EV Owners … Real life experience & help thread

[KhunLA]

Cruise control set @ 110, doing 109kph and usage is  13.4kWh per 100kms at that speed.

Equates to 345 kms range in ECO mode

Usage battery - 46.3kWh ÷ 13.4 = 3,455 X 100 = 345 kms

NEDC range 403, we rarely get that around town

WLTP range 320, at least get that, and usually more, up to 360 kms 'estimated' per charge.

 

Bit blurry as screenshot off vid

[KhunLA]

One annoying thing about EV, well, MG ZS at least, though guessing other do the same.  App will have a brain freeze.   Had one yesterday while on the road, of all place.   Warning pops up, and never on screen long enough to actually read.   Then check icon comes on, and I scroll through the screens, and no longer displaying air pressure in tires.   Handling fine, so know I don't have a flat, and in heavy traffic so can't really stop.

 

When it does have a brain freeze, (rare) it's usually the screen will be blank, won't load, or simply have date & time.   Simply turn off, wait 2 minutes, and restart, and all clears up, back to normal.

 

Yesterday was first time it did that, warning icon AND missing info.  So checked for closest MG dealer, as didn't want to do the usually, turn off / on, and not have it restart.  No detour needed, and dealer was just 12 kms up the road.  Cycling through screens and when back at main screen, warning pops up, so made a vid, so could actually read it.   Didn't have a clue what it was, but we did top up the tires earlier in the day.  

 

Wife call dealer before arriving and stated that's probably it, so pulled in, wife went in for a chit chat, longer than needed, as I simply restarted the car, and all normal again.  With verification notice on screen.  'Good condition / No faults'

 

Just something to know, if local, then just restart.  If on the road, personally, if still operating, and no noticeable issue, then restart at next dealer, JIC.   Do call your local rep, and have noted in your record no matter what, if more than just a brain freeze, which actually are rare, and we don't bother reporting.

[KhunLA]

Charging your EV with solar ... Charge when you can, when having excess.   Car only at 84%, but charge while the sun is out, especially during rainy season.

 

Yesterday, solar was barely producing enough for the house.   Today, no prob, so charge up when excess is available.

[JBChiangRai]

11 minutes ago, KhunLA said:

Charging your EV with solar ... Charge when you can, when having excess.   Car only at 84%, but charge while the sun is out, especially during rainy season.

 

Yesterday, solar was barely producing enough for the house.   Today, no prob, so charge up when excess is available.

It would nice to be able to stop and start charging automatically, sun out? Charge, clouds? Stop charging.

 

i did setup something to do that with my grid-tied system.  I used an adjustable ice/under voltage cut off wired to a NC (Normally Closed) contractor. The over voltage was set high and the under voltage turned off.

 

The sun shines and the inverters increase voltage above PEA, contractor closes car charges, and the reverse when a cloud comes out.

 

It worked a few times on a German EV then the car would trip fault.

 

I will try it on the BYD when I get round to it

[KhunLA]

6 minutes ago, JBChiangRai said:

It would nice to be able to stop and start charging automatically, sun out? Charge, clouds? Stop charging.

 

i did setup something to do that with my grid-tied system.  I used an adjustable ice/under voltage cut off wired to a NC (Normally Closed) contractor. The over voltage was set high and the under voltage turned off.

 

The sun shines and the inverters increase voltage above PEA, contractor closes car charges, and the reverse when a cloud comes out.

 

It worked a few times on a German EV then the car would trip fault.

 

I will try it on the BYD when I get round to it

I got caught a few times, charging the car, get involved / distracted, and couple hours later, damn, sun gone, solar batteries down a bit ... oops

[UWEB]

9 hours ago, JBChiangRai said:

It would nice to be able to stop and start charging automatically, sun out? Charge, clouds? Stop charging.

 

i did setup something to do that with my grid-tied system.  I used an adjustable ice/under voltage cut off wired to a NC (Normally Closed) contractor. The over voltage was set high and the under voltage turned off.

 

The sun shines and the inverters increase voltage above PEA, contractor closes car charges, and the reverse when a cloud comes out.

 

It worked a few times on a German EV then the car would trip fault.

 

I will try it on the BYD when I get round to it

If you have a smart Charger like ABB Terra you can install an Energy Meter, that is exactly doing what you want to do. Called Dynamic charging.

