Scottish nationalists set for record majority, boosting independence push

[tebee]

8 hours ago, JonnyF said:

 

Looks like the SNP will self destruct before a second Indyref. T

 

So not only is the EU going to disintegrate, now the SNP is. 

 

Lots of wishful thinking from brexiters/unionists who seem to manage to avoid cognitive dissonance  somehow.

 

I'd put money on Labour or the Tories splitting first.

 

Of course post-independence it would be only natural for the SNP to split.  

[Rookiescot]

1 hour ago, Nout said:

Corruption at the heart SNP

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/debate/article-9297015/ANDREW-NEIL-Nicola-Sturgeons-storm-troops-turned-Scotland-banana-republic.html

 

The Daily Mail and Andrew Neil?

Unionist wet dream that combination. 

Neither Salmond nor Sturgeon is the face of independence. Either could disappear off the political radar tomorrow and we will still be voting for independence come the elections in May.

I'm afraid your hopes of a collapse are going to be dashed. 

[Rookiescot]

16 minutes ago, tebee said:

 

So not only is the EU going to disintegrate, now the SNP is. 

 

Lots of wishful thinking from brexiters/unionists who seem to manage to avoid cognitive dissonance  somehow.

 

I'd put money on Labour or the Tories splitting first.

 

Of course post-independence it would be only natural for the SNP to split.  

 

Its their only hope of averting what is obvious. Scotland will become independent and within 10 years the Peoples Democratic Kingdom of Brexitland, having reverted back to being the sick man of europe, will be holding a referendum on joining the EU.

Perhaps Scotland will veto their application. 

[sharksy]

7 hours ago, Neeranam said:

 Scotland has become the only oil producing nation in the world to become poorer since the discovery of these resources, the City of London has financialised itself on the back of Scotland’s oil.

Off the top of my head, Venezuela hasn't done too well, and they have a lot more oil than the UK.
https://foreignpolicy.com/2018/07/16/how-venezuela-struck-it-poor-oil-energy-chavez/

Edited February 25, 2021 by sharksy

[vinny41]

19 minutes ago, Rookiescot said:

 

Its their only hope of averting what is obvious. Scotland will become independent and within 10 years the Peoples Democratic Kingdom of Brexitland, having reverted back to being the sick man of europe, will be holding a referendum on joining the EU.

Perhaps Scotland will veto their application. 

Scotland has been called "sick man of Europe" several times, but for health reasons instead of economic.^[31]

In 2015 and 2016, Finland has been called the "sick man of Europe" due to its recession and lacklustre growth, in a time when virtually all other European countries have recovered from the Great Recession.^[29][30]

^{A report by Morgan Stanley referred to France as the "new sick man of Europe."[23] This label was reaffirmed in January 2014 by European newspapers such as The Guardian and Frankfurter Allgemeine.[24][25] They justified this with France's high unemployment, weak economic growth and poor industrial output.[26]}

^{https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sick_man_of_Europe}

 

^{Greece, Italy and Germany have all been referred to has the sick man of Europe over the past 20 years}

[JonnyF]

23 minutes ago, sharksy said:

Off the top of my head, Venezuela hasn't done too well, and they have a lot more oil than the UK.
https://foreignpolicy.com/2018/07/16/how-venezuela-struck-it-poor-oil-energy-chavez/

The Scots nats are clinging onto to the oil they think they own just as the ICE is being phased out and electric/green energies and green philosophies are taking over. Oil prices are plummeting and that's all they have lol.

 

A lot of them would consider themselves environmentalists as well but they'll forget all  that green nonsense if it means independence from England (sorry I mean Westminster) and complete subservience to the EU. 

 

Only 200 years too late to make the most of that oil. Wait for it to hit rock bottom in a green revolution then try to use it as leverage. Great plan. ????

 

 

 

 

[RuamRudy]

17 minutes ago, sharksy said:

In Scotland it is quicker to get a drugs delivery than a pizza.  What did you order when you wrote this?

 

Would you care to address the points rather than insinuate about me, personally?

