Brazil's tragic ivermectin frenzy is a warning to the US, experts say

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1 hour ago, impulse said:

I don't put anyone on "ignore", because I enjoy the entertainment value.

 

But if I did, the complete TVF narrative on Covid, vaccines, ivermectin, lockdowns, etc would change 100% if I put just 4 of them on "ignore".

 

Tens of thousands of members, with hundreds chiming in every day.  And 4 of them drive the narrative...  Absolutely convinced that they're right and that their sources are definitive, to the exclusion of everything else out there.  Like the tremendous Ivermectin success story being seen in India.

 

About that  "Ivermectin success story"

UP: 24 districts reported 110% more deaths between July and March than same period the previous year

https://scroll.in/latest/998069/up-24-districts-reported-110-more-deaths-between-july-and-march-than-same-period-the-previous-year

 

 

Edited October 7, 2021 by placeholder

[Scott]

A post has been removed for violating Fair Use Policy.  

[WhiteBuffaloATM]

“Like the tremendous Ivermectin success story being seen in India.”

 

“story” as in fantasy fiction……

[placeholder]

6 hours ago, LetsGoBrandon said:

Social media is full of misinformation....that cuts both ways BTW. It's largely anonymous trolls and even the verified ones have connections/vested interests they do not reveal. It is up to the consumer to sift the grain from the chaff.

 

Ive always been wary of doctors but these days I am on Defcon 1 with them.

Let me explain.

Recently, I accompanied a friend experiencing acute stomach pains to a specialist who poked his tummy a bit and said gall stones....then he immediately followed up by saying it would be better to remove his gall bladder. My friend said Im not too keen on getting my organs removed so can we 100% establish the cause first.

When the ultrasound came back, the doc scratched his head and said, I cant see any stones here, just some biliary sludge which is normal, so we can't really operate as there's nothing to remove. Of course....because his off the cuff diagnosis and recommendation was flawed.

 

I remember joking with my buddy later...I said did you notice how sad the docs face was when he realised he wouldn't be able to operate? Even his voice was full of regret....friend concurred and we had a laugh at the joker. Mind you, a lot of low info people who are trained to accept whatever someone in uniform says would have gladly had the operation without question.

 

So...just be careful out there folks.

Wow! Realy bad example. Doctor made a preliminary diagnosis, then double checked it with tests and found out he was wrong. But thanks for your nonsensical comment about how he looked disappointed.

Maybe you should offer your learned comments to that eminent scientific publication called The Journal of I Have A Friend Who...

[Scott]

Troll post removed.

 

[LetsGoBrandon]

33 minutes ago, placeholder said:

Wow! Realy bad example. Doctor made a preliminary diagnosis, then double checked it with tests and found out he was wrong. But thanks for your nonsensical comment about how he looked disappointed.

Maybe you should offer your learned comments to that eminent scientific publication called The Journal of I Have A Friend Who...

The guy wanted to admit and was talking about surgical removal of GB even before ordering the tests. Kept saying its better if you remove it before it really starts to act up. Terrible.

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Just now, LetsGoBrandon said:

The guy wanted to admit and was talking about surgical removal of GB even before ordering the tests. Kept saying its better if you remove it before it really starts to act up. Terrible.

And when the facts contradicted him, he changed course. Whereas in this forum no matter how many times it's pointed out that the vast majority of deaths from covid are among the unvaccinated, there's a big contingent of posters who ignore the fact and continue spouting  falsehoods. And that just one falsehood repeatedly debunked that they continue to believe in.

[cdemundo]

10 hours ago, Saanim said:

"Significant protection"? So, how to understand that in USA with their high vaxx percentage is the death almost 10 times higher (per 1M population) than in Thailand? (as shown on https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/#countries)

Since I was looking at the Sinovac vaccine that is not used in the US I have no idea what the heck your point is.

 

 

[LetsGoBrandon]

51 minutes ago, placeholder said:

And when the facts contradicted him, he changed course. Whereas in this forum no matter how many times it's pointed out that the vast majority of deaths from covid are among the unvaccinated, there's a big contingent of posters who ignore the fact and continue spouting  falsehoods. And that just one falsehood repeatedly debunked that they continue to believe in.

We are seeing data that is beginning to make it sound not as clear cut as you put it.

Esp from Israel and now Singapore

 

ie. it is not only the unvaxxed who are dominating the death charts....most deaths of unvaxxed people are in 70-90 yrs and they have underlying conditions (that may have dissuaded them from getting vaxxed to begin with)...everyones risk-benefit analysis and situation is unique

Edited October 7, 2021 by LetsGoBrandon

[Jeffr2]

2 minutes ago, LetsGoBrandon said:

We are seeing data that is beginning to make it sound not as clear cut as you put it.

