Chances of Brexit deal fading every day, EU Commission chief says

[Rookiescot]

5 minutes ago, vogie said:

We are where we are today because a remainer parliament have been procastinating for 3 years.

Scottish indy is for another thread.

You don't want to see the UK/England harmed, no thought for the Welsh then, and others. 

You are still the one that is responible for your own actions or even lack of them, and is the reason where we are today, time to take some responsibility rookie.

And 3 years ago if Johnson had been in charge we would still be facing the same crises.

Leaving with no deal. 

I am always responsible for my actions. You Brexiteers, if you continue to believe the lies told to you, despite all that has happened, need to take FULL responsibility for the harm done to the country. 

[7by7]

59 minutes ago, vogie said:

If you cannot honour a democratic referendum that is entirely up to you and your conscience, ignore democracy at your peril, but don't cry about it when you do.

 How about a Prime Minister who ignores an international agreement which just 9 months ago he was hailing as a personal triumph?

[Loiner]

1 hour ago, welovesundaysatspace said:

Nice example showing why educated people don’t read the garbage press. (1) Quoting only half the statement (2) Using it to falsely claim something that he didn’t say (3) Completely missing the point that it’s the (Democrats controlled) congress that decides (4) Enough to keep their imbecile readers entertained. 
 

Not surprised Brexiteers read these Mickey Mouse papers. 

Ha Ha, even the Euro think they can override UK trade with "My paper is better than your paper." retorts now. Sorry Fritz but it didn't work for the Remainers so won't for you lot.

Better you stick to cartoons and fairy tales in Eurodisney.

[vogie]

Just now, Rookiescot said:

And 3 years ago if Johnson had been in charge we would still be facing the same crises.

Leaving with no deal. 

I am always responsible for my actions. You Brexiteers, if you continue to believe the lies told to you, despite all that has happened, need to take FULL responsibility for the harm done to the country. 

But here is where you have created your own little logjam, you are refusing to acknowledge that if the duplicitous remainers had voted for Mays deal, voila, Boris would not be PM. So not only are you responsible for a probable no deal, you were very instrumental in getting Boris for your PM.????????????

[dunroaming]

1 hour ago, vogie said:

You have just attacked the leader of our country umpteen times there DR whilst defending the EU, most people do not share your intense vehement hatred of our PM and like many on here it all boils down to sour grapes. And again I repeat that the remainer parliament have put you in this position, Boris probably wouldn't have even been PM if the duplicitous MPs had voted for Mays deal, do you agree?

Of course I don't agree.  And yes I have a problem with liars and cheats when they are there supposedly representing me.  But what is worse is that he is an incompetent liar and cheat.  We have all been led astray by a conman now and then but usually they are pretty savvy.  Not so with Boris Johnson.  Well known for avoiding questions by hiding in Toilets whereas savvy conmen at least stand their ground when challenged.

 

Hope my comments on Boris Johnson haven't been ambiguous, would hate to be seen as sitting on the fence.

[vogie]

2 minutes ago, dunroaming said:

Of course I don't agree.  And yes I have a problem with liars and cheats when they are there supposedly representing me.  But what is worse is that he is an incompetent liar and cheat.  We have all been led astray by a conman now and then but usually they are pretty savvy.  Not so with Boris Johnson.  Well known for avoiding questions by hiding in Toilets whereas savvy conmen at least stand their ground when challenged.

 

Hope my comments on Boris Johnson haven't been ambiguous, would hate to be seen as sitting on the fence.

It would be nice occasionally though if you could discuss the topic instead of demonizing Boris all the time. I am sure many people would agree what an amazing start he has had to his leadership and he has come through it with flying colours, not many PMs have had a start to their leadership like Boris, he needs praising not knocking, let's all clap for Boris, you too DR, you know you want to.

 

[RayC]

51 minutes ago, vogie said:

 

 

1 hour ago, vogie said:

You have just attacked the leader of our country umpteen times there DR whilst defending the EU, most people do not share your intense vehement hatred of our PM and like many on here it all boils down to sour grapes. 

I am making an assumption here that you think that Johnson is doing a good job? It would appear that most people in the UK do not share this view (Yes, another opinion poll) https://yougov.co.uk/topics/politics/trackers/boris-johnson-approval-rating

 

1 hour ago, vogie said:

again I repeat that the remainer parliament have put you in this position, Boris probably wouldn't have even been PM if the duplicitous MPs had voted for Mays deal, do you agree?

51 minutes ago, vogie said:

 

 

51 minutes ago, vogie said:

 

And again, no. Those who voted 'Leave' have put us in this position. As @Rookiescot pointed out why would a Remainer vote for something s/he didn't believe in? 'Leavers' are responsible - and should be accountable - for this débâcle.

