Special Report: Doctors embrace drug touted by Trump for COVID-19, without hard evidence it works

[atyclb]

4 hours ago, J Town said:

4 hours ago, rabas said:

220 million malaria sufferers per year not including millions more on prophylactic doses, would degree with your medical analysis based on Trump Trump.

They took it for malaria under doctor's orders. People taking it cuz Trump said so are practicing medicine without a license.

 

your deductive reasoning and brainstorming-cognitive ability continues to "boggle the mind"

[simple1]

1 minute ago, Chiphigh said:

It has been through 3 different trials, it has worked well for over 98 percent of patients. 

 

The stupidity of not using it to treat patients that are at risk of going into severe respiratory problems is also clear. 

 

I know you want the panic to continue, but common sense will prevail.

Perhaps so for mild cases, but not clinically proven across all scenarios. Again why are denying the current status evidence from medical experts - seems daft to me.

 

Your highlighted comment is ridiculous - again exactly the same as trump's nonsensical attacks against those who disagree with him.

[atyclb]

5 hours ago, J Town said:

5 hours ago, rabas said:

220 million malaria sufferers per year not including millions more on prophylactic doses, would degree with your medical analysis based on Trump Trump.

They took it for malaria under doctor's orders. People taking it cuz Trump said so are practicing medicine without a license.

 

and all the people advocating against taking the drug can also be construed as practicing medicine without a license since they are also giving advice

 

yes and some geniuses will react to this with a "confused" emoticom 

Edited April 7, 2020 by atyclb

[atyclb]

17 minutes ago, simple1 said:

35 minutes ago, Chiphigh said:

No evidence other than it has cured over 98 percent of the people who have received the drug. 

 

Reuters is always a good source of a liberal narrative. 

 

The lengths the left will go to to twist reality to spew this garbage is amazing. 

 

Keep it up, then you can have another 4 year term. 

You've done well with absorbing trump political propaganda - congrats. Another 'expert' contravening current actual medical specialists advisory.

 

https://www.thelancet.com/journals/lanrhe/article/PIIS2665-9913(20)30089-8/fulltext

 

A lot more clinical investigation needs to be done, not least interaction with other treatments a patient is receiving e.g. diabetes

 

the overwhelming majority imo 99.9 % of health care providers treating covid 19 around the world are NOT doing it because trump touted it. trump just touted what the medical community was already doing.

 

is that concept too difficult for you?

[rabas]

26 minutes ago, simple1 said:

You've done well with absorbing trump political propaganda - congrats. Another 'expert' contravening current actual medical specialists advisory.

https://www.thelancet.com/journals/lanrhe/article/PIIS2665-9913(20)30089-8/fulltext

 

A lot more clinical investigation needs to be done, not least interaction with other treatments a patient is receiving e.g. diabetes

Your quote is true of all licensed medicines, is it not? Google "tylenol liver damage".

 

More amazing is the MSM Trump propaganda. Chloroquine has been studied for 17 years for corona viruses since SARS!. Everyone knew, including doctors. So now MSM adds time travel to Trump's other god like powers. Perhaps Trump has already been re-elected.

 

Edited April 7, 2020 by rabas

[Chomper Higgot]

9 minutes ago, atyclb said:

 

and all the people advocating against taking the drug can also be construed as practicing medicine without a license since they are also giving advice

What about those advocating waiting until the ongoing medical trials are completed and against people with zero medical training giving advice on taking these drugs?

[atyclb]

1 hour ago, rabas said:

BREAKING: Dem. Detroit Rep Says Hydroxychloroquine, Trump Saved Her Life From Coronavirus

State Rep. Karen Whitsett, who learned Monday she has tested positive for COVID-19, said she started taking hydroxychloroquine on March 31, prescribed by her doctor, after both she and her husband sought treatment for a range of symptoms on March 18.

“It was less than two hours” before she started to feel relief, said Whitsett, who had experienced shortness of breath, swollen lymph nodes, and what felt like a sinus infection.

Asked if she thinks Trump may have saved her life, Whitsett said: “Yes, I do,” and “I do thank him for that.”

 

 

omg, it's not supposed to help democrats with covid 19

 

a thorough investigation is needed,  call adam schiff

[simple1]

1 minute ago, atyclb said:

 

the overwhelming majority imo 99.9 % of health care providers treating covid 19 around the world are NOT doing it because trump touted it. trump just touted what the medical community was already doing.

 

is that concept too difficult for you?

I known you've claimed you're a qualified medical practitioner so interested to hear from you who is claiming 99.9% of doctors w/w are using Hydroxychloroquine for treatment of Covid-19. 