[JBChiangRai]

9 hours ago, UWEB said:

If you have a smart Charger like ABB Terra you can install an Energy Meter, that is exactly doing what you want to do. Called Dynamic charging.

 

Thanks for that, I do have the ABB Terra, I will look for an Energy Meter

[UWEB]

On 7/1/2024 at 7:28 AM, JBChiangRai said:

 

Thanks for that, I do have the ABB Terra, I will look for an Energy Meter

I'm still struggling to get my Phone connected to the Charger. Will you please let me know which OCPP Server you are using?

[JBChiangRai]

1 hour ago, UWEB said:

I'm still struggling to get my Phone connected to the Charger. Will you please let me know which OCPP Server you are using?

I have no idea, I don’t remember being asked that, or maybe I chose default option 

[KhunLA]

MG ZS was getting 12v battery fault warning.  Not charged up, and gauge showing 10.1-14.3 at times while warning 'dinging' for about 2 minutes, then it would reset, all good again.   Until a few more kms, and repeat.

 

Here's a post about solution, and before taking into service dept, if mechanically inclined, or they have a long Q, check the obvious .... 'loose cable wire to battery'

 

[KhunLA]

On 7/22/2024 at 10:35 AM, KhunLA said:

MG ZS was getting 12v battery fault warning.  Not charged up, and gauge showing 10.1-14.3 at times while warning 'dinging' for about 2 minutes, then it would reset, all good again.   Until a few more kms, and repeat.

 

Here's a post about solution, and before taking into service dept, if mechanically inclined, or they have a long Q, check the obvious .... 'loose cable wire to battery'

 

A bit more on the MG ZS 12v battery, after everything tightened up.

More at this post, as asked about voltage at rest & driving.

 

Short version, off and at rest, 12v battery seems comfy at 13.1v

Few minutes after car started, at 'ready or while driving' and 14.1v seem to be it's happy place.

[KhunLA]

DECO SUSU model E-MC ... 3 years owning

All 3 warranties now expired; battery, motor, electronics 

Has run almost flawless for ...

 

 

Average 2500 kms for first 2 yrs, and less for 3rd.   Well taken care of (battery), and never below 20%, usually above 30% before topping back up.   About once a week, since old tech, not LFP, and not liking to be topped up daily.

 

Would image some battery degradation, though nothing of note.  Battery life 3-5 yrs when purchased, and expect to get at least another 3-5 yrs out of it.  Since our local driving kms is minimal, all being close to the house.   Daily runs are 8-15 kms when weather is cooperating.

 

Really can't ask for a cheaper mode of transportation, especially now with govt incentive of 18k baht, and upgraded battery (LFP).

 

 

 

[KhunLA]

Did another battery equalization, from 18% to 100%

Slow charging @ 7.4kWh

 

But, for some reason, stop charging @ 40% for about an hour, 

as I didn't notice.  Going to guess that affected slightly in a

negative way, if at all.   

 

Results were, according to the car,  ranges when

new @ 100% & now,  Along with what the pea meter

finished & started at, kWh used...

 

 

At the 14 month period & equalization, was only 0.6%, so considerably more, or one or both, were a bit flawed.  But, ballpark enough for me.

 

So end of battery warranty, 8 yrs, maybe about 10% degradation +/-

 

May Equalize it again in another 7 months, as CATL does recommend a couple times a year.  We've only done it twice.

 

NOTE:  ... WLTP range rating is 320, car in ECO mode is 360

[Klonko]

Upgraded from a Ora GoodCat 500 to a Tesla Model 3 AWD. 580 km real range (629 km WTP) from Isaan to Sattahip via Bangkok (450 km, partially motorway), keeping A/C on during two stops. One charging stop would suffice from Sattahip to Chiang Rai. The longer range of the Tesla is convenient but not a necessity at least on weekdays. The Ora GoodCat's range is 400 km at 90 km/h but only 280 km at 120 km/h. The Tesla is more comfortable and has better software, but the Ora is still good value and we will keep it.

[KhunLA]

Coming up on 2 years (Oct 30), of owning the 2022 MG ZS EV, and still Lovin' It.  Can't think of any negatives for us.  Really like the ZS, ICE & E versions.  

 

We seem to average 20k +/- kms a year.  2 yrs / 40k kms with ICE version, and now 2 yrs / 35.5k with the E version.  (19.5k the 1st year).  Been hanging around the house more this past year.  

