Despite Washington’s confidence, US war with Iran would be disastrous

[Hawaiian]

On 12/11/2023 at 4:20 PM, placnx said:

The way things are now, the Taiwan operation would be over before the international community has time to have a meeting. SE Asia is not about to have a war with China.

 

I agree that the BRI (Belt & Road Initiative) is faltering, but the bad economic situation in China might incentivize Xi to create a distracting "win", the take over of Taiwan, similar to Putin's takeover of Crimea in 2014. There are elections in Taiwan next month, but Xi might wait until after the US election to see whether Trump wins. Taiwan is woefully ill prepared for a CHinese attack, and it will take the US many years to upgrade its navy and increase production capacity of advanced weapons.

 

 

Is Xi beginning to have second thoughts about Chinese aggression in the South China Sea and his continual threats against Taiwan?  It seem kissing up to Biden and his recent courting of Vietnam are signs that Chinese belligerence is not having the results he had hoped for.  And now that the U.S. has openly displayed support for the Philippines against Chinese moves in the West Philippine Sea will China continue their bullying tactics?  Perhaps invading Taiwan is beginning to sound like a bad idea.

[Morch]

5 minutes ago, thaibeachlovers said:

Thank you for correcting me on that. I had forgotten the 1973 war, and was not aware that there was any air combat involved in 1982, but I see there was some activity against the Syrian airforce, but the Syrians were apparently useless ( not unexpectedly ), and didn't put up much of a show.

 

However, though I was wrong on those cases, my point is still valid. It's been 30 years since 1982, and probably none of those pilots will still be flying in combat, even if not retired.

 

 

 

@thaibeachlovers

 

Air superiority operations, top gun style are sexier, but when it comes down to it, they are just a prelude to what an air force is really for - air-to-ground and ground-support operations.

 

With regard to the example you highlighted, the air superiority element exemplifies comments made before about training, mentality and freedom afforded for pilots. Being restricted in terms of training, tactics and command didn't help the Syrians - and I think these are issues relevant to the Chinese example as well. The air-to-ground part is/was considered textbook example of how to effectively dismantle a multi-layered air defense system, innovative as far as tactics and some of the gear used. 

 

Since then, Israel carried out hundreds of air raids on targets in neighboring hostile countries. Several more broad scale altercations included. That's way more battle experience than most air forces possess.

[Hawaiian]

30 minutes ago, DeaconJohn said:

 

The simple premise of this topic was responded to concisely and convincingly by these rwo posts.

Yet it quickly degenerated into a troll-fest with pro-war gasbags and Zionist  meshugas  pushing their agendas.

A diarrhea of words and a constipation of useful ideas as to how the USA can effectively change course for the better.

We've tried to be the world's policeman for long enough. The results have been catastrophic for everybody including ourselves.

It's time we put our own house in order before "nation-building" in other parts of the world.

Agree, Western style democracy is not for everyone.  What is your explanation why are so many breaking their necks to get in the police headquarters.

[sirineou]

14 minutes ago, Hawaiian said:

Agree, Western style democracy is not for everyone.  What is your explanation why are so many breaking their necks to get in the police headquarters.

It's the only safe place from the cops?

(if you cant beat them , join them)

Edited December 13, 2023 by sirineou

[Presnock]

On 12/4/2023 at 2:10 PM, billd766 said:

Will YOU be the first to volunteer to go to a war that nobody wants, and put YOUR body in harms way?

 

Or are you happy enough to be a keyboard warrior and let others stop the bullets instead of you?

When I left high school in '64, joined the military in June, then Gulf of Tonkin, so instead of computers which

I didn't have an idea what they were, the military decided I would be a Vietnamese Linguist and I spent most of 3 years 

in that area including 2 within VN 66-69.  When the country called, I went without a complaint.  Would do it again if I

thought it would make a difference and that the military wouldn't be ignored by the politicians, most of them have

never been anywhere near combat nor do they plan to do it themselves.  Other high ranking politicians let their children

join the military but keep them away from the bad areas.

