Brexit brinkmanship: Johnson says prepare for no-deal, cancels trade talks

[vinny41]

1 hour ago, 7by7 said:

 

Leave won on the basis of the many lies they told, primarily those about the single market and immigration. Then there's the £350 million lie as well!

 

If Remain had won on the basis of the far fewer lies they told, then I have no doubt that you and most other Brexiteers would still be calling for another vote.

 

Still, good to see that you are at last acknowledging that Leave lied to us.

 

Majority of leave voters made up their minds in 2010 long before Vote leave was formed on 8th October 2015

There are Polls going back to September 2010 that indicated that 47% would leave the EU if there was a referendum on Britain's membership of the European Union.

http://d25d2506sfb94s.cloudfront.net/cumulus_uploads/document/nqf0ycudkh/YG-Archives-Pol-Trackers-Europe-220113.pdf

 

These polls that a large % of people had decided their position be in remain or leave  6 years before the  referendum in 2016

[RayC]

39 minutes ago, vinny41 said:

 I was replying to RayC post  where he was under the impression that the EU pickup all UK retirees public healthcare costs.

Actually that's not my position. What I said (meant) was the country where you are domiciled (resident) will usually pick up the tab.

 

In the case of Spain, you are deemed to be resident if you spend more than 183 days in the country in any one year. In such cases, Spain will be liable for meeting an individual's treatment costs within Spain irrespective of nationality, and will (probably) be responsible for issuing the EHIC and meeting any costs for treatment in other EU countries.

[RayC]

33 minutes ago, evadgib said:

Statement on UK-Singapore Economic and Business Partnership

 

The UK and Singapore continue their economic cooperation. Excellent news.

 

This is the 6th annual meeting, so presumably the first was held in 2015 (pre-referendum)? Therefore, it begs the question: What has this got to do with Brexit? Unless, of course, you are suggesting that the UK's membership of the EU somehow helped initiate this arrangement? ????

[3NUMBAS]

the eu has now caved in on fishing rights for brit s in their own pond ,how nice of them

[7by7]

1 hour ago, vinny41 said:

 

Not sure what point you are trying to make  I was replying to RayC post  where he was under the impression that the EU pickup all UK retirees public healthcare costs.

 

Clarifying your saying

2 hours ago, vinny41 said:

The UK paid out £674 million in health costs to European countries, but received only £49 million in return.

in what appeared to be an attempt to show the UK was being ripped off.

 

If you are saying that was not your intention I will, of course, believe you.

[7by7]

1 hour ago, vinny41 said:

Majority of leave voters made up their minds in 2010 long before Vote leave was formed on 8th October 2015

There are Polls going back to September 2010 that indicated that 47% would leave the EU if there was a referendum on Britain's membership of the European Union.

http://d25d2506sfb94s.cloudfront.net/cumulus_uploads/document/nqf0ycudkh/YG-Archives-Pol-Trackers-Europe-220113.pdf

 

These polls that a large % of people had decided their position be in remain or leave  6 years before the  referendum in 2016

 

Most polls indicate the majority of voters would now vote Remain if given the chance. Such as these. 

 

Whilst the 'don't knows' mean neither side has over 50% in all of them, a significant number of the polls do have Remain at 50% or more. Also, whilst there are some ties, you have to go back to 2nd March 2018 to find one where Leave comes out ahead.

 

As you are so fond of polls, are you saying that these results show we should have another referendum?

 

Or are you, like others here, only a believer in polls when they produce results with which you agree?

[7by7]

1 hour ago, RayC said:

The UK and Singapore continue their economic cooperation. Excellent news.

 

This is the 6th annual meeting, so presumably the first was held in 2015 (pre-referendum)? Therefore, it begs the question: What has this got to do with Brexit? Unless, of course, you are suggesting that the UK's membership of the EU somehow helped initiate this arrangement? ????

 

As the press release says

Quote

During the EBP, the UK reiterated its intention to pursue accession to the Comprehensive and Progressive Agreement for Trans-Pacific Partnership (CPTPP). 

 The CPTPP is a free trade bloc managed by a commission of appointees. Member states of the CPTPP have to abide by certain rules and can be punished if they don't.

 

Sound familiar?

[vinny41]

7 minutes ago, 7by7 said:

 

Most polls indicate the majority of voters would now vote Remain if given the chance. Such as these. 

 

Whilst the 'don't knows' mean neither side has over 50% in all of them, a significant number of the polls do have Remain at 50% or more. Also, whilst there are some ties, you have to go back to 2nd March 2018 to find one where Leave comes out ahead.

 

As you are so fond of polls, are you saying that these results show we should have another referendum?

