China wants a canal to cross Thailand into the Indian Ocean

[webfact]

China wants a canal to cross Thailand into the Indian Ocean

Beijing might back Muslim rebels to secede if Thailand becomes less China-friendly: Foreign Policy

By Matthew Strong, Taiwan News, Staff Writer

 

FILE PHOTO

 

TAIPEI (Taiwan News) — As tension between China and India mounts, the former wants to build a canal across Thailand’s Isthmus of Kra to shorten its access to the Indian Ocean by 1,100 kilometers, reports said Thursday (Sept. 3).

 

At present, one of China’s weak points is that oil tankers, freighters and warships have to sail south to round Singapore and West Malaysia via the Malacca Strait. Beijing would like to reduce the problem by building the “Thai Canal” between the Gulf of Thailand and the Andaman Sea in Southern Thailand, a project estimated to cost US$30 billion (NT$880 billion).

 

Foreign Policy drew parallels between the eventual Chinese canal in Thailand and the Panama Canal, which caused Panama to secede from Colombia with more than a century of American domination as a result.

 

-- © Copyright Taiwan News 2020-09-04

 

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[ezzra]

Sure, why not, anything for big brother right?...

[Poet]

This idea has been floated for quite a while.

It would be a massive engineering project. Even across the narrowest part of Thailand, it would be far more difficult than any previous canal, probably requiring the use of small nuclear detonations.

Past governments have rejected the idea, mainly because there would be no particular financial benefit to Thailand while encouraging the Muslim separatists to claim the entire area south of the canal.

Now, however, the Chinese view war with the US is a credible future possibility, and this Army government are sufficiently in hock to the Chinese to not have much choice in the matter.

 

Edited September 4, 2020 by Poet

[baansgr]

Under the Anglo-Thai peace treaty signed in 1946, they are not allowed to build a canal without permission from the British Government....along with the fact it would offer the resurgents in the South advantages, it isn't going to happen...

[Poet]

1 minute ago, baansgr said:

Under the Anglo-Thai peace treaty signed in 1946, they are not allowed to build a canal without permission from the British Government....along with the fact it would offer the resurgents in the South advantages, it isn't going to happen...

The Chinese may be able to advise the Thai government on how seriously they should treat their agreements with the British government.
 

[PatOngo]

China, spreading communism to the world! Any takers?

[fangless]

8 minutes ago, Poet said:

Even across the narrowest part of Thailand, it would be far more difficult than any previous canal, probably requiring the use of small nuclear detonations.

Total BS.

 

"The current Thai canal proposal, known as the 9A route, would involve two parallel channels—each 30 meters deep, 180 meters wide, and running 75 miles at sea level from Songkhla on the Gulf of Thailand to Krabi in the Andaman Sea."

 

Please clarify why it is more difficult that the Panama canal which did not use "small nuclear detonations" (they hadn't been invented then I know)

Edited September 4, 2020 by fangless

[Poet]

10 minutes ago, fangless said:

Total BS.

Please clarify why it is more difficult that the Panama canal which did not use "small nuclear detonations" (they hadn't been invented then I know)

Engage brain.

I did not write that the construction of the Panana canal, in the Nineteenth Century, required the use of nuclear detonations. The proposed Kra canal is significantly longer and, because of the way that canal locks work over distance, must be significantly deeper. The ground they must work through is also more difficult.

For that reason, some have suggested that unconventional tools may be needed for the project to be economically viable. One of the techniques under consideration was nuclear detonations to blast through particularly solid stretches. I only mentioned this to highlight just how massive the task would be, and how little justification there is for it other than China's military needs.

You know, if you did a little research you could discover all of this for yourself.

 

Edited September 4, 2020 by Poet

[cmarshall]

16 minutes ago, baansgr said:

Under the Anglo-Thai peace treaty signed in 1946, they are not allowed to build a canal without permission from the British Government....along with the fact it would offer the resurgents in the South advantages, it isn't going to happen...

Hardly relevant after Singapore's independence in 1965.  Anyway, the Thai government will never agree to a canal across the Kra Isthmus.

Edited September 4, 2020 by cmarshall

[RotBenz8888]

It only takes some "gifts" from China to the Thai decision makers to make it happen. 

[thaibeachlovers]

18 minutes ago, baansgr said:

Under the Anglo-Thai peace treaty signed in 1946, they are not allowed to build a canal without permission from the British Government....along with the fact it would offer the resurgents in the South advantages, it isn't going to happen...

LOL. In 1946 Britain was still a major military power. Now however .............................................

IMO Thailand has nothing to fear from ignoring Britain. What's Britain going to do,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,, ban Britons from going to LOS for fun times?

 

The Kra Canal has been mooted for a very long time and would be a good idea, but the Singaporeans would be against it as it would sink Singapore's shipping related industry. Perhaps a solution would be to get them to build it and take a percentage of passage fees. I'd certainly be for them to be doing the maintenance.

[Enki]

19 minutes ago, fangless said:

Total BS.

 

"The current Thai canal proposal, known as the 9A route, would involve two parallel channels—each 30 meters deep, 180 meters wide, and running 75 miles at sea level from Songkhla on the Gulf of Thailand to Krabi in the Andaman Sea."

 

Please clarify why it is more difficult that the Panama canal which did not use "small nuclear detonations" (they hadn't been invented then I know)

Ofc, nukes are not needed. However Russia used some in similar construction projects. And keep in mind, the Panama Chanel Project costed 5600 lives. Mostly to diseases, though.

[Puchaiyank]

I'll give China this: They dream big!

