Thai Expert Explains High Electricity Bills in Thailand

[MJCM]

49 minutes ago, nchuckle said:

Are you calling him a lyre…?

I had to look up what that means

 

Quote

The lyre (/ˈlaɪər/) is a stringed musical instrument that is classified by Hornbostel–Sachs as a member of the lute-family of instruments.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lyre

Edited May 1, 2023 by MJCM

[GameMaster]

Title is missing a word.

Should read: "Thai Expert Bullpooper Explains..."

 

Edited May 1, 2023 by GameMaster

[tandor]

4 hours ago, Dellboy218 said:

A lot of that is contracted to China, I spent my last 5 working years running from Karratha to China.  I believe Thailand imports some from Malaysia and the Mid East

..thnx

[racket]

My electric bill came at 2950 baht for the month of April. Last year, I didn’t pay more than 1200 baht per month. 

[Chongalulu]

1 hour ago, chilli42 said:

Well I was thinking more along the lines that electricity prices are managed and don’t reflect global commodity pricing.  That door swings both ways … electric prices were reduced during Covid but now over priced relative to LNG prices

Global Energy prices always in the end are reflected in utility bills .notwithstanding any governmental subsidies (like France ) or taxes distorting that. And It isn’t just LNG prices ,which Europe for example imported very little of given their reliance on  Nordstream pipelines  pumping actual gas from Russia supplying nearly all of their needs. 

[sambum]

3 hours ago, Karma80 said:

Prices are going up because someone sees the opportunity to make money. And most people will nod and say - oh yeah, the war, inflation and stuff. A reality check - corporate profits are the leading cause of inflation globally, including the profitability of quasi-state operations.

I saw a couple of months ago in a UK newspaper that BP had just announced record profits, and the customers are paying record increases in fuel bills! Something wrong somewhere!

[sambum]

1 minute ago, barefootbangkok said:

I suppose that you're not interested in hearing both sides of the story.  I wonder why it is that when there is a fight between one foreigner and a Thai, it always turns into 10 against 1.  There is rarely a fair fight in Thailand.  

Let's see if the Finnish man's side of the story gets shared.  Highly doubtful!!!

Are we on the right thread here? I fail to see what a supposed fight between a Finnish man and a Thai(s) have to do with high electricity prices!!!

[vinci]

I don't mind the increase but how do you justify double the price, we foreigner will pay the price cause we can do nothing, but I'm telling you the Thai are piss as !!!!, that's their hard earning money you're robbing. 

[John Drake]

8 hours ago, sidneybear said:

Perhaps Thailand should build nuclear power stations?

Nooooooo!

[jacko45k]

5 hours ago, sambum said:

So am I reading this right? Consumers have to pay private power companies for excess reserve power even though they are not using it? 

I expect it gets built into the costs and price They need to have generation capacity on the grid ready to rise or fall as demand moves. Along with generation capacity available to be started up for peak times. Some sources take an half hour to be ready to generate and far longer to get up to peak capacity. 

[Dart12]

ahh. I see why the uproar.  They jacked mine double this month...No extra usage.

[AustinRacing]

I hope he’s not expecting the Nobel prize for Economics this year. Stating the obvious. 

[Dazinoz]

8 minutes ago, Dart12 said:

ahh. I see why the uproar.  They jacked mine double this month...No extra usage.

Really find it hard to see how your bill doubled with no extra usage.

 

My bill doubled almost to the baht but my usage went fro 268 to 440 units which is 1.64 times usage to last bill.

 

Also the discount on the last bill was 180 baht which has been removed from this bill. I think a lot of people overlook that the discount was removed.

[sambum]

26 minutes ago, jacko45k said:

I expect it gets built into the costs and price They need to have generation capacity on the grid ready to rise or fall as demand moves. Along with generation capacity available to be started up for peak times. Some sources take an half hour to be ready to generate and far longer to get up to peak capacity. 

I see your point, and I am sure you are correct in what you say in your first sentence. 

It's a bit like having an insurance policy that you might never make a claim on, but still have to pay the premium - and goes up every year, whether you make a claim or not!

[BritScot]

A lot of profiteering going on around the world using Ukraine as the excuse.  I spoke to a butcher recently who has stopped selling Lamb altogether and also pork fillet due to the cost he would have to charge. In weeks he has seen massive rises in his costs. He also said European farmers were holding onto their animals to force the prices up. Here in the uk the official inflation is only 10% and that I say is a lie as I've seen prices jump 50% in the shops and also down sizing going on. My shopping has gone from £70 to an average of £125 a trip. A meal yesterday that would have cost me £70 at our favorite restaurant cost me £110 (we are very much creatires of habit and eat our favourite dishes when we go there so it is very much a comparison). 

