Story Of My Thai Citizenship Application

[Neeranam]

On 6/6/2019 at 8:00 AM, Big Guns said:

The International school I worked for employed foreign staff on one year fixed term contracts. A few years ago they inserted a clause stating that staff had to inform them if they received Thai citizenship or residency. I'd kept them informed since I first applied. When I became Thai they couldn't employ me on fixed term contracts (private schol act forbids this for Thai citizens). They tried to give me another fixed term contract which I pointed out broke the law. They then gave me a non fixed term contract but removed my bonus and flights as they said Thai staff didn't receive them. I asked the ministry of education to investigate and informed the school they were breaking employment law as you can't reduce an employee's benefits without their consent. Their justification was flawed as they tried to argue that Thai and international staff had set benefits. I proved this was incorrect as staff had negotiated different benefits. In the end I took them to the labour court for breach of contract as they didn't pay my flight and breaking employment law as they didn't pay me severance for my 10 years of employment. In court the judge sided with me and they had to pay plus interest. We signed an agreement which stated they wouldn't prevent me from getting a new job. They then gave me a terrible reference which implied it might be unsafe to hire me. I took them to court again and the judge stated the headmaster was a slanderer and awarded damages. I don't regret becoming a Thai citizen one bit. I only regret giving 10 years of effort to an unethical organisation.

Were you on year by year contracts?

[Big Guns]

Yes I was on one year fixed term contracts which are allowed for foreign teachers. However, Thai nationals who are teachers can't be employed on fixed term contracts. I'm now such an expert in Thai labour law for the education sector I should create a new niche enterprise ????

[david143]

any member receive any call for Next meeting.
please share with us.

 

[Neeranam]

On 6/9/2019 at 7:45 AM, Big Guns said:

Yes I was on one year fixed term contracts which are allowed for foreign teachers. However, Thai nationals who are teachers can't be employed on fixed term contracts. I'm now such an expert in Thai labour law for the education sector I should create a new niche enterprise ????

Lol, I may need your services soon, as I've been on one year contacts for 10 years, but they tried to get out of paying severance by just giving me a 6 month contract this time, and also said they would reduce my salary when I became Thai. 

[Neeranam]

6 hours ago, david143 said:

any member receive any call for Next meeting.
please share with us.

 

I think it will be nearer the end of the month, fingers crossed, as usual.

[david143]

Exactly thanks for replying.

I think it will be nearer the end of the month, fingers crossed, as usual.

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[GarryP]

35 minutes ago, Neeranam said:

Lol, I may need your services soon, as I've been on one year contacts for 10 years, but they tried to get out of paying severance by just giving me a 6 month contract this time, and also said they would reduce my salary when I became Thai. 

That 6 month extension should not change the fact that if they do not retain your thereafter, they must pay severance for you 10 years and 6 months service. Also, I do not believe that the court would agree to the reduction of salary. You just need to hang in their and let them know you are not going anywhere. The only way for them to avoid the need to pay severance is if you resign or you do something which warrants your dismissal with cause.  

 

I would not make any threats just yet though, but once you get your citizenship I would be clear with them and let them know you will not back down. 

 

Best of luck both in your citizenship application and dealing with the school.  

[Big Guns]

Neeranam if you're worried I can give you what you need to win if you need it. Get your citizenship first. No fee to a Thai brother of course ????. If you're really concerned send me a pm & I should be able to help.

[Neeranam]

10 hours ago, Big Guns said:

Neeranam if you're worried I can give you what you need to win if you need it. Get your citizenship first. No fee to a Thai brother of course ????. If you're really concerned send me a pm & I should be able to help.

Thanks mate, much appreciated!

However after waiting only 1 year 6 months from my application, and 1 year 3 months since application sent to MOI, I won't be a Thai citizen by then.

I believe to claim severance, one need to claim within a month of being fired.

Incidentally, I read recently(doesn't apply to me) that a new law says that those over 60/65 can also claim severance when asked to leave.

[GarryP]

6 minutes ago, Neeranam said:

Thanks mate, much appreciated!

However after waiting only 1 year 6 months from my application, and 1 year 3 months since application sent to MOI, I won't be a Thai citizen by then.

I believe to claim severance, one need to claim within a month of being fired.

Incidentally, I read recently(doesn't apply to me) that a new law says that those over 60/65 can also claim severance when asked to leave.

You are paid severance upon retirement. The rates for those who have worked in the same place for more than 20 years were very recently increased from 300 to 400 days, which will be my case when I retire in 3.5 years.  If they wish to keep you on after the standard retirement age, quite a few companies pay the severance sum upon reaching 55 or 60, as the case may be, and then re-hire on a one year contract basis. 

 

I am not sure what happens in those companies that do not have a fixed retirement age. They could keep you on indefinitely hoping you will quit so they do not have to pay severance. I will try to find out more on this as I find it quite interesting.  

[david143]

44 minutes ago, Neeranam said:

Thanks mate, much appreciated!

However after waiting only 1 year 6 months from my application, and 1 year 3 months since application sent to MOI, I won't be a Thai citizen by then.

I believe to claim severance, one need to claim within a month of being fired.

Incidentally, I read recently(doesn't apply to me) that a new law says that those over 60/65 can also claim severance when asked to leave.

K.Neeranam
exactly how old are you , are you reaching over 60, because i heard 60 or over 60 they not consider for Thai citizenship, i may wrong but need to know too.
 

[david143]

55 minutes ago, Neeranam said:

Thanks mate, much appreciated!

However after waiting only 1 year 6 months from my application, and 1 year 3 months since application sent to MOI, I won't be a Thai citizen by then.

I believe to claim severance, one need to claim within a month of being fired.