 

Or are you, like others here, only a believer in polls when they produce results with which you agree?

What I am saying is the majority of voters that vote either for remain or leave made their decision long before the referendum campaign so it didn't make any difference to them what the remain campaign stated or what the leave campaign stated.

We don't know which way Tony Benn would have voted in the referendum as he died in 2014 but as he was anti eu we can make an educated guess that he would have voted leave based on his previous statements made over the past 40 years

[nauseus]

5 hours ago, david555 said:

They might be working , paying taxes ....that never came up in your mind ? 

 

Yes it did - read it again and absorb it.

[nauseus]

5 hours ago, Rookiescot said:

Right so the EU nationals are anti British not anti Brexit.

You cant help yourself can you? You honestly believe only Brexiteers are patriots. This is the problem right there. You equate being anti Brexit as being anti British. Nothing could be further from the truth.

Patriots dont vote to damage their country.  

Go on find something I have posted which is anti British. Not something which is anti Brexit but actually anti British.

And find something from one of the EU nationals which is anti British as well.

 

 

Patriots don't want to risk the existence of their country.  

[nauseus]

3 hours ago, 7by7 said:

 

Leave won on the basis of the many lies they told, primarily those about the single market and immigration. Then there's the £350 million lie as well!

 

If Remain had won on the basis of the far fewer lies they told, then I have no doubt that you and most other Brexiteers would still be calling for another vote.

 

Still, good to see that you are at last acknowledging that Leave lied to us.

 

 

Same old rubbish. Boring as well as false.

[7by7]

48 minutes ago, 3NUMBAS said:

the eu has now caved in on fishing rights for brit s in their own pond ,how nice of them

Unusual for you not to provide a headline in massive font from the Express. There is one, after all.

 

Whilst the headline says 'caves in' the article, whilst containing the usual Express hyperbole, tells a different story to the headline.

Quote

the Brussels diplomat said he was ready to let the exact numbers of fish both sides can land be decided after the Brexit deal is struck.

 The article also says that the UK have agreed to negotiate future quota shares for EU boats;

Quote

No 10 has offered a three-year transition to allow the bloc to adjust to the new rules.

Under the plan, the UK and EU would agree to a framework agreement before December but post-Brexit quota shares would not fully kick in until after the end of 2023.

which, of course, means that EU boats will still be able to fish in UK waters.

 

Doesn't sound like much of a cave in by Barnier; more of a negotiated compromise acceptable to both sides.

[nauseus]

3 hours ago, 7by7 said:

 

Am I right to assume the 'B' stands for 'British?'

 

Am I right to assume it would only apply to British waters? (What about Northern Irish ones? I'd have gone for UKFP myself.)

 

So; in what way would your BFP differ from the CFP?

 

Assuming the UK government does take back all the licences to fish in UK waters currently owned by foreign fleets and issues them to British fleet owners, who don't have the number of boats required anyway, what would you do to stop those fleet owners from simply doing what they did last time and selling them on?

 

Brilliant - well done. Yes UK waters. Different because it would not concern the EU. We can build boats which will make profit for British fishermen, for a change.  

[7by7]

9 minutes ago, vinny41 said:

What I am saying is the majority of voters that vote either for remain or leave made their decision long before the referendum campaign so it didn't make any difference to them what the remain campaign stated or what the leave campaign stated.

 And I am saying that the majority of voters would now vote to Remain if given the chance!

 

According to the polls, that is.

 

I could also say that 67% voted to remain in 1975. So which figure is more relevant to 2020; 1975s, 2010s or 2020s?

 

But are we talking about now or 4 years ago? Well, if four years ago then as your figures stop in 2013, how relevant are they to 2016?

[nauseus]

3 hours ago, 7by7 said:

 

They are as they are paying tax and NICs, or the family members of same, and so are contributing to the NHS the same as any British taxpayer and their non working family.

 

Even if not working or the family member of a worker, they still pay tax on nearly everything they buy.

 

NHS care is dependent upon residency; there is no minimum amount of tax or NICs you have to pay before qualifying for it.

 

 

 

 

I know but not the point. UK retirees will have paid in full. EU people in the UK have not and it will tale them a more time to catch up and much more than the UK oldies will probably be around for in the EU. Seems more than fair to me.

[7by7]

6 minutes ago, nauseus said:

 

Same old rubbish. Boring as well as false.

 You may find it boring; but were you to check Vote.Leave's campaign material you'll find all the lies I have mentioned in there; and quite a few more as well.

 

Except the £350 million lie; Boris reserved that for his bus!

