 

That's exactly my point, but i see too many people being brainwashed in thinking that if you are not rich and successful, you are a failure.

[impulse]

11 hours ago, AlexRich said:

 

Anywhere I have travelled in the world I have gone through immigration and moved from hotel to hotel or apartment to apartment, without having to provide any information to the immigration authorities. As long as I don't overstay I'm pretty much free to go about my business within the country.

 

Not so in Thailand, where your every move apparently needs to be monitored? 

 

Absolutely nothing to do with your bank balance. I don't want to live somewhere were I feel like a prisoner on parole. 

 

What you don't see is that the hotels in many countries are quietly reporting your whereabouts without you even realizing it.

 

In 7+ years, I never reported my whereabouts in Thailand.  I'm sure my apartment manager did the appropriate paperwork when I arrived (I never got involved), and when I traveled around the country I was often asked for my passport, but they generally accepted my Thai DL.

 

Living back in the USA now, I recently (October, 2019) stayed a week in 2 hotels in Thailand and they did any reporting.  For me, it was seamless.  I didn't even have to know what a TM30 was.

 

Edit:  On an aside, I went back through Swampy, forgetting my TM6 in the hotel room, expecting problems.  One of the nice ladies in the departure hall just before immigration handed me a new one without batting an eye.  Live and learn.

 

 

Edited November 6, 2019 by impulse

[thaibeachlovers]

11 hours ago, AlexRich said:

 

Anywhere I have travelled in the world I have gone through immigration and moved from hotel to hotel or apartment to apartment, without having to provide any information to the immigration authorities. As long as I don't overstay I'm pretty much free to go about my business within the country.

 

Not so in Thailand, where your every move apparently needs to be monitored? 

 

Absolutely nothing to do with your bank balance. I don't want to live somewhere were I feel like a prisoner on parole. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

LOL. Everywhere that you go through immigration you have to provide information, exactly as on entry to LOS.

If you stay in hotels in LOS YOU don't have to do anything other than show your passport at the reception, exactly as I have to do in other countries

As long as you don't overstay you are free to move about Thailand.

Perhaps you stay in a different Thailand than the one I did. I recognise nothing about your experience in all my days in LOS.

Other than the foolish information page that we had to fill in once upon a time ( it only lasted a short while ), and 90 day reporting, living in LOS is hardly challenging, and most of us do so because we find LOS a better place to live than the alternatives. If it were really so bad, there wouldn't be any farangs living in LOS to be discontented.

 

I don't want to live somewhere were I feel like a prisoner on parole. 

If you really think that, I strongly suggest that you exit Thailand, never to return.

The vast majority of farangs will not be joining you.

[thaibeachlovers]

9 minutes ago, mauGR1 said:

That's exactly my point, but i see too many people being brainwashed in thinking that if you are not rich and successful, you are a failure.

I consider anyone with that opinion to be the failure and poor in spirit.

[mauGR1]

7 minutes ago, thaibeachlovers said:

When I was a child, my father earned enough for my mother to stay home and take care of her children, a simple car was sufficient, a simple house likewise.

Now everyone has to work to afford the expensive car and the exceedingly expensive house, so children have no parent at home after school. None are happy.

Well, i think to have a mother at home, taking care of the children at least until school time, is a good thing.

More in general, competitiveness in the society is positive in a way, but when it's exaggerated like in present times, it has surely some negative side-effects.

[mauGR1]

2 minutes ago, thaibeachlovers said:

I consider anyone with that opinion to be the failure and poor in spirit.

Yet we are "social animals" and when we don't follow the stream, we have to pay a price.

But as Socrates once said, you can choose whether to be a happy pig or a philosopher ????

[thaibeachlovers]

6 hours ago, jpeezy said:

Crime rate? My limited observation is that there isn't a lot of violent crime, at least compared to the US. I don't feel like I have the need to look over my shoulder constantly, unless I am in an obviously shady area/dark alley at 3 am or something. Is this me being ignorant and that crime is more prevalent than I realized? I can handle petty theft etc, pretty much any 3rd world or developing country has those problems.

Crime towards farangs is mainly of the con sort where farangs fall victim to their own stupidity ( I've been pretty stupid myself when it comes to cons ).

I feel safer anywhere in LOS, except on the roads, than I do in a western country, and I've been in a few desolate slums and seedy areas.

Worst problem was avoiding katoeys when going back to the hotel.

Avoidance is always the best policy.

[thaibeachlovers]

2 minutes ago, mauGR1 said:

Yet we are "social animals" and when we don't follow the stream, we have to pay a price.

