Thailand again signals move away from mass-market foreign tourism with falling numbers

[sdweller]

I love Thailand, and I am NOT a "sex tourist"... but I'm not sure that Thailand would make a top destination for most "high end" tourists?  There are many places to go around the world for big-spenders, Thailand certainly has some areas that would fit, but I think what primarily makes Thailand such a popular tourist destination is NOT high-end ritzy sites. This would be shooting for a totally different market, which from an economic standpoint would be, in all probability, a costly mistake. 

[spidermike007]

These guys continue to occupy a self entitled dreamworld. Their gazillionaire status insures a total detachment from reality, facts, truth and practical concerns. 

 

There are a dozen good reasons why wealthy tourists AVOID Thailand. Do I need to repeat them again? Air quality, water quality, highway hazards, poor law enforcement, the lack of access to fine wine at fair prices (whether you drink fine wine or not, it is part of the lifestyle for most wealthy people), grossly exorbitant luxury taxes (every wealthy person I know loves to shop for luxury goods while on vacation, especially the wives!). I could go on. 

 

The creeps like to rant on and on and on about wanting to attract well heeled tourists and ex-pats, yet are offering barely anything to attract them. No improvements, few incentives, and a relatively poor overall experience. 

[rickudon]

Although Thailand may wish to improve their 'image' as a tourist destination, they have failed to fully analyse the impact this has had on their 'foreign person' income. For instance, the number of EU, UK and USA tourists has stagnated over the last 10 years - the increased number of tourists has only been achieved by tapping new markets (Russia, india, China). The older markets have failed to grow due to poorer exchange rates, higher prices, publicity about scams and corruption. 

 

What they have failed to realise is that 10 years ago the long stay tourists and retirees probably spent as much as the tourists from their own countries - for the UK for instance there were about one million tourists a year, typically staying 2 weeks,  but this included the long stay UK citizens who numbered 90,000 but stayed 20 times longer. Long stay UK citizens have now halved - only 45,000 left. Most of these were driven out by higher prices and the disappearance of many of the easy to get medium term visas which could be picked up with a quick border hop or an annual return to your home country. In the 11 years i have lived here i have seen as many visa changes - some affected me, some not. But now unless an Elite customer, only the marriage and retirement visa options left as genuine multi-year options - and although theoretically the income required hasn't changed, in practice it has, unless you use money in the bank (income requirements were previously gross and annual, now net and monthly).

 

As a result, the loss of long term residents has probably meant that income from foreigners from the UK probably hasn't even kept up with inflation in dollar/Euro/GBP values. They have lost half of a reliable income source which is more reliable than fickle tourist spending. Only 1% of the tourists came back this year, but 50% of the long term residents are still spending. Getting those replacement rich tourists will not be easy - there are only so many millionaires in the world, and competition is growing.

[spidermike007]

21 minutes ago, sdweller said:

I love Thailand, and I am NOT a "sex tourist"... but I'm not sure that Thailand would make a top destination for most "high end" tourists?  There are many places to go around the world for big-spenders, Thailand certainly has some areas that would fit, but I think what primarily makes Thailand such a popular tourist destination is NOT high-end ritzy sites. This would be shooting for a totally different market, which from an economic standpoint would be, in all probability, a costly mistake. 

You are totally spot on. There are a dozen good reasons, which I have specified on former posts, why most rich tourists AVOID Thailand. It is a total pipe dream, thought up by guys who are so out of touch, and so ignorant, it boggles the mind. 

 

A note to the out of touch policy dreamers. You want rich tourists? What sacrifices are you willing to make? For many reasons Thailand has dropped way, way down that list of desired destinations for the rich. The out of touch, and overly self entitled leaders here do not have a clue. 

[spidermike007]

12 minutes ago, rickudon said:

Although Thailand may wish to improve their 'image' as a tourist destination, they have failed to fully analyse the impact this has had on their 'foreign person' income. For instance, the number of EU, UK and USA tourists has stagnated over the last 10 years - the increased number of tourists has only been achieved by tapping new markets (Russia, india, China). The older markets have failed to grow due to poorer exchange rates, higher prices, publicity about scams and corruption. 

 

What they have failed to realise is that 10 years ago the long stay tourists and retirees probably spent as much as the tourists from their own countries - for the UK for instance there were about one million tourists a year, typically staying 2 weeks,  but this included the long stay UK citizens who numbered 90,000 but stayed 20 times longer. Long stay UK citizens have now halved - only 45,000 left. Most of these were driven out by higher prices and the disappearance of many of the easy to get medium term visas which could be picked up with a quick border hop or an annual return to your home country. In the 11 years i have lived here i have seen as many visa changes - some affected me, some not. But now unless an Elite customer, only the marriage and retirement visa options left as genuine multi-year options - and although theoretically the income required hasn't changed, in practice it has, unless you use money in the bank (income requirements were previously gross and annual, now net and monthly).

 

As a result, the loss of long term residents has probably meant that income from foreigners from the UK probably hasn't even kept up with inflation in dollar/Euro/GBP values. They have lost half of a reliable income source which is more reliable than fickle tourist spending. Only 1% of the tourists came back this year, but 50% of the long term residents are still spending. Getting those replacement rich tourists will not be easy - there are only so many millionaires in the world, and competition is growing.

