Expired Thai passport, entering Thailand

[ryan15987532]

Hello,

 

 We are heading to Thailand for 1 year in November.

 My partner has a UK passport but her Thai passport expired around 15 years ago. We have only just realised that the waiting list for appointments at the embassy in London is very long, no appointments until 2nd of December.

 Is there any way she could enter on her Uk passport and get a Thai passport in Thailand and proceed to stay in country for the year? I’m sure this will

probably cause issues so hopefully someone is clued up on this and can help. 
 

Worst case scenario we will have to delay our trip until end of December which isn’t ideal.

 

Thanks in advance. 

 

[BritTim]

Entering on a UK passport is no issue. Once here on, say, a visa exempt entry, it is possible to apply for a one-year extension as a "returning Thai citizen". Be aware that some Thai officials take a dim view of dual citizenship (and may even claim, erroneously, that she is no longer Thai). Thus, do not volunteer this information except when necessary.

[chalawaan]

35 minutes ago, BritTim said:

Entering on a UK passport is no issue. Once here on, say, a visa exempt entry, it is possible to apply for a one-year extension as a "returning Thai citizen". Be aware that some Thai officials take a dim view of dual citizenship (and may even claim, erroneously, that she is no longer Thai). Thus, do not volunteer this information except when necessary.

Hmm. That didn't work for a Thai acquaintance who nipped down to Singapore and back on a US Passport for a day. It's protocol globally to enter your birthright nation using your birthright issued passport. Also, 'don't volunteer she's Thai?' 555 acting stoned is my schtick, she's standing in front of an IO and her Brit passport says birthplace : Thailand 5555 just goes show how convincing BS is at first glance. You're too much!

She can and should depart UK as a Brit. She can and could enter Thailand on her ancient document. 

They'll make a pointless jobsworth fuss at the immigration desk, taken aside and treated like an errant child for a few hours, perhaps, but she can't be denied entry to her homeland with any legit passport in her name.

The good news is new Thai passports are now valid ten years, not just five.

Edited September 19, 2021 by chalawaan

[ryan15987532]

33 minutes ago, BritTim said:

Entering on a UK passport is no issue. Once here on, say, a visa exempt entry, it is possible to apply for a one-year extension as a "returning Thai citizen". Be aware that some Thai officials take a dim view of dual citizenship (and may even claim, erroneously, that she is no longer Thai). Thus, do not volunteer this information except when necessary.

Do you know if applying for “returning Thai citizen” requires a Thai passport? 

 

This is sounding promising as we were getting a bit worried, thank you.

 

 

[BritTim]

11 minutes ago, chalawaan said:

Hmm. That didn't work for a Thai acquaintance who nipped down to Singapore and back on a US Passport for a day. It's protocol globally to enter your birthright nation using your birthright issued passport. 

She can and should depart UK as a Brit. She can and could enter Thailand on her ancient document. 

They'll make a pointless jobsworth fuss at the immigration desk, taken aside and treated like an errant child for a few hours, perhaps, but she can't be denied entry to her homeland with any legit passport in her name.

The good news is new Thai passports are now valid ten years, not just five.

In the past, that was the right option. Right now, it does not work. You cannot apply for a COE using a UK passport and fail to use that passport to enter Thailand. You cannot apply for a COE using an expired passport.

 

Of course, it is true that a Thai should enter Thailand as a Thai in normal times. That said, I would be interested in more details of your Thai acquaintance (assuming the incident occurred after 2008 when the latest nationality act took effect). Any attempt to prevent entering on the US passport, or refusal of an extension of stay, would have been improper. 

[BritTim]

Just now, ryan15987532 said:

Do you know if applying for “returning Thai citizen” requires a Thai passport? 

 

This is sounding promising as we were getting a bit worried, thank you.

A Thai passport (expired or otherwise) or a Thai ID card (expired or otherwise) is sufficient.

[chalawaan]

22 minutes ago, BritTim said:

In the past, that was the right option. Right now, it does not work. You cannot apply for a COE using a UK passport and fail to use that passport to enter Thailand. You cannot apply for a COE using an expired passport.

 

Of course, it is true that a Thai should enter Thailand as a Thai in normal times. That said, I would be interested in more details of your Thai acquaintance (assuming the incident occurred after 2008 when the latest nationality act took effect). Any attempt to prevent entering on the US passport, or refusal of an extension of stay, would have been improper. 

