What Do I Do With A Fridge Grounding Wire?

[CH26]

Hello everyone, 

 

I've been reading these forums for hours trying to solve this but I really don't understand enough. Can anyone give me a simple

 

answer? 

 

I just got a new fridge and it has a grounding wire which I need to screw to the back and bury in the earth?! The trouble is, I live in a 21st floor condo and there are no metal pipes for me to attach the wire to. I thought I could connect the grounding wire to a plug and just plug it in another socket but, from what I have read, it seems earthing/grounding of sockets is not to be trusted here. I would ask my building manager if my sockets are grounded but I know he will just say yes regardless. Its a 10+ year old building so I'ts probably safer to assume not. 

 

The question is, what can I do to make it safe? I'm a renter so I can't rewire everything. 

 

I have attached some pictures of the wire, sockets and circuit breaker. I really appreciate any advice! Thanks a lot. 

[bankruatsteve]

You show a receptacle for a 3-pin plug.  Hopefully, that means there is ground available within the socket.  The simplest solution is to off the breaker for that socket (or cut all electricity if you're not sure).  Pop off the cover to the receptacle, take out the screws to the receptacle so that you can pull out and see the connections.  They should be labelled: L, N, and E.  E is earth or ground.  Connect the fridge ground to that terminal.  Pack things back up - you may need to make a small cut to allow the ground wire to route.  Connect the ground to the fridge ground and that's it. 

 

There are other more elegant ways to do this, but this is easiest and assumes you will not be moving the fridge around.

 

Edit:  If there is no wire already connected to E, you are back to square-1.

 

Edited June 12, 2020 by bankruatsteve

[CH26]

Thank you so much for the straightforward answer! I opened it up and there are 3 wires inside so I'm hopeful. Can't see any letters but there is red, white, and green. If I connect just the ground wire into an empty plug, can I just plug it in? Or would it be better to get an electrician to come and properly connect it?

 

Also, I've read lots of these forums today and it seems pretty common to have earth wires that don't actually connect to anything. How can I test that it is actually safe?

 

[stouricks]

Why not dispose with the plug already fitted to the fridge, which is probably moulded. Cut it off and fit a 3 pin plug which you can buy almost anywhere, connecting the loose end of the green wire to the earth pin. Done.

[bankruatsteve]

14 minutes ago, CH26 said:

Can't see any letters but there is red, white, and green. If I connect just the ground wire into an empty plug,

Connect the fridge ground to the same connecter as the green wire. After you pack things back up and on the breaker, just plug in the fridge as normal. You're done. If your fridge ever gives you a "tingle" that's when you need to check the ground in your building. 

Edited June 12, 2020 by bankruatsteve

[worgeordie]

Get a 3 pin plug,connect wires to it, Red live ,White nuterel and green Earth, 

inside the plug should show this,while getting the plug,get some insulating tape,

 wrap your fridge wire with green wire,after fixing to fridge,plug into socket

regards worgeordie

 

[gunderhill]

Trust NOTHING in that socket, check RED actually is  live, Ive been to a condo today where the "electrician" was using YELLOW for  LIve , grey for earth and Black for neutral, all cables were different thicknesses with the earth being the  thinnest , also the yellow  had been joined to a Black somewhere between the shower and the  Breakers in the main board.

Check the earth wire IS  actually earthed not  just disappearing to nowhere.

As mentioned 3  pin plug HOMEPRO is available also Thai Watsadu has them BTCINO brand or Haco  if I remember correctly

[CH26]

Thanks everyone! How do I actually check it is earthed? (Literally all I know how to do is wire a plug!) Is it necessary to remove the two pronged plug and connect all three wires together into a new plug? Or can I leave the current plug as it is (warranty) and just do the ground wire on its own in the next socket?

 

I know my limited capabilities could handle that! 

 

If anyone can recommend a competent electrician I'll get them to do it properly but it seems they are in rather short supply. 

[bankruatsteve]

1 hour ago, CH26 said:

Thanks everyone! How do I actually check it is earthed? (Literally all I know how to do is wire a plug!) Is it necessary to remove the two pronged plug and connect all three wires together into a new plug? Or can I leave the current plug as it is (warranty) and just do the ground wire on its own in the next socket?

 

I know my limited capabilities could handle that! 

