Advice on buying a new car in Thailand

[sometimewoodworker]

1 hour ago, Sheryl said:

Doesn't really help me to know that other people living in different areas and dealing with different dealers had different experiences. I live where I live, and for servicing and repairs I am not going to make overnight trips out of province.

A point I was making is that unless you have absolutely decided on the make of car the quality of the local dealers should influence your choice. There should be different dealers/company garages within a reasonable distance.

 

Clearly the Honda dealer is poor, how about Mazda, Toyota, MG, etc.

 

Also why fixate on buying from Bangkok? Unless you are making at least a 10% saving on the purchase.

 

We had to travel to a dealer 60km away because they were the closest for the make we wanted.

[Sheryl]

53 minutes ago, sometimewoodworker said:

A point I was making is that unless you have absolutely decided on the make of car the quality of the local dealers should influence your choice. There should be different dealers/company garages within a reasonable distance.

 

Clearly the Honda dealer is poor, how about Mazda, Toyota, MG, etc.

 

Also why fixate on buying from Bangkok? Unless you are making at least a 10% saving on the purchase.

 

We had to travel to a dealer 60km away because they were the closest for the make we wanted.

 

I'm not fixated on buying from Bangkok. I prefer to buy in my own province. It happens that I am making a trip to Bangkok soon so while there anyway will check out dealers there, as there are several.

 

There may be more chance of finding a rep who speaks some English, and also of the rep having some negotiation skills and knowledge, than has been the case in my province. Certainly will not be a 10% savings, in fact I am not counting on any saving at all there vs my own province; if there is I would expect the difference  to be very, very modest.

 

Just hoping for a better experience in terms of the agent being able to answer simple questions, being interested in making a sale, negotiating with something approximating normal Thai salesmanship (all 3 totally lacking so far) and also being able to resolve the registration issue.

 

And yes, I have decided on the make and model I want.

[bkk6060]

I would never buy a car here, but I know some who have.  Although they live in Pattaya, they bought in Bangkok because the dealers there were more willing to negotiate the price.  One guy I know bought a Fortunner and claims he got some upgrades and the Bangkok dealer also took 75,000 b off the Pattaya prices he was quoted.  

[Cake Monster]

Something that you may wish to think about is the Model of Car you are looking to buy.

A Model that is going " Old " and being replaced by a newer version will be a load cheaper than the latest new Model.

And it will probably have 95% of all the toys on it that the new Model has.

Another thing is to look at the purchase of a Dealerships " Demonstrator Vehicle in the Model you like "

Sometimes they push these out fairly cheaply to replace them with a brand new Vehicle ( for Image )

Whatever you choose to do, Cash will be King at the moment, as the Banks are really tightening the screws on Loans through fear of NPL Loans.

Good luck, and be safe

[Sheryl]

2 hours ago, Cake Monster said:

Something that you may wish to think about is the Model of Car you are looking to buy.

A Model that is going " Old " and being replaced by a newer version will be a load cheaper than the latest new Model.

And it will probably have 95% of all the toys on it that the new Model has.

Another thing is to look at the purchase of a Dealerships " Demonstrator Vehicle in the Model you like "

Sometimes they push these out fairly cheaply to replace them with a brand new Vehicle ( for Image )

Whatever you choose to do, Cash will be King at the moment, as the Banks are really tightening the screws on Loans through fear of NPL Loans.

Good luck, and be safe

 

Thanks.

 

Actually cash seems to be part of the problem. Apparently dealers make extremely low commissions on sales and get much of their income from commissions on loans. So they are not much interested in a costumer paying cash up front.

[Lancashirelad]

5 hours ago, Sheryl said:

 

Haven't rushed into anything and have not yet bought the car. That's the whole point of this thread: asking for info before buying.

 

I have plenty of faith in the manufacturer.  The local dealer, no.

My apologies, for some reason I thought you'd already done the dal when you put up the figures. Yes, you are absolutely doing the right thing discussing it here, carry on.

 

I note an errant 'not' sneaked into a sentence in my post #146

 

"A few have mentioned that in order not to maintain the warranty..............."

[sometimewoodworker]

26 minutes ago, Sheryl said:

 

Thanks.

