Why are more & more expats leaving Thailand?

[EricTh]

11 hours ago, fruitman said:

 

 

Also i don't like the chinese or indians, i have nothing in common with them. And there are less westerners now to talk to. Thai don't speak english, most shops try to overcharge me...i'm just done with it.

You don't have anything common with the Thai either so I am surprised why you came to Thailand in the first place. 

 

How many of these elements do you have in common with the Thai?

 

1. Religion - Buddhism

2. Race - East Asian

3. Language - Thai

4. Food - Asian food

5. Culture - Indic culture

 

zero....

Edited January 2, 2020 by EricTh

[Skallywag]

3 minutes ago, NightSky said:

Things cost much more these days in Thailand compared to other places and even in western countries. 

 

After many years of good value for money some may just feel it’s no longer worth the higher cost.

What "things" cost more?  Not my electric bill, not my cell phone/internet, not my food, not my clothing, not my laundry, not my dates, not my health insurance (from USA)....  and I don't need a car here, huge savings.

Foods like lasagna, pizza, tacos, and beef hamburgers/steaks are cheaper elsewhere. Fruits like cherries or peaches are cheaper in other countries, but that is about it AFAIK.  Could you elaborate please?

[Don Mega]

1 minute ago, sanemax said:

"Tossing" is slang for masturbation and you didnt need to masturbate last night because you have a Woman in bed with you and you had sex with her .

  If I misunderstood, what did you mean ?

Maybe he was tossing her salad.

[Skallywag]

7 minutes ago, EricTh said:

You don't have anything common with the Thai either so I am surprised why you came to Thailand in the first place. 

 

How many of these elements do you have in common with the Thai?

I didn't have much in common with most Americans in the USA either. Commonality is overrated????

[Isaanbiker]

Thailand needs more Pinocchios. 

[Pattaya46]

16 hours ago, RyanWalker said:

Why are more & more expats leaving Thailand?

 

Because they have an unfriendly Embassy in Thailand ? 

Seems to be specific to US, UK & AU only.

 

Too early for exact statistics, but from my consulate the number

of French living in Thailand increased in 2019, as it does every year.

[Christie Paul]

I've lived/visited extensively in many countries and am able to live just about anywhere I want.

 

Most places have deteriorated from a cost/quality of life perspective. 

 

Governments the world over are exerting more control and the results with few exceptions are not much good. 

 

Here they've chased away many foreigners, I don't see how this has helped anything. Certainly it has reduced the velocity of transactions, particularly at the grass roots level. It's also damaged tourism enormously. On the other hand its given a boost for Cambodia and Vietnam, which will help some people there.

 

When I try to average everything out - I don't come to the conclusion that comparatively Thailand is that bad - but I can say that it used to be a lot easier and more enjoyable.

 

I'm content with my set up here - which would cost double or triple in many countries and in others would not be possible at all. 

 

I'm hopeful that one day authorities adopt a more relaxed approach and realise that the North Korean direction isn't going to work for anyone.   

 

  

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[sanemax]

3 minutes ago, DannyCarlton said:

I'm sure that you know more about that than me.

 

As I said....

 

 

 

self deleted

Edited January 2, 2020 by sanemax

[CharlieH]

A quantity of bickering posts removed.

Persist and holidays will follow swiftly.

[Christie Paul]

6 minutes ago, DannyCarlton said:

This is mainly due to a large input from PRC in recent years. Something that Thailand is dipping a toe into.

 

Be careful who you get into bed with. It won't end well.

This is complicated.

 

China's influence was on a rise in SEA - but has collapsed dramatically.

 

Cambodia has adopted a fairly easy going attitude for long term expats, it is cheap and much of it is a bit nasty - but the local economy is booming. 

 

Vietnam - the grass roots opposition to China is visceral.  

 

Thailand - on the one hand they have have given a green light to China on trade in exchange for investment. On the other hand they have not ratified the CRS/OECD agreements which firmly align them wit the US on international tax treaties - an instance in which they have play their hand most skilfully.    

 

 

[ICELANDMAN]

17 minutes ago, Pattaya46 said:

 

Because they have an unfriendly Embassy in Thailand ? 

Seems to be specific to US, UK & AU only.

 

Too early for exact statistics, but from my consulate the number

of French living in Thailand increased in 2019, as it does every year.

Yes, because France has become an uncontrollable country, the French flee the tyranny of Macron, tax hell, invasion Muslims, and more.... in many countries Asia,  another countries Europe, America and...