 

Dr Anthony Fauci, the country’s top infectious disease doctor, has repeatedly warned that there is no conclusive evidence to support using the drug. Asked whether it should be considered a treatment for Covid-19, he said on 24 March: “The answer is no.”

 

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/apr/06/hydroxychloroquine-trump-coronavirus-drug

 

President Donald Trump and his administration kept up their out-sized promotion Monday of an anti-malaria drug not yet officially approved for fighting the new coronavirus, even though scientists say more testing is needed before it’s proven safe and effective against COVID-19.

 

https://abcnews.go.com/Health/wireStory/debate-heats-anti-malaria-drug-covid-19-69997268

[atyclb]

8 minutes ago, Chomper Higgot said:

20 minutes ago, atyclb said:

 

and all the people advocating against taking the drug can also be construed as practicing medicine without a license since they are also giving advice

What about those advocating waiting until the ongoing medical trials are completed and against people with zero medical training giving advice on taking these drugs?

 

#hint.  worldwide communicable disease pandemic threatening hundreds of millions that can result in significant morbidity and or death

 

#hint.  majority (or numerous) countries in the world have zero doctor prescription requirement.

 

hint#. you should write yourself a "living will" that specifies you refuse any of those non completed clinical trial drugs. that way when you intubated and paralyzed on a respirator you need not worry.

Edited April 7, 2020 by atyclb

[simple1]

24 minutes ago, rabas said:

Your quote is true of all licensed medicines, is it not? Google "tylenol liver damage".

 

More amazing is the MSM Trump propaganda. Chloroquine has been studied for 17 years for corona viruses since SARS!. Everyone knew, including doctors. So now MSM adds time travel to Trump's other god like powers. Perhaps Trump has already been re-elected.

 

Yes, with the result of statistical known side effects / interactions to guide medical practitioners.

 

Was hydroxychloroquine ratified for the general treatment / cure for SARS?

 

Have a read of the following

 

https://theconversation.com/a-small-trial-finds-that-hydroxychloroquine-is-not-effective-for-treating-coronavirus-135484

 

Plus...

 

Data to support the use of HCQ and CQ for COVID-19 are limited and inconclusive. The drugs have some in vitro activity against several viruses, including coronaviruses and influenza, but previous randomized trials in patients with influenza have been negative. 

 

Physicians should educate themselves about the strength of available data regarding HCQ and CQ in treating COVID-19. They should avoid misuse of HCQ and CQ for the prophylaxis of COVID-19, because there are absolutely no data to support this. Public figures should refrain from promoting unproven therapies to the public

 

https://annals.org/aim/fullarticle/2764199/use-hydroxychloroquine-chloroquine-during-covid-19-pandemic-what-every-clinician

Edited April 7, 2020 by simple1

[Chiphigh]

40 minutes ago, simple1 said:

Perhaps so for mild cases, but not clinically proven across all scenarios. Again why are denying the current status evidence from medical experts - seems daft to me.

 

Your highlighted comment is ridiculous - again exactly the same as trump's nonsensical attacks against those who disagree with him.

I never said that it should not be under a doctors supervision. It is obviously a good treatment with very high success rates to date. It will suffice to reduce the amount of panic and stress on the health system quite efficiently until the vaccines are available.

 

But as long as you can keep up the trump bashing it must be maintained as not a viable solution to the problem. 

Edited April 7, 2020 by Chiphigh

[RANGER55]

7 hours ago, jimmjam said:

Need to keep giving money to the big pharma companies some how.

 

No, just the opposite. The patent ran out years ago, is very low cost and easy to produce. Some have speculated that was the reason it was not being push as much. It is in large supply already due to its use in Africa.

[Chomper Higgot]

25 minutes ago, atyclb said:

 

#hint.  worldwide communicable disease pandemic threatening hundreds of millions that can result in significant morbidity and or death

 

#hint.  majority (or numerous) countries in the world have zero doctor prescription requirement.

 

hint#. you should write yourself a "living will" that specifies you refuse any of those non completed clinical trial drugs. that way when you intubated and paralyzed on a respirator you need not worry.

I’ll tell you what I’ll do, I’ll follow the advice of flesh and blood medical professionals who I consult with face to face, I’ll skip the advice of strangers on the internet and I’ll not be stockpiling prescription medicines, let alone doing so then posting photos of my ‘private pharmacy’ online.

 

I also took the precaution of confirming my and my family’s medical insurance covers testing for and treatment of this disease and then confirmed which of the private hospitals near me accept patients with this disease and too accept our insurance.