 

Half our kms are O&A, requiring CSs & hotel stays.   Half our local driving is also away from the house, exploring locally (50-125 kms, one way), no CSs or hotels needed.

 

~95%, or more, of home charging is done with solar.  We really have not need for the grid, though connected for ฿26 a month, JIC.

 

MG dealer, service shop has been excellent, though very little needed, aside from check ups @ 10k kms.  Local dealer is also their oops / body shop, and did an excellent job with our minor oops, and Roojai insurance was excellent, start to finish.

 

No negatives worth mentioning.  BEVs fits our lifestyle & transport needs perfectly, whether car, MB or ebike.

 

Stated many times, for us, savings (long game) was motivation to buying, and afterwards, performance was way more impressive than expected, making it an even better choice for us.  Makes driving fun again.  If wanting either, highly recommend owning or at least test driving a BEV, before your next vehicle purchase.

 

With that, think I'm done with this thread, unless asked a specific question.  I think everything I could think of was covered in the thread.

 

Thanks for contributing, asking questions, and helping with my choice before owning, and along the way.

 

HAPPY MOTORING

 

Solar & EV info is why I joined the forum, so thanks for all the info and assistance with those.  Owning E-MB for 3 yrs, BEV for 2 years, w/Solar for 2 yrs, to compliment them.  Threads on each if interested.

 

PEACE OUT

[richard_smith237]

31 minutes ago, KhunLA said:

No negatives worth mentioning.  BEVs fits our lifestyle & transport needs perfectly, whether car, MB or ebike.

 

There are a couple of negatives...   but they are not show stoppers.

 

 

1) There is the need for numerous different EV charging Apps ( I think about 8 in total )

... some of which requires money pre-loaded into in-app wallets.

 

2) When 'charging' at a shopping mall.

- its great if you can get a slower Type 2 AC charger that will gently top up the charge over a few hours (2-3-4 hrs etc)

- But, if you get a CCS2 DC charger that will top up the car in 20-30mins, then you have to go back and exit the charging bay and park elsewhere (which of course adds a further element of inconvenience).

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[vinny41]

1 hour ago, KhunLA said:

Coming up on 2 years (Oct 30), of owning the 2022 MG ZS EV, and still Lovin' It.  Can't think of any negatives for us.  Really like the ZS, ICE & E versions.  

 

We seem to average 20k +/- kms a year.  2 yrs / 40k kms with ICE version, and now 2 yrs / 35.5k with the E version.  (19.5k the 1st year).  Been hanging around the house more this past year.  

 

Half our kms are O&A, requiring CSs & hotel stays.   Half our local driving is also away from the house, exploring locally (50-125 kms, one way), no CSs or hotels needed.

 

~95%, or more, of home charging is done with solar.  We really have not need for the grid, though connected for ฿26 a month, JIC.

 

MG dealer, service shop has been excellent, though very little needed, aside from check ups @ 10k kms.  Local dealer is also their oops / body shop, and did an excellent job with our minor oops, and Roojai insurance was excellent, start to finish.

 

No negatives worth mentioning.  BEVs fits our lifestyle & transport needs perfectly, whether car, MB or ebike.

 

Stated many times, for us, savings (long game) was motivation to buying, and afterwards, performance was way more impressive than expected, making it an even better choice for us.  Makes driving fun again.  If wanting either, highly recommend owning or at least test driving a BEV, before your next vehicle purchase.

 

With that, think I'm done with this thread, unless asked a specific question.  I think everything I could think of was covered in the thread.

 

Thanks for contributing, asking questions, and helping with my choice before owning, and along the way.

 

HAPPY MOTORING

 

Solar & EV info is why I joined the forum, so thanks for all the info and assistance with those.  Owning E-MB for 3 yrs, BEV for 2 years, w/Solar for 2 yrs, to compliment them.  Threads on each if interested.