[Tofer]

16 hours ago, RyanWalker said:

8 guys feom Austria who settled down in Bkk 5 years ago. Young and got money. Visa issues.. Got denied study visas too. These guys get money from abroad etc. Working online so depend on tv's. Few other friends mostly American, moved to Vietnam & Colombia. Some went back home to the US

Ah, the truth is out!

 

A bunch of chancers trying to manipulate the immigration laws, whilst working illegally.

[from the home of CC]

1 hour ago, EricTh said:

And you are Canadian?

yes

[SkyFax]

1 hour ago, sanemax said:

1 hour ago, DannyCarlton said:

Don't you mean Marbella?

"Doesnt matter" in Thai : Mar bull lie or Mai Pen Rai  in BKK

In Isaan when they say MarBullLie it just means they want you to take them shopping:

[Christie Paul]

4 minutes ago, Tofer said:

Ah, the truth is out!

 

A bunch of chancers trying to manipulate the immigration laws, whilst working illegally.

Working illegally online ?

 

I just don't see the harm in it. 

 

To the contrary, if they earn from abroad and spend here, the beneficiary is where they spend. 

 

Furthermore, because of such policies Thailand loses out to many countries which welcome such people and thrive because of it. 

[Letseng]

17 hours ago, RyanWalker said:

Yeah mate, not what it was before. I am stunned to see how cheap China is if I compare it to Thailand. It's very much different.

It sure is different. So different that I wouldn't want to live amongst Chinese.

[from the home of CC]

2 hours ago, rabang said:

Cons outweigh the pros and besides there is a whole wide world out there so why not explore it before it's too late (too sick and old)?

already did hence why I'm here..

[wwest5829]

17 hours ago, thaibeachlovers said:

I doubt it's visas alone, though they may say it is. I left as I couldn't afford insurance, but extensions were not a problem once I started using an agent.

However, it's true that LOS is no longer sanuk. Also, the BGs are too expensive now.

My thinking as a current holder of a NON IMM O-A Visa issued in 2011 and facing the insurance issue next June is that this is a Visa issue. My first fall back position is to switch to a NON IMM O Visa as I cannot qualify for health insurance. We will have to wait and see what new Royal Thai Immigration regulations will be in place at that time and at which offices enforce which requirements. In any case, my plan to spend my remaining years retired in Thailand are not on steady footing. Last fallback position is to abandon my life and relationships here and go elsewhere.

[wwest5829]

1 hour ago, EricTh said:

These are the main reasons people are leaving in descending order.

 

1. They don't have the financial requirements of the visa as most of them have been declaring false affidavits in the past (Americans, British, Australians). If this is extended to Canadians, French , then more and more will leave. I still see quite a lot of Canadians and French living here.

 

2. Immigration getting tougher by refusing entry to long-term stayers doing border/visa runs to circumvent rule #1.

 

3. Baht is getting stronger and things are getting more expensive in Thailand

 

4. Insurance requirement isn't really a problem because one can always switch to O visa, it becomes a problem only when it covers O visa in the future. At that time more people will leave.

 

5. Tm30 reporting on top of 90 days reporting. 

 

Agree but would add the air pollution issue. The financial issue is true but some of that was due to varying enforcement at different immigration offices. That was true also of the TM-30 issue which seems to have been straightened out (only new report after returning from abroad, not required for out of province overnight travel).

[pixelaoffy]

The fake democratic gov wants you to go, but it isn't going to announce it as such ! Just other subtle ways 

[wwest5829]

Saddened that we cannot see reliable statistical support from exit interviews (reason for long stayers leaving), from source of unpaid medical bills (I think requiring short time tourists being required to have medical insurance is warranted). Otherwise we are just speculating without documentation supporting fact.

[The Theory]

15 hours ago, oldhippy said:

And did I mention Portuguese wine yet?

Perhaps you should tell us about girls. ????

[sanemax]

2 minutes ago, The Theory said:

Perhaps you should tell us about girls. ????

What would you ;like to know about girls ?

[DannyCarlton]

1 minute ago, wwest5829 said:

Saddened that we cannot see reliable statistical support from exit interviews (reason for long stayers leaving), from source of unpaid medical bills (I think requiring short time tourists being required to have medical insurance is warranted). Otherwise we are just speculating without documentation supporting fact.

Pointless. If the threads on this forum entitled "I'm leaving Thailand after xx years" are anything to go by, all a survey will get you is a pile of tosh.

 

Not one has stated the true reason, " I've scammed TI for XX years as to my true income, now my embassy won't support my lies".