 

You might want to do likewise.

 

 

 

 

Edited April 7, 2020 by Chomper Higgot

[RANGER55]

6 hours ago, J Town said:

People have died taking this drug without first getting advice from a doctor. Turns out Trump has financial ties to this drug. Heavy sigh . . .

No, he does not, this came from Morning Joe on MSNBC with no, no facts to back it up. You can’t get the drug without a doctor’s prescription.

[RANGER55]

6 hours ago, J Town said:

https://www.cbsnews.com/news/coronavirus-news-arizona-man-dies-after-taking-chloroquine-drug-touted-by-trump-as-treatment/

 

There are others if you research yourself. While this example is only one person, sure would be a drag if that person was you.

 Again, no, those two fools took something to clean a fish tank. It had nothing to do with this drug. Stupid is as stupid does!

CBS=FAKE NEWS

[Chomper Higgot]

4 minutes ago, RANGER55 said:

No, he does not, this came from Morning Joe on MSNBC with no, no facts to back it up. You can’t get the drug without a doctor’s prescription.

No, it came from the NYT and they named names. 

Right now the not unexpected denials are being made, but the news hounds are on it. 

https://www.nytimes.com/2020/04/06/us/politics/coronavirus-trump-malaria-drug.html

 

------

 

A number of TVF members have posted accounts of their purchases of these medicines, providing directions and maps to pharmacies that are selling these medicines and in some cases posting photos of their personal stock of these medicines. 

 

[Steven Brothers]

 

The best practice and results seems to be to give the drug cocktail early before the lungs are damaged and you get ARDS. Some of the small negative result studies were done at a later stage of the disease perhaps when lungs already damaged. Dr. Zelenko from NY says hit the virus hard with the drug cocktail and hit it early, Deputy National Secretary of the Italian Federation of General Practitioners Italy Dr. Pier Luigi Bartoletti said administer the drug early for good results, Health director-general Malaysia Datuk Dr. Noor Hisham Abdullah said there are more deaths if you start the treatments at a later stage of the disease.

 

Perhaps Dr. Pier Luigi Bartoletti says it best: Dr. Pier Luigi Bartoletti, Deputy National Secretary of the Italian Federation of General Practitioners, explains: The drug “is already giving good results” ... “every single person with Covid-19 that has early signs, like a cough or a fever for example, is now being treated with the anti-malaria drug. We have just understood that the virus has an evolution in two phases and that it is during the second phase, after a few days (about a week), that the situation can suddenly, in 24 or 48 hours, worsen and leads to respiratory failure requiring intensive care.”

 

“The results that we are starting to accumulate suggest that hydroxychloroquine administered early, gives the possibility of avoiding this evolution in a majority of patients and is also helping us to prevent hospitals from filling up.”

 

 

Key take away idea according to Dr. Selenko: Hit the virus early and hard with a combination of Hydroxychloroquine, Azithromicine and Zinc supplements. Don’t wait days for many tests and risk patients

health deteriorating into ARDS (acute respiratory disease syndrome) Once the patients have ARDS the lungs are damaged, they have a 40-50% chance of dying and the drugs are not very effective. In other words the damage is already done.

 

March 29th 2020 Italy They will start mass treatment with Hydroxychloroquine. The drug “is already giving good results,” Bartoletti says . Give the drug early before pneumonia sets in for best result. “So hopefully UK, US and other countries will now learn from Italy and get this early treatment out there before deaths reach Italy levels or even more for USA as they will if people are not treated, but with early treatment this should be contained as in South Korea and many other countries where they have been giving early treatment from nearly the very beginning.”

https://www.trustnodes.com/2020/03/29/italy-finally-starts-mass-treatment-with-hydroxychloroquine

 

 

March 28th 2020 USA Dr. Vladmir Zelenko of New York says of 699 patients treated, he has had ZERO deaths, ZERO intubations, and four hospitalizations.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1TJdjhd_XG8&t=586s&fbclid=IwAR0GVZ-MgpmwU_Oxj9mFNt0ZKZ1so1HLuBLPYTziX8WMAP4LEPvw-DI54Jg

 

 

March 29th 2020 Malaysia Chloroquine, a drug used for malaria, has been used to treat Covid-19 patients since the first wave of the outbreak in Malaysia and shown its efficacy, says Health director-general Datuk Dr Noor Hisham Abdullah. He explained that the number of deaths due to the virus had increased as the patients were either elderly, had comorbidities such as high blood pressure and kidney disease, or those who sought treatment at a later stage or after they began having breathing difficulties.

