'It'll be carnage': British companies dread a Brexit border breakdown

[Hi from France]

16 minutes ago, Hi from France said:

Indeed the EU protect the interest of her members, like the US does (the US is more protectionist than the EU) and indeed China does (even more). 

 

Trading freely with the whole world will not happen, even though this is what has been sold to you, and I see you are still a believer. 

 

I'm not sure you understand every trading block protects its interest and this is not going to change but rather protectionism is on a very fast rise. 

 

Another preoccupation is the Brexit is going opposite to the world today: this strategy could have been fine in the 80' 90' or early 2000'

... now since 2008, globalization has slowed, if not reversed, and now it's definitely reversing with Trump and Covid-19. 

 

E. G. if you want to sell your services to the US, you cannot do it without sacrificing your farmers.

We are not talking about a few fishermen who want more fishing quotas there, but about a whole sector with many jobs and families. 

With free trade, they won't be able to compete with the huge Brazilian / US farms, chlorinated chicken, whatever... 

 

Trading deals are "give and take", the problem with the UK alone is that it does not have much to give, or rather at a hefty cost. 

 

 

That's why I think Brexit would have been more clever keeping the European Free Trade Area (and limiting the risk of ending the Union). 

 

As to fishing zones, if I were a negotiator, that's probably the very first thing l'd trade: EU aside, other world powers are not interested in those fishing zones and it turns out they are quite worthless without market access. 

 

Quote

In the late 1980s, grants from Europe were made available for fishing communities to modernise their boats and tackle. This funding had to be match-funded by national governments. Other governments supplied this funding, unlike the UK. The result was that British fishermen were unable to compete with the bigger, more efficient boats, and many sold their quota to French, Spanish or Dutch fishing companies. The quotas were introduced to preserve fish stocks.

The reason the future of fishing is so fraught in the Brexit negotiations is that other European nations paid British fishermen to be able to fish for what had been British quotas.
Veronica Hardstaff, MEP for Lincolnshire 1994-1999 and former member of the European parliament fishing committee, Sheffield

 

Quote

The most serious threat to the UK fishing fleet is that 37% of fish caught by UK boats are landed in the European Economic Area, with the largest shares being exported to Norway, the Netherlands and France. The UK fleet may well want a larger quota of available stocks, but the main species found in UK waters are mackerel and herring, which do not have a UK market. The continuation of EU/EEA landing rights without tariffs, quotas or phytosanitary restrictions is far more important than sharing a few cod with France. A no-deal Brexit would result in the loss of substantial and valuable exports for the UK fishing fleet.

Eric Goodyer
Birsay, Orkney

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2020/oct/25/britain-at-fault-for-brexit-fishing-woes-letters?CMP=

 

 

I'd trade it against market access for my automotive industry, chemical industry, whatever.. it actually has very little value for the UK, although it's symbolic 

 

 

. 

[Rookiescot]

2 hours ago, vinny41 said:

Most people I know listen to both the remain and leave camps and then made their decision on the ballot paper

and yes I did know what I was voting for thanks

Really? And which side was telling the truth?

Yup that would have been the remain side.

Still you decided to vote leave and do not seem to have changed your mind since. Which I always find odd. Most people when presented with new facts and evidence will reappraise their position but not Brexiteers it seems. 

[Rookiescot]

23 minutes ago, johnray said:

Aww poor England.  Who will buy your jam now?

There is more at stake than just jam.

There is cheese and pork pies ! 

[7by7]

30 minutes ago, Loiner said:

 

 

Did you miss the part about "...freely with the whole world"? The EU does not trade freely with the whole world because it is a protectionist bloc.

If trading freely between UK and EU is over in a few weeks the EU only has itself to blame. We will still trade regardless of the Remainer rhetoric, but there will be new rules from January. The extent and impact of those depends on the EU now, but we have left already and won't sign up again to the old EU restrictive rules and regulation that apply to its members.

Remainers, Euros and those with vested interest will continue to play up potential or imagined problems about that trade, as we see in the title of this topic. Why have none of them who complain so much come up with some solutions over the past four years? 

 

The EU trades freely with those parts of the world with which it has trade agreements in place. 

 

The EU is as protectionist as other large trading blocs; from the USA and ASEAN.

 

Yes, even with no deal we will still trade with the EU; but under the same rules , regulations and restrictions as every other country which does not have a trade deal with them!

 

Why do you Brexiteers still fail to understand that? Why do you still believe we are somehow special and deserve to be treated better by the EU than every other non member without an agreement?

