Money Transfer

[DPKANKAN]

Just a heads up warning for anyone using Transferwise, now Wise, for doing your monthly income for retirement visa extension.

After having issues last year getting a statement sorted by Kasikorn Bank, I started a month early this time with them. 

It has still been like pulling teeth with them and has dragged down to the wire now.

After eventually getting a name and meeting set up with the said Asst Branch Manager, she still had no clue notwithstanding I had emailed to them their previous letter, a monthly schedule, the works.

"Come back tommorow, I call you"

Went back the next day, yesterday, to collect it, low and behold it was wrong. 3 months missing.

So after many phone calls with someone burbling English, Kasiikorn said those 3 missing monthly payments came via Bangkok Bank, not direct to Kasikorn. 

Having checked my statement from Wise, it states that it was sent to my Kasikorn account.

I now have been trying to get Bangkok bank to confirm this, shunting between both banks!!!

On checking further I noticed that each payment that did not come direct was for over, by a little, 100,000 baht. Only those ones seem to have not come directly!!

I have now taken that up with Wise as well, as the clock ticks down for my visa date imminently.

So the heads up is for anyone using Wise and monthly pension retirement visa, check with your bank that your payments came in directly.

Now to continue stressing!!

[hotandsticky]

It is a simple process with my local Kasikorn branch.

I request the standard bank letter confirming that I have an account and showing the current balance (minimal)

I request 12 months of bank statements stamped and signed by the bank.

I highlight (in pink) each monthly transfer of 65,000 Baht.

Buriram Immigration are satisfied with this.

[DPKANKAN]

27 minutes ago, hotandsticky said:

It is a simple process with my local Kasikorn branch.

I request the standard bank letter confirming that I have an account and showing the current balance (minimal)

I request 12 months of bank statements stamped and signed by the bank.

I highlight (in pink) each monthly transfer of 65,000 Baht.

Buriram Immigration are satisfied with this.

Yes but you missed the point. 3 monthly transfers were said to have come from Bangkok Bank not Transferwise or Wise, so they would not include them on the statement. My irritation require a signed statement as well, confirming international income.

[Pib]

OP,

   Where you say the transfers come directly, all of the Wise transfers come from one of their Thai banking "partner" banks which is Bangkok Bank, Kaiskorn Bank, and/or maybe still Thai Military Bank (TMB).

   On your Wise full PDF receipt at the very bottom it will show which banking partner Wise used for a transfer.   Like below from one of my transfers to my Krungsri Bank acct....while higher up in the PDF receipt it will show my  Krungsri acct info in the "Sent To" area of the receipt in the "Paid out from" area at the very bottom it will show which partner bank Wise used to send the money to whatever bank.   For this particular transfer it was Bangkok Bank who was the Wise partner bank used and who sent it over to my Krungsri acct..  If I wanted to get confirmation that is was an international transfer Krungsri would most likely tell me to go to Bangkok Bank.

 

   

Edited March 17, 2021 by Pib

[scubascuba3]

Op doesn't seem to understand how TransferWise works and the problems with getting transactions recorded as International. If 3 months are domestic I can see Immigration using that as an excuse to direct you to an agent, unless of course they are pragmatic and accept other proof

[DPKANKAN]

11 hours ago, Pib said:

OP,

   Where you say the transfers come directly, all of the Wise transfers come from one of their Thai banking "partner" banks which is Bangkok Bank, Kaiskorn Bank, and/or maybe still Thai Military Bank (TMB).

   On your Wise full PDF receipt at the very bottom it will show which banking partner Wise used for a transfer.   Like below from one of my transfers to my Krungsri Bank acct....while higher up in the PDF receipt it will show my  Krungsri acct info in the "Sent To" area of the receipt in the "Paid out from" area at the very bottom it will show which partner bank Wise used to send the money to whatever bank.   For this particular transfer it was Bangkok Bank who was the Wise partner bank used and who sent it over to my Krungsri acct..  If I wanted to get confirmation that is was an international transfer Krungsri would most likely tell me to go to Bangkok Bank.

 

   

Never seen/used those as I have the app and the Transaction details in there do not show that, but will look next time at the other paper trail that comes. I have never had an issue before as it always comes in and they know the code is Twise. Just these 3 for some reason which were over 100,000 baht!!

[Tracyb]

OP, when initiating the Wise transfer do you tick the box “Funds for retirement” before completing the transaction?  I discovered that this helps assure the proper bank coding when the transfer is done.

[Taccos]

1 hour ago, Tracyb said:

do you tick the box “Funds for retirement” before completing the transaction?  I discovered that this helps assure the proper bank coding when the transfer is done.

