Thai submarine to be powered by Chinese engine following German withdrawal

[webfact]

 

In a recent development, an American naval source revealed that a panel is expected to recommend a Chinese-designed engine for the Thai submarine as a replacement for the original German one intended for the under-construction S26T Yuan-class submarine in China.

 

This comes on the heels of a committee chaired by the navy’s chief-of-staff, Adm Chonlathis Navanugraha, unofficially proposing the use of the Chinese CHD620 engine as a possible stand-in for the German MTU 396 diesel engine. The panel believes the procurement of the Thai submarine aligns with the navy’s mission to fortify the country’s maritime interests.

 

However, it’s worth noting that the panel’s anticipation of the Chinese-made engine is pending its certification by the Chinese Defence Ministry.

Recently, said committee oversaw the testing of the Chinese-made power unit, clarifying that it wouldn’t be for the propulsion system of the Thai submarine. Instead, it’s meant for energy generation to recharge the batteries operating the submarine.

The Thai submarine procurement project has encountered some setbacks due to the Covid-19 pandemic, which has resulted in construction hold and engine issues. As a result, the submarine’s delivery to Thailand has been pushed back. 

 

by Mitch Connor 

Photo courtesy of Dorian Archus, Naval Post

 

#news

Full story: https://thethaiger.com/news/national/chinese-engine-expected-to-power-thai-submarine-following-german-withdrawal-2

 

-- © Copyright Thaiger 2023-07-10

 

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[Callmeishmael]

The CHD620 is a Deutz design made in China.  As long as the factory can meet the original specifications it should be the same as the German engine.

 

Of course, the real problem is not where the engine was made, it's why Thailand needs a sub at all.

[jacko45k]

1 minute ago, Callmeishmael said:

The CHD620 is a Deutz design made in China.  As long as the factory can meet the original specifications it should be the same as the German engine.

Let us hope so........ although I recall the company I worked for allowing some parts to be made in China that failed and forced some very expensive retrofits!

[ezzra]

Yeah buy a submarine while your people are languishing with poor, lacking, much needed health system improvements, but hey, we need a sub to protect us from imaginary, non existing enemies.

[stoner]

30 minutes ago, webfact said:

The Thai submarine procurement project has encountered some setbacks due to the Covid-19 pandemic, which has resulted in

the decimation of many thai lively hoods. but hey lets buy subs anyways. 

[2baht]

16 minutes ago, Callmeishmael said:

Of course, the real problem is not where the engine was made, it's why Thailand needs a sub at all.

To defend Chiang Mai! 

[h90]

32 minutes ago, Callmeishmael said:

The CHD620 is a Deutz design made in China.  As long as the factory can meet the original specifications it should be the same as the German engine.

 

Of course, the real problem is not where the engine was made, it's why Thailand needs a sub at all.

maybe because they have a long coast line?

[h90]

16 minutes ago, stoner said:

the decimation of many thai lively hoods. but hey lets buy subs anyways. 

I would not connect that.....beside that it is the same government who destroyed the small and medium companies that want to purchase the subs.

But I can not see a connection

[stoner]

3 minutes ago, h90 said:

I would not connect that.....beside that it is the same government who destroyed the small and medium companies that want to purchase the subs.

But I can not see a connection

use sub money to help thai. who cares about chinese companies. my heart has very little emotion for communism. 

[watchcat]

37 minutes ago, Callmeishmael said:

Of course, the real problem is not where the engine was made, it's why Thailand needs a sub at all.

Back handers/brown envelopes ?

[inactiveposter]

“Exciting” update? Are you reporting or editorializing?

[h90]

41 minutes ago, stoner said:

use sub money to help thai. who cares about chinese companies. my heart has very little emotion for communism. 

handing out money is a bit in the direction of communism.....It would better to lower or abolish the taxes for the poor as the first step.

As second improve education....best with free technical schools...but that need decades to show results. Taxes would help immediately.

 

[Gsxrnz]

Their submarine base at Sattahip is currently vacant.