 

If anyone can recommend a competent electrician I'll get them to do it properly but it seems they are in rather short supply. 

I recommend that you do what I advised.  It is something anyone can do.  Others have good suggestions, but things can go bad for the unknowing.  Don't worry about your ground unless you have issues.

[CH26]

2 hours ago, bankruatsteve said:

Connect the fridge ground to the same connecter as the green wire. After you pack things back up and on the breaker, just plug in the fridge as normal. You're done. If your fridge ever gives you a "tingle" that's when you need to check the ground in your building. 

Is it dumb if I ask what you mean by connecter? Do I have to cut the earth wire in the wall and connect the wire directly to it? Sounds simple enough in theory but there was barely any length on those wires, what you see in the photo is how far out I was able to pull it. 

 

(Thanks for all your help, I know so little about this!) 

[bankruatsteve]

Don't cut any wires.  If you can't pull it out enough to see the connections, it wasn't done properly.  If you don't see or know how the wires are connected in a receptacle, get your building spark to do it.  Cheers.

[gunderhill]

2 hours ago, CH26 said:

How do I actually check it is earthed?

Go out and buy a multimeter but  I  think this  is a bit  beyond  your ability.

You could go and buy a neon tester screwdriver (59baht) and  shove it  into the red wires hole to check for  live. Earth checking with a multimeter is fairly easy and plenty of You Tube videos on it.

From your questions though I would get someone who really  knows about this to do it for  you.

[lopburi3]

Cheap multi meters are available at any electric shop, Lazada, Shopee or hardware store and are a good investment for the long term.  Check voltage between the the socket normal holes (should be about 220v) then check between ground hole and each of the socket holes - one should be zero and other the same 220v.  That proves ground and you can easily test any socket without removing from wall.  If you do not get about the same voltage reading between the live and ground there is a problem that needs to be taken care of but have someone with experience do it.

[VBF]

4 hours ago, lopburi3 said:

Cheap multi meters are available at any electric shop, Lazada, Shopee or hardware store and are a good investment for the long term.  Check voltage between the the socket normal holes (should be about 220v) then check between ground hole and each of the socket holes - one should be zero and other the same 220v.  That proves ground and you can easily test any socket without removing from wall.  If you do not get about the same voltage reading between the live and ground there is a problem that needs to be taken care of but have someone with experience do it.

Agree with that @lopburi3 but would caution people against buying VERY cheap multimeters.

The worst ones are poorly calibrated, and very poorly constructed, sometimes to the point of being dangerous. I've seen horror shows where the probe insulation was peeling off, thus exposing the wires to the unsuspecting user.  Also, the main body insulation was such that high voltages could be present on case screws (just an example)

Think about those nasty cheap phone chargers that burst into flames and you start to get the idea, or do a search for "cheap multimeter problems "

 

I have a Fluke MM and a Beckman MM - both expensive but trustworthy.

Edited June 12, 2020 by VBF

[Issanman]

Here is one clever method that is being used. But this is wrong, of course.

 

[lopburi3]

7 hours ago, VBF said:

I have a Fluke MM and a Beckman MM - both expensive but trustworthy.

20 years ago maybe cheap were much less accurate or safe but you have never needed a Fluke to get accurate and safe readings for home use.  Any MM is safer than removing outlets for the average homeowner.  Believe viewing instructions would be much more useful than horror shows (which you can find for anything if you look enough).

[VBF]

5 hours ago, lopburi3 said:

20 years ago maybe cheap were much less accurate or safe but you have never needed a Fluke to get accurate and safe readings for home use.  Any MM is safer than removing outlets for the average homeowner.  Believe viewing instructions would be much more useful than horror shows (which you can find for anything if you look enough).

I agree that a Fluke / Beckman are "overkill" - I have them as a legacy of my working life, but I disagree with you if you're implying that none of today's MMs is unsafe.

 

Never mind then my comment "Think about those nasty cheap phone chargers that burst into flames and you start to get the idea, or do a search for "cheap multimeter problems" but just go to a market and look at the quality of some supercheap MMs. I've seen some in Thailand that I would never trust with Mains voltages, but I've also seen some respectable ones. 