[Enki]

12 minutes ago, cmarshall said:

Hardly relevant after Singapore's independence in 1965.  Anyway, the Thai government will never agree to a canal across the Kra Isthmus.

Hard to say, they would make a fortune on the passage fees.

[thaibeachlovers]

11 minutes ago, Poet said:

Engage brain.

I did not write that the construction of the Panana canal, in the Nineteenth Century, required the use of nuclear detonations. The proposed Kra canal is significantly longer and, because of the way that canal locks work over distance, must be significantly deeper. The ground they must work through is also more difficult.

For that reason, some have suggested that unconventional tools may be needed for the project to be economically viable. One of the techniques under consideration was nuclear detonations to blast through particularly solid stretches.

You know, if you did a little research you could discover all of this for yourself.

 

No need for locks on the Kra canal, and there isn't a sufficient water supply to use them- just make it at sea level. The spoil could be used to create an artificial island to build the container terminal and shipyards on.

[Somtamnication]

I say do it and fill it up with piranhas! 

[thaibeachlovers]

24 minutes ago, fangless said:

Total BS.

 

"The current Thai canal proposal, known as the 9A route, would involve two parallel channels—each 30 meters deep, 180 meters wide, and running 75 miles at sea level from Songkhla on the Gulf of Thailand to Krabi in the Andaman Sea."

 

Please clarify why it is more difficult that the Panama canal which did not use "small nuclear detonations" (they hadn't been invented then I know)

No need for nuclear detonations. Just big bulldozers/ loaders and normal explosives. Nothing difficult about it at all.

[Poet]

1 minute ago, thaibeachlovers said:

No need for locks on the Kra canal, and there isn't a sufficient water supply to use them- just make it at sea level.

How would you get around the need for locks? The land is not level.

Unless they have come up with something pretty amazing over the past few years, that is an inescapeable engineering requirement.
 

 

3 minutes ago, thaibeachlovers said:

The spoil could be used to create an artificial island to build the container terminal and shipyards on.

The Chinese certainly love to build new islands ????

[thaibeachlovers]

1 minute ago, Poet said:

How would you get around the need for locks? The land is not level.

Erm, big bulldozers, explosives and keep digging till reach sea level.

 

It's not even a difficult engineering project. The Australians are good at digging big holes.

[Poet]

2 minutes ago, thaibeachlovers said:

No need for nuclear detonations.

I did not say there was a "need" for nuclear detonations, I said it was considered as a way to bring down the massive costs of the project.

 

4 minutes ago, thaibeachlovers said:

Just big bulldozers/ loaders and normal explosives.

Sure but, again, this would be a huge project, the most ambitious canal project in history. Expensive.
 

 

5 minutes ago, thaibeachlovers said:

Nothing difficult about it at all.

Put in a bid ????
 

[Poet]

1 minute ago, thaibeachlovers said:

Erm, big bulldozers, explosives and keep digging till reach sea level.

 

Just now, fangless said:

Use a big bulldozer.

Guys, seriously. Just spend five minutes reading about how a canal actually works. I promise, you will find it fascinating.

[fangless]

There are many reasons why the canal might never be built but engineering problems are the least likely cause of it not happening.

Edited September 4, 2020 by fangless

[ExpatOilWorker]

If the Greece can do it, surely Thailand can do it. Just start digging.

 

[fangless]

1 minute ago, ExpatOilWorker said:

If the Greece can do it, surely Thailand can do it. Just start digging.

 

It is an amazing feeling when you "navigate" a ship through the Corinth Canal.  The Suez canal is quite boring especially after the recent rebuild!

[Jack Mountain]

Surprised that India isn't kicked out of BRICS yet.

[canuckamuck]

What they need is a rail yard at each coast and loading cranes on each side.

Boat pulls up to the port. multi destination shipments are distributed by train car to specific ships on the other side, pick them up and off you go. All computer controlled. You get the benefit of distribution as well as not needing to divide the country. Ships only need to go part of the distance. No inherent canal problems, like having special pilots, and bottlenecking. You can also choose the location based on land based benefits rather than the place being determined by the narrowness of the land and sea depth. of course this is mainly for container ships.

Edited September 4, 2020 by canuckamuck

[PatOngo]

40 minutes ago, cmarshall said:

Hardly relevant after Singapore's independence in 1965.  Anyway, the Thai government will never agree to a canal across the Kra Isthmus.

It's been considered for decades!

[fangless]

2 minutes ago, canuckamuck said:

What they need is a rail yard at each coast and loading cranes on each side.

Boat pulls up to the port. multi destination shipments are distributed by train car to specific ships on the other side, pick them up and off you go. All computer controlled. You get the benefit of distribution as well as not needing to divide the country. Ships only need to go part of the distance. No inherent canal problems, like having special pilots, and bottlenecking. You can also choose the location based on land based benefits rather than the place being determined by the narrowness of the land and sea depth. of course this is mainly for container ships.

I think the Chinese want to get their actual warships thru the proposed canal.  Your idea does not quite "float" in that regard!

[jvs]

Great for the Thai navy,buy a few subs and get a free canal!!!

Just bring over a few million Chinese grunts and start digging.(or people that need to be re educated)

 

Brings back memories from when i was 16 ,standing at the wheel of a coaster,

The guide would say,'two spokes starboard' answer,'two spokes starboard'.

 

[sungod]

40 minutes ago, thaibeachlovers said:

The spoil could be used to create an artificial island to build the container terminal and shipyards on.

Or a Chinese outpost so they could expand there territorial claims.