 

Actually cash seems to be part of the problem. Apparently dealers make extremely low commissions on sales and get much of their income from commissions on loans. So they are not much interested in a costumer paying cash up front.

That was a point I was going to make,

 

do not say how you are going to pay until you have negotiated everything, do ask for the monthly payments available. 
 

I’m a little unclear of the relevance of your current or previous job Unless you have a brown uniform. ???????? 

 

2 hours ago, Sheryl said:

yes, I have decided on the make and model I want.

Then you will either have to travel further for service or try reporting the dealer to Honda.

[Sheryl]

1 hour ago, sometimewoodworker said:

That was a point I was going to make,

 

do not say how you are going to pay until you have negotiated everything, do ask for the monthly payments available. 
 

I’m a little unclear of the relevance of your current or previous job Unless you have a brown uniform. ???????? 

 

Then you will either have to travel further for service or try reporting the dealer to Honda.

 

Actually that seemed to cause a problem with last negotiations. The second dealer did not ask about payment plan until the end and then, after we had agreed on everything (I even had the money out for the deposit) she sent scanned copy of the completed paperwork to her manager who -- having previously agreed on all the conditions, extras, discount etc - reversed himself and lowered the discount by half (after having already previously lowered it from what she had initially offered me in writing). The only price negotiation I have ever had in Thailand where the seller's price went up repeatedly as negotiations proceeded....

 

Thinking it over, since she had repeatedly contacted the manager as we went along, I can only conclude (1) communication between the 2 of them was very poor and (2) there was something in the final paperwork that had not been apparent to him in the prior discussions, and the only thing I can think of that  might be that it was cash upfront. His prior decisions might have assumed it was going to be on financing and this would have affected his profit margin.

 

So based on this I think best to make it clear from the start, it only causes upheaval to have a deal vetoed at the last minute.

 

This is one of the frustrations of new car vs used car buying: the person you negotiate with does not have much stake in it and  -- at least at the 2 dealers I have been to -- is also not empowered to make a final  decision. 

 

 

[BritManToo]

14 minutes ago, Sheryl said:

there was something in the final paperwork that had not been apparent to him in the prior discussions,

More likely he hadn't realised you were white, and she hadn't mentioned it to him.

[DavisH]

On 7/31/2020 at 8:25 PM, Sheryl said:

 

Except what I seem to be hearing is (1) most things won't in fact be covered and (2) to have any chance of anything ever being covered I will have to spend considerable time and money taking it all the  way to the dealership for every single oil change. A full day of my time plus higher cost and hassles to schedule it. Not very appealing.

 

Until now I have always bought old cars and paid out of pocket for all repairs. Starting to look like not a bad strategy in terms of saving time and money. And purchasing used is certainly an easier buying experience.

You wil need to have your car serviced at a dealer to ensure the warranty remains valid. You can use he closest dealer to where you live for that. I would not use backyard garages while your car is still under warranty. If you get your car serviced regularly, and you don't thrash it everyday, the gearbox and engine will be fine for well over 100k kms. I regularly serviced my honda civic and the engine and auto gearbox were still good even after 250K kms when I sold it. Wear and tear parts are like the battery and brake pads. Those wouldn't be covered under warranty. I rarely made a claim on my previous hondas. Most failing parts happened after my warranty had expired. 

I would not suggest buying second hand here, unless you know the history of the car and the previous owners. If you do, make sure it has a full book service. 

[HauptmannUK]

Sheryl, couple of things....

1. It is true that they probably make more commission from finance than from the car sale. Not only in Thailand - it is also true in UK, USA etc.  So cash is definitely not always king.

2. Dealerships, and indeed salesmen, have monthly or quarterly targets to meet. If your purchase enables them to hit the target then they may give a better discount. My guess is they are way down on target right now.

3. You appear to know the exact vehicle spec. that you want to buy. Telephone each dealer, ask for the sales manager, tell them the spec. and that you are ready to order. Make it clear you are serious and ask their best price.

 

Last year I was thinking of buying either a Mercedes C class or a BMW 3 series. I was in Pattaya but negotiating with dealers in Bangkok via Line. Both dealerships ended up offering similar discounts of over 10% and a free servicing package.