But as Socrates once said, you can choose whether to be a happy pig or a philosopher ????

I'd rather be a happy pig than a philosopher, but it's hard to be happy these days with the maniacs in charge.

I don't think there is a way to live in modern society and be happy. There is always some <deleted> coming along to stuff it up. I've said it before, but if there were a way to be a monk without the chanting and the 4am start, or the religion, I'd join a monastery. 

[mauGR1]

12 minutes ago, thaibeachlovers said:

I'd rather be a happy pig than a philosopher, but it's hard to be happy these days with the maniacs in charge.

I don't think there is a way to live in modern society and be happy. There is always some <deleted> coming along to stuff it up. I've said it before, but if there were a way to be a monk without the chanting and the 4am start, or the religion, I'd join a monastery. 

Happiness is an illusion though, the same as sadness, having a balanced opinion is what makes you a "philosopher" , or a monk if you prefer.

That means being content with what you have, without the need to be bothered too much by what the other people think or do.

[Antonymous]

To all the unhappy expats, I’m a little tired of reading all the negative comments about your miserable life in Thailand.

 

To the OP, and anyone thinking of living in LOS, you could make it your home and enjoy yourself here too, but much depends on your skills and expectations.

 

If you have business qualifications and acumen and drive, there’s no better time or place to make your mark and maybe your fortune than here in Thailand. Opportunities for businesses abound – but I’m not talking about bars and restaurants. Do your research, you’ll find a niche that isn’t being exploited already, or which is being done badly by local Thais and could be vastly improved.

 

If you’re a qualified teacher and believe in the integrity of your profession and the value of helping people to learn and to solve life’s problems, Thailand is probably not the place for you to fulfill your passion, or to realise your noble ambitions. But there are some openings in international schools and universities that can provide employment with salaries that are livable, if that’s what floats your boat.

 

If you have made your pile and/or have a good pension and are looking for a place to retire, Thailand has so much to offer. There are rules and regulations for retirees that are very easy to follow if you plan ahead and have the means (financial and intellectual). But if you cannot meet the financial requirements, or are easily confused by change, Thailand can be a nightmare and is not for you.

 

The miserable sods who populate this forum are among those who haven’t managed to get their sxxt together and who are ready to blame the country they moved to for all their ills, which in almost every case could have been avoided with proper planning. They likely could never make it in their own countries either.

 

My point is this: life will always throw punches at you. Very few of us don’t get knocked down sometimes. In almost every case YOU are to blame for the setbacks fully or to a great extent. There’s no point blaming all and sundry except yourself for the position or the place you find yourself in today.

 

One last word: I do genuinely feel sorry for those long term retirees who had all the means to support their lifestyles when they first came here, but now find themselves in a sticky predicament due to new IO requirements and exchange rate fluctuations. But hey, surely you were always aware that you were sailing too close to the edge for comfort? Accept responsibility for that. The world doesn’t owe you a living and certainly Thailand doesn’t either. I hope that you can overcome your difficulties, but please stop blaming Thailand for your unpreparedness.

 

Now I’ve probably made myself the most unpopular poster on TV.

Edited November 6, 2019 by Antonymous

[Lacessit]

3 hours ago, sanemax said:

Why though ?

Do you need to feel important and special ?

You want the movie star experience ?

You are starting to sound like a helicopter, why why why.

Your blatant attempts at trolling are getting tiresome.

I understand you have gone back to the UK. Why anyone would want to live in that godforsaken cold hole in preference to Thailand is beyond my understanding, unless you have health issues that are only affordable in your home country. Perhaps that explains some of the bitterness you exhibit on this and other threads to people who are enjoying their lives.

You are entitled to your opinions. Please don't confuse entitlement with the proposition they have any merit.

[geronimo]

4 hours ago, BritManToo said:

I'm still looking to bang 'em.

Is anything safe around you?

 

[geronimo]

1 hour ago, thaibeachlovers said:

I'd rather be a happy pig than a philosopher, but it's hard to be happy these days with the maniacs in charge.

I don't think there is a way to live in modern society and be happy. There is always some <deleted> coming along to stuff it up. I've said it before, but if there were a way to be a monk without the chanting and the 4am start, or the religion, I'd join a monastery. 

There is a way to be happy in a modern society, all you have to do is focus on the good stuff!!! We can't change what happens but we can change how we respond.

Edited November 6, 2019 by geronimo

[thaibeachlovers]

1 minute ago, geronimo said:

There is a way to be happy in a modern society, all you have to do is focus on the good stuff!!!