Esp from Israel and now Singapore

Israel and Singapore are clear cut if you get your information from credible sources. Sadly, they are fodder for conspiracy theorists.

[LetsGoBrandon]

1 minute ago, Jeffr2 said:

Israel and Singapore are clear cut if you get your information from credible sources. Sadly, they are fodder for conspiracy theorists.

of course...how convenient...when the data disagrees with the narrative it's all a big conspiracy.

yes yes yes indeed. ????

 

 

 

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36 minutes ago, LetsGoBrandon said:

We are seeing data that is beginning to make it sound not as clear cut as you put it.

Esp from Israel and now Singapore

 

ie. it is not only the unvaxxed who are dominating the death charts....most deaths of unvaxxed people are in 70-90 yrs and they have underlying conditions (that may have dissuaded them from getting vaxxed to begin with)...everyones risk-benefit analysis and situation is unique

'And how are those 7O to 9O year olds faring compared to those who aren't vaccinated? .And no, everyone's risk benefit ratio isn't significantly unique. If that there the case, there would be no use for statistics. Sto trying to obfuscate. Both Singaporean and Israeli statistics show that you are much more likely to die if you are not vaccinated.

Edited October 7, 2021 by placeholder

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27 minutes ago, LetsGoBrandon said:

of course...how convenient...when the data disagrees with the narrative it's all a big conspiracy.

yes yes yes indeed. ????

 

 

 

But the data doesn't disagree with the narrative. Both Israeli data and Singaorean data show you are at much much greater risk of dying if you are unvaccinated, Why is that so difficult for you to understand?

[Jeffr2]

33 minutes ago, LetsGoBrandon said:

of course...how convenient...when the data disagrees with the narrative it's all a big conspiracy.

yes yes yes indeed. ????

 

 

 

Again. Get your information from reliable sources. But yes, the data disagrees with the narrative from the conspiracy theory websites.

[LetsGoBrandon]

57 minutes ago, placeholder said:

'And how are those 7O to 9O year olds faring compared to those who aren't vaccinated? .And no, everyone's risk benefit ratio isn't significantly unique. If that there the case, there would be no use for statistics. Sto trying to obfuscate. Both Singaporean and Israeli statistics show that you are much more likely to die if you are not vaccinated.

 

Not hugely different from the unvaxxed ones.

Today 3 people died in SG...1 was unvaxxed and 2 were fully vaxxed.

So your words are of no comfort to them.

Thankfully people are noticing these numbers and starting to speak up. Many fully vaxxed are worried because things aren't panning out exactly as they were told. 

 

It all seems to be a crapshoot at the moment....one's chances of survival depend 

on a complex relationship between their age, immune system, symptoms, treatment protocols and general health.

 

I have to laugh when people say I am fully vaxxed and still copped Covid. I feel like

c r a p but it would have been far far worse if I hadst been vaccinated....are they psychics?

Edited October 7, 2021 by LetsGoBrandon

[placeholder]

1 minute ago, LetsGoBrandon said:

 

About as badly as the unvaxxed ones.

Today 3 people died in SG...1 was unvaxxed and 2 were fully vaxxed.

So your words are of no comfort to them.

Thankfully people are noticing these numbers and starting to speak up.

 

It all seems to be a crapshoot at the moment....one's chances of survival depend 

on a complex relationship between their age, immune system, symptoms, treatment protocols and general health.

 

I have to laugh when people say I am fully vaxxed and still copped Covid. I feel like <deleted>

but it would have been far far worse if I hadst been vaccinated....are they psychics?

Do you have any understanding of statistics at all?

Do you think one day of data constitutes an adequate  sample?

"Authorities said on Sunday that 98% of people infected in the last 28 days have recorded mild or no symptoms of COVID-19. Singapore is discovering asymptomatic cases by testing close contacts of infected individuals. Kenneth Mak, Singapore’s director of medical services, told Singapore’s Straits Times last week that the vaccinated in Singapore have been 12 times less likely to die or require hospitalization than the unvaccinated."

https://fortune.com/2021/09/28/singapore-covid-reopening-record-cases-vaccines/

 

"I have to laugh when people say I am fully vaxxed and still copped Covid. I feel like <deleted>

but it would have been far far worse if I hadst been vaccinated....are they psychics?"

No, but unlike you they do understand probability. And they do understand that the risk of hospitalization and death is greatly reduced for the unvaccinated.

Maybe you should invest all your saving in lottery tickets. After all, unless you're a psychic, you don't know that you won't win.