I guess I'm suggesting "Caveat Emptor"

[Mama Noodle]

21 hours ago, stouricks said:

Why not dispose with the plug already fitted to the fridge, which is probably moulded. Cut it off and fit a 3 pin plug which you can buy almost anywhere, connecting the loose end of the green wire to the earth pin. Done.

 

This is what I would be looking at, not at the very least because of ease of use. This way you can plug and unplug the appliance and move it around to any plug in the house. 

 

Otherwise as far as OP goes and his skill level I wouldn't use the green wire at all - just tie it up out of the way and plug the sucker in. 

[Mama Noodle]

6 hours ago, lopburi3 said:

20 years ago maybe cheap were much less accurate or safe but you have never needed a Fluke to get accurate and safe readings for home use.  Any MM is safer than removing outlets for the average homeowner.  Believe viewing instructions would be much more useful than horror shows (which you can find for anything if you look enough).

 

Agree with this as well, and this is coming from someone who owns Fluke tools in a professional capacity. 

 

But for a homeowner just a simple 'cheap' DVOM is fine for checking voltage and resistance. And those little body-grounding voltage detectors are handy (some say they are dangerous) or a non-contact voltage detector. All of the above can be bought for under 1000 baht and will be fine for a basic user as long as the user knows how to use it and confirm its actually working - which is a whole other matter. 

[lopburi3]

41 minutes ago, VBF said:

I guess I'm suggesting "Caveat Emptor"

Can't argue that but have bought a blister pak meter from Lotus about 15 years ago and seemed to be fine (and cheap).  In a working life started with Triplett and even RCA volt meters and then the Flukes so kind of happy with some of the small cheap stuff that is now available.  Really like this little automatic unit for under $20 which has very safe probes (mine is Hyelec).

Edited June 13, 2020 by lopburi3

[stouricks]

Whatever happened to AVO meters?

[jastheace]

4 hours ago, stouricks said:

Whatever happened to AVO meters?

bought out/ changed name/ merged with 'megger instruments'. factory's still in Dover UK. 

[Metropolitian]

Anyone got a deja vu feeling here?

 

I did , and this is why.

 

 

????

 

 

Anyway; if the fridge can use two socket, nothing wrong with using another plug for only the green wire and keep the original plug intact.

I myself use a banana plug and stick it in the earth hole in the same outlet as the cable for the fridge, which is euro-plug, is connected.

 

 

[alacrity]

On 6/12/2020 at 8:11 PM, lopburi3 said:

Cheap multi meters are available at any electric shop, Lazada, Shopee or hardware store and are a good investment for the long term.  Check voltage between the the socket normal holes (should be about 220v) then check between ground hole and each of the socket holes - one should be zero and other the same 220v.  That proves ground and you can easily test any socket without removing from wall.  If you do not get about the same voltage reading between the live and ground there is a problem that needs to be taken care of but have someone with experience do it.

Unlikely to be an absolute zero.  Theoretically, the higher the value is, the poorer the earthing circuit.

If the value is high. Back emf can cause spurious results.

Crosscheck that by simply probing the terminals with the live input to the DMM and the -ve/LO terminal to to the floor or wall your apartment.

7 to 15V should be considered as normal. Approaching 32V is permissible, but not so good.

Haven't seen a domestic refrigerator, with a separate earthing requirement for more than 20 years. 

[Startmeup]

I’m having similar issue as the OP but I only have two pin plugs.

 

Aren’t all these fridges double insulated anyway? I would have to imagine the bulk of these earth cables never get any attention on installation. 

[xylophone]

20 minutes ago, Startmeup said:

I’m having similar issue as the OP but I only have two pin plugs.

 

Aren’t all these fridges double insulated anyway? I would have to imagine the bulk of these earth cables never get any attention on installation. 

You are probably right when you say that, "aren't all of these fridges double insulated anyway?"....... 

 

Luckily enough whenever I have had to install something like this or a large microwave, I have found a way to earth them satisfactorily, and being an electrical engineer by profession (although long since stopped practising it) I knew what I was doing.

 

Then a friend asked me to look at his fridge/freezer because he was getting a "tickle" from it, which was very noticeable, so I used my multimeter on it and sure enough there was around 50 V between the fridge and earth! 

 

I ran a separate earth wire from the back of the fridge to a socket outlet nearby and that cured it, so the moral of this story is not to rely solely on "double insulation"!