 

PEACE OUT

I think the major  negatives are cost of ownership EV vs Petrol

2020 MG ZS 1.5 model D millage between 60K-80K prices on one2car range from B345K to B369K no next to nothing in depreciation from when you sold your car in 2022 at B400k

However the 2022 MG ZS EV model D has taken a huge hit in depreciation mainly from subsidy and price reductions

price before subsidy  1,189,000 baht

price after subsidy 949,000

Current price at dealers B599,000 for a brand new car

There is a MG 2022 model x millage 10K-15K advertised for B495K

depreciation and 100% increase in insurance costs + major reduction in Insurance capital value due to price reduction

I would have expect the inital price of EV insurance to have been substantially lower than ICEV on the basis that only 20 moving parts on EV compared to 2,000 on ICEV

but the killer is the EV battery which replacement costs are approx 70% of the total cost of the vehicle where compared to an ICEV there isn't a single component that costs 70% of the total cost of the vehicle

Viriyah Insurance

Mr. Surachai said that the number of EV insurance claims in the first quarter of 2024 grew by 100% compared to the first quarter of 2023. It is expected that the number of insurance claims in 2024 will grow by no less than 50% compared to 2023.

https://www.thairath.co.th/news/auto/evcar/2798462

 

[jacob29]

28 minutes ago, vinny41 said:

There is a MG 2022 model x millage 10K-15K advertised for B495K

depreciation and 100% increase in insurance costs

Your article says 100% increase in claims, not costs. EV sales increased by 900%, so they likely had more than 100% increase in policies as well.

[vinny41]

16 minutes ago, jacob29 said:

Your article says 100% increase in claims, not costs. EV sales increased by 900%, so they likely had more than 100% increase in policies as well.

Look foward to you providing a supporting link that EV sales have increased by 900%

You are correct the 100% increase in insurance premium  was incorrect it was 122% increase in Insurance  premium from B9k to B20K with a capital value reduction from B840K to B640K

as stated by the op here

 

[jacob29]

19 minutes ago, vinny41 said:

Look foward to you providing a supporting link that EV sales have increased by 900%

 

https://www.environmentenergyleader.com/stories/thailand-advances-in-the-race-for-electric-vehicle-dominance,48299

 

In 2023, EV sales in Thailand surged nearly eight-fold to 76,000 units, representing 12% of all vehicles sold

 

19 minutes ago, vinny41 said:

You are correct the 100% increase in insurance premium  was incorrect it was 122% increase in Insurance  premium from B9k to B20K with a capital value reduction from B840K to B640K

as stated by the op here

 

Sample size one.. are you being serious?

[KhunLA]

1 hour ago, vinny41 said:

I think the major  negatives are cost of ownership EV vs Petrol

2020 MG ZS 1.5 model D millage between 60K-80K prices on one2car range from B345K to B369K no next to nothing in depreciation from when you sold your car in 2022 at B400k

However the 2022 MG ZS EV model D has taken a huge hit in depreciation mainly from subsidy and price reductions

price before subsidy  1,189,000 baht

price after subsidy 949,000

Current price at dealers B599,000 for a brand new car

There is a MG 2022 model x millage 10K-15K advertised for B495K

depreciation and 100% increase in insurance costs + major reduction in Insurance capital value due to price reduction

I would have expect the inital price of EV insurance to have been substantially lower than ICEV on the basis that only 20 moving parts on EV compared to 2,000 on ICEV

but the killer is the EV battery which replacement costs are approx 70% of the total cost of the vehicle where compared to an ICEV there isn't a single component that costs 70% of the total cost of the vehicle

Viriyah Insurance

Mr. Surachai said that the number of EV insurance claims in the first quarter of 2024 grew by 100% compared to the first quarter of 2023. It is expected that the number of insurance claims in 2024 will grow by no less than 50% compared to 2023.

https://www.thairath.co.th/news/auto/evcar/2798462

 

You're not going to find one for 599k, as one poster tried locating.

 

So new price is 829k, and 2 yr old insured value is 590k = ~28% depreciation over 2 yrs.    Much better than our ICE version's depreciation, 695k & 400k = 42%.  But it was a buyer's market, especially where we live, and we were motivated sellers.   Probably could have easily got 450k for it or ~35% depreciation.

 

I'm going by real life experiences, and numbers that are real, new price vs insured value.  The 2nd hand advertised market means nothing to me.  MG marketing to get you in the showroom means nothing.  

 

Obviously, this is a unique time to buy vehicles, with the BEV price wars, and may go on for quite sometimes, since basically a new, emerging well priced, 'mass produced now', technology.   

 

Depreciation is only relevant to those selling after a few years vs people (us) planning on keeping till it dies or repurposed into the solar system.

