New Protocol to convert tourist visa to Non-Immigrant type O retirement option.

[thairat]

4 hours ago, BritTim said:

Two points:

1. There is no substantive difference when planning to convert to a Non O visa at immigration between entering visa exempt or with a tourist visa. Thus, I do not see that Chiang Mai immigration misled you on this.

Maybe so but,I have never before had to come back on a specific tick of the clock. So this process is now the routine? If so the whole reason I start this thread.

[BritTim]

6 minutes ago, thairat said:

Maybe so but,I have never before had to come back on a specific tick of the clock. So this process is now the routine? If so the whole reason I start this thread.

Asking you to come on a specific day (assuming no misunderstanding) is strange, but I am quite sure it is unrelated to your flavour of tourist entry. One possible explanation is that they know, on that day, there will be someone around with excellent English who can relieve the stress on both sides.

[ubonjoe]

36 minutes ago, thairat said:

In the past were tourist visas ever granted at the border? or was admission at the border always referred in this context to visa exempt.

No

It has always been called a visa exempt or visa waiver when you enter without a visa of any kind.

A look at your arrival stamp informs you of what you had when you enter the country. A exempt is written as ผ.30 on the first line of it. And your admitted until date on the 2nd line would be for 30 days from the day you arrived.

A tourist visa would be written as a TR-60 with a 60 days of stay on the 2nd line.

[BritTim]

35 minutes ago, thairat said:

It appears that commonly used term “tourist visa” is not actually a visa at all, but rather visa exempt.

There is huge confusion on a regular basis caused by people calling every stamp in their passport a "visa". One clue as to whether a sticker or stamp is a visa is that a visa has the word VISA close to the top of it. Any stamp or sticker that does not contain that specific word is not a visa.

 

When you enter without a visa (visa exempt) there will be nothing called a visa placed in your passport. All you get is an entry stamp.

 

Apart from the entry stamp you receive when entering the country (where you should always check the admitted until date) and exit stamp you receive when leaving the country, you should look at all other stickers and stamps placed in your passport and endevour to understand what they are and what they mean. The most common types are: visa, extension, re-entry permit, under consideration and overstay. Just having officials place stamps in your passport you do not understand is perilous. Officials sometimes make mistakes, and if you do not detect them you can end up in serious trouble, even though it was the official's original error that was the cause. 

[thairat]

So “Visa upon arrival” is a misnomer doest exist in Thailand.

 

The problem here is the ambiguity of commonly used terms, which dont apply in the precise context with regard foreigner permission to visit or live in Thailand, as  used by Thai immigration.

[thairat]

9 minutes ago, BritTim said:

There is huge confusion on a regular basis caused by people calling every stamp in their passport a "visa". One clue as to whether a sticker or stamp is a visa is that a visa has the word VISA close to the top of it. Any stamp or sticker that does not contain that specific word is not a visa.

 

When you enter without a visa (visa exempt) there will be nothing called a visa placed in your passport. All you get is an entry stamp.

 

Apart from the entry stamp you receive when entering the country (where you should always check the admitted until date) and exit stamp you receive when leaving the country, you should look at all other stickers and stamps placed in your passport and endevour to understand what they are and what they mean. The most common types are: visa, extension, re-entry permit, under consideration and overstay. Just having officials place stamps in your passport you do not understand is perilous. Officials sometimes make mistakes, and if you do not detect them you can end up in serious trouble, even though it was the official's original error that was the cause. 

Thank you for this, is there a current guide or sticky to explain pitfalls of visa acquisition.

[thairat]

Just reviewed my passport, the only place I see the word visa written in English is on my Laos Visa Sticker.

 

No stamp in my passport has the word visa.

[thairat]

40 minutes ago, BritTim said:

Asking you to come on a specific day (assuming no misunderstanding) is strange, but I am quite sure it is unrelated to your flavour of tourist entry. One possible explanation is that they know, on that day, there will be someone around with excellent English who can relieve the stress on both sides.

My payment receipt for this application was stamped with the date 12 July as my return date.

[JayClay]

29 minutes ago, thairat said:

So “Visa upon arrival” is a misnomer doest exist in Thailand

It does exist but it's something different that you don't need to concern yourself with.

 

The easiest way to remember it is that a visa is a permission to enter the country. The stamp you get when entering, either with or without a visa, is permission to stay in the country. The length of the permission to stay will be determined the class of visa you had (or didn't have) when you entered the country.

[GroveHillWanderer]

17 minutes ago, thairat said:

So “Visa upon arrival” is a misnomer doesnt exist in Thailand.

Visa on arrival does exist, however it's only available to the citizens of specific countries, and is only valid for 15 days.

 

You keep mentioning that you couldn't have known any of this but the information about the different types of visas  and modes of entry is freely and easily available from multiple sources. Any Thai Embassy website, the Thailand Immigration official website (immigration.go.th), many other immigration-related websites or even this forum itself, would have given you the relevant information needed to avoid misunderstandings.

 

For instance, the full info for visa exempt entry, visa on arrival (VOA) and all other types of visa is available on the Thai immigration website mentioned above.

[BritTim]

19 minutes ago, thairat said:

Just reviewed my passport, the only place I see the word visa written in English is on my Laos Visa Sticker.

 

No stamp in my passport has the word visa.

On July 12th, you will get one.

[thairat]

14 minutes ago, GroveHillWanderer said:

Visa on arrival does exist, however it's only available to the citizens of specific countries, and is only valid for 15 days.

 

You keep mentioning that you couldn't have known any of this but the information about the different types of visas  and modes of entry is freely and easily available from multiple sources. Any Thai Embassy website, the Thailand Immigration official website (immigration.go.th), many other immigration-related websites or even this forum itself, would have given you the relevant information needed to avoid misunderstandings.