If your Thai is a bit shaky then ask a Thai friend for help or maybe even pay a couple thousand to an agent to make the calls for you.

 

Your lousy Honda dealer is a major issue because you will have to use them for servicing and repairs under warranty (unless you are prepared to travel further afield to another dealer). If they are as bad as you say then maybe consider another brand.....e.g. Toyota.

[mike787]

don't do it, save your money.

[Sheryl]

Well, matters have progressed after my trip to Bangkok.

 

I stopped at 3 dealers, one on the outskirts (Thanyaburi) and 2 in Bangkok. The first one (Thanyaburi) was so crowded that I gave up after a while and left; this was on a Sunday afternoon so perhaps to be expected.

 

Monday went first to Honda Sathorn.  Was referred to a rep who spoke English, before we even sat down she asked me "cash or financing?", obviously has sold to foreigners before so did not assume financing.  We then sat down and despite my having clearly said manual transmission, started pointing on the price list to automatics. I again repeated that I wanted MT. She said they did not have any in stock, which of course I expected. I asked if she could order it and she said "No, cannot -- too old, too long ago" (I did not understand that part). I told her that 3 other dealers had told me they could order it so would she please check. She  got up, walked out of sight and then returned in under 60 seconds, obviously not having checked anything, and  said "no, we cannot order it for you". Clearly not interested in selling  a Jazz for cash and wanting to get rid of me as quickly as possible. Made no effort to suggest any alternative cars. I left.  The only positive I can say for that experience was that it was air-conditioned so unlike my up country dealer visits I was not reduced to a pile of sweat.

 

I next went to Honda Ekamai. Very pleasant, down to earth sales rep who spoke English well, was knowledgable about all aspects of the car and the registration process (a first) and both candid, and pleasant,  and reasonably interested in making the sale.  She showed me  internal documents she had which listed what extras could be had for free and what the maximum discount possible was; for paying cash this was 35,000 baht but inclusive of the value of the insurance so a little under 15,000 discount with the insurance - still almost 10k  better  than the upcountry dealers had offered. (This 35k was specific to Jazz.  other models, different amounts but I did not make note of how much).  Tinted windows free. Re the 5 year warranty, she showed me the section of her documents dealing with that, currently offered by Honda free but have to receive the car no later than end of September and this may not be possible as they are estimating up to 2 month delay to receive it (apparently Honda stopped production for 3 months during lockdown so there is a backlog). To buy it would run a little over 8k but she suggested to hold off on that as Honda might again offer it free after the current promotion ends. I'm a pretty good judge of character and I believe she was being truthful and that she will follow up on it. She also offered me choice of insurance company, which none of the others dealers did.

 

I do not know if the internal  documents she had are for all Honda dealerships or specific to just that one but seemed to be generic. (In which case the 2 upcountry dealers who insisted they could not discount further were lying. They were also wrong in guaranteeing the free 5 year warranty, maybe that would have come to light later as they may not have actually checked with the factory yet to find out the delivery time).

 

Most refreshing, she was able to negotiate and close a deal herself, working from what were obviously clear parameters well known to her. The upcountry dealers could not, had to constantly check with their manager (in one case involving several days delay for each and every issue such that it took a full 10 days to get a final offer). Perhaps if I had tried to squeeze her further she would have had to get authorization from above but as she was offering better than anyone else had already, and I really liked her and she was taking plenty of time to answer all my questions in full, and I knew that at most I might get another 1-2k off, I was disinclined to do that.

 

So we settled and I paid the deposit. We agreed that I need not come back until the paperwork needed to register it in Prachinburi is ready (we had already had a clear discussion about that and she promised it in under 30 days from date the car arrives at the dealership) but I will need to pay the balance once they get the car in.

 

Anyone wanting to buy a Honda and living in or within reasonable drive of Bangkok I wholeheartedly recommend Khun Jah Jaa at Honda Ekamai. I would also suggest not wasting too much time with upcountry dealers if the nearest one does not work out well.

