Thai health officials skeptical about vaccine passports

[ThailandGuy]

I just read that people still have to go into quarantine after being vaccinated when visiting Thailand. I predict that not many people will visit Thailand the next year. People just do not have that many days available for holidays and they do not want to spend that extra money per person sitting in a hotel waiting to enter the country. They will go to another country with a more friendly entry regime. The hole idea behind vaccinating is to stop the virus spread and reduce severe illness. Although Thailand has proven the rightness of their strategy reducing the pandemic spread, the consequences for their economy are disastreus. The latter will continue if they keep on going that way.

[jomtienisgood]

8 minutes ago, ThailandGuy said:

I just read that people still have to go into quarantine after being vaccinated when visiting Thailand. I predict that not many people will visit Thailand the next year. People just do not have that many days available for holidays and they do not want to spend that extra money per person sitting in a hotel waiting to enter the country. They will go to another country with a more friendly entry regime. The hole idea behind vaccinating is to stop the virus spread and reduce severe illness. Although Thailand has proven the rightness of their strategy reducing the pandemic spread, the consequences for their economy are disastreus. The latter will continue if they keep on going that way.

Could possibly go to Nigeria or Saudi......55555555

[Dialemco]

It is to early to see if vaccines actually reduce infections to manageable levels. It is probably still best to require Covid Free Certificate before travel which could be issued by Airlines before departure. Meanwhile looks like no International travel between continents this year after which who knows how many airlines will have survived so travel may also be restricted by the then available capacity and price which likely to be very much more than precovid. The tourism cash cow will not exist for many years if ever.

[ThailandGuy]

22 minutes ago, jomtienisgood said:

Could possibly go to Nigeria or Saudi......55555555

Besides those countries there are better locations, much more friendly, safer, cheaper and open without these idiotic quarantine requirements. Thailand keeps on killing it's own tourist-economy. Average People do not have the extra 14 days to spend besides that they do not want to spend the extra money it cost. So good luck with no tourist to come except a few which income for Thailand will vaporate in the sun like a drop of water.

 

Edited February 9, 2021 by ThailandGuy

[stuarty]

27 minutes ago, ThailandGuy said:

I just read that people still have to go into quarantine after being vaccinated when visiting Thailand. I predict that not many people will visit Thailand the next year. People just do not have that many days available for holidays and they do not want to spend that extra money per person sitting in a hotel waiting to enter the country. They will go to another country with a more friendly entry regime. The hole idea behind vaccinating is to stop the virus spread and reduce severe illness. Although Thailand has proven the rightness of their strategy reducing the pandemic spread, the consequences for their economy are disastreus. The latter will continue if they keep on going that way.

You read this? Where?

[tomauasia]

20 hours ago, YetAnother said:

maybe there exists the tiniest grain of intelligence in them after all

Absolute nonsense. The main vaccines work. Yes they are super intelligent hilarious. Keep destroying the economy. Soon there will homeless Thais on the streets 

[tomauasia]

18 hours ago, anchadian said:

If this vaccination passport is not adopted, travelers will still need to do the 14 days quarantine.

 

Again, it's all about money. 

 

 

Yes Thai brain. We don't have vaccines and we won't have our people vaccinated until we build theThai space station. So until then we make excuses why not to let vaccinated tourists in. These army characters will fall flat on there heads. And take all Thai nationals along for the big dipper fall. Vaccinated 1st world nationals will not pay for quarantine. Anyway when is the election. lm sure Thais are ready to vote. 

[popabear]

19 hours ago, snoop1130 said:

The Director-General of the Disease Control Department, Dr. Opas Karnkawinpong announced yesterday that the vaccine passport is only a suggestion, because the World Health Organisation has suggested that there is not enough evidence to show that the COVID-19 vaccine will fully protect people from getting infected.

This seems to go on and on , when will they ever get their thinking right about this virus , so maybe one day things just might get back to near normal. This COVID-19  is not going away, even if everybody gets the vaccine , so if they don't learn to live with this virus , we will forever be having lock downs , like here in Australia , we just get one positive case and they lock  the whole State down , it' just a joke , forget about international travel , you cannot even travel within Australia , with a lock down that could happen at any minute , that would leave you stranded in some remote place for 14 days ,miles from your home and with only a few hours warning .. Regards,,,,, Popa

[tomauasia]

1 hour ago, ThailandGuy said:

I just read that people still have to go into quarantine after being vaccinated when visiting Thailand. I predict that not many people will visit Thailand the next year. People just do not have that many days available for holidays and they do not want to spend that extra money per person sitting in a hotel waiting to enter the country. They will go to another country with a more friendly entry regime. The hole idea behind vaccinating is to stop the virus spread and reduce severe illness. Although Thailand has proven the rightness of their strategy reducing the pandemic spread, the consequences for their economy are disastreus. The latter will continue if they keep on going that way.