 

They desperately need to have one of the parking bays occupied to justify the construction of the base, and the ongoing graft expenses of the sans submarine, Submarine Squadron of the Royal Thai Navy.

 

It requires a lot of staff and a huge budget to do absolutely nothing except write a quarterly press release saying there are no further developments.  Jeez, if they were gifted a free submarine, serious panic would ensue.

 

 

 

 

 

[h90]

1 hour ago, ezzra said:

Yeah buy a submarine while your people are languishing with poor, lacking, much needed health system improvements, but hey, we need a sub to protect us from imaginary, non existing enemies.

Thailand almost had a war with Cambodia a few years ago. There is a lot tension at the Myanmar border and the new government want to openly support the rebels which in turn will make the Myanmar government hostile to Thailand.

So investing in defense makes sense.

But the health system is of course complete rotten....Thailand need both and could easily save money at the bureaucracy. Thailand has 76 states with all having a governor and the full pyramid of staff that does nothing.

Like Samut Songkhram has 190.000 people and it split again into 3 districts.....what a waste of money

[WHansen]

Two birds with one stone...

Please the Chinese puppet master and get handsomely rewarded for accepting an alternative, contrary to the original contract

[Henryford]

1 hour ago, ezzra said:

Yeah buy a submarine while your people are languishing with poor, lacking, much needed health system improvements, but hey, we need a sub to protect us from imaginary, non existing enemies.

They have a very big enemy on their doorstep looking to take over all of SE Asia, but one sub won't stop them.

Edited July 10, 2023 by Henryford

[herfiehandbag]

53 minutes ago, h90 said:

maybe because they have a long coast line?

Most of which is in waters to shallow for submarines to operate effectively.

 

The bit which is deep enough for submarines to operate effectively can only be reached from the projected base by sailing down the Gulf of Thailand, around Singapore and through the Malacca Straits, which are amongst the most heavily monitored waters ( in the naval and submarine sense) in the world.

 

There is no military justification or role for a submarine fleet for Thailand. There is no surface naval threat posed by any of the country's neighbours, which would require a submarine to counter.

 

It is purely a source of "backhanders" to the naval procurement system. It is a budget, to be managed and disbursed  With control of a budget comes real power and influence. The Navy has been rather left behind in this respect since they broke all the aeroplanes for their carrier!

[Purdey]

Just fit the sub with pedals the crew can use to recharge the batteries.

You're welcome Thailand. 

[stoner]

33 minutes ago, h90 said:

handing out money is a bit in the direction of communism

oh at home we called them social services. 

 

you know things like buses and trains, infrastructure, hospital and health care, education. things like that. 

 

if that is communism sign me up NOW.

[h90]

17 minutes ago, herfiehandbag said:

Most of which is in waters to shallow for submarines to operate effectively.

 

The bit which is deep enough for submarines to operate effectively can only be reached from the projected base by sailing down the Gulf of Thailand, around Singapore and through the Malacca Straits, which are amongst the most heavily monitored waters ( in the naval and submarine sense) in the world.

 

There is no military justification or role for a submarine fleet for Thailand. There is no surface naval threat posed by any of the country's neighbours, which would require a submarine to counter.

 

It is purely a source of "backhanders" to the naval procurement system. It is a budget, to be managed and disbursed  With control of a budget comes real power and influence. The Navy has been rather left behind in this respect since they broke all the aeroplanes for their carrier!

yes submarines in the gulf is really strange. But I am no military expert. Yes the carrier It could rescue tourists from Koh Samui in 2011, so it is not useless

[h90]

1 minute ago, stoner said:

oh at home we called them social services. 

 

you know things like buses and trains, infrastructure, hospital and health care, education. things like that. 

 

if that is communism sign me up NOW.

buses, trains and infrastructure are used to pay for themself and should not cost tax.

I agree to education....

health care is a difficult topic but in general I agree...Most west has a state insurance which is supposed to pay for it...but I agree that is state/tax.

