Nice post with impeccable facts. Are they aware of that at PoiPet crossing. 

36 minutes ago, OneMoreFarang said:

How many people go through immigration every day? And how many have problems? Maybe 1%? Or maybe less? That's "a few" in my book.

 

At this specific border crossing it is certainly more than 1%. I go through it all the time (it is near my house), always see people being hassled, shaken down for bribes, denied entry. Khmer and foreigners both.

15 hours ago, overherebc said:

Yes, and I've worked with a few. The decisions they make on solving most problems are based on what their boss tells them. Doesn't matter if it's right or wrong, boss says so, so that's the way it is.

Should fit in very well in Thailand. ????

19 hours ago, IvorLott said:

I imagine some 'round up', followed by a mass expulsion of foreigners would cause irreparable long-term damage to Thailand's already frail tourist industry, let alone her equally frail international reputation (especially in Human Rights).

Bangkok is the most visited city in the world. Look it up. I wouldn’t categorize Thailand as having a frail tourist economy. 

Edited January 9, 20206 yr by Onrai
Additional info. Added.

On 1/8/2020 at 5:41 AM, Elmer Fudd said:

This is starting to become comical. Can I ask what is your nationality sir?

You can't guess already?  ????

 

19 hours ago, Traubert said:

By definition Thailand is not and has never been a third world country.

 

The same old false statement. It's a developing country.

Which they love to tout as though it's something special, but they've been doing that since the Yanks left after Vietnam.

I do have to wonder when it will actually ever become developed.

Every year millions enter Thailand and sail past immigration with no hassles. However they do not post about these experiences, so sadly we end up with only those negative experiences being posted about which creates a false narrative that immigration is has it in for foreigners. If that were the case one would expect tens of or hundreds of thousands of negative posts, rather than a few thousand a year. 

17 minutes ago, jonclark said:

Every year millions enter Thailand and sail past immigration with no hassles. However they do not post about these experiences, so sadly we end up with only those negative experiences being posted about which creates a false narrative that immigration is has it in for foreigners. If that were the case one would expect tens of or hundreds of thousands of negative posts, rather than a few thousand a year. 

Let's say it's 1500 ( made up figure by me ) subtract those who are on their 8th or 9th back to back VE entry.

Subtract those on their third or fouth SETV from a country next door.

Subtract those who when asked can't show required cash, ticket bookings etc as required.

Subtract those that look lik a bag of brown stuff tied around the middle with an old rope and smell like it.

Subtract those that rock up pi--ed and with attitude.

With all those, in a year, removed from the 'knocked back at Imm' list I would venture very few innocents are caught up in the system.

Edited January 9, 20206 yr by overherebc

It looks like some travellers are still super sensitive with this stuff.

Everyone knows IOS anywhere are never a smiley bunch.

 

The guy got asked questions, then let in with " welcome to Thailand"..

more than i ever got.

 

And If you ever used Visa Exempt, you should also know by now, it puts a target on your head.

 

If you cant handle questions and a guy who really is just doin his job..

get a dxxn visa

not that hard!!

On 1/8/2020 at 5:01 PM, possum1931 said:

On 1/8/2020 at 7:13 AM, OneMoreFarang said:

Posts like that should always include pictures or at least honest descriptions of the people who have problems. Because it seems only few people have these problems... 

Really?? "Only few people"???? There are plenty of reports appearing in this forum about westerners having to deal with IOs and their hostile attitudes nearly every day, sounds like more than a few to me.

Being asked a few questions by IOs is not "having problems".  The ones who have problems are the very few who are refused entry, a very rare occurrence.

On 1/8/2020 at 5:21 PM, jackdd said:

All three of your points are wrong

No flight ticket required

No hotel booking required

Only 10,000 THB cash required

Care to elaborate a bit ? Your statement is very misleading so a bit more details are required.

