Relationship advice

[Elkski]

I never once suspected I was talking to a guy on a dating site. I used the 2 main sites in 2016-2018.   I've read that bar girls started using social media during covid.  Especially the attractive and fit ones. It did seem true and permanent based on what I observed on soi cowboy in 23'.  I can see how they didnt need the bar to take a big cut. 

I briefly tried tinder but I wasnt just looking for a hook-up in a few hours. I preferred time to weed out the "pro"  sex workers.  I do think 2 slipped through but they lost out playing the long game with me. Playing with the long game ones or genuine gals, at most cost a dinner and maybe cab fare.  Or at best dinner then early bounce to another before the promised afternoon necessity and gas tank filling date. 

I met many mature, quality women over 50, a couple under, who didnt drink  much if at all, non smoking, good career women.  Nurses , teachers, director, loan shark, high placed government workers in finance office and health department.  Was I naive to believe the ones with kids told me that I was  only the 2nd man? I actually kept in touch with many for a long time in direct conversation or social media and some eventually found a less demanding foreigner,  and I still believe them.  Some conversed faithfully with 1 man for a long time before he came to visit.  Many Thai women have 1 man  mindsets and most i fitvto know are very giod people. Although the quality of education even with advanced degrees is striking. 

Many had property, house(s), car, good jobs, sought after government jobs.  Government workers can retire and get a lifelong salary.  The calculation was 50/ years service X current compensation. So 50% of working salary possible by late 40s.   I met several at or near 50% retirement.  Many I met did have debt.  Be sure to ask them point blank early on about debt.   Dont expect an honest answer but it gives you an immediate out in the future if you ever find the truth you dont like .   Its true they think falang have endless money. 

 

#1  see a doctor about your low libido ASAP so you can enjoy things fully.  Its normal for a man's sex drive to be strong into his 90s.

I have to say  any gal I chatted with for long or  a few in the first 20 mins, it turned sexual.  If there is chemistry it is just natural.  Before I would travel from USA or pay for their flight to visit I think uts prudent to see all the goods on video.  If they hide anything its a big red flag.  

Edited January 3 by Elkski

[Jimjim1]

14 hours ago, BigStar said:

Most members here seemingly know only uneducated lower class Thais, and many of those women used to work in bars or massage parlors.

You speak for yourself as I and I suspect many others in here have never been with a bargirl or ever been in a massage parlour nor would I and probably them ever dream of it, my experiences have all come from meeting and making great Thai friends over the last 27 years most of whom are working in highly responsible jobs such as banks, other financial institutions, management positions in the likes of Robinson, and many who run there own very successful businesses, all of them highly respected positions in high end companies, and non of them would ever prostitute themselves.

 

whilst we are on the subject and as you ignorantly put it “ most members here seemingly know only uneducated lower class Thais “ ) I have known a great many who desperately wanted to learn and did all they could at school but were grossly let down by a failed education system overseen by so called teachers and administrators who consider themselves to be educated and beyond reproach, these poor students who may well have come from the villages have come from good solid families and although victims of circumstance have maintained there own personal high standards continuing there lives with true honesty and integrity.

How dare you have the gall to insult me, the members here and the vast majority of Thais with your jaded views, I am so glad that I do not live under your particular cloud.

[BigStar]

1 hour ago, Jimjim1 said:

You speak for yourself as I and I suspect many others in here have never been with a bargirl or ever been in a massage parlour

 

So, you have a "suspicion," and I disagree with that suspicion, based on reading and posting in the forum for many years. Wth your meager 259 posts, you seem, understandably, rather naive about the membership. Still, I said "seemingly." Much of the cynical advice here does seem to arise just as I suggested.

 

My own long-term gf is educated (two degrees), middle class, former office manager, now owner of her own company. I've never paid her any "salary" at all--a fact that created much incredulity here in another recent thread. There she was accused of "playing the long game" scheming to get my assets eventually. Laughable.

