Phuket hotelier takes government and local administration to court demanding 242 million baht compensation

[BritManToo]

1 hour ago, khunPer said:

Some companies gain, and some companies lose, that's how free market works

If the government orders your business closed, you aren't in a free market!

[khunPer]

22 minutes ago, BritManToo said:

If the government orders your business closed, you aren't in a free market!

Yes you are, but your free market competitors are also ordered to temporary close. Free markets are still controlled by government and trade agreements, among others, but you have the freedom to compete within at any time present rules. Not so free markets are for example centralized systems, where everything is monopolized by governments.

[kimamey]

15 hours ago, khunPer said:

Taxes work different. If you have a loss then you can deduct the loss in future income, a government don't pay your loss, or part of it, in cash.

Yes they do work differently than that but you asked if they paid money to the government when they made a profit which they do in tax. That's a simple fact and as you point out they can make deductions on tax if they make a loss.

 

This is a slightly different in that it isn't a normal trading loss but directly attributable to government actions in closing the borders and closing businesses. As I said many other countries have helped out business sectors in various  ways during these times as they aren't something the business could necessarily do anything about themselves. I'm guessing the people at the top of the tourism ministry including the minister were still paid during the time there were no tourists as were those in immigration whilst there were few people entering the country. It's important to remember as well that it's not only the businesses themselves but the workers. Any calculation as to what financial help should be given needs to be weighed against any direct help to those workers. Is the government paying to keep the business afloat until times improve and also so they can pay their employees or are they provided for separately?

 

There's also the fact that if this account is correct then there are or were funds available to help but they couldn't be accessed. As I said I've no idea how accurate these statements are but a court should be able to sort this out. I would also assume that the amount claimed is a negotiating position rather than an anticipated amount.

Edited July 13, 2021 by kimamey

[khunPer]

2 hours ago, kimamey said:

Yes they do work differently than that but you asked if they paid money to the government when they made a profit which they do in tax. That's a simple fact and as you point out they can make deductions on tax if they make a loss.

 

This is a slightly different in that it isn't a normal trading loss but directly attributable to government actions in closing the borders and closing businesses. As I said many other countries have helped out business sectors in various  ways during these times as they aren't something the business could necessarily do anything about themselves. I'm guessing the people at the top of the tourism ministry including the minister were still paid during the time there were no tourists as were those in immigration whilst there were few people entering the country. It's important to remember as well that it's not only the businesses themselves but the workers. Any calculation as to what financial help should be given needs to be weighed against any direct help to those workers. Is the government paying to keep the business afloat until times improve and also so they can pay their employees or are they provided for separately?

 

There's also the fact that if this account is correct then there are or were funds available to help but they couldn't be accessed. As I said I've no idea how accurate these statements are but a court should be able to sort this out. I would also assume that the amount claimed is a negotiating position rather than an anticipated amount.

People are not equal, and there is a difference between being employed, and being a business owner; the latter is more like winning the lottery, but based on taking a risk, just like buying lottery tickets, i.e. sometimes you win and sometimes you lose.

 

Small and medium sized business in Thailand have been helped with for example lowered interest rates and "loan payment holiday". There might be more help provided, including that staff the business owner let off, received individual help. However, more might have been possible, or needed, which I cannot judge.

And there might be more to the story mentioned in the OP, as it's mainly those companies with some level of problems before the pandemic that have the more serious problems during the pandemic.

 

In general, business owners are in a game for winnings a fat jackpot, i.e. move up to be among the 10 percent that many envy, or even among the one top percent.

 

PS: I've been self-employed, i.e. small business owner with in periods up to around 10 employees, for 45 years, and had my ups and downs, so I know what it's like when something happens beyond control and planning, and I probably had more downs than ups, since I never hit the jackpot where one could reach up to mingle with the one percent...????(Slightly Smiling Face-emoji)

[impulse]

6 hours ago, khunPer said:

Some companies gain, and some companies lose, that's how free market works; i.e. for example transport sector, including food deliveries, and online sales have gained through the pandemic, whilst airlines and tourists sector are among those loosing turnover. The ones in major problems seems to be the ones that already had a tight economy, or negative bottom-line, before the pandemic; i.e. THAI to mention a local company.

What's free market about forcing hotels and gyms and massage parlors to close while allowing shopping malls to stay open?  Or forcing bars to close while allowing restaurants to stay open? 

 

The gub'ment has been picking the winners and the losers, not the free market.

[sammieuk1]

Unfortunately no Czar was named on the writ so doomed to fail immediately  

[khunPer]

16 hours ago, impulse said:

What's free market about forcing hotels and gyms and massage parlors to close while allowing shopping malls to stay open?  Or forcing bars to close while allowing restaurants to stay open? 

 

The gub'ment has been picking the winners and the losers, not the free market.

You are comparing apples with bananas!

 

Shopping malls and a massage parlors are not the same, nor are bars, or nightlife in general, vs. restaurants.

 

Free market is for example that all bars were asked to close in an area, not just some selected ones.

 

A total other thing is if it makes sense to close some kind of business, and leave other kinds open, but that has nothing to do with "free market".

[impulse]

7 hours ago, khunPer said:

You are comparing apples with bananas!

 

Shopping malls and a massage parlors are not the same, nor are bars, or nightlife in general, vs. restaurants.

 

Free market is for example that all bars were asked to close in an area, not just some selected ones.

 

A total other thing is if it makes sense to close some kind of business, and leave other kinds open, but that has nothing to do with "free market".

There is virtually nothing "free market" about Covid restrictions.  It's government interference in free markets.

 

You can argue all you want about whether it's justified, or a good idea.  But you can't argue that the gub'ment ordering some businesses to close while allowing others to stay open is the free market at work.

 

[khunPer]

2 hours ago, impulse said:

There is virtually nothing "free market" about Covid restrictions.  It's government interference in free markets.

 

You can argue all you want about whether it's justified, or a good idea.  But you can't argue that the gub'ment ordering some businesses to close while allowing others to stay open is the free market at work.

Me might not agree, and that's the great thing with discussions and forums, that we, and others, can exchange opinions.

 

However, definition of free market is...

Free market

Political ideology

 

Description

In economics, a free market is a system in which the prices for goods and services are self-regulated by buyers and sellers negotiating in an open market.