I have just made a transfer from Wise to Krungsri in excess of 100k Baht and used the „Funds for retirement“ reference. Regardless, the fund were still routed via Bangkok Bank. I am now considering opening an account with them just for this purpose to avoid the hassel with Krungsri and IO.

[joebrown]

22 hours ago, DPKANKAN said:

Yes but you missed the point. 3 monthly transfers were said to have come from Bangkok Bank not Transferwise or Wise, so they would not include them on the statement. My irritation require a signed statement as well, confirming international income.

I had this problem a couple years ago when Transferwise used Kasikorn as their agent bank to send funds internally to my a/c at Siam Commercial.

All you need to do is go to Bangkok Bank who dealt with the incoming funds and ask for the 3 Exchange Forms (FETs) for the relevant transfers. The FETs will show where the funds originated and the currency.  I showed these to my IO and they were accepted.

I resolved any future problem by opening an A/C with Bangkok Bank to have all transfers sent there. There is a 'dropdown' section on the Transferwise instruction on - line which asks for a reason for the transfer. Be sure to tick the box for 'Funds Required For Long Term Stay in Thailand'. I have since found Transferwise & Bangkok Bank 100% reliable in showing all transfers as FTTs (Foreign Telegraphic Transfers) on my statement.

[joebrown]

4 minutes ago, Taccos said:

I have just made a transfer from Wise to Krungsri in excess of 100k Baht and used the „Funds for retirement“ reference. Regardless, the fund were still routed via Bangkok Bank. I am now considering opening an account with them just for this purpose to avoid the hassel with Krungsri and IO.

Please read my post above!

[hargri]

I had the same problem until about 18 months ago. Transfers would show as overseas sometimes but not others. I don't recall if it was transfer value related. I contacted TransferWise, told them it was imperative that all showed as originating overseas and was advised to message them nominating an account for that purpose. I did so and since then every transfer has shown as foreign. I had believed that all funds sent to a Bangkok bank account would show as foreign but TransferWise told me it was the account in Thailand they sent the money from not where they sent it to.

[DPKANKAN]

2 hours ago, Taccos said:

I have just made a transfer from Wise to Krungsri in excess of 100k Baht and used the „Funds for retirement“ reference. Regardless, the fund were still routed via Bangkok Bank. I am now considering opening an account with them just for this purpose to avoid the hassel with Krungsri and IO.

Alledgedly, I have received an email from TWise confirming that all money will in future be sent direct to Kasikorn Bank.

I was knocked back by immigration today until I can get the confirmation and statement from Bangkok Bank.

As my renewal was due tomorrow thet have given me a 60 day extension, of course at a cost of the same annual fee!!

[hotandsticky]

4 hours ago, Tracyb said:

OP, when initiating the Wise transfer do you tick the box “Funds for retirement” before completing the transaction?  I discovered that this helps assure the proper bank coding when the transfer is done.

Not wishing to be pedantic but the drop down option is actually:-

"Funds for long-term stay in Thailand"

[DPKANKAN]

20 hours ago, scubascuba3 said:

Op doesn't seem to understand how TransferWise works and the problems with getting transactions recorded as International. If 3 months are domestic I can see Immigration using that as an excuse to direct you to an agent, unless of course they are pragmatic and accept other proof

As I stated there has been no previous issues using Transferwise on any previous Visas as every transaction came strait to my Kasikorn account. 

There was never any inference or reason to say it would be different than always.

Alledgedly they have confirmed now that all transfer in future will be direct to my Kasikorn account.

[DPKANKAN]

27 minutes ago, hotandsticky said:

Not wishing to be pedantic but the drop down option is actually:-

"Funds for long-term stay in Thailand"

Yes and that is what I use. The same every time. 

It only has happened when the value was over a certain amount, never any other time.

[hotandsticky]

28 minutes ago, DPKANKAN said:

As I stated there has been no previous issues using Transferwise on any previous Visas as every transaction came strait to my Kasikorn account. 

There was never any inference or reason to say it would be different than always.

Alledgedly they have confirmed now that all transfer in future will be direct to my Kasikorn account.

Just for clarification..... what does "allegedly" mean in the context of your post?  What have they confirmed and to whom?

[DPKANKAN]

25 minutes ago, hotandsticky said:

Just for clarification..... what does "allegedly" mean?  

I have only this morning received that email statement so I have to wait for my next transfer to find out!!

[hotandsticky]

24 minutes ago, DPKANKAN said:

I have only this morning received that email statement so I have to wait for my next transfer to find out!!

