License for driving scooter in Thailand, need motorcycle endorsement in home country?

[Peterw42]

The days of getting a Bike license based on the UK license 50cc moped endorsement are long gone. A couple of years ago some DLTs didn't know what it meant but most are aware its not a bike license nowadays.

Australian used to be able to do similar by showing a MC (Multi Combo heavy vehicle) endorsement and saying it meant Motorcycle.

[Kwasaki]

23 minutes ago, herfiehandbag said:

My UK driving licence has a series of little pictograms on the back - showing the vehicles which it entitles me to drive.

It acts as a "provisional licence" for a motorcycle (learner, riding solo, with L plates on a small motorcycle - less than 250cc I think), and so has an appropriate picture on the back.

 

Based on that, when I got my Thai driving licences they gave me one for a car and one for a motorcycle!

Yeah I guess if there's a category letter by the m/c pix that could be why they gave it.

At our DLT I never had a problem although the category shown on my UK DL is for a full m/c DL.

Edited October 24, 2021 by Kwasaki

[ourdon]

For What it's Worth:

12 hours ago, Kwasaki said:

The consensus is 90 days.

There seems to be some disagreement on how long an IDP is valid.  It Seems to be a year.   The issuing country/agency determines the length of validity not the person reading it at the other end.

I also note that your valid drivers licence must accompany the IDP (I didn't know that).

[seedy]

Issued in Canada

 

[Kwasaki]

38 minutes ago, ourdon said:

For What it's Worth:

There seems to be some disagreement on how long an IDP is valid.  It Seems to be a year.   The issuing country/agency determines the length of validity not the person reading it at the other end.

I also note that your valid drivers licence must accompany the IDP (I didn't know that).

I have never needed a IDP but understand why people from many countries are required to have one accompanied with a valid full driving licence from there country.

 

The thing is they do not have a translation in Thai only in English and other languages.

 

In Thailand the cut off point of many things is 90 days whether it is valid for 1 year that may be valid in many other countries that requires IDP. 

 

If you have a photocard DL from your country with all categories of what you can legally drive and it's all in English you don't need a IDP,  that said you could get into an argument with a Thai policeman who does understand the rules. 

 

 

 

Edited October 24, 2021 by Kwasaki

[ourdon]

13 minutes ago, Kwasaki said:

In Thailand the cut off point of many things is 90 days whether it is valid for 1 year that may be valid in many other countries that requires IDP. 

You know, I really don't consider this at all important or interesting but you still have got me bringing out my magnifying glass and reading the fine print.  It seems you are absolutely correct.  If I may read from the bottom of the Contracting States list

 

(2) The state in which the visitor is driving may limit the period during which an IDP is recognised for each visit to that state.

 

 

Regards 

[Salerno]

53 minutes ago, ourdon said:

There seems to be some disagreement on how long an IDP is valid.  It Seems to be a year.   The issuing country/agency determines the length of validity not the person reading it at the other end.

There's a distinction you may be missing.

 

The IDP is valid for 1 year (depending on which version obviously) but that does not mean you are necessarily able to drive on it for 1 year in any given country. All it means is you can drive in any country that is a signatory in the 12 months it's valid for. 

 

Countries have their own rules on length of time when you are deemed to be a resident at which point you need a local licence to be "legal".

 

An analogy for you, you apply for a tourist visa (TR), when granted it is valid for 3 months from the date of issuance; you only get 60 days on entry.

[Kwasaki]

4 minutes ago, ourdon said:

You know, I really don't consider this at all important or interesting but you still have got me bringing out my magnifying glass and reading the fine print.  It seems you are absolutely correct.  If I may read from the bottom of the Contracting States list

 

(2) The state in which the visitor is driving may limit the period during which an IDP is recognised for each visit to that state.

 

 

Regards 

Yeah I was only stating what I had read years ago to be the way Thailand govt does things.

 

It always amused me that people with a UK DL got a IDP which stating in English what was already in English on the photo card DL, an IDP would make sense if it had the details written in Thai.

[skatewash]

23 minutes ago, ourdon said:

You know, I really don't consider this at all important or interesting but you still have got me bringing out my magnifying glass and reading the fine print.  It seems you are absolutely correct.  If I may read from the bottom of the Contracting States list

 

(2) The state in which the visitor is driving may limit the period during which an IDP is recognised for each visit to that state.