 

I would add that there is no truth at all to the idea that it is currently a buyer's market, at least not for Honda in the central provinces and Bangkok. I suspect those saying this are just making an assumption and have not actually bought a car recently. All the dealerships I went to were packed and doing brisk business, which may have to do with the fact that they were  closed for 3 months during lockdown leading to a backlog in consumer demand.

 

And of course not at all true that "cash is king", cash as far as car dealers in Thailand are concerned is a negative factor that makes a sale less attractive.

 

 

 

[Lancashirelad]

Excellent write up Sheryl and very informative. A classic example of why it's worth spending a bit of time & effort visiting several dealers. I'm pleased you finally got it sorted. What colour have you ordered?  I'm sorry I misunderstood a few posts back and thought you'd already ordered when you han't.

[Sheryl]

Silver.

 

 

[HauptmannUK]

4 hours ago, Sheryl said:

 

 

I would add that there is no truth at all to the idea that it is currently a buyer's market, at least not for Honda in the central provinces and Bangkok. I suspect those saying this are just making an assumption and have not actually bought a car recently. All the dealerships I went to were packed and doing brisk business, which may have to do with the fact that they were  closed for 3 months during lockdown leading to a backlog in consumer demand.

 

And of course not at all true that "cash is king", cash as far as car dealers in Thailand are concerned is a negative factor that makes a sale less attractive.

 

 

 

A good outcome.

I am a partner in a used car business in the UK (mostly a 'sleeping partner' because I usually spend half the year in Thailand but actually working at the moment due to being stuck in UK!).

We have a 40-car pitch and service/MoT workshop. We work with several finance companies and typically receive 5-10% commission on a finance acceptance. We receive a higher commission if the customer pays a higher interest rate. In a typical month we would receive over £3000 commission which is enough to cover power, water, internet and waste etc bills. Its a vital income stream.  In fact you could say finance customers subsidise cash buyers....    I would imagine commissions in Thailand are not dissimilar.

Over 80% of cars in the UK are bought with finance, probably higher in Thailand. The last thing I want is a customer paying cash. The worst ones are the punters that turn up holding a bundle of cash expecting 20% off. Watching too many TV shows I think.....   Not only will they get nothing off but we actively avoid taking physical cash (money laundering regs and risk of counterfeit notes).

The car market in the UK is currently very strong and prices at an all time high. Cars are in short supply. Pent up demand following lockdown and the government has been handing out a lot of money.

I do expect a downturn though, as the impact of job losses makes itself felt. There will be lots of defaults. UK and Thailand both I think...

 

[Lancashirelad]

@HauptmannUK I thought you seemed to know what you were talking about. ????  No doubt you're already aware, but seems like you might be getting less finance commission in the near future: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-50052375

[HauptmannUK]

19 hours ago, Lancashirelad said:

@HauptmannUK I thought you seemed to know what you were talking about. ????  No doubt you're already aware, but seems like you might be getting less finance commission in the near future: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-50052375

Yes, this has been rumbling along for a couple of years now and will be implemented soon.  Actually we don't think our commission will change much, its more to crack down on the dodgy players who only quote '£X per week' and never the APR and then bounce the customer onto a high APR to maximise commission.

No doubt worse goes on in Thailand, from my observation..

[sucit]

On 8/4/2020 at 8:33 PM, Sheryl said:

Well, matters have progressed after my trip to Bangkok.

 

I stopped at 3 dealers, one on the outskirts (Thanyaburi) and 2 in Bangkok. The first one (Thanyaburi) was so crowded that I gave up after a while and left; this was on a Sunday afternoon so perhaps to be expected.

 

Monday went first to Honda Sathorn.  Was referred to a rep who spoke English, before we even sat down she asked me "cash or financing?", obviously has sold to foreigners before so did not assume financing.  We then sat down and despite my having clearly said manual transmission, started pointing on the price list to automatics. I again repeated that I wanted MT. She said they did not have any in stock, which of course I expected. I asked if she could order it and she said "No, cannot -- too old, too long ago" (I did not understand that part). I told her that 3 other dealers had told me they could order it so would she please check. She  got up, walked out of sight and then returned in under 60 seconds, obviously not having checked anything, and  said "no, we cannot order it for you". Clearly not interested in selling  a Jazz for cash and wanting to get rid of me as quickly as possible. Made no effort to suggest any alternative cars. I left.  The only positive I can say for that experience was that it was air-conditioned so unlike my up country dealer visits I was not reduced to a pile of sweat.