 

[Jeffr2]

36 minutes ago, placeholder said:

Do you have any understanding of statistics at all?

Do you think one day of data constitutes an adequate  sample?

"Authorities said on Sunday that 98% of people infected in the last 28 days have recorded mild or no symptoms of COVID-19. Singapore is discovering asymptomatic cases by testing close contacts of infected individuals. Kenneth Mak, Singapore’s director of medical services, told Singapore’s Straits Times last week that the vaccinated in Singapore have been 12 times less likely to die or require hospitalization than the unvaccinated."

https://fortune.com/2021/09/28/singapore-covid-reopening-record-cases-vaccines/

 

"I have to laugh when people say I am fully vaxxed and still copped Covid. I feel like <deleted>

but it would have been far far worse if I hadst been vaccinated....are they psychics?"

No, but unlike you they do understand probability. And they do understand that the risk of hospitalization and death is greatly reduced for the unvaccinated.

Maybe you should invest all your saving in lottery tickets. After all, unless you're a psychic, you don't know that you won't win.

 

Stunning some just don't get it.

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On 10/7/2021 at 9:56 PM, impulse said:

Trouble is, most of the conspiracy theories are now looking true...  And the "science and facts" are looking more like sponsored content.

 

Which is neither here, nor there.  61 total replies here, with hundreds of posters looking in, and over 40% of those replies are from 2 of you...  

 

 

Actually, the problem is that some actually believe that there is some sort of massive conspiracy going on in the scientific community thanks to their. political predilections. As usual, such comments are accompanied by an impressive and overwhelming lack of substance. One hardly knows how to meaningfully respond to so much emptiness.

 

I know you're reluctant to provide information, but can you at least share with us why the level of someone's articiation is significant? And it isn't strange in the least bit that you would compile a statistic about that. Not in the least. Not at all. In now way. perfectly rational.

Edited October 8, 2021 by placeholder

[Jeffr2]

22 minutes ago, placeholder said:

Actually, the problem is that some actually believe that there is some sort of massive conspiracy going on in the scientific community thanks to their. political predilections. As usual, such comments are accompanied by an impressive and overwhelming lack of substance. One hardly knows how to meaningfully respond to so much emptiness.

 

I know you're reluctant to provide information, but can you at least share with us why the level of someone's articiation is significant? And it isn't strange in the least bit that you would compile a statistic about that. Not in the least. Not at all. In now way. perfectly rational.

He's an admitted conspiracy theorist. Falls for all the lies brought up by the fake news right wing media outlets. Seriously.

[Saanim]

7 hours ago, Jeffr2 said:

conspiracy

Sometimes the "conspiracy" becomes a true reality. It needs just to wait some time.

 

For instance, anthrax affair some 20 years ago, when the population had been prepared for Iraq war. Who did not believe the official story shown daily on MSM was a conspiracy theorist.  How long had it taken to know the truth where the anthrax originated? 

 

And that was not the only one "conspiracy theory" that was prior to Iraq war presented.    

 

[placeholder]

4 minutes ago, Saanim said:

Sometimes the "conspiracy" becomes a true reality. It needs just to wait some time.

 

For instance, anthrax affair some 20 years ago, when the population had been prepared for Iraq war. Who did not believe the official story shown daily on MSM was a conspiracy theorist.  How long had it taken to know the truth where the anthrax originated? 

 

And that was not the only one "conspiracy theory" that was prior to Iraq war presented.    

 

That conspiracy was cooked up by political operatives, What similarity does that have to the work of thousands of scientists openly published in various journals and the actions of public health officials worldwide?

[JackGats]

On 10/7/2021 at 7:10 PM, LetsGoBrandon said:

....most deaths of unvaxxed people are in 70-90 yrs and they have underlying conditions (that may have dissuaded them from getting vaxxed to begin with)...

Interesting for I had been reading the opposite as well. Namely in heavily vaxxed countries most deaths are now vaxxed people because they're very old and very old people are nearly all vaxxed.

 

Note that in some countries the unvaxxed are becoming thin on the ground so it is not surprising that whatever patients still die of covid should be vaxxed. This, of course, is exploited for desinformation to the tune of "mostly vaxxed people are dying of covid".

[Jeffr2]

27 minutes ago, JackGats said:

Interesting for I had been reading the opposite as well. Namely in heavily vaxxed countries most deaths are now vaxxed people because they're very old and very old people are nearly all vaxxed.

 

Note that in some countries the unvaxxed are becoming thin on the ground so it is not surprising that whatever patients still die of covid should be vaxxed. This, of course, is exploited for desinformation to the tune of "mostly vaxxed people are dying of covid".