[dunroaming]

19 minutes ago, vogie said:

But here is where you have created your own little logjam, you are refusing to acknowledge that if the duplicitous remainers had voted for Mays deal, voila, Boris would not be PM. So not only are you responsible for a probable no deal, you were very instrumental in getting Boris for your PM.????????????

Vogie, Boris was always going to be PM, something he had been working on since Cameron was at No.10.  He carefully avoided it too early as instructed by Cummings and let May handle all the Brexit fiasco first.  By the time May was mortally wounded he was the only candidate who was ever going to succeed her.

[vogie]

6 minutes ago, dunroaming said:

Vogie, Boris was always going to be PM, something he had been working on since Cameron was at No.10.  He carefully avoided it too early as instructed by Cummings and let May handle all the Brexit fiasco first.  By the time May was mortally wounded he was the only candidate who was ever going to succeed her.

You are some hell of a psychic, you know there will be a deal, now you know Boris would have become PM. So you don't agree that if Mays deal had been voted on, everything in the parliamentary funny farm would have carried on as normal.

[dunroaming]

6 minutes ago, vogie said:

It would be nice occasionally though if you could discuss the topic instead of demonizing Boris all the time. I am sure many people would agree what an amazing start he has had to his leadership and he has come through it with flying colours, not many PMs have had a start to their leadership like Boris, he needs praising not knocking, let's all clap for Boris, you too DR, you know you want to.

 

When Covid first came to light and Boris stood up and faced the press at the daily briefings, I gave him kudos for that, especially as it followed the hiding in the toilet incident.  I, like most others, were suckered into all the spin and promises.  Didn't last long as all the cracks started to appear and people realised that the handling of the pandemic was an unmitigated disaster.  Then he disappeared from the briefings almost completely leaving others to deal with the awkward questions. 

 

His one saving grace was to give the new chancellor of the exchequer control of the cheque book and he grasped it with both hands.  I will give Rishi Sunak credit for the way he quickly put in place the financial safety net that allowed businesses to stay afloat.  In fact I would even go as far as to say that he looks far more like a proper politician than any of the other charlatans in the cabinet.

 

So there you go Vogie.  I will put my hands together for Rishi Sunak.  Happy now?

[dunroaming]

6 minutes ago, vogie said:

You are some hell of a psychic, you know there will be a deal, now you know Boris would have become PM. So you don't agree that if Mays deal had been voted on, everything in the parliamentary funny farm would have carried on as normal.

Not a psychic.  Just well documented common sense.  May was a puppet and it was only ever until Boris felt the time was right.  He could have had it after Brexit but Cummings knew that the Brexit fallout was going to be bloody and so he waited.

 

This really is obvious stuff as you well know.

[vogie]

1 minute ago, dunroaming said:

When Covid first came to light and Boris stood up and faced the press at the daily briefings, I gave him kudos for that, especially as it followed the hiding in the toilet incident.  I, like most others, were suckered into all the spin and promises.  Didn't last long as all the cracks started to appear and people realised that the handling of the pandemic was an unmitigated disaster.  Then he disappeared from the briefings almost completely leaving others to deal with the awkward questions. 

 

His one saving grace was to give the new chancellor of the exchequer control of the cheque book and he grasped it with both hands.  I will give Rishi Sunak credit for the way he quickly put in place the financial safety net that allowed businesses to stay afloat.  In fact I would even go as far as to say that he looks far more like a proper politician than any of the other charlatans in the cabinet.

 

So there you go Vogie.  I will put my hands together for Rishi Sunak.  Happy now?

Not really, seriously if parliament had have voted for Mays deal, don't you think that parliament would have limped along untill the next election date. Surely the reason May went was because parliament turned down her deal 3 times, Boris would never even have been in the equation IMO.

[Rookiescot]

50 minutes ago, vogie said:

But here is where you have created your own little logjam, you are refusing to acknowledge that if the duplicitous remainers had voted for Mays deal, voila, Boris would not be PM. So not only are you responsible for a probable no deal, you were very instrumental in getting Boris for your PM.????????????

Why would remainers vote for any form of Brexit?

How many times does this need explained to you?

We didnt and still do not want any form of Brexit. Either Mays "deal" or Johnsons no deal.

Which football team do you support and have you at any time, ever, supported the team you are playing against?

[vogie]

Just now, Rookiescot said:

Why would remainers vote for any form of Brexit?

How many times does this need explained to you?

We didnt and still do not want any form of Brexit. Either Mays "deal" or Johnsons no deal.

Which football team do you support and have you at any time, ever, supported the team you are playing against?

You can explain untill you are blue in the face for all I care, you are not listening to what anyone says to you.