 

I next went to Honda Ekamai. Very pleasant, down to earth sales rep who spoke English well, was knowledgable about all aspects of the car and the registration process (a first) and both candid, and pleasant,  and reasonably interested in making the sale.  She showed me  internal documents she had which listed what extras could be had for free and what the maximum discount possible was; for paying cash this was 35,000 baht but inclusive of the value of the insurance so a little under 15,000 discount with the insurance - still almost 10k  better  than the upcountry dealers had offered. (This 35k was specific to Jazz.  other models, different amounts but I did not make note of how much).  Tinted windows free. Re the 5 year warranty, she showed me the section of her documents dealing with that, currently offered by Honda free but have to receive the car no later than end of September and this may not be possible as they are estimating up to 2 month delay to receive it (apparently Honda stopped production for 3 months during lockdown so there is a backlog). To buy it would run a little over 8k but she suggested to hold off on that as Honda might again offer it free after the current promotion ends. I'm a pretty good judge of character and I believe she was being truthful and that she will follow up on it. She also offered me choice of insurance company, which none of the others dealers did.

 

I do not know if the internal  documents she had are for all Honda dealerships or specific to just that one but seemed to be generic. (In which case the 2 upcountry dealers who insisted they could not discount further were lying. They were also wrong in guaranteeing the free 5 year warranty, maybe that would have come to light later as they may not have actually checked with the factory yet to find out the delivery time).

 

Most refreshing, she was able to negotiate and close a deal herself, working from what were obviously clear parameters well known to her. The upcountry dealers could not, had to constantly check with their manager (in one case involving several days delay for each and every issue such that it took a full 10 days to get a final offer). Perhaps if I had tried to squeeze her further she would have had to get authorization from above but as she was offering better than anyone else had already, and I really liked her and she was taking plenty of time to answer all my questions in full, and I knew that at most I might get another 1-2k off, I was disinclined to do that.

 

So we settled and I paid the deposit. We agreed that I need not come back until the paperwork needed to register it in Prachinburi is ready (we had already had a clear discussion about that and she promised it in under 30 days from date the car arrives at the dealership) but I will need to pay the balance once they get the car in.

 

Anyone wanting to buy a Honda and living in or within reasonable drive of Bangkok I wholeheartedly recommend Khun Jah Jaa at Honda Ekamai. I would also suggest not wasting too much time with upcountry dealers if the nearest one does not work out well.

 

I would add that there is no truth at all to the idea that it is currently a buyer's market, at least not for Honda in the central provinces and Bangkok. I suspect those saying this are just making an assumption and have not actually bought a car recently. All the dealerships I went to were packed and doing brisk business, which may have to do with the fact that they were  closed for 3 months during lockdown leading to a backlog in consumer demand.

 

And of course not at all true that "cash is king", cash as far as car dealers in Thailand are concerned is a negative factor that makes a sale less attractive.

 

 

 

I am getting the same type of responses to queries about manual transmission jazz vehicles. Dealers say they do not have them. I was going to believe them but I saw you had trouble too and you actually got one.

 

Does anyone happen to know if MT Jazz are actually completely unavailable and unorderable in Thailand? 

[canthai55]

7 minutes ago, sucit said:

Does anyone happen to know if MT Jazz are actually completely unavailable and unorderable in Thailand? 

https://www.honda.co.th/jazz

[sucit]

3 minutes ago, canthai55 said:

https://www.honda.co.th/jazz

Thanks for the help but they list MT on websites, they even have them on the price sheets at the dealerships.

 

But when you go in, nobody is interested in ordering them for you. I am wondering if ordering one is impossible and I should give up, or as the op did, sorta been firm and went to a dozen or so places and found one. 

[Sheryl]

14 hours ago, sucit said:

I am getting the same type of responses to queries about manual transmission jazz vehicles. Dealers say they do not have them. I was going to believe them but I saw you had trouble too and you actually got one.