 

[7by7]

1 minute ago, nauseus said:

 

I know but not the point. UK retirees will have paid in full. EU people in the UK have not and it will tale them a more time to catch up and much more than the UK oldies will probably be around for in the EU. Seems more than fair to me.

 Paid in full?

 

Do you seriously believe that access to the NHS should be dependent on how many NICs one has paid?

 

What about people who have never paid any NICs; like children?

[vinny41]

4 minutes ago, 7by7 said:

 And I am saying that the majority of voters would now vote to Remain if given the chance!

 

According to the polls, that is.

 

I could also say that 67% voted to remain in 1975. So which figure is more relevant to 2020; 1975s, 2010s or 2020s?

 

But are we talking about now or 4 years ago? Well, if four years ago then as your figures stop in 2013, how relevant are they to 2016?

I have no issue if there is another referendum is carried out in the year 2057 once the instruction of the 2016 referendum has been executed

[nauseus]

3 minutes ago, 7by7 said:

 You may find it boring; but were you to check Vote.Leave's campaign material you'll find all the lies I have mentioned in there; and quite a few more as well.

 

Except the £350 million lie; Boris reserved that for his bus!

 

 

You seem to believe that VoteLeave had full influence on the vote  - I know that it didn't.

[7by7]

1 minute ago, vinny41 said:

I have no issue if there is another referendum is carried out in the year 2057 once the instruction of the 2016 referendum has been executed

 Despite the fact that the majority want it now?

 

How democratic of you.

 

Of course, I am under no illusions. What's done is done and we are beyond the point of no return.

[7by7]

Just now, nauseus said:

 

You seem to believe that VoteLeave had full influence on the vote  - I know that it didn't.

 

Not full influence; of course not. But enough influence on the undecided to give Leave the narrow victory.

[nauseus]

3 minutes ago, 7by7 said:

 Paid in full?

 

Do you seriously believe that access to the NHS should be dependent on how many NICs one has paid?

 

What about people who have never paid any NICs; like children?

 

No, I don't seriously believe that access to the NHS should be dependent on how many NICs one has paid. But that is not the issue here.

 

How many UK children are retired in the EU?  

[nauseus]

1 minute ago, 7by7 said:

 

Not full influence; of course not. But enough influence on the undecided to give Leave the narrow victory.

 

Maybe more would have voted out if it were not for Project Fear. Who knows?

[7by7]

Just now, nauseus said:

 

No, I don't seriously believe that access to the NHS should be dependent on how many NICs one has paid. But that is not the issue here.

 

How many UK children are retired in the EU?  

 

The issue is access to the NHS. That is available to any and all legal UK resident; regardless of how many NICs they've paid or whether or not they are working.

 

If you have a problem with that, take it up with your MP and see if they can get the government to change the law.

[vinny41]

2 minutes ago, 7by7 said:

 Despite the fact that the majority want it now?

 

How democratic of you.

 

Of course, I am under no illusions. What's done is done and we are beyond the point of no return.

The majority want  it now according to the polls and most people don't believe the polls as they always come out in favour of the sponsor that is paying for the poll

[7by7]

6 minutes ago, nauseus said:

 

You seem to believe that VoteLeave had full influence on the vote  - I know that it didn't.

 

2 minutes ago, nauseus said:

 

Maybe more would have voted out if it were not for Project Fear. Who knows?

Make your mind up.

 

Project Fear was a Vote.Leave campaign slogan.  

[nauseus]

Just now, 7by7 said:

 

The issue is access to the NHS. That is available to any and all legal UK resident; regardless of how many NICs they've paid or whether or not they are working.

 

If you have a problem with that, take it up with your MP and see if they can get the government to change the law.

 

Wrong. Read back. The issue was reciprocal health care for UK/EU citizens in each other's countries.

[7by7]

2 minutes ago, vinny41 said:

The majority want  it now according to the polls and most people don't believe the polls as they always come out in favour of the sponsor that is paying for the poll

 So your much trumpeted 2010 poll is as meaningless as any other; glad we agree at last.

[7by7]

1 minute ago, nauseus said:

 

Wrong. Read back. The issue was reciprocal health care for UK/EU citizens in each other's countries.

 

Gawd; you really do have a major problem remembering what you've posted; let alone others.

 

I don't have time to go through all the posts again for you now. so you have a lie down and then see if you can do it for yourself.

 

TTFN

[kingdong]

11 hours ago, Rookiescot said:

Its a public forum so yes.

You still evade my question.

Why do YOU equate being a Brexiteer with being pro British?

Can,t speak for my learned friend,however being a resident of the uk can only suggest if you lived here it would answer your question.