[xtrnuno41]

Electricity made by private companies.

Yes they make a fortune, as fossil fuels rises, so is electricity.

And with solar panels you have "free" electricity, selling at higher prices.

Investment is low, due to cost of solar panel and profit rises with the Ukraine war, as fossil fuels sky rocket. Same happens in "my" country, not with solar panels but windturbines. Government is now looking into it????, to have more tax on the bigger profits they make. 

Also the climate change train is effecting, pay more and more for you to get less. Forcing you to use less.

Why you think there is alcohol in the petrol? They do so and what happens, food is getting more expensive, as the alcohol is made of the food, we eat daily.

If i was Thailand, i would forget about rubber trees and have more sugarcane.

Of course not burning it for easy cutting, but cutting machines to do so.

 

SO when is Thailand starting, to make hydrogen with the solar panels? 

you can store it and use it in hydrogen fueled power plants.

Handy if the sun doesnt shine.

Ill bet they just wait on private companies again and big brown envelopes.

 

I wonder if they red my comment of using solar panels on water (to prevent evaporation of water at the same time) made it years ago.

See if now hydrogen making is now also starting. 

[billd766]

13 hours ago, sidneybear said:

It's the same everywhere. As it says in the article, the Ukraine war has caused large increases in fuel prices, which are set internationally. Perhaps Thailand should build nuclear power stations? ????

Should they put one in your back garden, or are you a nimby?

 

And where will they build these nuclear power stations? Who will pay for them and they don't come cheap in money or time.

 

It will probably be the customers in the end through even higher electricity bills.

Edited May 1, 2023 by billd766
added extra text

[billd766]

9 hours ago, sambum said:

The way I read the article is that these private  companies are charging the consumer to store the product, even though it is not being used!!! 

The way I understand it is that the private companies are selling to EGAT at a high cost on a 25 year contract, and the only way for EGAT to get its money back is to charge the ordinary customers more.

[TimeMachine]

12 hours ago, Freddy42OZ said:

 

Did you bother to research Thailand's solar energy plans or anything?   

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Solar_power_in_Thailand

https://www.pv-magazine.com/2022/10/31/thailand-introduces-fit-scheme-for-solar-storage/

 

An article in a newspaper is one thing. Seeing solar panels on houses across the country is another. I don't think solar power to the masses will be allowed for the masses anytime soon. The products are not plentiful and are overpriced. 

[connda]

19 hours ago, Bim Smith said:

If the last three years have taught me anything is that as soon as the word "expert" is mentioned I switched off.

Me too.

[it is what it is]

 

don't need an expert to explain this, it's pretty obvious to anyone following current affairs, domestic/international news

[sidneybear]

8 hours ago, billd766 said:

Should they put one in your back garden, or are you a nimby?

 

And where will they build these nuclear power stations? Who will pay for them and they don't come cheap in money or time.

 

It will probably be the customers in the end through even higher electricity bills.

In Eastern England, I used to live not far from Sizewell, and several US air bases which were targets in the Cold War, and was never worried. Our chances of dying in other ways are so very much higher. 

 

The prices of building and operating them are coming down too, with modern modular designs.

 

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Small_modular_reactor#:~:text=Small modular reactors (SMRs) are,operated at a separate site.

[jacko45k]

13 hours ago, BritScot said:

(we are very much creatires of habit and eat our favourite dishes when we go there so it is very much a comparison). 

Well in Pattaya too. As you say creatures of habit and my bills crossed the 1000 baht line a few months back.... and not by baby steps. 

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

Yesterday, I got our electric bill from our landlord for the past month. It was DOUBLE what  our normal, typical bill would be.

 

Admittedly, we ran the AC a lot last month because of the searing heat, which seemed like one of the worst heat spells I've seen in Thailand, both in terms of length and the peaks of high temperatures.

 

And, on top of that, because the Bangkok air quality was terrible for most of that same period due to agricultural burning, we also were running our HEPA air purifiers almost constantly on high during the same period.

 

All of that made for a rather unpleasant month, and a rather unpleasant surprise when the latest electric bill arrived!

 

[metisdead]

A post with an unattributed chart has been removed as there was no link provided to the source of information. 