It was after 2008 he got sin-binned, tho he first retired back here before that, on the SIN trip, he wasn't prevented from reentering Thailand, but he was hassled for hours, and I think fined. He's elderly, and like that fossil generation that are destroying life here, entered and lived  as a US citizen even doing 90 day reports as a Thai because he's a face lovin idiot. US PASSPORT HERE EVERYONE! 

Only that time the IO was having none of it. Good points about the Covid hassles. But your suggestion she might Avoid detection as Thai by not volunteering that info is ludicrous. Apart from her physical appearance. Any passport she presented will show her birthplace. No Thai IO lets that slide.

Edited September 19, 2021 by chalawaan

[ryan15987532]

29 minutes ago, BritTim said:

In the past, that was the right option. Right now, it does not work. You cannot apply for a COE using a UK passport and fail to use that passport to enter Thailand. You cannot apply for a COE using an expired passport.

 

Of course, it is true that a Thai should enter Thailand as a Thai in normal times. That said, I would be interested in more details of your Thai acquaintance (assuming the incident occurred after 2008 when the latest nationality act took effect). Any attempt to prevent entering on the US passport, or refusal of an extension of stay, would have been improper. 

Born in ‘93, moved to UK in ‘99, passport expired in early 2000’s - she still has it but will need to dig it out to see exact dates. She can talk thai fluently but reading/writing is sort of primary school level she tells me so gaining passports out there will be fun, her mum will join us and help with that hopefully. 
 

She is ringing the embassy tomorrow to see if they can offer any advice, if there’s anything useful I will share it here.

 

cheers 

 

edit, UK passport does state Bangkok as place of birth and she’s 1/2 Thai so looks pretty Thai 

Edited September 19, 2021 by ryan15987532

[BritTim]

3 hours ago, chalawaan said:

It was after 2008 he got sin-binned, tho he first retired back here before that, on the SIN trip, he wasn't prevented from reentering Thailand, but he was hassled for hours, and I think fined. He's elderly, and like that fossil generation that are destroying life here, entered and lived  as a US citizen even doing 90 day reports as a Thai because he's a face lovin idiot. US PASSPORT HERE EVERYONE! 

Only that time the IO was having none of it. Good points about the Covid hassles. But your suggestion she might Avoid detection as Thai by not volunteering that info is ludicrous. Apart from her physical appearance. Any passport she presented will show her birthplace. No Thai IO lets that slide.

Based on your description, I do not think the issue was just that he was entering at a US citizen even though a dual national. It appears he was doing an in/out border run using his US passport, and doing so through one of the Bangkok airports. In recent years, immigration officials at the Bangkok airports have taken a dim view of those using border runs as a way of staying in Thailand "without the right visa". Entering using the US passport initially was not ideal, but should have been allowed. Once staying for long periods in Thailand, he should have used the one-year extension "as a returning Thai citizen" as I suggested earlier.

[ubonjoe]

She should apply for a emergency passport (ETD) so she can enter as a Thai. It can be done by mail.

Info is here in Tha: https://london.thaiembassy.org/th/publicservice/การขอเอกสารการเดินทางฉุกเฉิน-emergency-travel-document-etd-กรณีหนังสือ?page=5d6636cd15e39c3bd00072c8&menu=5d6636cd15e39c3bd00072c9

If she enters on a UK passport she would have to meet all the requirements needed by a UK citizen.

 

[spoon1967]

I believe, she can renew her Thai passport at the Thai Embassy you still have time, although I agree with a few others, Thailand will not refuse entry on her expired one - I think that maybe international law, a country can not refuse entry to one of their own citizens, or she can apply for an emergency travel document at the Thai Embassy.Consulate

Emergency travel document is valid for 30 days from date of issue and for single journey to Thailand only. After returning to Thailand, emergency travel document is expired and cannot be renewed.

[natway09]

No Thai will ever get refused entry into Thailand on an expired passport.

Make sure she gets a new one when here & departs on it

[ryan15987532]

Thanks all, we will go with expired Thai and current UK passport. We’ll explain that we are going to renew her passport in country.

 

 

[BritTim]

9 hours ago, ryan15987532 said:

Thanks all, we will go with expired Thai and current UK passport. We’ll explain that we are going to renew her passport in country.

