Wifey's UK widows pension when i ''Pop me clogs''- Anyone have any knowledge/experiences ?

[billd766]

2 hours ago, Pumpuynarak said:

 

If her widows pension income exceeds the personal allowance currently £12570 pa she will pay income tax, that is what HMRC have told me. They also told me she will have to claim the personal allowance each year at the end of each year by completing form K43 and then receive a lump sum refund.

Thank you. I did not know that.

 

The pensions combined will not exceed the  current tax free allowance (unless that changes or is cancelled).

[Pumpuynarak]

1 hour ago, MartinL said:

 

Shouldn't that be R43?

 

Yes indeed it should be R43, my apologies.

[OJAS]

18 hours ago, billd766 said:

 

I/We have been assuming that she will receive the full 50% of each and pay no UK income tax.

 

Whilst this is, indeed, the case provided that the amounts involved do not total more than the UK personal allowance (currently £12,570) as already said, it would appear that her widow's pensions might, however, be deemed assessable income for Thailand taxation purposes, because of Article 19(2) of the UK/Thailand Double Taxation Agreement, which states:

 

(2) (a) Any pension paid by the Contracting State or a political subdivision or a local

authority thereof to any individual in respect of services of a governmental nature

rendered to that State or subdivision or local authority thereof shall be taxable

only in that State.

(b) However, such pension shall be taxable only in the other contracting State if

the recipient is a national of and a resident of that State.

 

But, given your subsequent statement that the amounts involved won't exceed the current UK personal allowance, she might not, in practice, have to pay any tax in Thailand either because of the various allowances and exemptions currently in force.

 

That all said, things could, of course, change at both UK and Thailand ends between now and when your wife claims her widow's pensions!

 

 

[billd766]

I went to this link https://www.gov.uk/guidance/claim-personal-allowances-and-tax-refunds-if-you-live-abroad

 

which is the link to HMRC form R43 and followed it along as far as I could and it seems as though my wife should be entitled to the UK tax free allowance, plus it looks as though she will not have to pay any income tax on my pensions at all.

[billd766]

18 minutes ago, OJAS said:

 

Whilst this is, indeed, the case provided that the amounts involved do not total more than the UK personal allowance (currently £12,570) as already said, it would appear that her widow's pensions might, however, be deemed assessable income for Thailand taxation purposes, because of Article 19(2) of the UK/Thailand Double Taxation Agreement, which states:

 

(2) (a) Any pension paid by the Contracting State or a political subdivision or a local

authority thereof to any individual in respect of services of a governmental nature

rendered to that State or subdivision or local authority thereof shall be taxable

only in that State.

(b) However, such pension shall be taxable only in the other contracting State if

the recipient is a national of and a resident of that State.

 

But, given your subsequent statement that the amounts involved won't exceed the current UK personal allowance, she might not, in practice, have to pay any tax in Thailand either because of the various allowances and exemptions currently in force.

 

That all said, things could, of course, change at both UK and Thailand ends between now and when your wife claims her widow's pensions!

 

 

However as a Thai national (she will be 60 in October) she will also be entitled to the standard 150,000 baht exempted income, and probably the age allowance of 190,000 baht.

[OJAS]

7 hours ago, Pumpuynarak said:

They also told me she will have to claim the personal allowance each year at the end of each year by completing form R43 and then receive a lump sum refund.

 

On the basis of section G it would appear that this refund would take the form of a GBP cheque which HMRC would then despatch to the beneficiary widow by snail mail. Another shining example of HMRC being really at the cutting edge of secure electronic technology, is it (not)?!! 

 

More seriously, though, is the note stating that "it’s sometimes not possible to cash British pound payments overseas" - which, I suspect, could be problematical here in Thailand. Would be nice, I think, if HMRC could proactively tell our widows how they would be able to receive their refunds instead.