 

Surely by now you must realise that the pony fed you by Cummings and others in 2016 was just that; pony.

 

Companies have not had four years to prepare as they have not known what, if any, rules, regulations and restrictions will apply w.e.f. 1/1/21. Which is the cause of this current concern. As even the government don't know, how can those who will be effected make provision?

 

"Prepare for every possible eventuality" you may say. But only if you have no idea about the tight cash flows even large, international companies are operating under.

 

Of course, many people have made their suggestions and proposals over the last four years; and we would have left on 31st March 2019 had Boris not scuppered that for his own political ambitions.

[7by7]

12 minutes ago, evadgib said:

"I mentioned it once but think I got away with it!"

Pleaassse stop digging 49; I'm doing the laughing policeman all over again! ????

 Go on then; tell us what the event of Earthshattering importance was, then.

 

Your continued refusal to do so only reinforces the evidence of you conspiracy theory absurdities. 

[evadgib]

4 minutes ago, Rookiescot said:

There is more at stake than just jam.

There is cheese and pork pies ! 

Whisky's covered though innit ????

[Rookiescot]

3 minutes ago, 7by7 said:

 Go on then; tell us what the event of Earthshattering importance was, then.

 

Your continued refusal to do so only reinforces the evidence of you conspiracy theory absurdities. 

Do yourself a favor and put him on ignore. 

[7by7]

Just now, Rookiescot said:

Do yourself a favor and put him on ignore. 

 

I don't use the ignore  button; and certainly wouldn't when watching @evadgib tie himself in knots in his attempts at self justification is so amusing.

[Scott]

A post linking to a Youtube video has been reported and removed.

 

[IgboChief]

On 10/26/2020 at 5:50 PM, Loiner said:

More Remainer truckers moaning. We don't care because we voted to Leave, not keep the cosy status quo with the fright industry. They had better get all their ducks in a row, rather than constantly moaning about it.

 

If the Remainers Project Fear was to believed, all trade would immediately cease anyway and there will be no movement of any goods in either direction. So which does Chicken Licken really think it will be? 

 

Sir, I wish you from all my heart that you will get exactly what you have asked for. Although I hope that you and your kind will also have to take the full responsibility for the outcome and will be hold accountable.

 

And make no mistake please: While I do not agree with the Brexit decision and was honestly shocked by the vote, I genuinely believe, that now ,after these 4 years, your BREXIT must be done. It would be impossible to heal the wounds on both sides before reckoning and assessment and taking responsibility.

 

My own prediction is: in 10-15 years from now, whatever is left of the UK will become the EUs finest and keenest although smallest member.

I wish you good luck! In the meantime you 60 mill. aging seniors, enjoy negotiating with India (1.2 bn. plus people) , China (1.5+ bn.), Indonesia (260+ mill.), Nigeria (210+ mill.), Brasil, Pakistan. Am sure, they just waited all the time long and will buy from you simply because they like the English so much and do not want to buy it from the EU, the Chinese or the US.

 

Cheers.

 

[evadgib]

 

21 minutes ago, IgboChief said:

 

Sir, I wish you from all my heart that you will get exactly what you have asked for. Although I hope that you and your kind will also have to take the full responsibility for the outcome and will be hold accountable.

 

And make no mistake please: While I do not agree with the Brexit decision and was honestly shocked by the vote, I genuinely believe, that now ,after these 4 years, your BREXIT must be done. It would be impossible to heal the wounds on both sides before reckoning and assessment and taking responsibility.

 

My own prediction is: in 10-15 years from now, whatever is left of the UK will become the EUs finest and keenest although smallest member.

I wish you good luck! In the meantime you 60 mill. aging seniors, enjoy negotiating with India (1.2 bn. plus people) , China (1.5+ bn.), Indonesia (260+ mill.), Nigeria (210+ mill.), Brasil, Pakistan. Am sure, they just waited all the time long and will buy from you simply because they like the English so much and do not want to buy it from the EU, the Chinese or the US.

 

Cheers.

 

- Smaller than Malta/Cyprus/Eire?

 

- What about the rest of ?????????

 

You should think before posting ????

[Hi from France]

40 minutes ago, IgboChief said:

My own prediction is: in 10-15 years from now, whatever is left of the UK will become the EUs finest and keenest although smallest member.

"Smallest" no way

 

"member", I think the UK could be better off leading the EFTA, it's not as good as holding power in the EU and I'm not sure at all other EFTA members would be foolish enough to become subject of English whims and its really really unlikely 27 EU countries can agree on putting back the English in power given recent history.