 

Does anyone happen to know if MT Jazz are actually completely unavailable and unorderable in Thailand? 

 

Most dealers do not have them in stock. They can be ordered.

 

Try Honda Ekkamai, Khun Ja Jah

[sometimewoodworker]

On 7/9/2021 at 8:56 AM, sucit said:

Thanks for the help but they list MT on websites, they even have them on the price sheets at the dealerships.

 

But when you go in, nobody is interested in ordering them for you. I am wondering if ordering one is impossible and I should give up, or as the op did, sorta been firm and went to a dozen or so places and found one. 

The dealers already own the vehicles they have on the show room floor and in their storage areas so that’s what they want to sell MT vehicles are produced less frequently so often longer lead times & are much less in demand so if you walk away from the deal your deposit, if small, isn’t going to help the dealership much selling an unpopular version. 
A dealership that sells lots of vehicles will have less problems & one that is used to foreign buyers will be more helpful. 

[sucit]

9 minutes ago, sometimewoodworker said:

The dealers already own the vehicles they have on the show room floor and in their storage areas so that’s what they want to sell MT vehicles are produced less frequently so often longer lead times & are much less in demand so if you walk away from the deal your deposit, if small, isn’t going to help the dealership much selling an unpopular version. 
A dealership that sells lots of vehicles will have less problems & one that is used to foreign buyers will be more helpful. 

So, MT is on website. I have been told unequivocally multiple times they don’t have them and cannot be ordered. I guess if you guys are correct my question has been answered… don’t listen to what the people in the Honda dealerships tell me. Ok, it all makes perfect sense, once again. Thanks for the help. I will keep asking them. 

[HAPPYNUFF]

Didnt read all the replies, but those I did cover most points..   One other, when  we bought our pickup, I  wanted it white in colour.   Better on road visibility   for others. to see. (and avoid) Told the salesman that, got immediate 7000 baht discount.   As  stated, you should also get first year  license, third party, and vehicle  1st class insurance for free.   You   should check the vehicle compliance plate in the engine compartment to  check the date when the  vehicle was manufactured,  for instance, if you were buying  a car  say  early in a year,,,  January  to say May,  you would most probably find it was manufactured the previous year, so you car is already one year old  by  re sale standards. Also  demand quality tyres,  say Michelin or similar..  Good luck.

[sometimewoodworker]

57 minutes ago, sucit said:

if you guys are correct my question has been answered… don’t listen to what the people in the Honda dealerships tell me. Ok, it all makes perfect sense,

They are selling cars (mostly ones already in dealerships), everything they say supports that or agrees with you. Truth to them is a concept that is mailable and not needed if it goes against selling what they have. 
 

They are not all automatically lies, but they are certainly not automatically true

[sucit]

12 hours ago, sometimewoodworker said:

They are selling cars (mostly ones already in dealerships), everything they say supports that or agrees with you. Truth to them is a concept that is mailable and not needed if it goes against selling what they have. 
 

They are not all automatically lies, but they are certainly not automatically true

Yes, I mean for example, if I had to guess right now if they have mt or not, I’d have no idea. It just seems so strange to me everything is like this here. Why not just say “we don’t sell the mt here” or something similar. Because I bet that is the truth. But when you ask them it’s a full blown “no you can’t get it no matter what” yet it’s all over the website in mt. 
 

it would just be nice to get a straight answer is all, and it would take to fking seconds. 

[sometimewoodworker]

23 minutes ago, sucit said:

It just seems so strange to me everything is like this here. Why not just say “we don’t sell the mt here” or something similar. Because I bet that is the truth. But when you ask them it’s a full blown “no you can’t get it no matter what” yet it’s all over the website in mt. 

it’s because it’s Thailand! 

Why it is phrased like that I don’t know yet. But I’ve heard the “not available in Thailand” often enough to know that it’s the usual way of saying we don’t have it. I know that if I walk down the street to the correct shop the answer will be “how many do you want and what colour”

 

Having spent over 30 years in the Far East I’ve learned that there are totally different ways of thinking here and what is logical for you is not logical for someone from Southeast Asia. Why is a whole field of study.