You got what you deserved, nothing, all because you refused to accept a democratic vote. At the end of the day one day you might realise that democracy is not all about you, it involves many more people than that. 

[twocatsmac]

32 minutes ago, vogie said:

You can explain untill you are blue in the face for all I care, you are not listening to what anyone says to you.

You got what you deserved, nothing, all because you refused to accept a democratic vote. At the end of the day one day you might realise that democracy is not all about you, it involves many more people than that. 

He explained nothing as usual, only demonstrated poor loser attitude of they were wrong, didn’t know what they were voting for tripe. 

[nauseus]

2 hours ago, Rookiescot said:

Vogie you cant expect remainers to vote for any form of Brexit. Even Brino as you like to call it.

This is because they want to remain in the EU.

Staying in the EU is a known value. We know what it means.

You Brexiteers voted to leave without the terms and conditions being defined. Hence the absolute shambles which has followed.

I dont blame you Vogie. You voted for what you thought was best for the country.

The people I blame are those who lied to you about what Brexit would look like when we eventually left.

Johnson, Gove, Farage and Cummins to name but a few.

The EU has never truly been a known quantity - too many secrets - when you think you know it, it just grows another head. It certainly is not the status quo.

 

In the 70's, who would have known what a corrupt mess it would become (apart from Heath & Co)?

 

No lies from the pro remain side before the referendum then? 

[david555]

Congratulations Thelegraph (I thought never would say that ????…) is the first one to bring a  rumor I heard already …..????

 Barnier or no Barnier … the E.U. parliament shall gave the last word and vote or veto any deal proposed (if any..? ???? ) …. and it does not look good for U.K. 'Boris wish …….. 

 

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2020/09/17/brexit-news-internal-market-bill-boris-johnson-deal-latest/

 Brexit latest news: Europe will block trade deal if Internal Market Bill is not 'rectified', threatens Guy Verhofstadt 

 

The European Parliament will block a post-Brexit trade deal between the UK and EU if Boris Johnson does not 'rectify' the Internal Market Bill further, Guy Verhofstadt has said. 
Mr Johnson's compromise with his backbenchers - whereby MPs will be granted a vote before a minister can use powers which override international law if the EU undermines the "fundamental purpose" of the Northern Ireland Protocol - has gone through on a new policy paper published today. 

But the Prime Minister's "climbdown" over the Internal Market Bill has no bearing on its breach of international law, the outspoken MEP and chair of the now-defunct Brexit Steering Groupsaid. 
European Parliament would "not give its consent to any trade deal" if the bill is not further "rectified", he added.

Earlier this morning Mr Verhofstadt this morning tweeted his support for presidential candidate Joe Biden, saying: "Biden is right. Boris Johnson might not care about international law or the Good Friday Agreement, but there are many who do! The world is watching with disbelief."

 

Edited September 17, 2020 by david555

[kingdong]

54 minutes ago, dunroaming said:

When Covid first came to light and Boris stood up and faced the press at the daily briefings, I gave him kudos for that, especially as it followed the hiding in the toilet incident.  I, like most others, were suckered into all the spin and promises.  Didn't last long as all the cracks started to appear and people realised that the handling of the pandemic was an unmitigated disaster.  Then he disappeared from the briefings almost completely leaving others to deal with the awkward questions. 

 

His one saving grace was to give the new chancellor of the exchequer control of the cheque book and he grasped it with both hands.  I will give Rishi Sunak credit for the way he quickly put in place the financial safety net that allowed businesses to stay afloat.  In fact I would even go as far as to say that he looks far more like a proper politician than any of the other charlatans in the cabinet.

 

So there you go Vogie.  I will put my hands together for Rishi Sunak.  Happy now?

writing cheques your finances can,t cover is never a solution.that money could have been better utilised than paying people80% of their wages to sit at home and scratch themselves for 6 months,all hes done is delay the inevitable,theres a tsunami of job losses in the post,which will start in october.

[elliss]

22 hours ago, OneMoreFarang said:

And Boris makes the situation worse every day. And the UK voters wanted Boris and Brexit. Amazing UK.

I wish them good luck. They will need a lot of that.

 

 

 

     Rather timid performance ..

          I much prefer the aggressive opposition , of red blood socialism . 

          Any names , come too mind ?. 

            Keir <deleted> .. 

[kingdong]

8 minutes ago, nauseus said:

The EU has never truly been a known quantity - too many secrets - when you think you know it, it just grows another head. It certainly is not the status quo.

 

In the 70's, who would have known what a corrupt mess it would become (apart from Heath & Co)?

 

No lies from the pro remain side before the referendum then? 

please correct me if i,m wrong, but wasn,t it a "common market " we voted for in the 70s ?