 

Ireland will probably be reunited in 20 years+, Scotland could be independent 5-10 years from now (it seems divergence is now irreversible and a majority of tory voters want the Scots out anyway).

 

 

Quote

In the meantime you 60 mill. aging seniors, enjoy negotiating with India (1.2 bn. plus people) , China (1.5+ bn.), Indonesia (260+ mill.), Nigeria (210+ mill.), Brasil, Pakistan. Am sure, they just waited all the time long and will buy from you simply because they like the English so much and do not want to buy it from the EU, the Chinese or the US.

 

sad reality, Lebanization is a very likely future for the UK

 

Anyway it's not just the fishing quotas that have been sold, the very land of the UK has been sold "oligarchs and City bankers own around 17% of England"

 

Actually the people (ordinary citizens + public sector) owns 8% of England, that leave out 92% of the country to Aristocracy and gentry, Corporations, oligarchs

 

Such a situation would not be acceptable in most countries

 

 

 

 

back in '16,  https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2016/oct/12/britain-brexit-eu-pound-euro 

[evadgib]

1 hour ago, 7by7 said:

 

I don't use the ignore  button; and certainly wouldn't when watching @evadgib tie himself in knots in his attempts at self justification is so amusing.

 

The event to which you refer occurred and in doing so blew your 'on a Perch in Thailand' out of the water. Having proved my point I have nothing further to add.

Goodnight 49 ????

+

 

[7by7]

29 minutes ago, evadgib said:

 

The event to which you refer occurred and in doing so blew your 'on a Perch in Thailand' out of the water. Having proved my point I have nothing further to add.

Goodnight 49 ????

+

 

 

As you still refuse point blank to say what that 'event' was, you have blown nothing out of the water and rather than proving your point, have yet again proven mine!

 

But keep it up; we all need a good laugh in these uncertain times.

[vinny41]

2 hours ago, Rookiescot said:

Really? And which side was telling the truth?

Yup that would have been the remain side.

Still you decided to vote leave and do not seem to have changed your mind since. Which I always find odd. Most people when presented with new facts and evidence will reappraise their position but not Brexiteers it seems. 

 I think you will find that both sides told lies 

and I think you will find that on both the leave and remain side large number of people had already made their minds up a long time before June 2016

Without even asking you from your posts the TVF members have a good idea which way you voted in  the last Scottish independence referendum. And which way you will vote when the next Scottish independence referendum occurs.

[evadgib]

4 hours ago, 7by7 said:

 

 

I, and am sure most others, have known for some time that you obtain your 'news' and opinions from conspiracy sites; your regular statements of your mistrust of the MSM and reference to non MSM sites as your sources made that obvious.

 

Whilst, to my knowledge, you have never mentioned them before now, what made me suspect your support for QAnon were your absurd predictions; such as that of an event of Earthshattering importance happening within walking distance of my home, followed by your claim that it had happened together with your utter refusal, despite several requests, to say what that event was! QAnon are notorious for such behaviour. 

 

What clinched it was your using one of English QAnon's symbols as your avatar. The one you use now but with "WWG1WGA" across the centre. Of course, as soon as you were rumbled you removed the incriminating lettering!

"I mentioned it once but think I got away with it! 

 

[Chelseafan]

On 10/26/2020 at 12:22 PM, lungbing said:

But there has not been any Brexit failures.  All we have is people like you and those with a vested interest telling us it's going to fail.  The egg may well be upon your face.

 

It's not going to fail but it will be costly and someone (the consumer) will have to pick up the tab.

 

 

[Hi from France]

First time I see this and a possible answer to the issue starting this thread : there might be a transition to the transition 

 

Quote

and almost certainly requiring a further transitional period beyond the end of the year to avoid chaos in Kent, although no doubt the transition will be called something else.

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2020/oct/25/like-pyrrhus-boris-johnson-loves-to-lay-claim-to-victories-all-of-which-are-at-our-expense?CMP=

[Laughing Gravy]

13 hours ago, welovesundaysatspace said:

We enjoy the best of both worlds: our politics aren’t embarrassing laughing stocks like Brexit or Trump, but we can always look at Brexit or Trump for our entertainment ???? 

Really! If you say so????

[soalbundy]

22 hours ago, Laughing Gravy said:

As a Brit i love reading about those Europeans who keep telling us what is best for us. It is hilarious as they think they understand the Brits but have no idea. Like the remain vote would win in 2016. like BJ would never be prime minister. You and your like have made so many predictions that fail you continue to embarrass yourselves.