 

So I suggested the OP give the lady in question benefit of doubt. Meanwhile, we've already one suggestion of what the going rate for her would like be per f**k. Note I also defended her against the implication of her freelancing owing to her membership in Tinder.

 

1 hour ago, Jimjim1 said:

victims of circumstance have maintained there own personal high standards continuing there lives with true honesty and integrity.

 

True, and so I pointed out to the OP that Thais are individuals. I've agreed elsewhere that relationships w/ bar girls etc. can be successful. Unquestionably true. I've known a few.

 

1 hour ago, Jimjim1 said:

How dare you have the gall to insult me, the members here and the vast majority of Thais with your jaded views,

 

Yawn. You protest way too much, m'lady, and are just so eager to imagine yourself in the category of the "many" I spoke of--for some reason, perhaps just out of obligatory victimism. Of course, I totally agree re: the vast majority of Thais and so suggested the OP judge his new lady as an individual, not according to the stereotypes promulgated here. My view of most posters here is however jaded, with good reason; and their views of the majority of Thai women, who are frequently described as all prostitutes, are even more jaded. Have a good day.

 

 

Edited January 3 by BigStar

[Elkski]

I would guess most single as well as couple tourists go to a thai massage parlor at least once or more per visit.   

[Chris Daley]

The first sign of things getting tough and she will drop you like a bag of dog <deleted>.  Get the go bag ready and have an escape plan.

[riclag]

20 hours ago, cavallerio said:

Lots of responses, many thanks. To be clear I've been lurking here for a while just to learn, but registered yesterday to post my question.

 

I didn't want to put too much detail in my original post to avoid any risk of identifying her. If I'm honest my doubts stem more from my own insecurities than anything she has said and done. The kids are great from whaI have seen, doing well at school and I have regular calls with one so she can practice her English. Way more hard working and motivated than I was at their age! She's not said anything about moving to Europe, she's pretty focussed on developing her career in Thailand with a view to giving her kids a good start in life. 

 

I get that if I shop around I could probably find someone younger, but TBH at my age and state of health 'boom boom' isn't the driver it once was...more looking for someone I respect, trust and can settle down with.

 

Anyway, thank you for the detailed and considered replies, a lot to think over. I should have a better idea after we have met, and experienced Thailand for myself. Worst case scenario I have an interesting holiday 🙂

“I get that if I shop around I could probably find someone younger, but TBH at my age and state of health 'boom boom' isn't the driver it once was...more looking for someone I respect, trust and can settle down with”.

I like this thought , companionship!

Sounds like you’re on the right track

mate.

Cheers

[GinBoy2]

On 1/2/2024 at 2:31 PM, cavallerio said:

 

 

She ticks a lot of boxes for me, she's smart hard-working and straightforward. I understand that a big part of her attraction to me is financial, as she's wanting a good education for her kids, and up to a point I'm okay with that. I'm probably about 5 years away from retirement here, and wouldn't be averse to moving somewhere warmer permanently. Got no real ties here, divorced and kids grown up.

 

I was just thinking about that last sentence.

 

Now all my kids both US and Thai are grown up and in their 20/30's.

 

When we lived in Thailand I missed my girls terribly.

 

When my Thai son told us he wasn't returning to Thailand after graduating college in the US, my wife cried for a week and it was the catalyst for our move to the US.

 

Now with grandkids that all looks like a smart move.

 

So don't write off those family ties they can be powerful emotions, especially as you get older 

[cavallerio]

7 hours ago, GinBoy2 said:

So don't write off those family ties they can be powerful emotions, especially as you get older 

That's a good point...it's a way down the road for me yet, but I'd certainly think long and hard before cutting ties with the UK. Financially I should be ok to keep my house here and travel back and forth reasonably frequently, but definitely something to bear in mind.