Good stuff? What good stuff? Try living on a pension in NZ now. Rent a decent house is more than the pension, food is expensive, Drs are a rort as have to have prescription to get medication ( over the counter in Thailand ), petrol is excessive due to high tax, health and safety is ruining the country with moronic regulations, councils are run by unelected bureaucrats that are idiots, etc etc etc.

Good stuff is only for rich people. The rest of us just try to survive as best we can. Not a day goes by I don't expect to be evicted and have to sleep in my car.

[Lacessit]

59 minutes ago, Antonymous said:

 

Now I’ve probably made myself the most unpopular poster on TV.

Not in my book. You are simply stating we are all responsible for our individual choices in life. Can't disagree with that.

The bitter posters lamenting a Thai woman did me wrong, lose sight of the truth they chose to go down that path. Nobody twisted their arm.

[thaibeachlovers]

1 hour ago, mauGR1 said:

Happiness is an illusion though, the same as sadness, having a balanced opinion is what makes you a "philosopher" , or a monk if you prefer.

That means being content with what you have, without the need to be bothered too much by what the other people think or do.

Happiness is waking up next to a gorgeous young woman and knowing that you can do it before breakfast, after breakfast, etc.

However, it's temporary. Nothing good lasts.

Women, while the source of my greatest happiness, are also the source of my greatest unhappiness, which is why I'm quite happy to live without them. I may not be as happy as I was when I was with said gorgeous young woman, but not being unhappy is about as good as I can expect these days.

Every time I miss being with a woman, I just remember the final days with my wife and then I'm happy not to be with one.

Happiness is sometimes found in small things.

[thaibeachlovers]

4 minutes ago, Lacessit said:

Not in my book. You are simply stating we are all responsible for our individual choices in life. Can't disagree with that.

The bitter posters lamenting a Thai woman did me wrong, lose sight of the truth they chose to go down that path. Nobody twisted their arm.

It's BECAUSE we chose to go down the path with the wrong person that we are so bitter. Nothing is as annoying as being the author of our own discontent. That's human nature.

However, it is possible to go down the path with the right woman, only to have her change into the raging harpy from hell. Sometimes they manage to hide it well, till it's too late.

[mauGR1]

3 minutes ago, thaibeachlovers said:

However, it's temporary. Nothing good lasts.

Well, it seems to me that you are on a good way to become a philosopher ????

[geronimo]

15 minutes ago, thaibeachlovers said:

Good stuff? What good stuff? Try living on a pension in NZ now. Rent a decent house is more than the pension, food is expensive, Drs are a rort as have to have prescription to get medication ( over the counter in Thailand ), petrol is excessive due to high tax, health and safety is ruining the country with moronic regulations, councils are run by unelected bureaucrats that are idiots, etc etc etc.

Good stuff is only for rich people. The rest of us just try to survive as best we can. Not a day goes by I don't expect to be evicted and have to sleep in my car.

Right, well first off, you're alive and presumably are in good health, and if you don't like NZ, find somewhere else to live.

 

And as for 'good stuff is only for rich people', I feel sorry for you that you have reached that level of despair.

[thaibeachlovers]

1 hour ago, Antonymous said:

To all the unhappy expats, I’m a little tired of reading all the negative comments about your miserable life in Thailand.

The solution is within your own control- just don't read any of those threads on TVF.

To complain about such is like moving next to an airport and complaining about the planes.

1 hour ago, Antonymous said:

If you have business qualifications and acumen and drive, there’s no better time or place to make your mark and maybe your fortune than here in Thailand.

 

Old expat saying.

Q. How to make a small fortune in Thailand?

A. start with a large one.

[Lacessit]

2 minutes ago, thaibeachlovers said:

It's BECAUSE we chose to go down the path with the wrong person that we are so bitter. Nothing is as annoying as being the author of our own discontent. That's human nature.

However, it is possible to go down the path with the right woman, only to have her change into the raging harpy from hell. Sometimes they manage to hide it well, till it's too late.

I've moved on from the wrong people in my life. Dwelling on them is a waste of time.

If my Thai GF was to walk away, I'd have mild regret. We've had great times together. Still do.  If she was to become a harpy, she'd be out the door. Quite unlikely scenarios IMO. You see, I have only put into Thailand what I can afford to lose.

[geronimo]

7 minutes ago, mauGR1 said:

Well, it seems to me that you are on a good way to become a philosopher ????

a negative one at that!!!