 

Been told those specifics requirements by an IO at bkk airport and got rejected myself at poipet once because of the lacks of those documents (I had the cash in hand), also it is the requirements for a visa so ... "inaccurate" maybe, "wrong" i dont think so.

 

You are abaolutely wrong and really not helping anyone in implying you only need 10'000 thb to cross a land border.

 

5 hours ago, freeman01 said:

You are abaolutely wrong and really not helping anyone in implying you only need 10'000 thb to cross a land border.

I believe 10,000 is correct for a sole tourist arriving without a Visa, ie 30 day exempt. 

8 hours ago, freeman01 said:

Care to elaborate a bit ? Your statement is very misleading so a bit more details are required.

 

Been told those specifics requirements by an IO at bkk airport and got rejected myself at poipet once because of the lacks of those documents (I had the cash in hand), also it is the requirements for a visa so ... "inaccurate" maybe, "wrong" i dont think so.

 

You are abaolutely wrong and really not helping anyone in implying you only need 10'000 thb to cross a land border.

 

There is no written requirement to have a hotel booking to enter Thailand (if an IO is looking to deny you entry he might of course try to make something up, similar to an imaginary 180 days limit etc.)

If entering at a land border there is no requirement to have a flight ticket out. In case you arrive at an airport (or by ship) and want to get a visa exempt, there is a requirement to have a booked ticket out of Thailand within 30 days.

When entering Thailand visa exempt the required cash is 10k THB, if arriving with a visa it's 20k THB.

 

In your previous post you were talking about visa exempt at a land border, thus no hotel booking, no flight ticket and only 10k THB cash required.

These are the requirements when actually entering Thailand, the requirements to obtain a visa might be different from this, because those can be defined by the embassy in each country.

Edited January 11, 20206 yr by jackdd

8 hours ago, freeman01 said:

Been told those specifics requirements by an IO at bkk airport and got rejected myself at poipet once because of the lacks of those documents (I had the cash in hand), also it is the requirements for a visa so ... "inaccurate" maybe, "wrong" i dont think so.

You are abaolutely wrong and really not helping anyone in implying you only need 10'000 thb to cross a land border.

Comparing the crossing at Poi Pet to other crossings is like comparing apples to oranges.

I would say 99% of them would never ask to see tickets or hotel reservations and about the same for showing the money.

The official amount of cash needed is 10K baht for a 30 day visa exempt entry.

 

On 1/8/2020 at 9:08 PM, Sheryl said:

 

At this specific border crossing it is certainly more than 1%. I go through it all the time (it is near my house), always see people being hassled, shaken down for bribes, denied entry. Khmer and foreigners both.

Ditto...

That was very convenient for me because I am living in Nadee, Prachinburi, and I am often visiting friends who are living in Phnom Penh.

But the last time that I went through they did not even want to let me out pretending that I did an illegal entry and my extension was bogus.

To make a long story short, I had to call myself Prachinburi immigration and the IO lady in charge totally lost her face.

 

Edited January 11, 20206 yr by lazygourmet

On 1/8/2020 at 5:53 PM, Traubert said:

By definition Thailand is not and has never been a third world country.

 

The same old false statement. It's a developing country.

You could make an argument that it was a Third World country for a few years prior to the Manila Pact in 1954...but that's a sneaky argument. 

 

You're largely correct. Then again, most people uttering the words "Third World" don't even know the origins of the term or its complicated meaning.

On 1/8/2020 at 5:53 PM, Traubert said:

By definition Thailand is not and has never been a third world country.

 

The same old false statement. It's a developing country.

Third world Country, by definition a country neither a member of NATO nor the Soviet Bloc.

As far as I know Thailand has never joined either.

 

Sorry to be pedantic.

 

Back on topic, Aranyaprathet border is a bloody nightmare, always has been, probably always will be.

A shame as I like Siem Reap, and a bus trip over that border is the easiest way to get there.