OK....so they HAVE confirmed, ...... but you are yet to see that happen with an actual transfer. Got it, thanks.

[chilly07]

On 3/17/2021 at 11:01 AM, Pib said:

OP,

   Where you say the transfers come directly, all of the Wise transfers come from one of their Thai banking "partner" banks which is Bangkok Bank, Kaiskorn Bank, and/or maybe still Thai Military Bank (TMB).

   On your Wise full PDF receipt at the very bottom it will show which banking partner Wise used for a transfer.   Like below from one of my transfers to my Krungsri Bank acct....while higher up in the PDF receipt it will show my  Krungsri acct info in the "Sent To" area of the receipt in the "Paid out from" area at the very bottom it will show which partner bank Wise used to send the money to whatever bank.   For this particular transfer it was Bangkok Bank who was the Wise partner bank used and who sent it over to my Krungsri acct..  If I wanted to get confirmation that is was an international transfer Krungsri would most likely tell me to go to Bangkok Bank.

 

   

If you use the' funds for long term stay ' drop down then the recipient bank will record it as FTT but to get round your specific problem just open and use a Bangkok Bank account exclusively with Transferwise (now Wise) Doing it this way for 2 yrs now and never a problem

[Pib]

53 minutes ago, chilly07 said:

If you use the' funds for long term stay ' drop down then the recipient bank will record it as FTT but to get round your specific problem just open and use a Bangkok Bank account exclusively with Transferwise (now Wise) Doing it this way for 2 yrs now and never a problem

Not necessarily...depends on the bank you are sending to.   

For example I did tests of sending money to my Krungsri Bank acct using the Funds for Long Stay Thailand reason for transfer.  Although Wise used Bangkok Bank as the partner bank for each transfer, Krungsri codes each transfer as a domestic transfer because that's how they saw the relay from Bangkok Bank to them.   

Now if sending to a Bangkok Bank acct and Bangkok Bank is used as the partner bank you will get international coding....I know that true from my personal testing and many posts.  And I've seen in several posts when sending to a K-bank acct and K-bank is used for the partner bank you get international coding. 

[Jeffrey346]

I don't understand why some of you make life so difficult. If the process that Wise uses to receive funds has the possibility that immigration may reject you Visa extension, why use them. 

Try Western Union.  Their rates are competitive, 2 days to receive your funds and they charge just $2.99.

[The Fat Controller]

If you go to this Facebook group

https://www.facebook.com/groups/TWSOL

You will find the only 100% certain way to get the FTT notification in your bank book is to have a Bangkok Bank account and use the "Funds for long term stay in Thailand" drop-down option when making the transfer.

[scubascuba3]

1 hour ago, Pib said:

Not necessarily...depends on the bank you are sending to.   

For example I did tests of sending money to my Krungsri Bank acct using the Funds for Long Stay Thailand reason for transfer.  Although Wise used Bangkok Bank as the partner bank for each transfer, Krungsri codes each transfer as a domestic transfer because that's how they saw the relay from Bangkok Bank to them.   

Now if sending to a Bangkok Bank acct and Bangkok Bank is used as the partner bank you will get international coding....I know that true from my personal testing and many posts.  And I've seen in several posts when sending to a K-bank acct and K-bank is used for the partner bank you get international coding. 

Doesn't selecting "for long term stay" tell Wise to route via Bangkok Bank? For FTT purposes

[Pib]

18 minutes ago, Jeffrey346 said:

I don't understand why some of you make life so difficult. If the process that Wise uses to receive funds has the possibility that immigration may reject you Visa extension, why use them. 

Try Western Union.  Their rates are competitive, 2 days to receive your funds and they charge just $2.99.

I signed up for a WU U.S. acct last year and did two test transfers of $50 to my Bangkok Bank acct.  Both showed up as Bahtnet transfers (i.e., domestic transfers).  Plus, after initiating each transfer online a few hour later I got an automated phone call from WU saying I need to call them within 12 hours to re-verification otherwise the transfer would be cancelled.  I called...had to wait about 10 minutes of listening to elevator music before getting a human....satisfied them it was really me initiating the transfer.  Then each transfer didn't show up for 3-4 days as WU waited approx 3 days for the funding to clear....I was funding by them pulling the money from my bank acct via ACH debit/pull (not debit card, ACH debit like how Wise will use a ACH Bank debit to fund a transfer.   Now if using a debit card the fee would have been $2.99 (I expect that's how you fund your transfers) and transfer time is suppose to be 1 to 2 business days.  But if I wanted to send a big chunk of money I'm not sure if I could fund more than $1,000 per transfer with my debit card since it has a daily cash withdrawal limit of $1,000....maybe if the transfer is treated as a "purchase" I could fund more...don't know as I only use my credit cards to buy/purchase stuff.