[cavallerio]

20 hours ago, BigStar said:

True, and so I pointed out to the OP that Thais are individuals. I've agreed elsewhere that relationships w/ bar girls etc. can be successful. Unquestionably true. I've known a few.

That's my thinking....I've visited quite a few countries over the years, and I guess I'd summarise my experience as people are people, wherever you are. Most are good, some exceptionally so, with a minority of pricks. I get that cultural differences matter and money matters a lot more in countries without social security and state funded healthcare. Trust but verify.

Edited January 4 by cavallerio
Replacing a naughty word

[PingRoundTheWorld]

On 1/2/2024 at 11:31 PM, cavallerio said:

any red flags to look out for, other advice, thoughts, etc? 

Your entire description of her is red flags. She is old, has kids, and is clearly more interested in financial support than a loving relationship. Best case scenario she's "only" a gold digger and will milk you for what she can. Worst case it's entirely possible she has multiple other "boyfriends" sending her money every month - that's very common. Also entirely possible that she moonlights as a freelancer (hooker) - also very common for single mothers here - they need to support a family and a government salary usually isn't enough.

 

I'm not saying you shouldn't do it - but you should first come to Bangkok, meet the lady, see what she's like and if there is an actual genuine connection - and only then decide if you want to commit to her. You say she's out of your league - but that's completely ridiculous - she's 38yo and a single mom - why do you think she's looking abroad for older men? This is Thailand - you can easily get a younger woman who isn't a mom (yet) if you wanted to.

 

Bottom line is becareful with your money and what you bring to Thailand with you. Anything you buy her you will never see again. Be ready to support not only her and her kids, but also her mom, possibly uncle, and various other family members who'll come to her asking for money once they learn she married a "rich" falang. (assuming a worst case scenario here - not ALL relationships are like that - but it's common enough that it needs mentioning)

[Banana7]

Lots of good advice in this thread before my 2 bits here.

 

There are probably hundreds of ladies in Thailand as good or better (less kids, better job, more attractive, more honest, nicer and more compatible personality) than the one you met online, many of them would be interested in you. In thailand, you'll be like a kid in candy shop, tough to choose only one. So line-up at least 5 and come for a month. Make no commitments, shop around, pace yourself.

 

Never send money to anyone whom you have never met in person. 

 

It will be a difficult relationship for the next 5 years, until you retire. You'll only be together for your vacation (1 month/year?) each year. For me, that wouldn't be enough. You might get lucky, and UK gives her a visa to visit you. But never send her airline tickets, ask her buy her own tickets, and you reimburse upon her arrival. I have had too many no shows.  But is even 2 months together per year enough, for 5 years? Also, if she doesn't take vacation while you are here, you'll have lots of spare time, while she is working or taking care of her children, etc.

 

In the Western world, men are starving for love and affection. Use your big head, not your little head, when making a choice.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited January 4 by Banana7

[GinBoy2]

27 minutes ago, PingRoundTheWorld said:

Your entire description of her is red flags. She is old, has kids, and is clearly more interested in financial support than a loving relationship. Best case scenario she's "only" a gold digger and will milk you for what she can. Worst case it's entirely possible she has multiple other "boyfriends" sending her money every month - that's very common. Also entirely possible that she moonlights as a freelancer (hooker) - also very common for single mothers here - they need to support a family and a government salary usually isn't enough.

 

I'm not saying you shouldn't do it - but you should first come to Bangkok, meet the lady, see what she's like and if there is an actual genuine connection - and only then decide if you want to commit to her. You say she's out of your league - but that's completely ridiculous - she's 38yo and a single mom - why do you think she's looking abroad for older men? This is Thailand - you can easily get a younger woman who isn't a mom (yet) if you wanted to.

 

Bottom line is becareful with your money and what you bring to Thailand with you. Anything you buy her you will never see again. Be ready to support not only her and her kids, but also her mom, possibly uncle, and various other family members who'll come to her asking for money once they learn she married a "rich" falang. (assuming a worst case scenario here - not ALL relationships are like that - but it's common enough that it needs mentioning)

Well support of family members is fairly common in asian cultures.