https://www.malaymail.com/news/malaysia/2020/03/29/chloroquine-used-to-treat-covid-19-patients-since-first-wave-says-health-d/1851457

 

 

Health director-general Datuk Dr Noor Hisham Abdullah. He explained that the number of deaths due to the virus had increased as the patients were either elderly, had comorbidities such as high blood pressure and kidney disease, or those who sought treatment at a later stage or after they began having breathing difficulties.

https://www.malaymail.com/news/malaysia/2020/03/29/chloroquine-used-to-treat-covid-19-patients-since-first-wave-says-health-d/1851457

 

 

[Chomper Higgot]

7 minutes ago, RANGER55 said:

 Again, no, those two fools took something to clean a fish tank. It had nothing to do with this drug. Stupid is as stupid does!

CBS=FAKE NEWS

The trouble with your argument is the wife, who fortunately survived, has explained precisely why she and her husband drank this substance. 

 

 

[allen303]

5 hours ago, DoctorG said:

Man, I was hoping that you actually had a real case instead of some dumbo taking something just because it had the word chlorine in it.

There are further developments to this particular story. Turns out she was a Hillary contributor not a Trump supporter, and that she had previously assaulted and possibly try to murder, her husband.

 

Maybe they should have picked up a box of worm medicine and a few flea collars for their self while at the pet store. Obviously, their IQ is less than some pets. But hey, she is a Hillary supporter, so what can you expect.

[allen303]

6 hours ago, J Town said:

They took it for malaria under doctor's orders. People taking it cuz Trump said so are practicing medicine without a license.

So, you are saying a doctor prescribed to his patients and wrote a prescription for something to clean alga off a fish tank. Can you provide the doctors name that prescribed this to them? You have to have a prescription from a doctor to get this medication. You can not walk into a drug store or anywhere else and buy off the shelf. But we are talking a pet store. I guess maybe their doctor is a veteanarian???

[Eric Loh]

So much controversies on a drug that Trump lied that it’s FDA approved but was not. Those who got better from taking the drug could be placebo. Without proper studies by FDA, hard to make any claim either way. People should err on the side of caution. 

[allen303]

45 minutes ago, Chomper Higgot said:

No, it came from the NYT and they named names. 

Right now the not unexpected denials are being made, but the news hounds are on it. 

https://www.nytimes.com/2020/04/06/us/politics/coronavirus-trump-malaria-drug.html

 

------

 

A number of TVF members have posted accounts of their purchases of these medicines, providing directions and maps to pharmacies that are selling these medicines and in some cases posting photos of their personal stock of these medicines. 

 

As was stated, it came from Morning Joe on MSNBC. He stated (we need to look at Trumps connection to this drug and follow the money). I have seen the clip numerous times on the news. This is in reference to Trump making money off the drug.

 

As for TVM buying this drug. Not in the US, maybe here in Thailand but I would bet not. If some store is selling it here in Thailand over the counter please give us the location and name. But other countries are not relevant to this couple who is located in the US. You can post pictures where you are buying Meth to, but not legal. Again, very slowwwwly, in the US it has to come from a doctor. You can go to any pet story and buy what they took, has nothing to do with the drug for malaria we are talking about.

[atyclb]

1 hour ago, Chomper Higgot said:

1 hour ago, atyclb said:

 

#hint.  worldwide communicable disease pandemic threatening hundreds of millions that can result in significant morbidity and or death

 

#hint.  majority (or numerous) countries in the world have zero doctor prescription requirement.

 

hint#. you should write yourself a "living will" that specifies you refuse any of those non completed clinical trial drugs. that way when you intubated and paralyzed on a respirator you need not worry.

I’ll tell you what I’ll do, I’ll follow the advice of flesh and blood medical professionals who I consult with face to face, I’ll skip the advice of strangers on the internet and I’ll not be stockpiling prescription medicines, let alone doing so then posting photos of my ‘private pharmacy’ online.

 

I also took the precaution of confirming my and my family’s medical insurance covers testing for and treatment of this disease and then confirmed which of the private hospitals near me accept patients with this disease and too accept our insurance.

 

You might want to do likewise.

 

your reply in of itself is reasonable but in the context of replying to the items/issues i listed is bizarre and avoids what i listed.

 

surely if you search online can find some face to face doctors that are warped leftist trump haters willing to capitalize on seeing similar belief  patients happy to not receive the currently worldwide used drugs.

 

there is an ever growing international body of evidence that the drugs are helping covid 19 patients granted there are no multiyear double blind randomized peer reviewed studies

and you are very welcome to use that criteria to refuse those drugs.