 

As for drugs home delivery, a UK wide problem apparently. One might almost be forgiven for thinking that the UK drug policy is a disaster, reserved as it is to Westminster. 

 

Cocaine delivered quicker than pizza in England and Scotland, according to drugs survey

Cocaine can be delivered quicker than a pizza in England and Scotland, according to a global drugs survey.

[RuamRudy]

2 hours ago, JonnyF said:

The Scots nats are clinging onto to the oil they think they own just as the ICE is being phased out and electric/green energies and green philosophies are taking over. Oil prices are plummeting and that's all they have lol.

 

A lot of them would consider themselves environmentalists as well but they'll forget all  that green nonsense if it means independence from England (sorry I mean Westminster) and complete subservience to the EU. 

 

Only 200 years too late to make the most of that oil. Wait for it to hit rock bottom in a green revolution then try to use it as leverage. Great plan. ????

 

Would you agree with me that it is a tragedy that so many in the UK are clueless about what is going on elsewhere on the isles?

 

https://www.businessforscotland.com/scotland-is-one-of-the-worlds-most-naturally-wealthy-nations/

 

[Nout]

1 hour ago, RuamRudy said:

 

I genuinely expected better of you than this. There is no dislike of English people in my post, or in any of my posts. I have not derided the history of your country nor have I belittled or questioned the varied and wonderful cultural facets it boasts. I have certainly given you no reason to write such statements as this:

 

or this:

 

I have made no suggestion that English history is anything other than rich, fascinating and something to be respected. I did, however, question why my own country's history was ignored while children were taught about the history of what was a separate country. I struggle to see why that would be so objectionable to you. Would you be happy for your children to learn about Scottish history in the middle ages at the cost of not learning of their own heritage? You said yourself that the story of Scotland prior to the act of union is fascinating - so why was it eschewed in Scottish schools so we could learn about the English civil war?

 

 

Er...you lost.

[sharksy]

2 hours ago, RuamRudy said:

 

Would you agree with me that it is a tragedy that so many in the UK are clueless about what is going on elsewhere on the isles?

https://www.businessforscotland.com/scotland-is-one-of-the-worlds-most-naturally-wealthy-nations/

 

And what would these figures by like after the islanders declare independence from Scotland?  I'm sure this has been considered by the SNP...... 

[RuamRudy]

1 minute ago, Nout said:

Er...you lost.

 

Fair enough, mate, when you put it as eloquently and fulsomely as that, how could I ever hope to win whatever is going on in your head.

[RuamRudy]

Just now, sharksy said:

And what would these figures by like after the islanders declare independence from Scotland?  I'm sure this has been considered by the SNP...... 

 

Oh are we back to the English guy, valiantly fighting for Shetland independence, who got 1% of the vote in the 2017 GE?

 

You do know that there are no trees on Shetland, don't you? One of my oldest friends is from Whalsay - he never saw a tree until he was 16. In all the many years I have known him, he has had a fascination for trees. 

[sharksy]

6 minutes ago, RuamRudy said:

 

Oh are we back to the English guy, valiantly fighting for Shetland independence, who got 1% of the vote in the 2017 GE?

 

You do know that there are no trees on Shetland, don't you? One of my oldest friends is from Whalsay - he never saw a tree until he was 16. In all the many years I have known him, he has had a fascination for trees. 

Not just Shetland.  Orkney too.  Who else might join them?

Seeing as you were happy to quote the Express in a recent post:
https://www.express.co.uk/news/politics/1334720/nicola-sturgeon-orkney-independence-referendum-vote-scotland-shetland-islands-snp-scottis
 

[RuamRudy]

Just now, sharksy said:

Not just Shetland.  Orkney too.  Who else might join them?

Seeing as you were happy to quote the Express in a recent post:
https://www.express.co.uk/news/politics/1334720/nicola-sturgeon-orkney-independence-referendum-vote-scotland-shetland-islands-snp-scottis
 

 

No trees on Orkney either, so we still get to claim 60% of the UK's forestry. 

 

To be honest, I really see this as simply being another scare tactic by unionist - because, let's be realistic. If one were concerned about the centralisation of power in Edinburgh, surely the answer is not to throw your lot in with Westminster?

