Scotland's Sturgeon puts UK on independence warning: We want a referendum soon

[Rookiescot]

1 minute ago, fangless said:

What oil?  ????

 And where are your figures that show when Scotland last made a NET contribution to the UK economy?

Look it up!

 

What oil? Oh yeah the oil thats been running out for the last 20 years but somehow keeps producing more oil.

Hows the pork pie and cheese production going?

[vogie]

59 minutes ago, Rookiescot said:

 

I did not insult him. I asked you to explain your hypocrisy that one politicians remarks are somehow written in stone but another's is not.

Do please explain your rational behind such thinking.

You nationalists have been explained this time and time again, the SNP is like a cult and must be obeyed at all time. So let's get this straight, you are rather weakly trying to compare a statement of 'once in a lifetime, and once in a generation' to Boris saying 'found dead in a ditch' perleaaaaase, give us a break.

[RuamRudy]

1 hour ago, Liverpoolfan said:

I am no brexiteer but I don't agree with a 2nd referendum on Scottish independence within the space of 5 years..

 

What happens when Sturgeon loses yet again?

another one 6 months down the line??

 

It's a load of pish. The Scottish people voted and they voted to remain part of the UK.

End of.

 

Wholly and utterly incorrect.

 

In 2014, a majority Scottish voters voted to leave the UK. However the extension of the franchise to voters from other parts of the UK and from the EU saw that majority overturned. A democratic decision, definitely, but do not state that the Scots want to stay in the UK. The majority of us didn't in 2014 and even more of us want out now. 

[kingdong]

12 minutes ago, Chomper Higgot said:

Oddly Brexiteers are at the forefront of arguments against the Scottish becoming an independent nation.

 

 

I,m not chomper,me old china,like most brexiteers i feel freedom and democracy are bastions of a free society.

[Rookiescot]

2 minutes ago, fangless said:

Alec Salmond stated it when he demanded!

Alex Salmond gave it away as a throw away sentence like politicians do all the time.

Or do you think Johnson should actually be dead in a ditch somewhere? 

[vogie]

29 minutes ago, Rookiescot said:

 

So what?

We dont have the same nationalistic fervor about fish that you Brexiteers do.

You better tell that to the Scottish fishermen.

[NanLaew]

1 hour ago, sammieuk1 said:

Wait for the pubs to open and ask them again ????

 

...and again after the pub shuts.

[kingdong]

2 minutes ago, Rookiescot said:

 

What oil? Oh yeah the oil thats been running out for the last 20 years but somehow keeps producing more oil.

Hows the pork pie and cheese production going?

Oil,the usage of which is destroying our planet.

[fangless]

1 minute ago, RuamRudy said:

If the SNP is doing a terrible job, why have they been in power for 10 years and are currently on course to take an overall majority next year in a parliament designed to prevent majorities being formed?

Because under the communist SNP practically everything which is charged for in England is free in Scotland but paid for by the English taxpayer,

Free busses for many, free prescriptions free University, Subsidised ferries,  free  etc all paid for by the English Taxpayer.

Scotland is fiscally broke by all accepted definitions.  It cannot meet the GDP threshold to become a member of the EU even if it was allowed to join by those who oppose it's membership.

[NanLaew]

1 hour ago, melvinmelvin said:

yes, I did, wow some slip of the keyboard that was, her upper hangouts blurred my vision

Now see what you've done?

 

https://www.news.com.au/entertainment/celebrity-life/celebrity-deaths/madonna-trends-online-after-people-mistakenly-thought-she-had-died/news-story/9441b1ce87ef5f57667cafb68b963640

[2530Ubon]

13 minutes ago, Rookiescot said:

 

Who agreed to a once in a lifetime vote?

Show me where it says so in any legal document or indeed in the last section 30 agreement. 

 

You appear to be correct, there is no LEGAL basis for that argument!  I apologise. However, they all did say ONCE IN A GENERATION. This was a repeated plea to the Scottish people at the time. I do still believe that it is far to soon for another referendum and should be left to the next generation to decide. This one has already had a vote, and they voted no. Let's see what the next generation think in 20 years time.

 

https://www.thenational.scot/news/18159096.fact-check-claim-snp-vowed-indyref-once-lifetime-opportunity/

'It is true that during the independence referendum campaign, both Alex Salmond and Nicola Sturgeon used the phrase “once in a lifetime opportunity” or “once in a generation opportunity” to define the political stakes facing the Scottish electorate.

Note the foreword written by Alex Salmond to the Scottish Government’s independence White Paper (Scotland’s Future, 26 November 2013): “The debate we are engaged in as a nation is about the future of all of us lucky enough to live in this diverse and vibrant country. It is a rare and precious moment in the history of Scotland - a once in a generation opportunity to chart a better way.”

However, it is abundantly clear from the context of this statement (and with others like it) that Salmond is not agreeing to some alleged, one-off constitutional device – to be used once then locked away in a cupboard for 40 years. Rather he is encouraging the Scottish electorate to seize a particular opportunity (“a rare and precious moment in the history of Scotland”) to oppose austerity and make a fairer Scotland.'

