Covid-19: Keep wearing masks - risks from asymptomatic young people on the rise

[nbg]

5 minutes ago, rwill said:

Besides the only ones with Covid-19 in Thailand now are the ones returning from other countries.

Are they testing at random on the general population and not only on overseas returnees? For sure they will be testing "domestically" on people with symptoms but without random mass testing the data will be false

[bipper]

1 hour ago, Enoon said:

 

Studies, here in "plague ridden" UK, have shown that COVID infects all age groups more or less equally, but heavily favours killing the older groups.

 

The younger ones know they are highly unlikely to die, so tend to mingle freely, thus spreading it and killing off more of the vulnerable oldies.

 

+50 years old is where the risk starts to look more worthy of "consideration".

 

As of 22 May, below 50 it had killed less than about 1 in every 15,000 people.

 

50-59 year olds about 1 in 5000.

 

60-69 about 1 in 1800

 

70-79 about 1 in 654

 

80-89 about 1 in 200

 

Here the virus might well be named "The Remainers Revenge".

 

 

 

 

 

Correct. The focus of the item as posted was the asymptomatic nature of young people. Not how they are affected but how they can effect others including their families. It not about the UK not everything is. Here in Thailand more often than not families live together grandparents to babies even great grandparents and a new born live in a house on my Soi. There is no social distancing in these households it isn't possible. The article refers to the dangers of young asymptomatic people bringing the virus back to the more vulnerable. This wouldn't need to be explained if you read it again and understood it's about Thai society not British.

[DavisH]

12 hours ago, JCP108 said:

If the people in the study were healthy and with no symptoms, why did so many get tested?

 

An article in the online site that can't be quoted today stated that Thailand's success was because they were only testing people with symptoms.

Contract tracing picked some up - those at high risk were tested. Usually those in contact with known cases. Also, some have been picked up as they were tested before having operations. Not sure on that number though. 

 

If there were indeed large numbers of asymptomatic carriers where I would have expected a lot more cases of those with symptoms (n local cases for 17 days isn't it?). Either that, or they are not likely to spread the virus. 

[DrJack54]

13 minutes ago, bipper said:

This wouldn't need to be explained if you read it again and understood it's about Thai society not British.

Rather than type rubbish. Outline your plan where the 20-29 bracket can live their lives currently in Thailand with various restrictions and then be able to return home where there are perhaps vulnerable elderly folk.

Outline your workable plan instead of childish posts

[GAZZPA]

26 minutes ago, bipper said:

Correct. The focus of the item as posted was the asymptomatic nature of young people. Not how they are affected but how they can effect others including their families. It not about the UK not everything is. Here in Thailand more often than not families live together grandparents to babies even great grandparents and a new born live in a house on my Soi. There is no social distancing in these households it isn't possible. The article refers to the dangers of young asymptomatic people bringing the virus back to the more vulnerable. This wouldn't need to be explained if you read it again and understood it's about Thai society not British.

Bit harsh, no need to attack with your anti- British stuff. I think he was just highlighting the data from the UK because the country has suffered and therefore has a lot of data on the facts. The point about how people suffer and die and the relation to age is correct, younger people who catch it can show no symptoms but they can spread it to people who will suffer. Simple really.

[GAZZPA]

1 hour ago, DrJack54 said:

I very rarely quote complete post. However your post deserves more than token like smile. 

Your spot on.

 

I think any sensible person would come to same conclusion,, wouldn't they? I do hope so because the wheels have to keep turning in order to clothe, feed and shelter families. Anyway, thanks for the comment, nice to know there are other sensible people about. ????

[rott]

2 hours ago, GAZZPA said:

Im sorry to hear that you suffer with an oxygen tank, must be difficult. The issue is not really with fitness though, yes being healthy is better but I am relatively fit and overall a clean bill of health but I have type 2 diabetes, the virus plays havoc with your blood sugar which could lead to organ failure, so fit or not I am at risk. Diabetes is rampant in the world today, it is very well documented that there are probably millions of people walking around with it and are not diagnosed. You cant feel diabetes until you get sick, it's silent, just like heart disease but it can be devastating to your health if not managed properly. Blindness, amputation, organ failure are all possible if it is not managed, the virus is just another thing to watch out for. Not good for people like me and of course millions of other. I suspect people who do catch the virus will also be finding out they have diabetes when being treated. Anyway, stay safe and I hope things go well for you. 

But surely diabetes is diagnosed through a simple blood test? 

[rott]

1 hour ago, DrJack54 said:

I very rarely quote complete post. However your post deserves more than token like smile. 

Your spot on.

 

I remember the days when mods would chastise people for quoting long posts only to reply with a two line answer. 

 

Standards are not what they were. 

[Mac98]

Different 'expert' every day. Once all 8,000 'experts' have had their day in the spotlight each one will be able to publish their book, "How I Stopped the Pandemic". That's when we can take our masks off.