Bankrupt Thais 

[Chiang Mai Bill]

10 hours ago, sirineou said:

So I am scanning the news on Google news:

The US Government is considering it.

"On his full first day in office, President Biden revealed his 200-page national pandemic strategy with seven goals aimed at ending the Covid-19 pandemic. Buried deep in the report, on page 181, is a directive for multiple government agencies to work together to “assess the feasibility” of linking Covid-19 vaccinations to international vaccination certificates and producing electronic versions of them. "

 

"The United Kingdom is preparing a certification system that would allow inoculated citizens to travel abroad this summer, reported the London Times "

 

" Last month, Ursula von der Leyen, president of the European Union Commission, said that she supports creating a common EU-established vaccination certificate that can be issued by member states to their citizens"

 

" While they wait for an EU-wide vaccination certificate to become available, some European Union member states are already or will soon be issuing their own certificates to citizens who have been vaccinated against Covid-19."

 

"Iceland, Denmark , Sweden, Spain,Cyprus, Poland, Estonia,Greece are some of the countries that will be issuing and accepting covid passports "

https://www.forbes.com/sites/suzannerowankelleher/2021/02/05/these-european-countries-are-launching-vaccine-passports/?sh=6176a6b677a5

 

"Greece agrees vaccine passport deal with Israel as ‘trial run’  "

https://www.politico.eu/article/greece-agrees-coronavirus-vaccine-passport-deal-with-israel-as-trial-run/

 

I am sure there are many other countries working on this proposal. As you can see the proposal is gaining speed  around the world. Thailand being a major tourist destination can't be far behind.

Of course everyone is monitoring Covid 19 developments and I am sure  will modify their position in the next few months depending on the data. 

 

Hmmmm. So the USA, UK, EU, Iceland, Israel and others will have their certification. I wonder if there will be any compatability --- or comparability -- with each? Will they all be in the language of their origin? Will, say in the case of Thailand, there be an infrastructure to detect forgeries and the Immigration officers have a knowledge of the different languages? I doubt that the French will want their certificates be in English!

 

In the first week of the UK demanding covid tests on all arrivals numerous forgeries were detected!

 

No doubt they will be available on the internet for $50.

[Geoff N]

21 hours ago, Antiparovian said:

Easily forgeable. Need a Bar or QR code linked to the vaccination.

 

 

There is no bar code or QR on the yellow fever certificate..... They work ok. Same with other innoculation cards, cholera, meningitis, typhoid etc too. Some, eg. Flu don't even need a certificate. Keep it simple.

[allyoops]

It would probably be best to have the vaccination pass together with a recent negative test. If that's not enough maybe a short quarantine until a test result can be obtained.

[DogNo1]

The primary objective of the Thai government should be to protect Thai citizens and Thai residents, especially the elderly and people with high-risk conditions, from contracting the virus.  What they are doing is correct and prudent.  If you lose your job and live, you can work another day.  If you die, you can’t.  Once a significant percentage of the population is vaccinated, especially all of those most vulnerable, travel restrictions can be eased.  Until then, they shouldn’t be.  Right now, those who must travel to countries with high infection rates should have a high priority for getting the vaccine.  The fate of the world and its unemployed workers depends on the speed of the administration of the vaccines.  While it may be an unstated objective, I think that it would be useful for the WHO to urge an intensified international effort to produce and administer vaccines.

[Paul DS]

So, in the UK and most of the EU...as soon as travel is allowed many will look at Thailand and see it still has quarantine and then frget them and go elsewhere, easy as that! Sorry for Thailand!

[Captain Monday]

1 hour ago, Chiang Mai Bill said:

Hmmmm. So the USA, UK, EU, Iceland, Israel and others will have their certification. I wonder if there will be any compatability --- or comparability -- with each? Will they all be in the language of their origin? Will, say in the case of Thailand, there be an infrastructure to detect forgeries and the Immigration officers have a knowledge of the different languages? I doubt that the French will want their certificates be in English!

 

In the first week of the UK demanding covid tests on all arrivals numerous forgeries were detected!

 

No doubt they will be available on the internet for $50.

Again, not something you can buy in the internet "for $50". The proposed travel health pass, vaccine passport or whatever it will be called as being developed by IATA has not anything do with a bit of paper, stamps or seals that can be faked, or other early 20th century nonsense.

https://www.iata.org/en/programs/passenger/travel-pass/

 

By the time it is rolled out however I think covid-19 will be largely gone. Airline CEOs such as Fernandes and Al Baker have reported international cooperation is way way behind other previous crisis.  Follow the money. 

[Ireland32]

21 hours ago, RotBenz8888 said:

If they decide to keep the quaranten during next high season, Phuket and Pattaya will as lively as Hiroshima and Nagasaki after ww2. 