That's what happened in Israel. Many older and at risk adults were jabbed early. The vaccine is wearing off. New variants are here. And unvaccinated kids are becoming super spreaders.

 

Sadly, this is fodder for the anti vaxxer nuts.

[Jeffr2]

Please. Please. Read this and stop referencing a super dodgy website. Please.

 

https://www.vox.com/future-perfect/22663127/ivermectin-covid-treatments-vaccines-evidence

 

The website c19ivermectin.com, for example, has an attractive user interface and is incredibly detailed, chronicling hundreds of studies of the drug. But it presents the estimated effect size based on all the studies out there, never mind that many of them appear fraudulent, and its visualizations effectively weigh every study equally — so a 100-person study that looked at a combination of many therapies including ivermectin will get a data point just like a many-thousand-patient RCT studying just ivermectin against a control group.

 

 

The end result is something that looks very scientific. But it’s all built on a backbone of studies that won’t report their data, that in at least some cases may have made that data up, that study ivermectin in combination with many other drugs, and that therefore aren’t any more enlightening when all meta-analyzed together.

Edited October 9, 2021 by Jeffr2

[Rimmer]

A post leading to misleading information has been removed also replies

[WhiteBuffaloATM]

Rimmer: never familiar with Red Dwarf although big on SciFi. Your handle/ picture / motto prompted me to Wiki the series as I vaguely recognized Barrie…..interesting stuff ; Barrie was Brittas & A. Jolie’s Butler in Tomb Raider ….. ! Barrie is a fascinating character with unique career……never appreciated that before… thanks !

[WhiteBuffaloATM]

“Sometimes the "conspiracy" becomes a true reality. It needs just to wait sometime.”

No, it never does so no, we dont”.

 

Ivermectin & Anti - Vaxx fans are oblivious to facts & reason or deliberately advocating false data.
Ignore them as you would Flat Earthers. Its pointless engaging.

They need to visit ICUs; to Witness their Stupidity ….or Engage with It as a Victim….. 

[Jeffr2]

1 hour ago, WhiteBuffaloATM said:

“Sometimes the "conspiracy" becomes a true reality. It needs just to wait sometime.”

No, it never does so no, we dont”.

 

Ivermectin & Anti - Vaxx fans are oblivious to facts & reason or deliberately advocating false data.
Ignore them as you would Flat Earthers. Its pointless engaging.

They need to visit ICUs; to Witness their Stupidity ….or Engage with It as a Victim….. 

Some simple fact checking would work wonders. Sadly, many of these people read what they want to hear. True or not.

[Saanim]

3 hours ago, WhiteBuffaloATM said:

“Sometimes the "conspiracy" becomes a true reality. It needs just to wait sometime.”

No, it never does so no, we dont”.

 

Ivermectin & Anti - Vaxx fans are oblivious to facts & reason or deliberately advocating false data.
Ignore them as you would Flat Earthers. Its pointless engaging.

They need to visit ICUs; to Witness their Stupidity ….or Engage with It as a Victim….. 

^Will you tell to Oxford University?

 

Leaving aside the discussion about credibility of the 121 studies and their 77 piers, some unbiased thinkers may get a second thought: 

Why a medicine - honoured by Nobel prize, produced by a renowned pharma company over 30 years, approved by FDA for other diseases - should be so harmful for Covid-19 treatment when no adverse effects and deaths are known at the millions using it mainly in India and Bangladesh (and other countries too) for other diseases?  

 

So, the unbiased thinker may ask: if it does not help, it does not kill either, does it? So why such a strong opposition?   

[placeholder]

21 minutes ago, Saanim said:

^Will you tell to Oxford University?

 

Leaving aside the discussion about credibility of the 121 studies and their 77 piers, some unbiased thinkers may get a second thought: 

Why a medicine - honoured by Nobel prize, produced by a renowned pharma company over 30 years, approved by FDA for other diseases - should be so harmful for Covid-19 treatment when no adverse effects and deaths are known at the millions using it mainly in India and Bangladesh (and other countries too) for other diseases?  

 

So, the unbiased thinker may ask: if it does not help, it does not kill either, does it? So why such a strong opposition?   

Because instead of getting vaccinated, some misguided people think this stuff will protect them instead. Not even the vast majority of those dubious studies claim that Ivermectin will come close to protecting people as will vaccination. It just goes to show how far down the rabbit hole you've gone that you can't see this obvious point. And as for India, Uttar pradesh was the poster boy  for India's success. Oddly enough, afterwards it was found that excess mortality in Uttar pradesh had jumped by 110%. Hmmmm....