 

 

Regards 

Yes, most IDPs have a one-year validity period, but how long you can use one in any particular country varies.  In Thailand the period is three months.
 

Quote

If you are staying longer than 3 months in Thailand, by law you are required to obtain a Thai license.

https://motogirlthailand.com/riding-thailand/

Edited October 24, 2021 by skatewash

[skatewash]

The reason for having an International Driving Permit (IDP) is to make things easy for people in different countries to understand exactly what license you have in your home country. 

It's a standardized format, unlike the format of the driver's licenses used in the 197 different countries in the world (it's even worse than that, for example, the US alone has 50 different driving licenses - one for each state).  It contains translations of the information in English, French, Spanish, Russian, Chinese, German, Arabic, Italian, Swedish, and Portuguese.  IDPs are obtained in your home country from something like an automobile association (for example, AAA in the US, $20) or from a government entity (post office or similar).  

If you are allowed to drive a motorcycle in your home country, the producer of the IDP in your home country will translate that permission into the standard format used in the IDP, namely a class "A" license will be stamped.  Class A is the category for motorcycle licenses on an IDP.  Which organization is better able to understand exactly what you have than an automobile association in your own country?  For example, one in the US will be familiar with the 50 different licenses and how they show the motorcycle endorsement or whatever they call it in that particular state.

So when you get to Thailand and you want someone to understand that you have a motorcycle license in your home country you show the IDP and point to the class "A" motorcycle license which is stamped there.  If you are stopped at a police checkpoint and you show your IDP the officer can tell you have a motorcycle license simply by looking for the class "A" stamp in your IDP.  This is much easier than deciphering the format and language of 197 different licenses that you could have shown instead.  

Thailand recognizes 2 of the 3 IDP conventions in use today:  the one-year Geneva 1949 convention, and the 3-year Vienna 1968 convention.  In both of these conventions a motorcycle license is show as class "A".

A IDP is only good with the actual license of which it is a translation.  In Thailand you can only use the IDP to drive for 3 months (or until your actual license expires, whichever comes first).

You will often be able to use only your actual home country license without the IDP if it is in English and if you can explain how the motorcycle permission is indicated.
 

[WhiteBuffaloATM]

people are simply crazy driving any motorbike in thailand without a national / state full mc licence by test (swiftly obtaining thai MC Licence) WITH substantial riding experience or at least intensive mc defensive driving course plus Test Licence. 

 

road death statistics (75% moped riders) inform this country is the Top Tier for foreigner skill / experience BEFORE taking a mc on the roads. your bike handling/ reactions/ confidence/ observation / anticipation MUST ideally ALL be top notch if you are not to join those stats…….

 

otherwise you are the equivalent of a national guardsman ( tier 4)operating in a seal team ( tier 2), which of course would never happen.

[Nojohndoe]

55 minutes ago, skatewash said:

The reason for having an International Driving Permit (IDP) is to make things easy for people in different countries to understand exactly what license you have in your home country. 

It's a standardized format, unlike the format of the driver's licenses used in the 197 different countries in the world (it's even worse than that, for example, the US alone has 50 different driving licenses - one for each state).  It contains translations of the information in English, French, Spanish, Russian, Chinese, German, Arabic, Italian, Swedish, and Portuguese.  IDPs are obtained in your home country from something like an automobile association (for example, AAA in the US, $20) or from a government entity (post office or similar).  

If you are allowed to drive a motorcycle in your home country, the producer of the IDP in your home country will translate that permission into the standard format used in the IDP, namely a class "A" license will be stamped.  Class A is the category for motorcycle licenses on an IDP.  Which organization is better able to understand exactly what you have than an automobile association in your own country?  For example, one in the US will be familiar with the 50 different licenses and how they show the motorcycle endorsement or whatever they call it in that particular state.

So when you get to Thailand and you want someone to understand that you have a motorcycle license in your home country you show the IDP and point to the class "A" motorcycle license which is stamped there.  If you are stopped at a police checkpoint and you show your IDP the officer can tell you have a motorcycle license simply by looking for the class "A" stamp in your IDP.  This is much easier than deciphering the format and language of 197 different licenses that you could have shown instead.  