 

The fat lady is still singing. I consider one of two probabilities, (1) since both the UK and the EU want a trade deal there will be one but it won't be one that satisfies the brexiteers, the EU is the heavyweight in the room.

(2) A no deal which will gratify the mouth foaming Daily Express readers which will result in utter chaos at the ports and such a mountain of red tape that the UK will throw up its hands in exasperation and ask for further negotiations which the EU will agree to, long drawn out and finely ground negotiations with the UK giving ground every month.

[Rookiescot]

1 hour ago, soalbundy said:

The fat lady is still singing. I consider one of two probabilities, (1) since both the UK and the EU want a trade deal there will be one but it won't be one that satisfies the brexiteers, the EU is the heavyweight in the room.

(2) A no deal which will gratify the mouth foaming Daily Express readers which will result in utter chaos at the ports and such a mountain of red tape that the UK will throw up its hands in exasperation and ask for further negotiations which the EU will agree to, long drawn out and finely ground negotiations with the UK giving ground every month.

3) An extension to the transition period called something else.

[Hi from France]

1 hour ago, pagan1 said:

Useful summary of the current position and issues remaining

 

 

There are valid points here and our Brexiteers posters could comment. 

 

Now I'm not a fan of this kind of videos : this guy is not a journalist he is just saying what's on his mind, like "this pandemic allowed this government to steal billions of our money" (11'13" +).

This is a big red flag, worse than Johnson reporting that the EU legislates on bendy bananas.

 

At least Johnson was sacked for lying as a reporter. Here on YouTube, no-one can fire that guy and his video goes viral.. 

[3NUMBAS]

if thats what the eu wishes for then what can uk do ..they want to cut off their noses to spite  their faces then so be it

[3NUMBAS]

Just now, 3NUMBAS said:

if thats what the eu wishes for then what can uk do ..they want to cut off their noses to spite  their faces then so be it

nigel farage is waiting in the wings to gobble up bojo should he backslide, by bringing back the brexit party and theres also the new BLM party to consider

[androokery]

On 10/27/2020 at 3:09 AM, Laughing Gravy said:

As a Brit i love reading about those Europeans who keep telling us what is best for us. It is hilarious as they think they understand the Brits but have no idea. Like the remain vote would win in 2016. like BJ would never be prime minister. You and your like have made so many predictions that fail you continue to embarrass yourselves.

 

BJ is your PM and who should be embarrassed?

[pagan1]

First the Brexiteers blamed the EU then they blamed Cameron, then they blamed the Conservative Party, then Theresa May, then the Remainers, then the EU again. Now the blame has moved to Boris Johnson, business for not being prepared and Covid. We are only a short step away from the Brexiteers saying the electorate was wrong for voting for Brexit !!!

You couldn't make it up

[evadgib]

19 minutes ago, pagan1 said:

First the Brexiteers blamed the EU then they blamed Cameron, then they blamed the Conservative Party, then Theresa May, then the Remainers, then the EU again. Now the blame has moved to Boris Johnson, business for not being prepared and Covid. We are only a short step away from the Brexiteers saying the electorate was wrong for voting for Brexit !!!

You couldn't make it up

UK and India agree to strengthen economic relationship to boost jobs

Quote

Chancellor and Indian Finance Minister hold talks, committing to deepen economic relationship to boost jobs and investment in the UK and India.

One of several published today.

HTH

[7by7]

22 hours ago, evadgib said:

"I mentioned it once but think I got away with it! 

 

 

You've mentioned more than once your absurd allegation that I post under multiple identities.

 

You've mentioned more than once  your prediction of an event of Earthshattering significance/importance would occur within walking distance of my home.

 

You've mentioned more than once that the aforementioned event happened.

 

What you haven't mentioned at all; in fact point blank refuse to mention, is what that event was!

 

Which leads to only two possible conclusions:

1. you fell for yet another conspiracy site, probably QAnon given your past allegiance, false prediction, or;
2. you made the whole thing up in the hope it would be forgotten before you had to put your money where your mouth was.

Whichever it is, you have done far more to prove my earlier points about you than I ever could.

[nauseus]

2 hours ago, pagan1 said:

First the Brexiteers blamed the EU then they blamed Cameron, then they blamed the Conservative Party, then Theresa May, then the Remainers, then the EU again. Now the blame has moved to Boris Johnson, business for not being prepared and Covid. We are only a short step away from the Brexiteers saying the electorate was wrong for voting for Brexit !!!

You couldn't make it up

Well you just did.

[Hi from France]

C'mon global Britain... but don't worry, there's nothing Brexit won't fix ..