 

For instance, the full info for visa exempt entry, visa on arrival (VOA) and all other types of visa is available on the Thai immigration website mentioned above.

Searching the domain immigration.go.th with google for visa exempt turns up 1 entry
 From that 1 entry see below

 

Visa

1. Generally, a foreign citizen who wishes to enter the Kingdom of Thailand is required to obtain a visa from a Royal Thai Embassy or a Royal Thai Consulate-General. However, nationals of certain countries do not require a visa if they meet visa exemption requirements as follows:
(1) they are nationals of countries which are exempted from visa requirements when entering Thailand for tourism purposes. Such nationals will be permitted to stay in the Kingdom for a period of not exceeding 30 days. For more information, please see Tourist Visa

Exemption
 

Searching the same domain for the exact phrase used above “Tourist Visa Exemption”

Yields zero results.

[ubonjoe]

10 minutes ago, thairat said:

Searching the domain immigration.go.th with google for visa exempt turns up 1 entry
 From that 1 entry see below

This screengrab from the list of countries that qualify for VOA's and visa exemption.

 

 

Download: List of countries for visa exempt and visas on arrival dated October 2021.

 

[BritTim]

1 hour ago, thairat said:

Thank you for this, is there a current guide or sticky to explain pitfalls of visa acquisition.

In all honesty, there is no source I have ever found that is 100% accurate on all aspects of Thailand's visa policy.

 

The Wikipedia page "Visa Policy of Thailand" provided an excellent introduction years ago but, unfortunately, has deteriorated now, being a little out of date, and also having recent edits that are simply wrong. The information is still about 80% accurate. However, for details, you will need to search further.

 

The actual laws and announcements (for which there is a sticky thread in this forum) is a very good resource. The information is mostly accurate as far as the official rules is concerned, but heavy going and sometimes ambiguous. A further issue is that Thailand does not follow its own laws at all airports, border crossings and immigration offices.

 

One of the main reasons this forum is useful is that, when you state your plans clearly, with your travel plans and intended immigration office to use, someone can usually point out any special issues you might encounter  The forum's biggest issue is the noise to signal ratio. There is a mass of irrelevant and incorrect information obscuring the useful data that you need. In time, you will learn which members provide accurate advice. This can help you weed out what you are better off ignoring.

 

What would be ideal (if someone had a free year to create one) would be a hierarchical knowledge base that started with a basic summary and then drilled down through several levels of increasing detail on specific topics. Any volunteers?

[Blue Muton]

7 hours ago, thairat said:

My payment receipt for this application was stamped with the date 12 July as my return date.

My return (to immigration) date is tomorrow. I phoned them this morning and they said I could come and get my extension stamp in my passport today, which I did. In and out in two minutes.

[thairat]

35 minutes ago, Blue Muton said:

My return (to immigration) date is tomorrow. I phoned them this morning and they said I could come and get my extension stamp in my passport today, which I did. In and out in two minutes.

How did you find a phone number?

[Onerak]

14 hours ago, thairat said:

It appears that commonly used term “tourist visa” is not actually a visa at all, but rather visa exempt.

 

So the commonly heard term “Visa on arrival” doesnt apply to Thailand?

This is a simple concept and applies to most countries. A visa is obtained at the embassy and it allows you  to enter a country. All immigrations will vet you before an entry is given and give you a permission to stay. For example, you may have a visa for ten year but your permission to stay is six-month. Visa exempt entry is when you don't need a visa to enter a country. Some countries don't have visa exempt entries. Some countries have only for passport holders of certain specified countries, etc. A visa on arrival is when you obtain a visa after arrival at the port of entry (for example an airport). For Thailand specific stuff, others have already posted umpteen times in this forum.

[worldexpress]

On 6/21/2022 at 10:52 PM, thairat said:

So “Visa upon arrival” is a misnomer doest exist in Thailand.

 

Wrong!

Unless one has no situational awareness, a big sign that reads "Visa on Arrival" on the way to passport control cannot be missed.

[Lemsta69]

On 6/22/2022 at 10:49 AM, BritTim said:

There is huge confusion on a regular basis caused by people calling every stamp in their passport a "visa". One clue as to whether a sticker or stamp is a visa is that a visa has the word VISA close to the top of it. Any stamp or sticker that does not contain that specific word is not a visa.

 

When you enter without a visa (visa exempt) there will be nothing called a visa placed in your passport. All you get is an entry stamp.

 

Apart from the entry stamp you receive when entering the country (where you should always check the admitted until date) and exit stamp you receive when leaving the country, you should look at all other stickers and stamps placed in your passport and endevour to understand what they are and what they mean. The most common types are: visa, extension, re-entry permit, under consideration and overstay. Just having officials place stamps in your passport you do not understand is perilous. Officials sometimes make mistakes, and if you do not detect them you can end up in serious trouble, even though it was the official's original error that was the cause. 

not only do they mix up their terms some of them get quite militant when you try to correct them. both in here and IRL. 

 

I've been called a tedious bore by some of my good friends when I try to help them with their visa stuff. next time I'll just let them go on overstay or have their "retirement visa" cancelled on a trip back home because they didn't get a re-entry permit.

[Lemsta69]

On 6/22/2022 at 10:52 AM, thairat said:

So “Visa upon arrival” is a misnomer doest exist in Thailand.

 

The problem here is the ambiguity of commonly used terms, which dont apply in the precise context with regard foreigner permission to visit or live in Thailand, as  used by Thai immigration.

there's nothing ambiguous about the terms, just the dummies who misuse then either wilfully or ignorantly. if your previous knowledge base was learned from friends then they owe you at least two cases by way of compensation. probably a bottle of bourbon too.