Thailand recognizes 2 of the 3 IDP conventions in use today:  the one-year Geneva 1949 convention, and the 3-year Vienna 1968 convention.  In both of these conventions a motorcycle license is show as class "A".

A IDP is only good with the actual license of which it is a translation.  In Thailand you can only use the IDP to drive for 3 months (or until your actual license expires, whichever comes first).

You will often be able to use only your actual home country license without the IDP if it is in English and if you can explain how the motorcycle permission is indicated.
 

I have found that quite often the RTP at a check point will disregard the IDP in favor of sighting a home country license. Never been sure if it is because they have no understanding of the significance of the IDP .

As an extra note I have done a little research and found that those countries which issue a Car driving license that allows the holder to ride a 49cc moped without a full Motorcycle license theoretically does not provide that condition to carry over in Thailand despite an accompanying IDP.

Something only of interest for those who might believe a moped as exempt.

[WhiteBuffaloATM]

continuing extreme legalizing smoke & mirrors posts here

OP Title Answer : YES by Full Manual MC Licence.

IDP wont help you if you are dead in a ditch or paraplegic from lack of mc skills.

 

get a full manual test motorbike licence in your home location.

get sufficient intensive riding experience.

get IDP from home

get thai mc licence & thai mc insurance for full & complete legality here.

[Kwasaki]

5 hours ago, skatewash said:

Thailand recognizes 2 of the 3 IDP conventions in use today:  the one-year Geneva 1949 convention, and the 3-year Vienna 1968 convention.  In both of these conventions a motorcycle license is show as class "A".

Show that to a Thai traffic cop and ask him whether he understands it. ????

[Damrongsak]

My license says it's for จักรยานยนต์ which is motor bicycle. It also says ตลอดชีพ (lifetime), which they don't issue anymore. 

 

To ensure I get my money's worth, I wear one of these.  I wear full protective gear when I don't have a monk on back.

[ourdon]

 

Just cause I can't seem to get enough of this thread.  I was looking up car rentals in the US for a relative.  I ran across these conditions.  They indicate that the local constabulary finds uses for the IDP world wide.

 

• An International Drivers License is recommended but not obligatory if drivers license is not in English. An International Driver License is mandatory if drivers license is not in Roman alphabet (such as Japanese, Greek, Russian, Bulgarian, etc.)and must be accompanied with your national drivers license.
• The local supplier will require a security deposit to be blocked on the primary drivers credit card for the duration of the rental. Contact Auto Europe for exceptions. Drivers license must be held for a minimum of 1 years (some exceptions may apply).
• Residents outside US, Canada, Puerto Rico and US Virgin Islands must present a passport at time of pick up.  

 

 

 

Out of curiosity, I have another question.  Wouldn't the 90 day licence change be only for long term visa holders?  It seems to be somewhat out of line to force someone with a tourist visa to get a Thai licence.  

Edited October 24, 2021 by ourdon

[Damrongsak]

40+ years ago, I helped teach a motorcycle class a couple times for Peace Corps Volunteers who might need to use a motorcycle in their job.  We did it in Bang Saen Beach (Chonburi) during the week, right close to the beach.  Big old property with bungalows so we could let them run around the grounds for a day or two.  Hardly a soul around back then.

 

One guy had never learned how to ride a bicycle, so we rented one.  I have never seen someone try sooo hard in my life.  He was beet red from the exertion/concentration, not to mention the heat.  He did manage the bicycle but never got on a motorcycle.  Another guy wanted to know how to do a wheelie.  So I told him a little more throttle, a little more, little more .... now pop the clutch. That little bike reared up and bucked him off.  Fortunately the driveway was sandy, not hard pavement. I'm bad. 

[Sticky Rice Balls]

18 hours ago, Kwasaki said:

Does it have written in Thai what you are licenced to drive. ????️ ????.

Is a USA shop and is in English----it may have a line to translate on back for other countries but thai cops glanced at mine, handed it back and waved me thru...

 

So it has been tried and tested in LOS-CNX....and was accepted by thai cops...was a great feeling driving off and they were hoping for another 500bt--not today!

[Thunglom]

An IDP needs to cover the class of vehicle you are driving - e.g. motorcycle or car etc.....

BUT they are only valid for your first 3 months in the country, more than that and you need a Thai licence.