Although the WU exchange rates are indeed competitive when using your online WU acct (not like their crappy rates you get if going to a WU agent to initiate a transfer),  the slowness of the transfer for an ACH bank debit which was fee-free, having to call each time to reverify myself, and then getting the Bahtnet coding just turned me off.

Just as FYI for other listening below is a WU vs Wise comparison for sending $2,200 worth of baht to Thailand as of 18 Mar 2021 at 3:30pm Thailand time.  Wise wins by a little of 1000 baht.

 

WU Transfer via U.S. Online Acct

 

Transferwise transfer

[Pib]

11 minutes ago, scubascuba3 said:

Doesn't selecting "for long term stay" tell Wise to route via Bangkok Bank? For FTT purposes

My understanding is all that does is tell Wise to use Bangkok Bank as the partner bank to complete the transfer.....and then if the funds are going to a Bangkok Bank acct then you get FTT/International Transfer coding on your transfer.  It's an internal Bangkok Bank policy to provide that international coding.

However, if sending to another Thai bank such as SCB, Krungsri, etc., although Bangkok Bank would be used as the partner bank, since the funds are leaving Bankgok Bank for the final leg of the transfer that final leg is via domestic transfer and you end up with domestic transfer coding on your SCB, Krungsri, etc., bank acct.

Now I've heard if you are sending to a K-bank acct and select "for long term stay" that Wise will use K-bank as their partner bank and then the receiving K-bank acct gets international coding due to how K-bank handles their coding.  It's pretty much a ditto of the Bangkok Bnak partner bank example.

The safest thing is to have a Bangkok Bank acct, send to that Bangkok Bank acct, and select the "long stay Thailand" reason for transfer.  That way Wise is suppose to use Bangkok Bank as its partner bank for that transfer and it's Bangkok Bank internal policy to provide FTT/International Transfer coding when the receiving acct is a Bangkok Bank acct.   Every Wise transfer I have sent to my Bangkok Bank acct has received FTT coding.

However, but, Wise will tell you their priority is to complete the transfer quickly and if for some reason they can't use Bangkok Bank for their partner bank due to some short term issue/glitch that they will use their other partner bank of K-bank....or maybe TMB if TMB is still a Wise partner bank.   So, this means you could still end-up with domestic coding "if", repeat, "if" Bangkok Bank could not be used as the partner bank for a transfer to a Bangkok Bank acct.

[MMan]

Over the past year that I've been using Transferwise / Wise, they've used various routings to my account at Bangkok Bank.  The first several transfers they sent direct and those all showed up on my BBL statements as 'International' transfers.

Then they started using various other Thai banks including Kasikorn as intermediaries.  The last 2 or 3 transfers they sent through Deemoney as the intermediary.  All those are just listed as 'Bahtnet' or 'Other Bank' transfers on my BBL passbook.

I print out all the transfer receipts from Transferwise/ Wise just in case Immigration wants to see proof where the money came from.  You can easily do so on the Wise website where they show a history of all your transfers.  Just click on the transfer, then click on the link that says 'details' or something like that, then click on the details link that says 'transfer receipt', which will download a PDF file of that particular transfer.

The transfer receipt shows (1) the sender's name and address (in my case my name and mailing address in my home country);  (2) the amount sent in the foreign currency plus the exchange rate and Wise fee;  (3) the amount of Thai Baht sent;  (4) the Thai bank & account number the money was sent to (in my case my local Bangkok Bank account);  (5) how it was delivered (Local Bank Transfer);  (6) the name of the local banking partner intermediary (such as Kasikornbank or Deemoney);  and (7) the banking partner reference code.

Of course it may depend on the specific Immigration Office and Immigration Officer who reviews your application as to whether they accept the receipt or not as proof of an international transfer, but it seems logical they should unless they are trying to be a pain in the <deleted>... That said logic isn't something they are always necessarily known for...
 