Edited January 11, 20206 yr by BritManToo

On 1/8/2020 at 7:14 PM, shy coconut said:

Well, there lies the confusion in this case.

 

The OP posted a thread just before Christmas asking how to get to Pattaya bus station

from his hotel in Soi Buakow with a whole load of luggage.

 

This seems to contradict his assertion that he hasn't been in Thailand for more than

2 years, perhaps he has a visa in Cambodia and has used a border crossing too

many times, he hasn't offered enough information really.

 

Anyway, as it stands, he was asked a few more questions and allowed entry, so not a

big deal really.

 

On 1/8/2020 at 8:04 PM, Happy Grumpy said:

It seems that those on Thai Visa think that anybody should be able to rock up with their passport, smile, then be stamped straight in a second later, even without a visa. 

 

Should they be asked a question, or asked to show where they're staying, the Thai IO are treating them like common criminals!!

 

Don't they know that you're white!! With a Western passport???

 

Fire them. 

 

Fire them all. 

Actually, I'm more struck by the suspicious tone of "those on Thai Visa" on so many threads dealing with border crossings, embassy/consulate experiences, and other bureaucratic adventures.

 

While I'm not saying there is zero chance that someone would troll or embellish a story here (hey, it's the internet), some of members of the TV Salty Squad are so skeptical that it border on conspiratorial thinking. One might even say there's a disorder akin to Stockholm Syndrome affecting a lot of expats. They sympathize with the bureaucracy and look down on anyone who complains. They search for reasons to blame the poster or even dismiss their tales as lies.

 

It's really sad.

 

In this case, the OP posted a reasonable-sounding story that jives with other experiences, including those shared by a moderator. The story wasn't over the top and the tone was balanced. 

 

Some people might be outraged by the incident. Some might say "that's unfortunate." Some might not think it's a big deal and ignore the thread. Then there are the types who actively complain about the complaint, as if raising these issues is insulting. The poster said Thailand is no longer a "favored destination" in light of their experience. Does anyone have valid reason to doubt the OP's veracity? I get that they previously (a few weeks ago) posted about Pattaya-specific travel questions, but that's easy enough to explain: this post began with "my recent experience" (so it easily could've been from last month when they crossed into Thailand; I recently wrote about my recent experience getting a re-entry permit, and I wrote that post after I had flown around the world and back).

 

Is it unreasonable for a person to feel mistreated in this situation, and to therefore subtract a few points on their mental score for the Thai government? 

 

To those who respond to the OP that it's not a "big deal," fair enough. Maybe it's a little deal. Some people let those go. Some feel compelled to raise those issues in the hopes of drawing attention to what could become a bigger deal in the future. For the OP, maybe it's a little deal (that's a matter of perception), but for those denied (including the young woman referenced in the OP's post) or shaken down, it's a huge deal. And for everyone who wishes to come to Thailand with good intentions, they have to be a little more diligent in printing everything out, weighing their entrance strategies, going to the ATM before traveling instead of waiting until the money is needed, etc.

 

The little deals add up. Some people are better at living the sabai sabai life than others, and more power to them. But many people get frustrated by the annoying little details and (real or potential) hassles of life. They want to live their lives without wasting excessive time sitting at Chaengwattana chasing down meaningless stamps. Their frustrations pile up like the mountains of worthless A4 copies of our passport pages (all autographed, of course, because...?), glossy photos handed to a bureaucrat with a camera attached to their monitor, and TM30 forms. 

 

If you're a member of the Salty Squad--someone who has the bureaucracy all figured out, or pays an agent to navigate it, or actually thinks the Thai bureaucratic system is a well-oiled machine we should all embrace--maybe you should recognize that not everyone sees Thailand the same way you do. It's possible to like--even love--Thailand while trying to abide by all the rules and being frustrated at how they are enforced. There's no need to jump on every poster who has a bad experience.

Edited January 11, 20206 yr by scottiddled
minor typos, etc.