 

But let's play out this little fantasy and see how it would end up - Orkney and Shetland becoming crown dependencies such as the IoM. 

 

The Official Isle of Man Government Website

The Territorial Seas (including hydrocarbon, coal and mineral rights, up to the 12 mile limit) was purchased by the Isle of Man Government from the United Kingdom Government in 1991. 

 

 

So I don't want to be churlish about things, and I definitely don't want to stand in the way of anyone's right to self determination. If either Orkney or Shetland wish to secede from an independent Scotland and form a crown dependency, I think they should be entitled to do so. I would also encourage the Scottish Government to sell to them the territorial rights to 12 nautical miles from their coast lines.

[JonnyF]

30 minutes ago, RuamRudy said:

 

Would you agree with me that it is a tragedy that so many in the UK are clueless about what is going on elsewhere on the isles?

 

 

Awwww that's sweet. Recent links to backup each of those outlandish claims please.

 

Otherwise it looks like a collage my 10 year old niece does to tell my sister how much she loves her on her birthday. ????

[RuamRudy]

Just now, JonnyF said:

 

Awwww that's sweet. Recent links to backup each of those outlandish claims please.

 

Otherwise it looks like a collage my 10 year old niece does to tell my sister how much she loves her on her birthday. ????

 

That's ok - your acknowledgement or otherwise is immaterial. This guy has a good handle on things though.

 

 

[Nout]

2 hours ago, Rookiescot said:

 

Its their only hope of averting what is obvious. Scotland will become independent and within 10 years the Peoples Democratic Kingdom of Brexitland, having reverted back to being the sick man of europe, will be holding a referendum on joining the EU.

Perhaps Scotland will veto their application. 

Silly. Euroland is slowly disintegrating. Just for once read some information that does not confirm your own prejudices.

Edited February 25, 2021 by Nout

[JonnyF]

59 minutes ago, RuamRudy said:

 

That's ok - your acknowledgement or otherwise is immaterial. This guy has a good handle on things though.

 

 

Actually it's a rule of the forum to provide links to such claims. 

 

A rule which is selectively applied of course.

[RuamRudy]

2 minutes ago, JonnyF said:

Actually it's a rule of the forum to provide links to such claims. 

 

A rule which is selectively applied of course.

 

The origin with web address is clearly stated on the graphic. No need for you to go running to teacher. You only need to pay more attention. 

[Rookiescot]

2 hours ago, Nout said:

Silly. Euroland is slowly disintegrating. Just for once read some information that does not confirm your own prejudices.

Is it really?

Or is that just something you want to believe.

But you are of course entitled to your opinion. Backed up by the right wing media and conspiracy theorists on the web.

The rest of us will take our chances using more educated sources.

[Rookiescot]

4 hours ago, JonnyF said:

The Scots nats are clinging onto to the oil they think they own just as the ICE is being phased out and electric/green energies and green philosophies are taking over. Oil prices are plummeting and that's all they have lol.

 

A lot of them would consider themselves environmentalists as well but they'll forget all  that green nonsense if it means independence from England (sorry I mean Westminster) and complete subservience to the EU. 

 

Only 200 years too late to make the most of that oil. Wait for it to hit rock bottom in a green revolution then try to use it as leverage. Great plan. ????

 

 

 

 

 

Scotland exports electricity to England.

After independence we might just sell it to someone else.

All those plucky Brexiteers sitting in the candlelight reminiscing about how this is just what it was like during the blitz ???? 

[tebee]

6 hours ago, Rookiescot said:

Is it really?

Or is that just something you want to believe.

But you are of course entitled to your opinion. Backed up by the right wing media and conspiracy theorists on the web.

The rest of us will take our chances using more educated sources.

Strangely enough we in Europe don't hear anything about the EU disintegrating. 

Must be that the Daily Express is better informed any European matters than all the press over here.....

[BritManToo]

13 minutes ago, tebee said:

Strangely enough we in Europe don't hear anything about the EU disintegrating. 

Must be that the Daily Express is better informed any European matters than all the press over here.....