[anchadian]

8 minutes ago, Pib said:

I signed up for a WU U.S. acct last year and did two test transfers of $50 to my Bangkok Bank acct.  Both showed up as Bahtnet transfers (i.e., domestic transfers).  Plus, after initiating each transfer online a few hour later I got an automated phone call from WU saying I need to call them within 12 hours to re-verification otherwise the transfer would be cancelled.  I called...had to wait about 10 minutes of listening to elevator music before getting a human....satisfied them it was really me initiating the transfer.  Then each transfer didn't show up for 3-4 days as WU waited approx 3 days for the funding to clear....I was funding by them pulling the money from my bank acct via ACH debit/pull (not debit card, ACH debit like how Wise will use a ACH Bank debit to fund a transfer.   Now if using a debit card the fee would have been $2.99 (I expect that's how you fund your transfers) and transfer time is suppose to be 1 to 2 business days.  But if I wanted to send a big chunk of money I'm not sure if I could fund more than $1,000 per transfer with my debit card since it has a daily cash withdrawal limit of $1,000....maybe if the transfer is treated as a "purchase" I could fund more...don't know as I only use my credit cards to buy/purchase stuff.

Although the WU exchange rates are indeed competitive when using your online WU acct (not like their crappy rates you get if going to a WU agent to initiate a transfer),  the slowness of the transfer for an ACH bank debit which was fee-free, having to call each time to reverify myself, and then getting the Bahtnet coding just turned me off.

Just as FYI for other listening below is a WU vs Wise comparison for sending $2,200 worth of baht to Thailand as of 18 Mar 2021 at 3:30pm Thailand time.  Wise wins by a little of 1000 baht.

 

WU Transfer via U.S. Online Acct

 

Transferwise transfer

I've just opened a Wise account purely for transferring monies as and when needed to my Krungsri account.

My other Thai bank account is solely for retirement purposes which has the required balance.

The stated amount by Wise, is that the amount you actually receive or does Bangkok bank or Krungsri bank deduct any bank charges?

 

[Pib]

2 minutes ago, anchadian said:

I've just opened a Wise account purely for transferring monies as and when needed to my Krungsri account.

My other Thai bank account is solely for retirement purposes which has the required balance.

The stated amount by Wise, is that the amount you actually receive or does Bangkok bank or Krungsri bank deduct any bank charges?

 

Yes...the amount that Wise quotes to hit your Thai bank acct is exactly the amount you will receive.  There are no fees on the Thai bank end like with SWIFT/ACH receiving fees.

The way Wise completes a transfer to Thailand is by instructing one of it's Thai partner banks to relay X-amount of baht from the partner bank (most likely Wise's acct with that partner bank which is full of baht to complete transfers) to the receiving bank.  That partner bank to the receiving bank is domestic transfer....no fees at all.    And if your receiving acct is with one of the partner bank's, same thing...no receiving fees.   

What Wise shows you on their transfer screen includes all fees and the exact amount your will receive.

[scubascuba3]

47 minutes ago, Pib said:

My understanding is all that does is tell Wise to use Bangkok Bank as the partner bank to complete the transfer.....and then if the funds are going to a Bangkok Bank acct then you get FTT/International Transfer coding on your transfer.  It's an internal Bangkok Bank policy to provide that international coding.

However, if sending to another Thai bank such as SCB, Krungsri, etc., although Bangkok Bank would be used as the partner bank, since the funds are leaving Bankgok Bank for the final leg of the transfer that final leg is via domestic transfer and you end up with domestic transfer coding on your SCB, Krungsri, etc., bank acct.

Now I've heard if you are sending to a K-bank acct and select "for long term stay" that Wise will use K-bank as their partner bank and then the receiving K-bank acct gets international coding due to how K-bank handles their coding.  It's pretty much a ditto of the Bangkok Bnak partner bank example.

The safest thing is to have a Bangkok Bank acct, send to that Bangkok Bank acct, and select the "long stay Thailand" reason for transfer.  That way Wise is suppose to use Bangkok Bank as its partner bank for that transfer and it's Bangkok Bank internal policy to provide FTT/International Transfer coding when the receiving acct is a Bangkok Bank acct.   Every Wise transfer I have sent to my Bangkok Bank acct has received FTT coding.

However, but, Wise will tell you their priority is to complete the transfer quickly and if for some reason they can't use Bangkok Bank for their partner bank due to some short term issue/glitch that they will use their other partner bank of K-bank....or maybe TMB if TMB is still a Wise partner bank.   So, this means you could still end-up with domestic coding "if", repeat, "if" Bangkok Bank could not be used as the partner bank for a transfer to a Bangkok Bank acct.

I'm not sure the transfer to Kasikorn consistently comes through as foreign. When I don't care about the foreign thing I send "long term stay" to Kasikorn and it comes domestic, so far anyway

[Taccos]

I have now opened an account at Bangkok bank which went very smoothly, only presenting passport and 1-year rental contract.
One more question though: when sending the funds to Bangkok Bank via Wise does the amount have to mirror my actual pension payment, or is any amount in excess of THB 65k acceptable for IO purposes?