[kingdong]

2 minutes ago, elliss said:

 

     Rather timid performance ..

          I much prefer the aggressive opposition , of red blood socialism . 

          Any names , come too mind ?. 

            Keir <deleted> .. 

jimmy clitheroe?

[bannork]

2 hours ago, kingdong said:

when i hear the word remainers,why do i mentally associate it with a battered wife in a violent abusive relationship whos too frightened to leave?

Blimey, what sort of couples do you mix with?

When I hear the word remain, I think of parties in my youth- 'What time did you leave?'

''We remained to the end, ended up dancing in the garden at sunrise.'

Bop till you drop,

Remain, return once again.

 

[Proboscis]

7 hours ago, nauseus said:

The fact the Thatcher manged to get a rebate proves that we were being ripped off from the start.

 

Blair manged to give some of this back and if we had stayed in then it would have disappeared entirely. 

 

Your rebate figure is wrong, as is your so-called "shortfall" theory - if we pay no contributions we will keep about 13 billion straight away.

Not quite. Although you will keep the 13 billion, you will either have to pay out for all the programs that the EU provides in the UK or not provide those programs. The programs include regional aid, agricultural subsidies, educational programs and much much more. But the really huge loss will be in trade, including the loss of jobs in exporting industries and the hike in costs of imports. Far more than the miserable 13 billion that you worry about will be wiped off the GDP of the country in 2021 if there is a no deal Brexit. Good luck with that.

[herfiehandbag]

On 9/16/2020 at 8:13 PM, Matzzon said:

Yes, and it´s only UK that is hurting out of that result. Maybe even the pound is going to fall a little bit more. Sometimes it makes one wonder how much the citizens of the UK can take?

Oh we're used to it - 40 odd years of being in the EU has made sure of that! It is known as BOHICA - bend over, here it comes again!

 

The various threats to prevent trade in foodstuffs between Northern Ireland and the rest of the UK, together with the talk from Brussels of punitive tariff regimes designed to punish by damaging or even wrecking certain industries rather reveal the true nature of the beast!

[Rookiescot]

1 hour ago, vogie said:

You can explain untill you are blue in the face for all I care, you are not listening to what anyone says to you.

You got what you deserved, nothing, all because you refused to accept a democratic vote. At the end of the day one day you might realise that democracy is not all about you, it involves many more people than that. 

No Vogie. YOU voted for this mess.

[elliss]

23 hours ago, kingdong said:

should get a few bob for that big red bus,tariffs?theres a whole world out there outside the eu.

     Not forgetting , 

Nigela Farage , was the clippy , on the big red bus .

   Strange World we live in ..

[nauseus]

38 minutes ago, kingdong said:

please correct me if i,m wrong, but wasn,t it a "common market " we voted for in the 70s ?

It was generally termed "common market" in the UK to refer to what was, then, the European Economic Community. We didn't actually vote for it per se. Heath signed us in in 1973 without a referendum first. In 1975 Wilson allowed a referendum and the UK voted to remain in - little had happened on the political front by then and the fishermen were the only ones particularly upset as the CFP had already had had a bad effect. As the economic adjective imples, the term "common market" did seem to make sense. In the mid 70's the UK was still mostly consumed by its domestic economic problems (oil price/ coal miners / strikes / unions and the rest) and there was high unemployment etc. The only way to truly understand the large political implications of joining the EEC would have been for everyone to spend a couple of weeks reading and then trying to digest the Treaty of Rome, the general availability of which was not exactly abundant at the time - no internet, of course. 

Edited September 17, 2020 by nauseus

[welovesundaysatspace]

 

10 minutes ago, herfiehandbag said:

 

The various threats to prevent trade in foodstuffs between Northern Ireland and the rest of the UK

Are you in lala land again? 
 

10 minutes ago, herfiehandbag said:

punitive tariff regimes designed to punish by damaging or even wrecking certain industries

You are in lala land again, aren’t you? 

[nauseus]

27 minutes ago, Proboscis said:

Not quite. Although you will keep the 13 billion, you will either have to pay out for all the programs that the EU provides in the UK or not provide those programs. The programs include regional aid, agricultural subsidies, educational programs and much much more. But the really huge loss will be in trade, including the loss of jobs in exporting industries and the hike in costs of imports. Far more than the miserable 13 billion that you worry about will be wiped off the GDP of the country in 2021 if there is a no deal Brexit. Good luck with that.

Much much more? Sounds like you are trying to sell me something!

[vogie]

13 minutes ago, Rookiescot said:

No Vogie. YOU voted for this mess.

Newton states that every action has an equal and opposite reaction, therefore your inaction leaves you where we are today, up a gumtree waving an EU flag whilst singing 'Don't Leave me This Way'