 

On a side note, the same language was used for the Brexit referundum.

When everyone saw that the brexiteers had mislead the nation (polite way of saying BS), and polls showed another vote would overturn the result, the 2nd referendum was never given... for the same reasons.

Edited November 27, 2020 by 2530Ubon

[Rookiescot]

Just now, kingdong said:

Oil,the usage of which is destroying our planet.

 

So the government of Westminster has completely shut down oil production in the North sea or is it only an issue for when Scotland becomes independent?

[RuamRudy]

1 hour ago, fangless said:

Scotland want to be independent - from what?  They want to keep the pound, the Queen and stay in the EU.  

How is that independence?

 

Well, there is a sizeable number itching to get shot of the German parasites after Betty pops her clogs. As for the pound, that will be for a transitory period while a Scottish currency is set up. And the EU - we like it. So much so that we overwhelmingly voted to stay in it. 

[Rookiescot]

3 minutes ago, vogie said:

You better tell that to the Scottish fishermen.

 

Tell them the same same thing that Johnson is going to tell them after he is forced to sign a deal with the EU?

[RuamRudy]

59 minutes ago, vogie said:

My ThaiVisa is going ultra slow and taking ages to load, anyway I'll try to answer.

 

"We all" refers to England, Scotland, Wales and N Ireland and as such it makes us an island nation, and as much as the Scottish Nationalists want to partition our island nation, it will not happen, they do not have a mandate to do so.

 

 

 

The English do not have mandate to determine the future of the UK. If the majority of Scots no longer wish to be in a political union with you, will you stop it? 

 

You do understand how crass and insensitive your repeated use of the term 'partition' is? To equate Scottish independence with British imposed partition and the horror caused by it is utterly nauseating, not to mention juvenile.

[fangless]

17 minutes ago, Rookiescot said:

 

Who agreed to a once in a lifetime vote?

Show me where it says so in any legal document or indeed in the last section 30 agreement. 

 

Scotland’s Future – Your Guide to an Independent Scotland.

View Independent Scotland’s Road Map 2014.

The preface to this document is a 4 page letter from Alex Salmond who was the Leader of the SNP and Scotland’s First Minister at the time. On page 10 of the PDF, numbered viii, or the first page of the preface, 5th paragraph is as follows:

The debate we are engaged in as a nation is about the future of all of us lucky enough to live in this diverse and vibrant country. It is a rare and precious moment in the history of Scotland – a once in a generation opportunity to chart a better way.

 

It was not a throw away comment.

Edited November 27, 2020 by fangless

[vogie]

57 minutes ago, Rookiescot said:

We do not have a mandate yet.

Read my comments about the court case and the projected results of the next Hollyrood elections.

You might learn something.

The only thing I could learn from you is insults, but expected from a nationalist.

Your comments about you saying that Scotland leaving the UK is nothing to do with the UK, are you serious?

[kingdong]

1 minute ago, Rookiescot said:

 

So the government of Westminster has completely shut down oil production in the North sea or is it only an issue for when Scotland becomes independent?

Think you,ll find the uk is fast forwarding the ban on fossil fuel powered vehicles and changing to electric as it takes the issue of air quality and subsequent threat to health seriously ,hows the air quality in pattaya just now?

[Rookiescot]

5 minutes ago, 2530Ubon said:

You appear to be correct, there is no LEGAL basis for that argument!  I apologise. However, they all did say ONCE IN A GENERATION. This was a repeated plea to the Scottish people at the time. I do still believe that it is far to soon for another referendum and should be left to the next generation to decide. This one has already had a vote, and they voted no. Let's see what the next generation think in 20 years time.

 

https://www.thenational.scot/news/18159096.fact-check-claim-snp-vowed-indyref-once-lifetime-opportunity/

'It is true that during the independence referendum campaign, both Alex Salmond and Nicola Sturgeon used the phrase “once in a lifetime opportunity” or “once in a generation opportunity” to define the political stakes facing the Scottish electorate.

Note the foreword written by Alex Salmond to the Scottish Government’s independence White Paper (Scotland’s Future, 26 November 2013): “The debate we are engaged in as a nation is about the future of all of us lucky enough to live in this diverse and vibrant country. It is a rare and precious moment in the history of Scotland - a once in a generation opportunity to chart a better way.”

However, it is abundantly clear from the context of this statement (and with others like it) that Salmond is not agreeing to some alleged, one-off constitutional device – to be used once then locked away in a cupboard for 40 years. Rather he is encouraging the Scottish electorate to seize a particular opportunity (“a rare and precious moment in the history of Scotland”) to oppose austerity and make a fairer Scotland.'

 

It was done so in order to get voter turnout.

A referendum with low voter turnout looks highly undemocratic. 

[RuamRudy]

5 minutes ago, fangless said:

Because under the communist SNP practically everything which is charged for in England is free in Scotland but paid for by the English taxpayer,

Free busses for many, free prescriptions free University, Subsidised ferries,  free  etc all paid for by the English Taxpayer.