 

My wife is a bit of an odd duck, after both her parents died young she and her siblings were farmed out to relatives.

 

She considers herself the lucky one as she got to live with her aunt and uncle in Chicago and got educated in the US, with ultimately a great job and career. 

Her other four siblings, not so much.

So unlike, I would suggest most Western societies she has always sent money, from even before I met her, to support brother sisters, and her Grandma who didn't have the breaks she had.

 

Don't always knock the asian tradition of looking after family, if as they always say 'Im Lucky'

[PingRoundTheWorld]

6 minutes ago, GinBoy2 said:

So unlike, I would suggest most Western societies she has always sent money, from even before I met her, to support brother sisters, and her Grandma who didn't have the breaks she had.

That's exactly what I'm talking about. While I have no problem with supporting a girlfriend and her kids - having her extended family expect her to support them just because of the "rich falang" is ridiculous.

 

If she wants to throw away her own money that she earned working - that's up to her - but using money that I give to support her to other people is completely disrespectful IMO, not to mention always asking for more because it's never enough.

 

And then of course you have those who actually have a boyfriend/husband other than you, and use YOUR money to support him. Sadly a lot more common than most guys realize.

[cavallerio]

1 hour ago, Banana7 said:

Lots of good advice in this thread before my 2 bits here.

 

The different viewpoints are interesting. For me, it's like I'm listening to two voices, one saying pull away before I get in too deep, and the other saying I don't want to be sitting here in 5 years time regretting the road not taken. The second voice is winning at the moment...I guess it helps that losing a few grand isn't going to make a massive difference to my situation if it comes to that. I'm really not someone who's going to enjoy dating multiple women - no judgement against those that do, it just isn't me.

 

I was contacted by loads of Thai women on Tinder, probably because I got my settings wrong. Most were obvious crypto scammers, some seemed genuine, but this was the only one that actually showed a genuine interest in me and my life. I realise that could mean she's clever and playing the long game, but I don't want to mess things up by being too cautious. I have sent relatively small amounts of money for Christmas and birthday presents so far (about 14K baht in total) but she's never actually asked or even hinted for any yet.

 

Again, thanks for the replies, all of them...good to have a spread of opinions to ponder.

[cavallerio]

Just to add, the Tinder pickings in the UK were diabolical... overweight, tattooed, bad plastic surgery, photos filtered to high heaven...not claiming to be an oil painting myself, but boy was it depressing.

[South]

22 minutes ago, cavallerio said:

Just to add, the Tinder pickings in the UK were diabolical... overweight, tattooed, bad plastic surgery, photos filtered to high heaven...not claiming to be an oil painting myself, but boy was it depressing.

Tinder her is online Soi 6,  you take your picks.

[thaibeachlovers]

On 1/3/2024 at 1:19 PM, save the frogs said:

 

I wouldn't say never.

There are some advantages. As kids are grown up, you can see if they're good kids and worth investing time and money.

But you would have to treat them as your kids. And so what? Unless you don't have a nurturing bone in your body, it's a good project to take on. 

 

The main point I made is that the relationship will never be just about the man and the woman, so why bother getting married unless want an instant family more than a relationship one on one for a while?

 

Does any farang go to LOS with the intention of being a father to someone else's kids?

 

 

[thaibeachlovers]

1 hour ago, cavallerio said:

I have sent relatively small amounts of money for Christmas and birthday presents so far (about 14K baht in total) but she's never actually asked or even hinted for any yet.

That is not a small amount for a Thai on a low income.

If a farang starts off by being "generous" they will expect that in the future.

That played a large part in the end of my Thai relationship, when I was no longer able to continue being "generous".