........ or EU censorship.

Have you had your EU COVID vaccination yet?  Just wondering.

[sandyf]

23 hours ago, JonnyF said:

Nice deflection ????.

 

I can understand why you'd want to avoid discussing the machiavellian antics of the Sturgeon and the Scottish Nasty Party. Especially when their self destruction will ruin your mission of breaking up the UK. You could be in for another tough year.

Fortunately, it has nothing to do with the SNP or what people like you think. At the end of the day it will be the view of the Scottish people that will prevail. It is a bit unfortunate that the current electorate are probably unaware, or have forgotten, that Alex Salmond was expelled from the SNP in 1982, many will now be regretting he was ever allowed back.

With the significant changes enforced on the UK by brexit, all devolved nations should have the option to reconsider the future and if they wish to remain under Westminster control, it would be their choice, not a dictate from Westminster.

It was England that determined the vote to leave the EU and they must learn to live with whatever fallout arises from that decision.

[sandyf]

15 hours ago, tebee said:

Of course post-independence it would be only natural for the SNP to split.  

Exactly. Independence would lead to a completely new set of political parties, something Douglas Ross is well aware of.

[Rimmer]

A troll post has been removed

[Mavideol]

17 hours ago, RuamRudy said:

 

Would you agree with me that it is a tragedy that so many in the UK are clueless about what is going on elsewhere on the isles?

 

https://www.businessforscotland.com/scotland-is-one-of-the-worlds-most-naturally-wealthy-nations/

 

in other words, England without Scotland (I didn't include Welsh and NI 555) will be a nothing to worry about country or just  a wanna be (as somebody here said)  sovereign/independent/good for nothing country .... (not trying to troll, just giving my opinion)

[RuamRudy]

15 minutes ago, Mavideol said:

in other words, England without Scotland (I didn't include Welsh and NI 555) will be a nothing to worry about country or just  a wanna be (as somebody here said)  sovereign/independent/good for nothing country .... (not trying to troll, just giving my opinion)

 

There are some here who think that Scotland is a financial burden on England. If that is true, the lifting of that burden must surely bode well for an English economic resurgence post Scottish independence? 

 

I have no doubt that England is more than capable of standing on its own two feet. Like Scotland, it has a mature and diverse economy, and while the whole of the UK is taking a bit of a battering at the moment, we will all doubtless rebound. Certainly England will become reliant on the importation of certain key resources it currently considers as its own, but there are no countries on this earth which are, to the best of my knowledge, wholly self sufficient, so that should be no huge issue. It may take some adjustment but nothing insurmountable. 

 

Of course, the status of the UK without Scotland will possibly need to be re-evaluated. I don't think its membership of the G7 would be threatened; my guess would be that rUK (or England, if you prefer) would be grandfathered into the slot previously filled by the UK. Whether rUK will remain a permanent member of the UN Security Council is debatable, however - I suspect that its right to that privilege will be challenged.

 

 

[RuamRudy]

3 hours ago, sandyf said:

Exactly. Independence would lead to a completely new set of political parties, something Douglas Ross is well aware of.

 

There are strong hints on twitter this morning, from people in the know, that something major is about to happen. My feeling is that Salmond is going to return to the front again, this time leading a List Only party. If that happens then it will be a massive win for independence - it will have only marginal effect on the SNP, who have very few list MSPs, but will destroy the unionist  bloc, which mostly consists of list MSPs. 

[youreavinalaff]

5 hours ago, sandyf said:

Fortunately, it has nothing to do with the SNP or what people like you think. At the end of the day it will be the view of the Scottish people that will prevail. It is a bit unfortunate that the current electorate are probably unaware, or have forgotten, that Alex Salmond was expelled from the SNP in 1982, many will now be regretting he was ever allowed back.

With the significant changes enforced on the UK by brexit, all devolved nations should have the option to reconsider the future and if they wish to remain under Westminster control, it would be their choice, not a dictate from Westminster.

It was England that determined the vote to leave the EU and they must learn to live with whatever fallout arises from that decision.

Incorrect. England did not have a vote. UK voted to leave the EU.