[Hawaiian]

35 minutes ago, sirineou said:

It's the only safe place from the cops?

(if you cant beat them , join them)

Funny, but quite apropos.

[billd766]

8 minutes ago, Presnock said:

When I left high school in '64, joined the military in June, then Gulf of Tonkin, so instead of computers which

I didn't have an idea what they were, the military decided I would be a Vietnamese Linguist and I spent most of 3 years 

in that area including 2 within VN 66-69.  When the country called, I went without a complaint.  Would do it again if I

thought it would make a difference and that the military wouldn't be ignored by the politicians, most of them have

never been anywhere near combat nor do they plan to do it themselves.  Other high ranking politicians let their children

join the military but keep them away from the bad areas.

I know how you feel having spent 25 years in the RAF as an aircraft radio fitter.

 

Luckily I was never sent to any active service post. The guys who taught us rifle drill and the annual range firing suggested that if it came to an actual war, the best thing I could do would be to give all my ammunition to my mates, then beat the Russians to death with my rifle.

 

On a 25 yard rifle range, if I managed to hit the target it was more by luck than judgement.

[Hawaiian]

28 minutes ago, Presnock said:

When I left high school in '64, joined the military in June, then Gulf of Tonkin, so instead of computers which

I didn't have an idea what they were, the military decided I would be a Vietnamese Linguist and I spent most of 3 years 

in that area including 2 within VN 66-69.  When the country called, I went without a complaint.  Would do it again if I

thought it would make a difference and that the military wouldn't be ignored by the politicians, most of them have

never been anywhere near combat nor do they plan to do it themselves.  Other high ranking politicians let their children

join the military but keep them away from the bad areas.

When I first reported aboard ship in 1958 my intent was to be a cook.  The operations officer had other ideas.  He had me assigned to the radio shack.  At first I wasn't happy, but he asked me to try for another month.  When the ops officer spoke with me 30 days later, I told him I would stay and promised not to disappoint him.  And I didn't.  I took the advancement exam for 3rd class radioman petty officer along with the other 4 guys in our radio gang who were graduates of the Navy's class A radioman school. With only on the job training I passed with the rest of them. 

Long story, short.  I retired after 23 years of service.

Personally, I feel that the U.S. should have compulsory military service of at least two years or some other worthwhile public service.  I never regretted my time in the military.  I believe it helps to build character and opens the door to many opportunities.

There are educational programs that helps those with limited financial resources.  The military has some of the finest schools in the country.

 

Edited December 13, 2023 by Hawaiian
Correction

[thaibeachlovers]

14 hours ago, Hawaiian said:

Personally, I feel that the U.S. should have compulsory military service of at least two years or some other worthwhile public service. 

Singapore did that for it's multi ethnicity population with good results.

NZ had National service but not for all, and gave it up decades ago.

I'm for it, but I doubt most that went through it would agree. They did it in the coldest and most boring camp it would be possible to find anywhere in NZ. I was actually called up for NS, but I had joined the military already, so avoided that unfortunate situation!

[thaibeachlovers]

14 hours ago, billd766 said:

Luckily I was never sent to any active service post. The guys who taught us rifle drill and the annual range firing suggested that if it came to an actual war, the best thing I could do would be to give all my ammunition to my mates, then beat the Russians to death with my rifle.

 

On a 25 yard rifle range, if I managed to hit the target it was more by luck than judgement.

LOL.

 

I managed to become a shooting coach, so I was able to hit the target. I also used to fire on the 800 yard range in my own time.

I preferred the SLR as that definitely put an enemy down if hit, whereas the M16 was less certain of that. However, I definitely preferred the weight of the plastic M16 to the solid and heavy SLR.

[thaibeachlovers]

15 hours ago, Hawaiian said:

What is your explanation why are so many breaking their necks to get in the police headquarters.

Their home country is a <deleted><deleted> and they grew up thinking that the streets of the US were paved in gold.

I guess most were disappointed after paying criminals to get there, even if able to stay.