But you are speaking about robbing the people with taxes and than handing out money. It would be better to cancel taxes for the poor and finance the few things the country need to do (education) from import taxes and taxes for the more wealthy.

[stoner]

1 minute ago, h90 said:

buses, trains and infrastructure are used to pay for themself and should not cost tax.

but they do cost tax...in almost every western country they are subsidized. 

 

1 minute ago, h90 said:

But you are speaking about robbing the people with taxes and than handing out money

no i'm not. i am saying don't spend millions on subs. rather spend it on things thai can actually benefit from. 

[MikeandDow]

34 minutes ago, h90 said:

Thailand almost had a war with Cambodia a few years ago. There is a lot tension at the Myanmar border and the new government want to openly support the rebels which in turn will make the Myanmar government hostile to Thailand.

So investing in defense makes sense.

But the health system is of course complete rotten....Thailand need both and could easily save money at the bureaucracy. Thailand has 76 states with all having a governor and the full pyramid of staff that does nothing.

Like Samut Songkhram has 190.000 people and it split again into 3 districts.....what a waste of money

God!!!! this is utter rubbish!!!!! For 1 Thailand does not have "states"

[h90]

5 minutes ago, MikeandDow said:

God!!!! this is utter rubbish!!!!! For 1 Thailand does not have "states"

call it provinces or call it however you want....does not change anything on the argument

[h90]

9 minutes ago, stoner said:

but they do cost tax...in almost every western country they are subsidized. 

 

no i'm not. i am saying don't spend millions on subs. rather spend it on things thai can actually benefit from. 

OK...maybe we even agree finally.....

I would rather save the money and reduce taxes than spending it, but that is a minor detail. No military export but subs in the flat gulf does not seem too great.....

[jaideedave]

2 hours ago, jacko45k said:

Let us hope so........ although I recall the company I worked for allowing some parts to be made in China that failed and forced some very expensive retrofits!

Several years ago I worked briefly for a US based O&G company north of Udon.They contracted a Thai driling company for a workover job.They used copied GM diesels (read China) You would not believe the amount of lube oil that leaked from these engines from any place there was a gasket.The clean up was a huge job.They had to find sawdust to help soak it up and placed it in barrels. 

 

[MikeandDow]

2 minutes ago, jaideedave said:

Several years ago I worked briefly for a US based O&G company north of Udon.They contracted a Thai driling company for a workover job.They used copied GM diesels (read China) You would not believe the amount of lube oil that leaked from these engines from any place there was a gasket.The clean up was a huge job.They had to find sawdust to help soak it up and placed it in barrels. 

 

Totally agree,  Chinese quality is very poor,  like stepping back into the 1940"s

[Robin]

Remember to close all hatches before leaving port

[jaideedave]

50 minutes ago, herfiehandbag said:

Most of which is in waters to shallow for submarines to operate effectively.

 

The bit which is deep enough for submarines to operate effectively can only be reached from the projected base by sailing down the Gulf of Thailand, around Singapore and through the Malacca Straits, which are amongst the most heavily monitored waters ( in the naval and submarine sense) in the world.

 

There is no military justification or role for a submarine fleet for Thailand. There is no surface naval threat posed by any of the country's neighbours, which would require a submarine to counter.

 

It is purely a source of "backhanders" to the naval procurement system. It is a budget, to be managed and disbursed  With control of a budget comes real power and influence. The Navy has been rather left behind in this respect since they broke all the aeroplanes for their carrier!

Correct herfie,The average depth of the gulf is 190 ft. I served 4 years on a diesel,electric sub that was 312 ft long.End on it would stick out of the water here by 120 ft.lol. The Yuan is about 250 ft.At least if it sank in the gulf the men could just pop open a hatch and swim to the surface. We trained for that at Ford Island sub base in Hawaii.

FYI: I was at Queen Sirikit Naval hospital last year and noticed a couple Thai officers in uniform with submarine badges. What's that all about?

 

 

[rbkk]

Quick, before the MFP get here.....