Incidentally, I read recently(doesn't apply to me) that a new law says that those over 60/65 can also claim severance when asked to leave.

sorry i got the answere   Age Points 20 to 30 2 points 30 to 40 5 points 40 to 50 10 points 50 to 60 8 points Over 60 5 points

[skippybangkok]

Lol, I may need your services soon, as I've been on one year contacts for 10 years, but they tried to get out of paying severance by just giving me a 6 month contract this time, and also said they would reduce my salary when I became Thai. 

Under Thai law , even if you get 6 monthly contracts for 10 years , you severance will be the same as you worked 10 years.

Thai laws favour the worker ( I know - cause was an employer).

Contact your local labour office - they are helpful ( I know , cause we got called down to discuss / negotiate when ex staff felt jilted )


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[GabbaGabbaHey]

I know this is not the exact place for such question but since it's related to what's been said in previous posts and interests me -and may interest others-: does anyone know if according to the labor law an employee (Thai or farang) who'd wish to retire at 55 (still minimum legal age I assume) would be able to claim and get the severance pay automatically?
 

[skippybangkok]

I know this is not the exact place for such question but since it's related to what's been said in previous posts and interests me -and may interest others-: does anyone know if according to the labor law an employee (Thai or farang) who'd wish to retire at 55 (still minimum legal age I assume) would be able to claim and get the severance pay automatically?

 

 

Doubt it. If they want to let you go, ok

 

If resign - get nada

 

But I am a few years out of date already

 

 

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[Big Guns]

In most industries nationality has no impact on eligibility for severance. The only exception I know of is teaching as the private school act barred foreign teachers from severance. However, a Supreme court ruling in 2014 found in favour of the plaintiffs & ordered an International school in Pattaya to pay severance to the foreign teachers as their fixed term contracts weren't renewed

[Neeranam]

3 hours ago, david143 said:

K.Neeranam
exactly how old are you , are you reaching over 60, because i heard 60 or over 60 they not consider for Thai citizenship, i may wrong but need to know too.
 

I'm nearly 54.

[GarryP]

4 hours ago, GarryP said:

You are paid severance upon retirement. The rates for those who have worked in the same place for more than 20 years were very recently increased from 300 to 400 days, which will be my case when I retire in 3.5 years.  If they wish to keep you on after the standard retirement age, quite a few companies pay the severance sum upon reaching 55 or 60, as the case may be, and then re-hire on a one year contract basis. 

 

I am not sure what happens in those companies that do not have a fixed retirement age. They could keep you on indefinitely hoping you will quit so they do not have to pay severance. I will try to find out more on this as I find it quite interesting.  

Apparently all companies need to indicate such information in their regulations, i.e. the company's retirement age. As such, it would be a none issue.

[Big Guns]

I agree with Gaz the company will state its age of retirement in the employee handbook/work rules.

[Neeranam]

2 hours ago, Big Guns said:

I agree with Gaz the company will state its age of retirement in the employee handbook/work rules.

What about a government school?

I assume that is 60.

[Neeranam]

2 hours ago, Big Guns said:

I agree with Gaz the company will state its age of retirement in the employee handbook/work rules.

What about a government school?

I assume that is 60.

[GarryP]

20 minutes ago, Neeranam said:

What about a government school?

I assume that is 60.

Yes. The retirement age for civil servants is currently 60 and that includes school teachers. So it should be no different for non-civil servant teachers who work in government schools. 

[Neeranam]

14 hours ago, GarryP said:

Yes. The retirement age for civil servants is currently 60 and that includes school teachers. So it should be no different for non-civil servant teachers who work in government schools. 

I assume it includes foreign teachers too. One question, if a 65 year old Brit has been working at the same school for 15 years, and has been told he must leave in 2 years when his daughter finishes, is he entitled to severance?

 

If I get citizenship, I'd like to become a legal advisor for foreign teachers, so many never apply for severance.

[Big Guns]

Neeranam when the contract ends they owe you 10 months salary as severance. Unfortunately severance is capped at 10 months until you hit 20 years then its 20 months.

[GabbaGabbaHey]

8 hours ago, Big Guns said:

Neeranam when the contract ends they owe you 10 months salary as severance. Unfortunately severance is capped at 10 months until you hit 20 years then its 20 months.

It's rather 400 days (13.3 months) after 20 years.

[Big Guns]

Yes Gaba you're right its 400 days for 20 years service. My case was 300 days for 10 years. When you receive naturalisation its worth checking if the firm you're working for has different retirement ages for Thai & foreign staff & how they will apply it.

[david143]

1 minute ago, qualtrough said:

 

nothing to worry qualtrough

Age

Age	Points
20 to 30	2 points
30 to 40	5 points
40 to 50	10 points
50 to 60	8 points
Over 60	5 points

[Neeranam]

Good news that General Anupong Paojinda will remain as interior minister. Therefore, hopefully no setbacks in the citizenship process.

[GarryP]

3 minutes ago, Neeranam said:

Good news that General Anupong Paojinda will remain as interior minister. Therefore, hopefully no setbacks in the citizenship process.

As much as I now hate the junta/military establishment, I must acknowledge that they did a great job in cleaning up the process for citizenship. So, yes, it is a good thing that the General will remain in control of the Ministry of the Interior.  

[skippybangkok]

As much as I now hate the junta/military establishment, I must acknowledge that they did a great job in cleaning up the process for citizenship. So, yes, it is a good thing that the General will remain in control of the Ministry of the Interior.  

Being selfish here - pre junta was non stop chaos for years and it was not safe down town. Also Yingluk el-al Poo pooed the process for citizenship

After junta came in, Thailand is stable and I got my citz. So my selfish self says OK!


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