Scotland is fiscally broke by all accepted definitions.  It cannot meet the GDP threshold to become a member of the EU even if it was allowed to join by those who oppose it's membership.

Please show us those definitions; while you are at it, and flexing that Nobel-like economic nous, can you explain how a country without borrowing powers, can be 'fiscally broke'? Was the addition of 'fiscally' intended to impart oomph?

[RuamRudy]

1 minute ago, kingdong said:

Think you,ll find the uk is fast forwarding the ban on fossil fuel powered vehicles and changing to electric as it takes the issue of air quality and subsequent threat to health seriously ,hows the air quality in pattaya just now?

 

Where will the plastic come from to build those electric cars?

[Rookiescot]

Just now, kingdong said:

Think you,ll find the uk is fast forwarding the ban on fossil fuel powered vehicles and changing to electric as it takes the issue of air quality and subsequent threat to health seriously ,hows the air quality in pattaya just now?

 

And we will not need plastic any more? A substancial part of those electric vehicles use plastic.

Which comes from?

Take your time now.

[fangless]

3 minutes ago, Rookiescot said:

 

It was done so in order to get voter turnout.

A referendum with low voter turnout looks highly undemocratic. 

The turnout of 84.6% was the highest recorded for an election or referendum in the United Kingdom since the January 1910 general election, which was held before the introduction of universal suffrage.

Edited November 27, 2020 by fangless

[NanLaew]

1 hour ago, Mavideol said:

3 hours ago, webfact said:

His government says there should not be another independence referendum in the near future.

it's like asking for a divorce, if one of the parties is not happy, he/she has the right to ask for a divorce.... Scotland not happy with the UK actions, they have the right to ask for a divorce and be on their own

 

But they have been asked and they have answered already.

 

All this 'once in a generation' or 'once in a lifetime' waffle is just the empty nonsense that Alex Salmond spouted as he vaingloriously sought to be right up there with Bill Wallace and Bob Bruce. In medical terms, I believe it's called premature ejaculation, or a 'preemie'.

[kingdong]

1 minute ago, Rookiescot said:

 

And we will not need plastic any more? A substancial part of those electric vehicles use plastic.

Which comes from?

Take your time now.

China?

[vogie]

27 minutes ago, Chomper Higgot said:

Oddly Brexiteers are at the forefront of arguments against the Scottish becoming an independent nation.

 

 

I don't know if anybody has told you this but the Scottish are againgst independence too, it is only the SNP that in the minority want to divide our nation.

[kingdong]

6 minutes ago, fangless said:

Scotland’s Future – Your Guide to an Independent Scotland.

View Independent Scotland’s Road Map 2014.

The preface to this document is a 4 page letter from Alex Salmond who was the Leader of the SNP and Scotland’s First Minister at the time. On page 10 of the PDF, numbered viii, or the first page of the preface, 5th paragraph is as follows:

The debate we are engaged in as a nation is about the future of all of us lucky enough to live in this diverse and vibrant country. It is a rare and precious moment in the history of Scotland – a once in a generation opportunity to chart a better way.

 

It was not a throw away comment.

Perhaps the snp feels the people must keep voting till they get it right.

[vogie]

30 minutes ago, Chomper Higgot said:

Oddly Brexiteers are at the forefront of arguments against the Scottish becoming an independent nation.

 

 

The Scots are againgst it as well.

[Rookiescot]

3 minutes ago, fangless said:

Scotland’s Future – Your Guide to an Independent Scotland.

View Independent Scotland’s Road Map 2014.

The preface to this document is a 4 page letter from Alex Salmond who was the Leader of the SNP and Scotland’s First Minister at the time. On page 10 of the PDF, numbered viii, or the first page of the preface, 5th paragraph is as follows:

The debate we are engaged in as a nation is about the future of all of us lucky enough to live in this diverse and vibrant country. It is a rare and precious moment in the history of Scotland – a once in a generation opportunity to chart a better way.

 

It was not a throw away comment.

 

So what?

Where is there any legal obligation that it was a "once in a generation" event?

Where is a generation even defined?

Alex Salmond is no longer in charge of the SNP.

Is this all you unionist Brexiteers have? Using a line designed to get the electorate to turn out is the only hope you have of holding the union together?

Dear God you guys are struggling.

Hey why not make a positive case for staying in the union?

Ah right. Tumbleweed and whistling wind. 

[RuamRudy]

Just now, vogie said:

I don't know if anybody has told you this but the Scottish are againgst independence too, it is only the SNP that in the minority want to divide our nation.

 

Now Vogie, surely you know this to be  lie. Surely you have picked up it, given the number of times I have had to explain it on every Scotland thread when so many people get it wrong.

 

For your awareness (again):

 

2014 - the majority of Scots voted for independence from the UK; majority of non Scottish voters voted to remain.

2020 - 14 consecutive Polls showing majority of ALL voters want independence from the UK