 

A post with a trolling meme and the replies have been removed.

[billd766]

9 hours ago, sidneybear said:

In Eastern England, I used to live not far from Sizewell, and several US air bases which were targets in the Cold War, and was never worried. Our chances of dying in other ways are so very much higher. 

 

The prices of building and operating them are coming down too, with modern modular designs.

 

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Small_modular_reactor#:~:text=Small modular reactors (SMRs) are,operated at a separate site.

But eastern England is not Thailand which is where people seem to thing nuclear power is needed.

 

I was also in eastern England in the RAF during the cold war which means nothing anymore.

 

The best cost estimate I have found so far is this one.

 

cost of a 2000 mw nuclear power station. thailand

 

Advanced nuclear reactors are estimated to cost $5,366 for every kilowatt of capacity. That means a large 1-gigawatt reactor would cost around $5.4 billion to build, excluding financing costs.

 

A 2000 MW nuclear power station using those figures would cost around 1 billion $USD,  or a minimum of 34 billion baht, excluding financing costs.

 

Then you would have to find sitewhere to site it where people would not object too much and hook it into the national grid. AFAIR all power stations need a constant water supply for cooling so it needs to be by the sea or by a river that won't run dry.

 

How long it would take to build is outside of my skill set but probably 10 years start to finish is my guess.

 

In the meantime Thailand already has a 36% electrical generating capacity and more will come on line when the Laos dams are completed (with mostly Thai funding).

[sidneybear]

6 hours ago, billd766 said:

But eastern England is not Thailand which is where people seem to thing nuclear power is needed.

 

I was also in eastern England in the RAF during the cold war which means nothing anymore.

 

The best cost estimate I have found so far is this one.

 

cost of a 2000 mw nuclear power station. thailand

 

Advanced nuclear reactors are estimated to cost $5,366 for every kilowatt of capacity. That means a large 1-gigawatt reactor would cost around $5.4 billion to build, excluding financing costs.

 

A 2000 MW nuclear power station using those figures would cost around 1 billion $USD,  or a minimum of 34 billion baht, excluding financing costs.

 

Then you would have to find sitewhere to site it where people would not object too much and hook it into the national grid. AFAIR all power stations need a constant water supply for cooling so it needs to be by the sea or by a river that won't run dry.

 

How long it would take to build is outside of my skill set but probably 10 years start to finish is my guess.

 

In the meantime Thailand already has a 36% electrical generating capacity and more will come on line when the Laos dams are completed (with mostly Thai funding).

I'm not disputing what you say about traditional nuclear technology, although if 1 GW capacity costs 5.4 billion, then wouldn't a 2,000MW plant (=2GW) cost 10.8 billion instead of 1 billion? In any case, the cost to build is only part of the equation, you'd also need to factor in the operating cost over the lifetime of the reactor to arrive at an overall cost per MWh of electricity generated, and then take into consideration the potential of future carbon pricing and the like. Recent advances like small nuclear reactors, that are serviced in a central location, and the like, are also worth looking at.

 

Nuclear is reliable, produces no CO2, and doesn't require flooding vast expanses of land in Laos. It also means that Thailand wouldn't be beholden to Laos for its electricity supply, given the vicissitudes of geopolitics.  

 

Edited May 2, 2023 by Pink Mist
Off topic section removed

[sambum]

19 hours ago, billd766 said:

The way I understand it is that the private companies are selling to EGAT at a high cost on a 25 year contract, and the only way for EGAT to get its money back is to charge the ordinary customers more.

I don't know who EGAT is (Damn abbreviations!) but reading between the lines, that wouldn't surprise me in the slightest! 

[kingoak]

I have been waiting since July last year to get PEA to connect my Solar Installation to the Grid. Really how long should it take to get this completed?? I am sure it would reduce the demand on the Grid but cant get any action even with the assistance of the Installer. One would think that they would be placing urgency on this to assist the grid but TIT.

[Dazinoz]

9 minutes ago, kingoak said:

I have been waiting since July last year to get PEA to connect my Solar Installation to the Grid. Really how long should it take to get this completed?? I am sure it would reduce the demand on the Grid but cant get any action even with the assistance of the Installer. One would think that they would be placing urgency on this to assist the grid but TIT.

How many Kw are you connecting? I had a 3kw system in Oz, helped a little but not much in the big scheme of things.

 

Since July is ridiculous. Have you thought they maybe busy connecting other grid tie systems? Hey, what am I saying? TiT.