 

Before coming to TH, I was a 'hold 'em' till they die vehicle owner.  First 3 POS new cars I bought here .. well ... you get what you pay for.  So very happy MG arrived as quite happy with both ZSs and price points compared other offerings.

 

Still just a machine to get from point A to B.  Though do enjoy the better performing and comfy ride over previous 3 POS, (Toyota & Mazda) we had before the ZSs.  Especially when O&A, exploring locally or beyond.

[vinny41]

11 minutes ago, jacob29 said:

 

https://www.environmentenergyleader.com/stories/thailand-advances-in-the-race-for-electric-vehicle-dominance,48299

 

In 2023, EV sales in Thailand surged nearly eight-fold to 76,000 units, representing 12% of all vehicles sold

 

 

Sample size one.. are you being serious?

Thailand EV sales in 2023 went up 684% vs 2022 

https://paultan.org/2024/01/09/thailand-ev-sales-in-2023-went-up-684-vs-2022-now-12-of-total-new-car-sales-byd-top-neta-second/

684% increase of ev sales between 2022 and 2023 not the 900% that you posted and still haven't provided a link to support that claim

There are plenty of facebook pages from various EV brands all stating that Insurance has doubled in insurance premium and that capital value has been reduced

[KhunLA]

39 minutes ago, vinny41 said:

Look foward to you providing a supporting link that EV sales have increased by 900%

You are correct the 100% increase in insurance premium  was incorrect it was 122% increase in Insurance  premium from B9k to B20K with a capital value reduction from B840K to B640K

as stated by the op here

 

Wife got back with Roojai, and first gal she talked to, which I posted about, gave wrong info.  Price is now ~14k, though insured value did drop to 590.  She was pricing as 2023 ZS.

 

Should also note, that the 9k previous year's price, was considerably lower than all the rest at the time, which was 20-22k for coverage.   Maybe they simply realized they priced it too low.   Good for us, that year anyway.

 

So now more in line with the rest, actually still 25ish % cheaper, as others still wanting 20k+/- for coverage.

 

Also closer to insurance prices for ICEV, if I remember, the ICE ZS was 12-13k for coverage (not Roojai), the last year we had it, and insured value less.  So depending on insurance carrier, prices will vary greatly.

 

Reality now, the 2 yr old BEV is about the same price for coverage/price, as the 2yr old ICE version was.  Another myth (higher insurance) busted. 

[vinny41]

19 minutes ago, KhunLA said:

You're not going to find one for 599k, as one poster tried locating.

 

So new price is 829k, and 2 yr old insured value is 590k = ~28% depreciation over 2 yrs.    Much better than our ICE version's depreciation, 695k & 400k = 42%.  But it was a buyer's market, especially where we live, and w were motivated sellers.   Probably could have easily got 450k for it or ~35% depreciation.

 

I'm going by real life experiences, and numbers that are real, new price vs insured value.  The 2nd hand advertised market means nothing to me.  MG marketing to get you in the showroom means nothing.  

 

Obviously, this is a unique time to buy vehicles, with the BEV price wars, and may go on for quite sometimes, since basically a new, emerging 'mass produced now', technology.   

 

Depreciation is only relevant to those selling after a few years vs people (us) planning on keeping till it dies or repurposed into the solar system.

 

Before coming to TH, I was a 'hold 'em' till they die vehicle owner.  First 3 POS new cars I bought here .. well ... you get what you pay for.  So very happy MG arrived as quite happy with both ZSs and price points compared other offerings.

 

Still just a machine to get from point A to B.  Though do enjoy the better performing and comfy ride over previous 3 POS, (Toyota & Mazda) we had before the ZSs.  Especially when O&A, exploring locally or beyond.

You not going to find a new one at B829 as MG reduced the price to B599K as they wanted to clear the remaining stock before the replacement model comes in next year

And you wife confirmed with your local MG dealer that the B599k price was valid while stocks last as you posted here

And you posted "The 599k & 699k advert is accurate, and available a MG dealer, while supplies last.  And if past sales #s are any indication, they have more than few sitting around."

 

 

[KhunLA]

1 minute ago, vinny41 said:

You not going to find a new one at B829 as MG reduced the price to B599K as they wanted to clear the remaining stock before the replacement model comes in next year

And you wife confirmed with your local MG dealer that the B599k price was valid while stocks last as you posted here

And you posted "The 599k & 699k advert is accurate, and available a MG dealer, while supplies last.  And if past sales #s are any indication, they have more than few sitting around."