5 hours ago, jackdd said:

There is no written requirement to have a hotel booking to enter Thailand (if an IO is looking to deny you entry he might of course try to make something up, similar to an imaginary 180 days limit etc.)

If entering at a land border there is no requirement to have a flight ticket out. In case you arrive at an airport (or by ship) and want to get a visa exempt, there is a requirement to have a booked ticket out of Thailand within 30 days.

When entering Thailand visa exempt the required cash is 10k THB, if arriving with a visa it's 20k THB.

 

In your previous post you were talking about visa exempt at a land border, thus no hotel booking, no flight ticket and only 10k THB cash required.

These are the requirements when actually entering Thailand, the requirements to obtain a visa might be different from this, because those can be defined by the embassy in each country.

My bad, I checked and indeed I was on a setv when asked 20k thb.

 

I understand my statement about "the rules" was wrong, now my point was to help people (think google search) who do frequent crossing that with those documents your chance of getting denied entry are very low.

 

So to reiterate, our best bet to get through land border on visa-exempt (max 2 per year) you need the following (even at poipet) :

- ticket out the country (bus, ferry, flight)

- hotel booking

- 10'000 thb

 

With this they will have a hard time to refuse you entry, though it is still possible.

Now the easiest free refundable ticket to get are flight ticket. Bus and ferry ticket are hardly refundable but cost can be negligible like below 10 usd. Expensive refundable flight ticket will weight much more in the eye of the officer, keep that in mind ...

Refundable Hotel booking are dead easy to get on booking.com.

 

Hope everyone can agree on this.

 

Edited January 11, 20206 yr by freeman01

16 minutes ago, scottiddled said:

There's no need to jump on every poster who has a bad experience.

I agree.

Aranyaprathet is the only border I've ever had a problem.

Not to mention the bribe required at Poipet (only time ever as well)

And I've been in and out (always on Non-o) for the past ten years.

 

IMHO the only way to avoid problems at this border is to not use it.

Edited January 11, 20206 yr by BritManToo

36 minutes ago, BritManToo said:

Third world Country, by definition a country neither a member of NATO nor the Soviet Bloc.

As far as I know Thailand has never joined either.

 

Sorry to be pedantic.

It's the internet. We can all be a little pedantic. ????

 

But your definition of Third World is a bit too narrow. A country need not have been in NATO to have been considered in the "Western Bloc." By that narrow definition, Australia, New Zealand, and Taiwan would be considered "Third World."

8 minutes ago, scottiddled said:

It's the internet. We can all be a little pedantic. ????

 

But your definition of Third World is a bit too narrow. A country need not have been in NATO to have been considered in the "Western Bloc." By that narrow definition, Australia, New Zealand, and Taiwan would be considered "Third World."

You would need to argue with the people that write the dictionaries, it's not my definition.

 

Origin

first applied in the 1950s by French commentators who used tiers monde to distinguish the developing countries from the capitalist and Communist blocs.

Edited January 11, 20206 yr by BritManToo

On 1/8/2020 at 6:43 PM, possum1931 said:

I still stand by what I have said, there are far too many IOs here with hostile attitudes.

It's about Poipet and the problems there are well known. 

27 minutes ago, freeman01 said:

My bad, I checked and indeed I was on a setv when asked 20k thb.

 

I understand my statement about "the rules" was wrong, now my point was to help people (think google search) who do frequent crossing that with those documents your chance of getting denied entry are very low.

 

So to reiterate, our best bet to get through land border on visa-exempt (max 2 per year) you need the following (even at poipet) :

- ticket out the country (bus, ferry, flight)

- hotel booking

- 10'000 thb

 

With this they will have a hard time to refuse you entry, though it is still possible.

Now the easiest free refundable ticket to get are flight ticket. Bus and ferry ticket are hardly refundable but cost can be negligible like below 10 usd. Expensive refundable flight ticket will weight much more in the eye of the officer, keep that in mind ...