[mrmicbkktxl]

49 minutes ago, EricTh said:

These are the main reasons people are leaving in descending order.

 

1. They don't have the financial requirements of the visa as most of them have been declaring false affidavits in the past (Americans, British, Australians). If this is extended to Canadians, French , then more and more will leave. I still see quite a lot of Canadians and French living here.

 

2. Immigration getting tougher by refusing entry to long-term stayers doing border/visa runs to circumvent rule #1.

 

3. Baht is getting stronger and things are getting more expensive in Thailand

 

4. Insurance requirement isn't really a problem because one can always switch to O visa, it becomes a problem only when it covers O visa in the future. At that time more people will leave.

 

5. Tm30 reporting on top of 90 days reporting. 

 

I came to Thailand 21 years ago.At that time Thailand was a <deleted>hole,but a cheap <deleted>hole.Police and immigration didn't care to much about foreigner and Thai people in general were friendly.The first 2 years I had to go out every 29 days(Aranyaprathet),it was a pain in the ...,but manageable.Health wasn't an issue at that time.It was cheap to buy food at big c,tesco and carrefour(except foreign stuff like cheese or wine)

Now it is 2020 and Thailand is still a <deleted>hole,but an expensive <deleted>hole,and Thai people are not that friendly anymore.Police and immigration hunting for foreigner,and extending my Non O visa is getting every year a bit more difficult,still manageable,but the overall feeling changed.It seems like they want foreigner from western countries out.Everytime I go to immigration I feel like a criminal.Last December I had to change from retirement to marriage extension.The whole process took 4 weeks and tons of documents and copies.On top immigration came to our house,I had to ask both of my neighbors to take a day off so immigration could interview them.I felt very embarrassed to bother them and more embarrassed immigration police came to our village and house.What will be next?In October I was a few days in Brisbane Australia and I loved it over there.People are super friendly,they say thank you,they say good morning,they open doors for you and waiting until u in or outside.It was clean allover the city.Cheese,wine and all other stuff what a foreigner needs for a standard life is 50% cheaper.Goldcoast beaches are clean,no plastic sh..,no dogs,etc.

Those last 3-4 months made me thinking it's time to leave Thailand.Where to go?Cambodia is in Chinese hands and not that clean and Hun Sen.Laos has no beach,Phili,I didn't feel safe there,besides that they have Duterte,Malaysia and Indonesia are muslim countries.Vietnam maybe ok for now, but the Chinese coming,nothing much left in Southeast Asia.Bulgaria to cold in Winter and to much mafia,Croatia to cold in winter,Turkey has Erdogan,Greece is full of Immigrants,Cyprus is to expensive,south Italy maybe ok,Spain and Portugal probably best for an EU citizen.So maybe it will be Spain,but Thai wife has a good job here and family,and getting a long term visa for a Thai is also not that easy.Then my daughter,she still study here

Even if I want to leave it's not that easy

Reasons to leave are 

1.Uncertainty about visa rules,health insurance requirements, and Thai government(Army)

2. Overall feeling in Thailand

3. Pollution and dirty beaches

4. As older I get as more I hate the hot and humid weather

5. I start to hate that loosing face culture and Thai behavior  in general

6.Many more small things

[sanemax]

4 minutes ago, DannyCarlton said:

Pointless. If the threads on this forum entitled "I'm leaving Thailand after xx years" are anything to go by, all a survey will get you is a pile of tosh.

 

Not one has stated the true reason, " I've scammed TI for XX years as to my true income, now my embassy won't support my lies".

Numerous posters have stated that that is the reason and other posters have stated other reasons why they are leaving .

  Posters have been quite honest for their reasons for leaving and there are various reasons . 

[Dustdevil]

17 hours ago, RyanWalker said:

Yeah I am in the North of China. Much cheaper here. For 100bht you can buy a huge bag full of fresh vegetables. General cost of living much much cheaper. 100bht in Bkk has zero value

I love Chinese women but having visited several times, and knowing the government, I'd never live there. Overcrowded, gov't surveillance, polluted, bad food (trips to the bathroom every time), noisy and everything is heavily censored. Have to play a lot of anti-Great Firewall games just to read my NY Times. I'd settle for a gf in the Philippines or Chiang Mai (and disappear every burn season). Probably the latter, because the internet in the Philippines is a joke. I had a serious gf in Saigon too--Vietnam might be the best bet and also with the most beautiful women.