[Sametboy2019]

Read a report the other day saying Asymptomatic people cant spread it and also young children.

[spidermike007]

6 hours ago, ukrules said:

There is no mention of new cases, it's pretty clear that they're talking about the people who tested positive during the initial epidemic which is now over in Thailand.

 

The headline of this article / forum topic name is very misleading, nothing is on the rise.

 

The risk of transmission from asymptomatic 'young uns' hasn't changed - they just know a little more about it now than they did before.

 

Thank you. A voice of reason, in the wilderness of horrendously bad information, panic and lack of knowledge 

[GAZZPA]

2 hours ago, rott said:

But surely diabetes is diagnosed through a simple blood test? 

No, not that simple. A simple test can determine your blood sugar at that moment in time, if you continue to take your blood sugar over a short period you can determine if you "may" have diabetes. The only way to be sure is to have an HBA1C blood test which takes a bit of time and will be done usually by a Doctor / Nurse.

[GAZZPA]

2 hours ago, rott said:

I remember the days when mods would chastise people for quoting long posts only to reply with a two line answer. 

 

Standards are not what they were. 

Why, I think most people are capable of concentrating for more then 30 seconds whilst reading? Don't see why you think a comprehensive post means standards have slipped. 

[bipper]

3 hours ago, DrJack54 said:

Rather than type rubbish. Outline your plan where the 20-29 bracket can live their lives currently in Thailand with various restrictions and then be able to return home where there are perhaps vulnerable elderly folk.

Outline your workable plan instead of childish posts

What kind of stupid are you? The article outlined the plan. Christ you can't read either. Why would I come up with anything that's up to experts but you idiots poke holes in every damn thing I'd say look to your own mess first and don't be telling the Thais what they should be doing when you're the worst in Europe yourselves. Thailand is doing fine.

[buasaard]

16 hours ago, DrJack54 said:

Just a question. How many in the 20-29yr group have been hospitalized and how many have died?

Excluding pre-existing health factors.

Why, people with pre existing conditions no matter if the die or get hospitalized? 

[ukrules]

6 hours ago, DrTuner said:

The deal with asymptomatic people and transmission is a PR nightmare, thanks to WHO. When one thinks about it logically, for a carrier to shed the virus, either he/she must pick the nose to get some goop and deposit it on a surface, or it must come out of the airways. Since they are asymptomatic, they don't cough, so that part of R is greatly reduced - no flying particles. Choirs and other loud shouting excluded.

 

In other words, if you're asymptomatic, some of the transmission methods that would be present with symptomatic carriers are not present. Hence, reduced R, reduced risk. 

The reason we're reading so much about it is due to China and their propaganda and the way the WHO is playing along with them.

 

I'm assured that technically people do breathe out virions even without a cough or sneeze, similar to what happens with influenza, that these move no more than a short distance away from the face doesn't seem to matter to the people running around screaming about asymptomatic transmission - it's a technical threat (a slight possibility) and has been used to ramp up fear of the virus and wreck economies. It's a part of what I'm going to call 'the lie'.

 

China has been working very hard to make sure people fear COVID more than anything and they've put out all sorts of exaggerated numbers and figures to make people think it's far worse than it really is.

 

Had the full facts been known back in January/February there would have been no large scale lockdowns. I believe China knew the full facts and at some point they decided to lie to everyone and cause widespread economic turmoil. This will come back to haunt them for decades to come.

 

Edited June 11, 2020 by ukrules

[kiwikeith]

16 hours ago, smedly said:

took the 5 months to figure out

 

so how many were/are infected in Thailand and how many have died undiagnosed ?

I watched a interview with 2 top experts on c19 and they said asymtomatic people are healthy people 

[JCP108]

4 hours ago, ukrules said:

 

 

Had the full facts been known back in January/February there would have been no large scale lockdowns. I believe China knew the full facts and at some point they decided to lie to everyone and cause widespread economic turmoil. This will come back to haunt them for decades to come.

 

Agree. 

 

https://www.news-medical.net/amp/news/20200608/Cremation-numbers-reveal-possible-suppression-of-true-COVID-19-data-in-China.aspx

[hotchilli]

22 hours ago, webfact said:

A Thai health ministry disease expert has warned the public that a high number of school students, students and younger people in the workplace have been found to have coronavirus.

 

They are healthy and have no symptoms of the disease and are thus a high risk group for the spread of the virus.

Yet Thailand boasts that it is locally coronavirus free, no new cases reported for over 14 days, [incubation period] with only returning Thais infected who go to quarantine facilities?

How are they able to spread what supposedly doesn't exist?

[Bender Rodriguez]

On 6/11/2020 at 7:48 AM, DrJack54 said:

Just a question. How many in the 20-29yr group have been hospitalized and how many have died?

Excluding pre-existing health factors.

EXACTLY ....

 

scare people, panic, we are all going to die

 

yeah, from ROAD ACCIDENTS, medicine, alcohol...

