Do I need to register for tax?

[Jimmy B]

Do I need to register for tax here in Thailand? From what I’ve read you are classed as a Thai tax resident if you reside here for more than 6 months a year. This includes rental income, pensions etc from abroad. I’ve never been asked about it in my 20 years living here. I’m on a marriage extension, I don’t work or own a company/business (no work permit), I just use transferwise to transfer living expenses from the UK(rental income) each month. I’ve been talking to a financial adviser in the UK concerning my UK assets and he’s saying he needs to discuss with my accountant about the tax system in Thailand. Other guys don’t seem to bother about it and say Thai authorities don’t care about old gits bringing in their pension money/income each month to spend and live here. I’ve also read that if you bring in money that wasn’t earnt in the current tax year (savings) you are exempt from Thai tax. I’m a bit confused and don’t want to deal with authorities here if I don’t have to. Anyone in a similar situation?

[tonray]

Do you pay tax on your income in the UK ? If you do...Thailand and the UK have a treaty to prevent double taxation...you owe nothing here if you pay taxes at home. Same for Americans and many others.

[Jimmy B]

Yes registered for tax in the UK. So no need to do anything this end I suppose. Cheers.

[foreverlomsak]

15 minutes ago, Jimmy B said:

Do I need to register for tax here in Thailand? From what I’ve read you are classed as a Thai tax resident if you reside here for more than 6 months a year. This includes rental income, pensions etc from abroad. I’ve never been asked about it in my 20 years living here. I’m on a marriage extension, I don’t work or own a company/business (no work permit), I just use transferwise to transfer living expenses from the UK(rental income) each month. I’ve been talking to a financial adviser in the UK concerning my UK assets and he’s saying he needs to discuss with my accountant about the tax system in Thailand. Other guys don’t seem to bother about it and say Thai authorities don’t care about old gits bringing in their pension money/income each month to spend and live here. I’ve also read that if you bring in money that wasn’t earnt in the current tax year (savings) you are exempt from Thai tax. I’m a bit confused and don’t want to deal with authorities here if I don’t have to. Anyone in a similar situation?

Registration with Thai Tax authorities at the moment is entirely up to you it's not even mandatory for Thais, don't do it if you don't want to, not he same system as UK where you are automatically registered.

You need to be earning about 35,000 THB per month to get into the lowest tax bracket, even then you may pay nothing due to Tax allowances, etc.

Theoretically if you have your UK pension(s) directly deposited here every month, you could be subject to Thai tax, but if your not registered they are not going to know.

All income up to and including December, is not subject to Thai tax if it is brought into the country in January, as the Thai tax year is the calendar year, not the stupid 6 April to 5 April that the UK has.

A couple of years ago the Taxation Agreement was changed between UK and Thailand, you could theoretically be taxed in the UK and then on arrival in Thailand, but if your not registered they are not going to know, if you are registered and you do get taxed, some types of income can be subject of refunds in the UK tax paid there.

[Peterw42]

OP, I would be finding a new financial advisor. For 20 years you have never had an issue but now feel the need to make enquiries, because the advisor doesn't know the difference between savings and earnings or tax treaties.

[foreverlomsak]

24 minutes ago, tonray said:

Do you pay tax on your income in the UK ? If you do...Thailand and the UK have a treaty to prevent double taxation...you owe nothing here if you pay taxes at home. Same for Americans and many others.

UK/Thailand treaty changed a few years ago, it is now theoretically possible to be taxed in both with rebates being claimable in the UK.

Registration for Thai Tax is not mandatory however, even for Thai's, if your not registered for Thai tax they aren't going to know.

[noise]

To be reassured, Google tax treaty UK Thailand and read it for yourself.

[natway09]

Your pension being transferred I would do nothing about.

If you are bringing over rental income untaxed then may be liable

[Neeranam]

8 hours ago, Jimmy B said:

Other guys don’t seem to bother about it and say Thai authorities don’t care about old gits bringing in their pension money/income each month to spend and live here.

I believe Al Capone thought the same about other gangsters evading tax, however, he got done. I don't know the penalty for bringing in earnings and not paying tax. I'm surprised you have to pay in the UK if you have lived here for 20 years.

My allowances are about 45,000 baht a month.

8 hours ago, Jimmy B said:

I’m a bit confused and don’t want to deal with authorities here if I don’t have to.

Not many people do, but it is the correct thing.

 

 

[foreverlomsak]

6 hours ago, noise said:

To be reassured, Google tax treaty UK Thailand and read it for yourself.