Another Doomsday Fan , enough is enough with this Thailand is Dead <deleted> 

[Ireland32]

13 minutes ago, DogNo1 said:

The primary objective of the Thai government should be to protect Thai citizens and Thai residents, especially the elderly and people with high-risk conditions, from contracting the virus.  What they are doing is correct and prudent.  If you lose your job and live, you can work another day.  If you die, you can’t.  Once a significant percentage of the population is vaccinated, especially all of those most vulnerable, travel restrictions can be eased.  Until then, they shouldn’t be.  Right now, those who must travel to countries with high infection rates should have a high priority for getting the vaccine.  The fate of the world and its unemployed workers depends on the speed of the administration of the vaccines.  While it may be an unstated objective, I think that it would be useful for the WHO to urge an intensified international effort to produce and administer vaccines.

Sadly I wouldn’t trust WHO to tie my shoes , Chinese owned snd operated and still China stingy with Funds 

[geisha]

The only problem I see is that until young travelers get their vaccin they won’t be able to travel ? 

[skippybangkok]

22 hours ago, YetAnother said:

maybe there exists the tiniest grain of intelligence in them after all

 

Ah, a Superious Farangerous in its natural environment, often join by its close relative Superious Ingorantous 

[Janner1]

9 hours ago, LomSak27 said:

That is why you have to fully vaccinate the Thai population. There is no other way around that fact. The Thai economy will continue to implode until this is done and tourism reopened.

 

What Is The Hold Up On That!     ????

 

Submarines ???

[placnx]

10 hours ago, ukrules said:

 

Any 'vaccine passport' would need to be very specific, apparently only some vaccines work for some of the variants and others, not so much.

 

It's going to be a complex and rapidly changing situation.

 

Conclusion - it's completely unworkable.

 

If it was as simple as showing you've been vaccinated then no problem but that's not the case at all.

It's going to be complex. I looked at the Estonia/WHO project today. Estonia is creating a digitized administrative environment, and a local private company is developing that for their government, so this WHO card project piggybacks on what they are already doing. Here are some links:

https://www.who.int/news-room/feature-stories/detail/estonia-and-who-to-jointly-develop-digital-vaccine-certificate-to-strengthen-covax

https://guardtime.com/vaccineguard

https://m.guardtime.com/files/Guardtime_VaccineGuard_Whitepaper_v2.pdf

It seems that they have developed their own data exchange standards, which in not helpful. Further, they do the same as other, such as the IATA initiative, by using a app on a smartphone to generate a QR "good-to-go" code. These QR codes are time-sensitive authorization codes.

 

I do not like all this fragmentation. Here you can see how bad it is:

 https://www.adalovelaceinstitute.org/project/international-monitor-vaccine-passports-covid-status-apps/

 

There would probably be a lot of people in the Third World with phones that could not deal with these apps. Though they are not the people likely to take international flights, their health is important for controlling Covid.

 

The opposite approach would make it possible for people all over the world to use the same basic certificate, but each certificate would have a pre-printed individualized QR code that would be entered in the national database of the country where the first vaccination was administered. This code would never change for the individual concerned, could be used for all subsequent vaccinations, for other diseases as well.

 

 

[QPRFC]

22 hours ago, Antiparovian said:

Easily forgeable. Need a Bar or QR code linked to the vaccination.

 

 

Already available on Khao San Road

[placnx]

22 hours ago, GeorgeCross said:

22 hours ago, snoop1130 said:

Thai health officials are not convinced about the “vaccine passport” idea, which would allow travellers, who have been vaccinated against COVID-19 to enter Thailand without the need to endure 14-days of quarantine.

Any vaccine passport should not override the discretion of public health officials at the entry point. Of course, it would make sense that the airline clears a person when they are getting a ticket, to let them know whether they will probably be able to enter x-country without quarantine, etc., or even be refused entry.

[Kwasaki]

22 hours ago, YetAnother said:

maybe there exists the tiniest grain of intelligence in them after all

Obviously not a lot. ????

[Captain Monday]

43 minutes ago, placnx said:

It's going to be complex. I looked at the Estonia/WHO project today. Estonia is creating a digitized administrative environment, and a local private company is developing that for their government, so this WHO card project piggybacks on what they are already doing. Here are some links:

https://www.who.int/news-room/feature-stories/detail/estonia-and-who-to-jointly-develop-digital-vaccine-certificate-to-strengthen-covax

https://guardtime.com/vaccineguard

https://m.guardtime.com/files/Guardtime_VaccineGuard_Whitepaper_v2.pdf

It seems that they have developed their own data exchange standards, which in not helpful. Further, they do the same as other, such as the IATA initiative, by using a app on a smartphone to generate a QR "good-to-go" code. These QR codes are time-sensitive authorization codes.