Edited January 2, 2020 by Dustdevil

[sanemax]

3 minutes ago, mrmicbkktxl said:

I came to Thailand 21 years ago.At that time Thailand was a <deleted>hole,but a cheap <deleted>hole.Police and immigration didn't care to much about foreigner and Thai people in general were friendly.The first 2 years I had to go out every 29 days(Aranyaprathet),it was a pain in the ...,but manageable.Health wasn't an issue at that time.It was cheap to buy food at big c,tesco and carrefour(except foreign stuff like cheese or wine)

Now it is 2020 and Thailand is still a <deleted>hole,but an expensive <deleted>hole,and

You post is quite difficult to read, because there are too many deleted words

[legend49]

10 minutes ago, wwest5829 said:

Saddened that we cannot see reliable statistical support from exit interviews (reason for long stayers leaving), from source of unpaid medical bills (I think requiring short time tourists being required to have medical insurance is warranted). Otherwise we are just speculating without documentation supporting fact.

Interesting the new medical insurance for Visa O-A tourists is already a problem. I was just at a private hospital in Chiang Mai getting a review of my treatment plan. Next to me are 2 French tourists, husband in a lot of pain , maybe appendicitis as he keeps holding that area. Lots of discussion with medical staff. Then these 2 Thais dressed in black turn up, they are the hospitals insurance agents. They discuss this couples Thai insurance policy " I hear the Thai guy saying the policies are really useless, we have to get permission for each treatment and it can take days , sometimes its ok and others its a no go". The wife says if she calls France maybe their French insurance can help. They all look bewildered as husband grimaces in pain" So maybe people are worried where this medical insurance is going and not working as the spin doctors tell us. I ask the people in black my monthly pharmacy bill is 17,000 baht is there a Thai medical insurance that would pay it; answer was no. Oh just to add salt into my wound I am untouchable for medical insurance at 70 years age.

[Jip99]

9 minutes ago, mrmicbkktxl said:

I came to Thailand 21 years ago.At that time Thailand was a <deleted>hole,but a cheap <deleted>hole.Police and immigration didn't care to much about foreigner and Thai people in general were friendly.The first 2 years I had to go out every 29 days(Aranyaprathet),it was a pain in the ...,but manageable.Health wasn't an issue at that time.It was cheap to buy food at big c,tesco and carrefour(except foreign stuff like cheese or wine)

Now it is 2020 and Thailand is still a <deleted>hole,but an expensive <deleted>hole,and Thai people are not that friendly anymore.Police and immigration hunting for foreigner,and extending my Non O visa is getting every year a bit more difficult,still manageable,but the overall feeling changed.It seems like they want foreigner from western countries out.Everytime I go to immigration I feel like a criminal.Last December I had to change from retirement to marriage extension.The whole process took 4 weeks and tons of documents and copies.On top immigration came to our house,I had to ask both of my neighbors to take a day off so immigration could interview them.I felt very embarrassed to bother them and more embarrassed immigration police came to our village and house.What will be next?In October I was a few days in Brisbane Australia and I loved it over there.People are super friendly,they say thank you,they say good morning,they open doors for you and waiting until u in or outside.It was clean allover the city.Cheese,wine and all other stuff what a foreigner needs for a standard life is 50% cheaper.Goldcoast beaches are clean,no plastic sh..,no dogs,etc.

Those last 3-4 months made me thinking it's time to leave Thailand.Where to go?Cambodia is in Chinese hands and not that clean and Hun Sen.Laos has no beach,Phili,I didn't feel safe there,besides that they have Duterte,Malaysia and Indonesia are muslim countries.Vietnam maybe ok for now, but the Chinese coming,nothing much left in Southeast Asia.Bulgaria to cold in Winter and to much mafia,Croatia to cold in winter,Turkey has Erdogan,Greece is full of Immigrants,Cyprus is to expensive,south Italy maybe ok,Spain and Portugal probably best for an EU citizen.So maybe it will be Spain,but Thai wife has a good job here and family,and getting a long term visa for a Thai is also not that easy.Then my daughter,she still study here

Even if I want to leave it's not that easy

Reasons to leave are 

1.Uncertainty about visa rules,health insurance requirements, and Thai government(Army)

2. Overall feeling in Thailand

3. Pollution and dirty beaches

4. As older I get as more I hate the hot and humid weather

5. I start to hate that loosing face culture and Thai behavior  in general

6.Many more small things

 

 

 

 

It is always more difficult when you cannot afford a retirement extension  - that tends to cloud one's judgement with negativity.