 

 

2 months ago, so let's deal in the present.

 

Told wife, they have that price, 'till they run out of cars'.  She didn't ask, and nobody stated, if they actually had cars available. 

 

Just stated the avert was real.  Since they are still showing it, and no cars available, well .... nuff said.

[vinny41]

3 minutes ago, KhunLA said:

2 months ago, so let's deal in the present.

 

Told wife, they have that price, 'till they run out of cars'.  She didn't ask, and nobody stated, if they actually had cars available. 

 

Just stated the avert was real.  Since they are still showing it, and no cars available, well .... nuff said.

MG updated their website 1st October

https://www.mgcars.com/th/promotions/12

[vinny41]

First class car insurance BYD ATTO 3

This year, the car insurance of BYD ATTO 3 has increased significantly from the first year of its launch.  And many insurance companies have also 'delayed the warranty for electric cars', which has reduced the number of leading insurance companies quite a bit.

https://money.priceza.com/blog/car-insurance/byd-atto-3-price-insure-blog/

Thaivivat adjusts EV insurance premiums after the Office of Insurance Commission (OIC) gives the green light to adjust premiums by 50% according to risk...

https://www.prachachat.net/economy/news-1599485

[JBChiangRai]

I think there is an issue with how we consider depreciation of EV's.

 

A car (to take Vinny's example) that used to cost 1,189k and now costs 599k by comparing to a purchase cost of 1,189k will have depreciated massively.  But if we compare it to the new cost of 599k then it hasn't depreciated so much.

 

I think the moment a manufacturer slashes the price of their cars, all used examples take an extra hit of depreciation.

 

Is it fair to say EV's depreciate rapidly because of that?  aren't we taking an extraordinary event to make a generalised  conclusion?

 

I think manufacturers are finding their feet regarding pricing of EV's.  Particularly the Chinese who aren't slashing their prices to survive, they are simply adjusting them to what they should be, and especially with the price of batteries falling.

 

Chinese EV's are sold in China at a realistic price, nobody thinks they are dumping product there, yet their cars are much cheaper there than Thailand which IMHO should be harmonised to that price structure.  There is no valid reason they should cost so much more here.

 

I think they entered the Thai market thinking they could make a quick killing and now that they have competition, ( mostly from each other) they are stabilising to real price and real value.

 

The big issue I think, is if China can build and sell quality EV's in China to a price, why can't the rest of the world even get remotely close to that?

 

Competition is great for the consumer, it pushes price down and quality up.

[KhunLA]

3 hours ago, richard_smith237 said:

 

There are a couple of negatives...   but they are not show stoppers.

 

1) There is the need for numerous different EV charging Apps ( I think about 8 in total )

... some of which requires money pre-loaded into in-app wallets.

 

2) When 'charging' at a shopping mall.

- its great if you can get a slower Type 2 AC charger that will gently top up the charge over a few hours (2-3-4 hrs etc)

- But, if you get a CCS2 DC charger that will top up the car in 20-30mins, then you have to go back and exit the charging bay and park elsewhere (which of course adds a further element of inconvenience).

That's a bit overstated.  You can download as many apps as you like.  We use 3 apps, MG, PEA & EV Station Pluz.   Only use when O&A. Many don't require 'in app wallets'.

 

Would imagine some people don't use any apps, if not going O&A in their BEV.

 

Same applies at the mall.  Have never charged at the mall.  Did pop in once to use, good photo opt, but slow chargers, so didn't bother.  

 

At the mall, nobody is forced to use fast charging cables, as AC cables are available.

 

Usually charge while taking a short stroll, a P, and having a munch, and fast charging cables always available, as no desire to use a slow one.

 

Never a negative, so far, charging away from home.  Once one was inop, so just popped down to the next one, about 12 kms away, I think.

 

[jacob29]

34 minutes ago, vinny41 said:

684% increase of ev sales between 2022 and 2023 not the 900% that you posted and still haven't provided a link to support that claim

What practical difference does it make whether it's 700% or 900%?  It's a number massively higher than 100%, which is the point being made. It's my poor math converting 8x to 900% when it should have been 700%.

 

If there are lots of links showing 100% increases in premiums, maybe you should post those instead of an article that talks about the volume of claims.