 

I do not like all this fragmentation. Here you can see how bad it is:

 https://www.adalovelaceinstitute.org/project/international-monitor-vaccine-passports-covid-status-apps/

 

There would probably be a lot of people in the Third World with phones that could not deal with these apps. Though they are not the people likely to take international flights, their health is important for controlling Covid.

 

The opposite approach would make it possible for people all over the world to use the same basic certificate, but each certificate would have a pre-printed individualized QR code that would be entered in the national database of the country where the first vaccination was administered. This code would never change for the individual concerned, could be used for all subsequent vaccinations, for other diseases as well.

 

 

People in developing countries are often actual already ahead in mobile technology as wireless networks/ smartphones leapfrog installation  of backward wired networks. More than a year since I have been to China but they are way ahead the US in mobile payments, hard to pay using cash there in many stores. The digital administrative environment and  health profile could be expanded to include visa information, criminal background checks, even bank data and credit ratings.  

[Autonuaq]

13 hours ago, sirineou said:

So I am scanning the news on Google news:

The US Government is considering it.

"On his full first day in office, President Biden revealed his 200-page national pandemic strategy with seven goals aimed at ending the Covid-19 pandemic. Buried deep in the report, on page 181, is a directive for multiple government agencies to work together to “assess the feasibility” of linking Covid-19 vaccinations to international vaccination certificates and producing electronic versions of them. "

 

"The United Kingdom is preparing a certification system that would allow inoculated citizens to travel abroad this summer, reported the London Times "

 

" Last month, Ursula von der Leyen, president of the European Union Commission, said that she supports creating a common EU-established vaccination certificate that can be issued by member states to their citizens"

 

" While they wait for an EU-wide vaccination certificate to become available, some European Union member states are already or will soon be issuing their own certificates to citizens who have been vaccinated against Covid-19."

 

"Iceland, Denmark , Sweden, Spain,Cyprus, Poland, Estonia,Greece are some of the countries that will be issuing and accepting covid passports "

https://www.forbes.com/sites/suzannerowankelleher/2021/02/05/these-european-countries-are-launching-vaccine-passports/?sh=6176a6b677a5

 

"Greece agrees vaccine passport deal with Israel as ‘trial run’  "

https://www.politico.eu/article/greece-agrees-coronavirus-vaccine-passport-deal-with-israel-as-trial-run/

 

I am sure there are many other countries working on this proposal. As you can see the proposal is gaining speed  around the world. Thailand being a major tourist destination can't be far behind.

Of course everyone is monitoring Covid 19 developments and I am sure  will modify their position in the next few months depending on the data. 

 

The big problem is that the people who are Vaccinated still can be super spreaders.

 

And the same as the flue you are only protected against the original and hope fully the mutations.

 

As seen already with the south african mutations the Oxford vaccine not work well enough.

 

And the Brazilian mutations is also the question.

Both are now spreading faster 

 

Vaccinated or not you are still having the chance to get ill from the mutations or spread them

 

 

[KhaoYai]

23 hours ago, snoop1130 said:

Thai health officials are not convinced about the “vaccine passport” idea, which would allow travellers, who have been vaccinated against COVID-19 to enter Thailand without the need to endure 14-days of quarantine.

Then its difficult to see what will convince them and how they intend to open up.  Its pretty obvious that as long as quarantine continues, tourism is all but dead.  What else, other than a vaccine will trigger the return of some form of normality? 

 

Even with effective vaccines, Covid 19 is going to be around for a long time - possibly forever. Before long every country will have to decide what level of risk they are prepared to accept.

[Truth Will Set You Free]

On 2/8/2021 at 6:39 PM, snoop1130 said:

the World Health Organisation has suggested that there is not enough evidence to show that the COVID-19 vaccine will fully protect people from getting infected.

Isn’t this country a joke.......????????????

Edited February 9, 2021 by Truth Will Set You Free

[BernieOnTour]

23 hours ago, GeorgeCross said:

only way thailand can open tourism with their current zero tolerance is if they vaccinate their whole population.

 

Sorry, but that is only wishful thinking ...

 

To achieve that, you would need a vaccine giving you immune sterility

(in essence, stopping you to infect others) !

 

Even Astra Zeneca is not claiming, their vaccine is achieving this:

https://papers.ssrn.com/sol3/papers.cfm?abstract_id=3777268

 

Their primary endpoint was:

vaccine is effective at preventing COVID-19, with no severe cases and no hospitalisations

 

Secondary endpoint was:

early prevention of severe disease after the first dose

[placnx]

10 hours ago, FarFlungFalang said:

The theory is that we need only achieve 70% for herd immunity to kick in and finish the virus off which is fine if the virus stops its mutation tricks. 

After the UK variant now they are saying that 80% is needed to achieve herd immunity. It also depends on the efficacy of the vaccine.