[Kwasaki]

5 hours ago, Sticky Rice Balls said:

Is a USA shop and is in English----it may have a line to translate on back for other countries but thai cops glanced at mine, handed it back and waved me thru...

 

So it has been tried and tested in LOS-CNX....and was accepted by thai cops...was a great feeling driving off and they were hoping for another 500bt--not today!

Yeah my point was if your USA DL has a photo of you and shows everything you can drive in English then what's the point of a IDP showing everything that's written on the DL. 

No doubt some countries would require a IDP for the language of the country but Thailand excepts English if all the information is on the DL. 

e.g. A UK photocard DL. 

I have know idea what a USA DL looks like. 

I know an OZ DL has to be accompanied with a IDP in our province. 

Edited October 25, 2021 by Kwasaki

[Kwasaki]

10 hours ago, ourdon said:

Out of curiosity, I have another question.  Wouldn't the 90 day licence change be only for long term visa holders?  It seems to be somewhat out of line to force someone with a tourist visa to get a Thai licence.  

Well to get a Thai DL it's just a requirement of the 90 day rule of staying Thailand and drive.  

No matter what visa you have it would apply. 

You can't get a Thai DL in our province with a tourist visa but it wouldn't surprise me if some provinces would issue one after all this is Thailand. ????

 

[Salerno]

2 minutes ago, Kwasaki said:

You can't get a Thai DL in our province with a tourist visa but it wouldn't surprise me if some provinces would issue one after all this is Thailand. ????

Can get one visa exempt (obviously down to the foibles of the staff at whatever office). What you can't get on short-term entry is a 5 year licence.

[Kwasaki]

11 minutes ago, Salerno said:

Can get one visa exempt (obviously down to the foibles of the staff at whatever office). What you can't get on short-term entry is a 5 year licence.

Spot on ???? reminds me about our local DLT years ago when I ask my wife did her eldest sister take a drive test, she said no she just paid 500 baht. ????

 

 

Edited October 25, 2021 by Kwasaki

[Salerno]

1 minute ago, Kwasaki said:

I ask my my wife did her eldest take a drive test, she said no she just paid 500 baht. ????

Life is so much simpler in Thailand ????

[RocketDog]

I had a valid driver's license from USA with a motorcycle endorsement. No problem getting both in Thailand, only the regular reaction/vision / depth perception test.

Edited October 25, 2021 by RocketDog

[jackdd]

15 hours ago, ourdon said:

Out of curiosity, I have another question.  Wouldn't the 90 day licence change be only for long term visa holders?  It seems to be somewhat out of line to force someone with a tourist visa to get a Thai licence.  

There is no 90 day limit, people who claim such a limit exists are just trolling.

[1sickpuppy]

On 10/23/2021 at 10:52 AM, seedy said:

The do not drive on the proper side of the road in LOS

They drive on the left

only septics drive on wrong side of the road mate, Thais do it propery

[Kwasaki]

7 hours ago, jackdd said:

There is no 90 day limit, people who claim such a limit exists are just trolling.

Here you go again the person who knows more, than the Thai authorities  

[Sticky Rice Balls]

16 hours ago, Kwasaki said:

Yeah my point was if your USA DL has a photo of you and shows everything you can drive in English then what's the point of a IDP showing everything that's written on the DL. 

No doubt some countries would require a IDP for the language of the country but Thailand excepts English if all the information is on the DL. 

e.g. A UK photocard DL. 

I have know idea what a USA DL looks like. 

I know an OZ DL has to be accompanied with a IDP in our province. 

I have a US DL for motorcycles--been driving em since a teen..the thai cops refused it and took it the first time until I paid them off

Afterwards I made copies of my DL as it had the info and the cops didnt like that--lol--i assume they still have a pile of those copies at the station

[Damrongsak]

30 minutes ago, Sticky Rice Balls said:

I have a US DL for motorcycles--been driving em since a teen..the thai cops refused it and took it the first time until I paid them off

Afterwards I made copies of my DL as it had the info and the cops didnt like that--lol--i assume they still have a pile of those copies at the station

IF I ever get back there, I certainly will never willingly hand over my genuine lifetime bike license from 1978. The home address on it is now underneath an SCB bank and a row of shops. LOL.