[Chomper Higgot]

12 minutes ago, atyclb said:

 

your reply in of itself is reasonable but in the context of replying to the items/issues i listed is bizarre and avoids what i listed.

 

surely if you search online can find some face to face doctors that are warped leftist trump haters willing to capitalize on seeing similar belief  patients happy to not receive the currently worldwide used drugs.

 

there is an ever growing international body of evidence that the drugs are helping covid 19 patients granted there are no multiyear double blind randomized peer reviewed studies

and you are very welcome to use that criteria to refuse those drugs.

That jumbled mess doesn't make any sense. 

Why would I search on line for a doctor to tell me anything? I have catogorically stated I will only seek advice from flesh and blood doctors who I consult face to face. 

 

 

 

 

 

[atyclb]

1 hour ago, Chomper Higgot said:

A number of TVF members have posted accounts of their purchases of these medicines, providing directions and maps to pharmacies that are selling these medicines and in some cases posting photos of their personal stock of these medicines. 

 

hint;  many medicines are legally available without a prescription in thailand and many other countries.

 

hint; what they decided to do was based upon the consensus from thousands of doctors worldwide that are treating covid 19 patients

 

doctors themselves are advocating same for themselves and family members.

 

 

 

enjoy your antithetical critical thinking

 

 

[atyclb]

2 minutes ago, Chomper Higgot said:

17 minutes ago, atyclb said:

 

your reply in of itself is reasonable but in the context of replying to the items/issues i listed is bizarre and avoids what i listed.

 

surely if you search online can find some face to face doctors that are warped leftist trump haters willing to capitalize on seeing similar belief  patients happy to not receive the currently worldwide used drugs.

 

there is an ever growing international body of evidence that the drugs are helping covid 19 patients granted there are no multiyear double blind randomized peer reviewed studies

and you are very welcome to use that criteria to refuse those drugs.

That jumbled mess doesn't make any sense. 

Why would I search on line for a doctor to tell me anything? I have catogorically stated I will only seek advice from flesh and blood doctors who I consult face to face.

 

 

if there is such a thing as "intellectual rape" i am a victim

[Chomper Higgot]

21 minutes ago, allen303 said:

As was stated, it came from Morning Joe on MSNBC. He stated (we need to look at Trumps connection to this drug and follow the money). I have seen the clip numerous times on the news. This is in reference to Trump making money off the drug.

 

As for TVM buying this drug. Not in the US, maybe here in Thailand but I would bet not. If some store is selling it here in Thailand over the counter please give us the location and name. But other countries are not relevant to this couple who is located in the US. You can post pictures where you are buying Meth to, but not legal. Again, very slowwwwly, in the US it has to come from a doctor. You can go to any pet story and buy what they took, has nothing to do with the drug for malaria we are talking about.

I assure you, members on this forum have posted accounts of buying these medicines in Thailand, and have posted pictures/directions to where they bought them. 

[Chomper Higgot]

3 minutes ago, atyclb said:

 

hint;  many medicines are legally available without a prescription in thailand and many other countries.

 

hint; what they decided to do was based upon the consensus from thousands of doctors worldwide that are treating covid 19 patients

 

doctors themselves are advocating same for themselves and family members.

 

 

 

enjoy your antithetical critical thinking

 

 

Your first 'Hint', yes I know, but then are these particular medicines amongst those or are you speaking without knowing. 

 

Your second 'Hint'. I'm not at all sure on what basis you claim 'what they decided to do...'? Perhaps you can provide us with the evidence to back up your statement. 

 

I'm not at all sure what doctors are doing, and I'm not inclined to accept your word or that of any other stranger on the internet. 

 

 

[allen303]

28 minutes ago, Chomper Higgot said:

I assure you, members on this forum have posted accounts of buying these medicines in Thailand, and have posted pictures/directions to where they bought them. 

Like I stated, maybe in Thailand. Like I stated, not relevant to this couple. They are in the US and it was not the malaria drug we are discussing. 

Next time my wife and Niece go out I will have them ask about getting it, just for facts of this argument.

[allen303]

1 hour ago, Eric Loh said:

So much controversies on a drug that Trump lied that it’s FDA approved but was not. Those who got better from taking the drug could be placebo. Without proper studies by FDA, hard to make any claim either way. People should err on the side of caution. 

It has been approved by the FDA years ago for the treatment of malaria. They know the side effects of taking the drug. If it helps with C19, no study yet. Point is, you as a patient don’t have to take it, so as they say down on walking street, just say no, to your doctor. Then you can wait for a few years for the FDA to tell you its all good my friend.