 

 

would like to see the "education" of the so called experts

 

all army boys & girls, you can see who is in charge of the country

Edited June 12, 2020 by Bender Rodriguez

[bipper]

12 hours ago, GAZZPA said:

Bit harsh, no need to attack with your anti- British stuff. I think he was just highlighting the data from the UK because the country has suffered and therefore has a lot of data on the facts. The point about how people suffer and die and the relation to age is correct, younger people who catch it can show no symptoms but they can spread it to people who will suffer. Simple really.

Just as soon as you clowns with the worse record in Europe (takes some doing to top Italy) stop the Thai bashing when they very clearly got a lot more correct than you lot.

[marquis22]

21 hours ago, JCP108 said:

Prepare yourself for a lot of wise cracks about 7-11 girls and 50+ touches. 

 

More seriously, will someone please do a public education campaign about the proper use of gloves?! If you wear a glove and touch all the same things as you would with your hand, the only thing that gets preserved is whatever was on your hand at the time you put on the glove. All the new things you touch until you take off the gloves cross-contaminate each other. I watched a clerk at a restaurant touch literally 25 different things (including her mask and nose) in the span of five minutes the other day.

My gripe also, how can gloves prevent any cross-contamination if they touch infected parts of the body or utensils etc etc then go handle 'things' that other people touch. If a covid sufferer coughs into his gloved hand then shakes my hand I still get infected. If I am wearing gloves and then touch my face same same.

[JCP108]

Am I confused about one needing to have symptoms and then get tested positive and then retested and positive again in order to be one of the official 3,126 cases? I thought that was clarified. You can't be an official case if you are asymptomatic even if you test positive. Anyone remember the official MOPH algorithm? 

[zhounan]

Absolutely misinformation! The constant use of masks creates Hypercapnia.

These people will have to pay for their crimes. 

What are these experts have in their mind? Do they really want to psychologically reprogram people and transform the world? Who is paying these experts to create social fear?

 

 

Edited June 12, 2020 by zhounan

[phetchy]

Is the head honcho from the Health Ministry really saying "If visiting Soi 6 (Pattaya), avoid the younger ones in short tartan skirt and a school tie, and as far as the mask goes, opt for the more mature, two bags over the head version just in case"?    

[uhuh]

On 6/11/2020 at 8:20 AM, JCP108 said:

If the people in the study were healthy and with no symptoms, why did so many get tested?

 

An article in the online site that can't be quoted today stated that Thailand's success was because they were only testing people with symptoms.

Many countries do this,  the most successful of all  - Taiwan - did that when they still had the virus,  Japan does this and their results are better than the West (worst in Asia,  though - except for Indonesia)

[uhuh]

On 6/11/2020 at 6:48 PM, DrTuner said:

The deal with asymptomatic people and transmission is a PR nightmare, thanks to WHO. When one thinks about it logically, for a carrier to shed the virus, either he/she must pick the nose to get some goop and deposit it on a surface, or it must come out of the airways. Since they are asymptomatic, they don't cough, so that part of R is greatly reduced - no flying particles. Choirs and other loud shouting excluded.

 

In other words, if you're asymptomatic, some of the transmission methods that would be present with symptomatic carriers are not present. Hence, reduced R, reduced risk. 

Infected people who have not yet developed symptoms ("presymptomatic") and infect others are responsible for almost 50% of the infections. They are very infectious about one day before symptoms start. 

Once they have developed symptoms,  they are still very infectious for about a day, then infectivity tapers slowly off for about a week, maybe 10 days - this causes over 50% of infections. 

 

"Asymptomatic" infected people who never develop symptoms are not responsible for many cases. That's the state of science as of now. 

 

How dangerous young people without symptoms are is a subject of hot debate in the scientific community. 

Personally, I think they are the most dangerous of all, but the studies so far cannot give us a definitive answer. 

 

 

[bipper]

14 hours ago, marquis22 said:

My gripe also, how can gloves prevent any cross-contamination if they touch infected parts of the body or utensils etc etc then go handle 'things' that other people touch. If a covid sufferer coughs into his gloved hand then shakes my hand I still get infected. If I am wearing gloves and then touch my face same same.

Gloves are for the wearer. The wearer washes hands so often during a working day the soap or alcohol destroys hands. That's it noting else doesn't make you any safer.

[marquis22]

On 6/11/2020 at 7:37 PM, mommysboy said:

 

Yes but he wouldn't because he's asymptomatic!

Wouldn't what? Be wearing a mask or cough all over me?

Or if you mean he wouldn't contaminate me, then well as i am not a medical practitioner and I am only going by the OP.

Or maybe you know more than both of us? Your credentials are??

[Derek B]

On 6/11/2020 at 8:09 AM, steven100 said:

Good to remind folks and especially the age bracket mentioned. No harm in his warning to all that now is not the time to be complacent.

I will continue to wear a mask when outside until it is deemed virus free & little chance if none of transmission be others.

Don't forget your gel too.