Excellent essay, on why tens of thousands of ex-pats are choosing to leave Thailand. A friend of mine uses a top foreign attorney in Bangkok, and this guy cannot come up with enough hours in the day, to handle foreigners married to Thais, who are quitting Thailand, bringing their immediate Thai families with them when moving elsewhere, and making arrangements for their assets here. 

 

The arrogance of the surly and ignorant authorities here, prevent them from even acknowledging what a loss this will be to the economy, especially upcountry. They are lost in a fantasy world of their own making. And their concern for the general public is nearly non existent. 

[spidermike007]

Just another misstep by an arrogant, surly, out of touch, and badly informed administration, led by people who are overly wealthy, self entitled, and care not one iota for the well being of the common man, who represent the vast majority of the population of the nation. It is all about their wealthy sponsors. The plebs count for nothing. 

 

They just do not get it. They nearly always miss the plot. They prove to us daily, what a tragic mistake it was to allow the army to lead the nation. Their ignorance knows no bounds, and is surpassed only by their arrogance, and false sense of self importance, and entitlement.

 

Woe is Thailand with these creeps running the show. 

[spidermike007]

The only way this nation has any hope of moving forward, is to rid itself of the spectacularly toxic army leadership. How about if Cha Cha sings his resignation song? That would likely be a huge hit. May I suggest some lyrics for his swan song? 

 

I know, I know, I know. I should have reacted when the outbreak happened back in December, and done the right thing by shutting down that area in Samut. 

 

I know. I should have taken the vaccine thing more seriously. I know, I should have had a more qualified health minister. 

 

I know, my pathological fear of the optics of a lockdown are causing many more cases than need be. Those deaths are on me. 

 

And I know, I should have been more diligent with the borders, I should have cracked down on corrupt immigration officials, and kept my promise to fight corruption, and I should have and could have done better.

 

People say I should resign now. I know what is what you are thinking. I probably should. It sure would be the right thing to do. But, doing the right thing would be so alien for me. I am not sure I even know how to do that. Give me some time to think about this. OK? I am sure enjoying all this power and money. 

 

[garyk]

Got to give a little to get a little. Take take take and no give is a thing of the past.

Personally I view Thailands government about the same as I view a bar girl. About the same way of thinking.

 

[spidermike007]

11 hours ago, thaibeachlovers said:

Nothing unique to Thailand in that. NZ workers have been going to OZ for decades because the pay is better. I'd say soon as it's possible to do so a lot of nurses will be abandoning NZ for higher pay in OZ. Same with Thailand. Now that apprentice type training has ended for many occupations loyalty has gone and people will go where the rewards are better. IMO nothing to do with a sense of hopelessness. 

Totally incorrect, and a total misread of what is going on here. I have never seen the level of discontent, hopelessness, and sorrow, as I see now in Thailand. Alot of despondency, from some of the happiest people I knew, at one time. Suicides are skyrocketing, like never before. You won't see proof of that anywhere. I have a paramedic friend in Bangkok, and she shows up to homes, where the entire family has taken themselves out. The group of them sit down and weep. This is entirely on Prayuth, his failed policies and a failed administration. The army leadership is the last thing in the world this nation needs, at this time.

 

They need hope, not hopelessness and staggering incompetency, spectacular levels of cronyism and corruption, with alot of rich men working the franchise. 

[drgoon]

On 12/18/2021 at 9:36 AM, RichardColeman said:

Problem with aiming for high class tourists and the dismantling of the sex industry is that that is probably 6-8 million jobs out the window and no new industry to employ them on the horizon.

 

The aim for high class tourists and no more sex industry is a fine aim, but they should not even attempt anything like that until tourism is back to 32-40 million a year and they have something in place to support their goals and start the transferring the sex industry workers and soon to be 'poor' tourism support workers to better jobs 

I doubt they have any ideas or motivation to do thay

[bkk_bwana]

18 hours ago, thaibeachlovers said:

Unless you can provide a breakdown of the numbers that, IMO is meaningless. It could just mean that  Malaysian businessmen were coming over the border for fun on weekends more often. Each border entry is counted as a separate person.

That's always been the case with tourism numbers. Malaysian businesses men coming aver the border on weekends is ...... tourists.  They don't have to stay for two weeks, be European, stay in resorts or anything else. Arrivals have been growing steadily. The number of hotel rooms, flights and all other statistics support this. 

[thaibook]

On 12/18/2021 at 4:51 PM, ChC1 said:

I was going to make that point. But I know someone here will jump out and criticise me' are you in Thailand? Do you know Thailand?' as illustrated by one of the poster here. Plus if I put that point it it would be too long to read. There are a big Thai middle class family now. No one would want their children going to sex industry once the family jumped through classes. Sure there is always illegal immigrants and peasant family may provide some sex workers. Yet the trend is there. General Thai population wants to be respected. New middle class Thai wants prosperity. I agree with you. 

Few other than some from the older upper class and higher bourgeois Thai families (many so called hi-sos are neither of these) would object to being the mia noi/mistress/paramour/concubine of a rich person.  This is seen as an easier way to prosperity for themselves and their clan than working in an office.