Refundable Hotel booking are dead easy to get on booking.com.

 

Hope everyone can agree on this.

 

"you need the following (even at poipet)"

That part I think no one can agree on. Poipet doesn't follow the normal rules, they make them up as it goes. 

4 minutes ago, Max69xl said:

"you need the following (even at poipet)"

That part I think no one can agree on. Poipet doesn't follow the normal rules, they make them up as it goes. 

I don't know, from my experience after crying on the officer's feet for a while he was about to let me in but renounced in the end because I was lacking a ticket out and hotel booking, if i had those i would have gone through.

17 minutes ago, BritManToo said:

You would need to argue with the people that write the dictionaries, it's not my definition.

 

Origin

first applied in the 1950s by French commentators who used tiers monde to distinguish the developing countries from the capitalist and Communist blocs.

I get that. And it's not cut and dry, at all. And the definition has shifted repeatedly over time (now it's casually used in economic, not political terms).

 

By virtue of the Manila Treaty, I'd include Thailand (post 1954 or whatever) in the "capitalist bloc" (better termed the "Western bloc"). Wikipedia would agree with me (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Third_World#/media/File:Cold_War_alliances_mid-1975.svg). But a case could be made that, when Sauvy originally coined the term (in 1952), since Thailand wasn't with the bloc at the time, it was Third World. Or one could argue that the Manila Treaty isn't enough to place Thailand in the U.S./NATO hegemony. I'd say it is, and my background is in international relations. But others may disagree.

3 hours ago, freeman01 said:

I understand my statement about "the rules" was wrong, now my point was to help people (think google search) who do frequent crossing that with those documents your chance of getting denied entry are very low.

 

So to reiterate, our best bet to get through land border on visa-exempt (max 2 per year) you need the following (even at poipet) :

- ticket out the country (bus, ferry, flight)

- hotel booking

- 10'000 thb

 

With this they will have a hard time to refuse you entry, though it is still possible.

Now the easiest free refundable ticket to get are flight ticket. Bus and ferry ticket are hardly refundable but cost can be negligible like below 10 usd. Expensive refundable flight ticket will weight much more in the eye of the officer, keep that in mind ...

Refundable Hotel booking are dead easy to get on booking.com.

 

Hope everyone can agree on this.

Useful post, as long as this is emphasized: most of this isn't the rules. As you correctly noted, it's travelers' "best bet to get through" given the arbitrary, inconsistent, and sometimes hostile whims of IOs.

 

I think someone could write a useful forum post or blog post that walks the reader through the differences in:

• the law
• what's the law requires of a tourist (for VE, VOA, to get a tourist visa, and to enter on a tourist visa)
• and what is occasionally asked about/demanded from IOs in practice that isn't in the law (e.g., printouts of hotel bookings)
• real-world tips on how to meet the various requirements in different ways (e.g., as freeman offers several options for travel tickets, refundable hotel bookings)

Or we could get some brass with the Immigration Police committed to enforcing the law as written and slapping down rogue IOs who have their own rules. But that's wishful thinking. ????

 

I went in and out through AP - Poipet last September... I was in Cambo for about half an hour.

The Thai immi staff did pull me over at the desk for a chat, and I spoke to the boss man (who I recognised) in Thai for a bit, and then we switched to English. I explained my family was waiting for me on the other side,  and we had to get back to hospital. I also suggested I'd lived in Thailand for lots of years, which may or may not be true, and happened to have a stamped official letter showing my address nearby (not a pr letter btw, just a residence letter). The guy suddenly changed his tone and hopped up and over to the guy on the desk telling him that I (or people with my kind of visa) could reenter the same day (I could understand his Thai). All over, but I probably wouldn't try it again. As for my appearance, I dressed in long-sleeved shirt, trousers, and proper shoes, and a businessy rucksack, and no tats, dreads, piercings.

Edited January 18, 20206 yr by codebunny