I will be very surprised if immigration will stamp her in on any passport other that that on her COE. Anyway, let us know how it goes.

[ubonjoe]

10 hours ago, natway09 said:

No Thai will ever get refused entry into Thailand on an expired passport.

Make sure she gets a new one when here & departs on it

In normal times that is correct. But at this time a certificate of entry (COE) is required and that cannot be issued with a expired Thai passport.

That is why embassies and official Thai consulate are issuing a emergency travel document (aka emergency passport).

 

9 hours ago, ryan15987532 said:

Thanks all, we will go with expired Thai and current UK passport. We’ll explain that we are going to renew her passport in country.

If she gets a COE with her UK passport she will have to use it to enter the country.

Did you read my earlier post where I posted a link with instructions for applying for a emergency passport by mail.

[Eff1n2ret]

11 hours ago, ryan15987532 said:

Thanks all, we will go with expired Thai and current UK passport. We’ll explain that we are going to renew her passport in country.

 

 

If you can avoid it, don't show them the UK passport, otherwise they are likely to stamp her in on that  as a visitor. If, as Ubonjoe says, it is quick and easy to get an Emergency Travel Document, that's probably the best solution.

During my time in UK Immigration Enforcement I dealt with a number of Thai illegals/overstayers, most of them without any means of identification, and their identities did not show up in our system. They were therefore removed on a simple A4 proforma with whatever name and address in Thailand they chose to give me. None of them were ever sent back. Many countries, the chief offenders being China and India, refuse to take back their nationals without a travel document, and then refuse to issue one because they claim the applicant's identity and nationality can not be verified. Thailand does not follow this scam, it takes responsibility for its own citizens, and for that reason I have long since thought that it should be easier for Thais to get a UK visa.

[Neeranam]

21 minutes ago, Eff1n2ret said:

If you can avoid it, don't show them the UK passport, otherwise they are likely to stamp her in on that  as a visitor. If, as Ubonjoe says, it is quick and easy to get an Emergency Travel Document, that's probably the best solution.

During my time in UK Immigration Enforcement I dealt with a number of Thai illegals/overstayers, most of them without any means of identification, and their identities did not show up in our system. They were therefore removed on a simple A4 proforma with whatever name and address in Thailand they chose to give me. None of them were ever sent back. Many countries, the chief offenders being China and India, refuse to take back their nationals without a travel document, and then refuse to issue one because they claim the applicant's identity and nationality can not be verified. Thailand does not follow this scam, it takes responsibility for its own citizens, and for that reason I have long since thought that it should be easier for Thais to get a UK visa.

Sorry for being off topic but could I, a UK/Thai citizen get into the UK with an expired UK passport?

[ryan15987532]

5 hours ago, ubonjoe said:

In normal times that is correct. But at this time a certificate of entry (COE) is required and that cannot be issued with a expired Thai passport.

That is why embassies and official Thai consulate are issuing a emergency travel document (aka emergency passport).

 

If she gets a COE with her UK passport she will have to use it to enter the country.

Did you read my earlier post where I posted a link with instructions for applying for a emergency passport by mail.

I did & I sent it to my Thai mother in law to read as I can’t read it. After reading it she was under the impression this was an outdated forum. I’ll have to ask her to double check or read it to me today. 

edit, I don’t think she realises a COE is still required, I’ll ask her to read it again with this in mind. 
thanks for the link 

Edited September 21, 2021 by ryan15987532

[ubonjoe]

3 minutes ago, ryan15987532 said:

I did & I sent it to my Thai mother in law to read as I can’t read it. After reading it she was under the impression this was an outdated forum. I’ll have to ask her to double check or read it to me today. 
 

Google translate works on the site.

It is certainly not out of date. The first paragraph in red has a date of January this year.

Number 2 is for a expired passport.

[ryan15987532]

1 hour ago, ubonjoe said:

Google translate works on the site.

It is certainly not out of date. The first paragraph in red has a date of January this year.

Number 2 is for a expired passport.

 I was a bit suspicious when she said that but wasn’t in a position to say anything as I couldn’t read it! Can’t translate on my phone for some reason so will get the laptop out. Cheers 

 

Edit, translate worked perfectly and this link looks to be exactly what we need. Thanks a lot.

Edited September 21, 2021 by ryan15987532