This is the important section on Personal Income Tax in Thailand

1.Taxable Person

Taxpayers are classified into “resident” and “non-resident”. “Resident” means any person residing in Thailand for a period or periods aggregating more than 180 days in any tax (calendar) year. A resident of Thailand is liable to pay tax on income from sources in Thailand as well as on the portion of income from foreign sources that is brought into Thailand. A non-resident is, however, subject to tax only on income from sources in Thailand.

Personal Income Tax | The Revenue Department (English Site) (rd.go.th)

[foreverlomsak]

15 minutes ago, Neeranam said:

I'm surprised you have to pay in the UK if you have lived here for 20 years.

I'm afraid it's true, in the UK income is taxed at source in the UK (and that includes Pensions), if it's earned in the UK it's taxed in the UK.

[Neeranam]

7 minutes ago, foreverlomsak said:

I'm afraid it's true, in the UK income is taxed at source in the UK (and that includes Pensions), if it's earned in the UK it's taxed in the UK.

Is that the same for money for renting a house? I thought one would be a tax exile. 

[PGSan]

9 hours ago, foreverlomsak said:

not the stupid 6 April to 5 April that the UK has.

Why is this stupid?  

[topt]

2 hours ago, Neeranam said:

Is that the same for money for renting a house? I thought one would be a tax exile. 

Income received from renting a property is definitely taxable and if you are a landlord abroad your agent or even your tenants are supposed to withhold tax unless you get dispensation from the tax man to be paid gross - which is not normally difficult to obtain. 

[foreverlomsak]

3 hours ago, Neeranam said:

Is that the same for money for renting a house? I thought one would be a tax exile. 

If the house is in the UK and the money is paid into a UK account, in a word yes.

[Neeranam]

1 minute ago, foreverlomsak said:

If the house is in the UK and the money is paid into a UK account, in a word yes.

What about if the house owner is Thai, do they have to pay UK tax?

[foreverlomsak]

1 minute ago, Neeranam said:

What about if the house owner is Thai, do they have to pay UK tax?

If they are classed as normally resident in the UK, i.e. reside in the UK over 180 days per tax year probably.

Not an area I'm really familiar with.

[Neeranam]

1 minute ago, foreverlomsak said:

If they are classed as normally resident in the UK, i.e. reside in the UK over 180 days per tax year probably.

Not an area I'm really familiar with.

OK, thanks. I'm thinking of buy a flat and renting it out in Scotland. Maybe best put it in my wife's name. 

[Jimmy B]

I have a non residents landlord set up with my accountant in UK. I think I will make sure all taxes sorted in the UK and leave the Thai side. A friend said he went to the tax office and they asked him why he wants to register if not working in Thailand. Not interested apparently. Only on money made in Thailand.

[foreverlomsak]

1 minute ago, Neeranam said:

OK, thanks. I'm thinking of buy a flat and renting it out in Scotland. Maybe best put it in my wife's name. 

I think you need to take UK legal advice before you go any further.

[Neeranam]

1 minute ago, foreverlomsak said:

I think you need to take UK legal advice before you go any further.

I'll ask my brother, he was a partner for Knight Frank. 

[foreverlomsak]

1 minute ago, Jimmy B said:

I have a non residents landlord set up with my accountant in UK. I think I will make sure all taxes sorted in the UK and leave the Thai side. A friend said he went to the tax office and they asked him why he wants to register if not working in Thailand. Not interested apparently. Only on money made in Thailand.

That's definitely consistent with what I understand the situation to be. Don't register in Thailand and nobody gives a da@#. May change in the future with the requirements of money laundering/disclosure agreements between countries, but worry about it if it happens not now.

[khunPer]

15 hours ago, Jimmy B said:

Do I need to register for tax here in Thailand? From what I’ve read you are classed as a Thai tax resident if you reside here for more than 6 months a year. This includes rental income, pensions etc from abroad.

In principle YES, you are a tax-resident in Thailand.

 

Taxation will be in accordance with the double taxation agreement between Britain and Thailand. In general, if you are already taxed of income in Britain, you will not also be taxed in Thailand.

 

Thai tax authorities has begun to show interest for foreign retires, starting with the Nordic countries, where they call retired long-stayers to meeting in the revenue department concerning retirement pension from one's home country. Even if tax has been paid, they still wish to register it. It's said that the revenue department will continue with all, but you never know what will happen in Thailand.

 

Income that is not taxed in one's home country, or any foreign income, is in principle taxable in Thailand; however, only if the income is transferred into Thailand during the same calendar years as it's earned, The following year, and any later time, the funds are considered savings that are free from tax when transferred into Thailand.

[Jimmy B]

So if necessary I could transfer my living expenses from a savings pot and that would solve any issues if the Thai authorities start cracking down on expats. Only monies earned and transferred to Thailand within the same tax year are taxable. I've never been asked anything at immigration or any authority for that matter so will see how things develop. Thanks for all the advice.