 

BTW, IMO never fall into the trap of feeling sorry for them and trying to make them feel better with money eg a monthly amount, or a car, or a house etc. While one can pay as you go with holidays, clothes etc, just giving money is IMO a very bad idea. She has a job ( if she doesn't, you are asking for trouble ) and can pay for her personal stuff herself.

 

In my experience, Thai women have a knack of making farangs fall into stupidity, and do things they'd never do for a woman back home.

[GinBoy2]

5 minutes ago, thaibeachlovers said:

The main point I made is that the relationship will never be just about the man and the woman, so why bother getting married unless want an instant family more than a relationship one on one for a while?

 

Does any farang go to LOS with the intention of being a father to someone else's kids?

 

 

My cousin actually did this.

 

He'd been unlucky in love as we say, but he was in his late 40's had always wanted kids but at his age he didn't want to be the elderly dad taking kids to soccer games.

 

He ended up meeting a woman in Mexico with kids, I think they were 10 and 11 at the time, and bingo he had his instant family.

 

Obviously there are differences, we're hispanic everybody spoke Spanish and the cultures are the same, but it can work.

 

15 years have passed and they call him Dad and he is their Dad, don't think they have ever had any contact with their biological Dad or want to

[thaibeachlovers]

13 minutes ago, GinBoy2 said:

My cousin actually did this.

 

He'd been unlucky in love as we say, but he was in his late 40's had always wanted kids but at his age he didn't want to be the elderly dad taking kids to soccer games.

 

He ended up meeting a woman in Mexico with kids, I think they were 10 and 11 at the time, and bingo he had his instant family.

 

Obviously there are differences, we're hispanic everybody spoke Spanish and the cultures are the same, but it can work.

 

15 years have passed and they call him Dad and he is their Dad, don't think they have ever had any contact with their biological Dad or want to

That's great, for him. Win win for everyone.

[Banana7]

15 hours ago, cavallerio said:

The different viewpoints are interesting. For me, it's like I'm listening to two voices, one saying pull away before I get in too deep, and the other saying I don't want to be sitting here in 5 years time regretting the road not taken. The second voice is winning at the moment...I guess it helps that losing a few grand isn't going to make a massive difference to my situation if it comes to that. I'm really not someone who's going to enjoy dating multiple women - no judgement against those that do, it just isn't me.

 

I was contacted by loads of Thai women on Tinder, probably because I got my settings wrong. Most were obvious crypto scammers, some seemed genuine, but this was the only one that actually showed a genuine interest in me and my life. I realise that could mean she's clever and playing the long game, but I don't want to mess things up by being too cautious. I have sent relatively small amounts of money for Christmas and birthday presents so far (about 14K baht in total) but she's never actually asked or even hinted for any yet.

 

Again, thanks for the replies, all of them...good to have a spread of opinions to ponder.

Not saying to pull away but go for it, but don't make any commitments or investments. Explore the opportunity and find the true nature of this wonderful woman. I found  in my past relationships, a women can hide her true personality, behaviour and attitude for up to 2 or 3 weeks, if you are together 24/7. After this period, I saw their true genuine characteristics beginning to emerge.  If you two are not together 24/7, it takes longer. I found that taking them on a one or 2 week vacation, isn't adequate to make a reasonable assessment.

 

As for sending money/gifts before meeting, you may get a nasty surprise upon meeting, meaning the person is not what you expected.  By sending money, it is setting expectations for future encounters. There is no benefit for you to send money. Most Thais don't celebrate Christmas and don't exchange presents, so why send Christmas presents? - Did they send you a present? Lots of time to spend your hard earned money in Thailand. Thailand women and customs are radically different from UK women and customs. About only thing in common is the side of the road you drive on.

 

[FruitPudding]

It is absolutely astounding what men will do for some pussy.

[FruitPudding]

20 hours ago, Banana7 said:

In the Western world, men are starving for love and affection. Use your big head, not your little head, when making a choice.

 

This is it. 💯 

 

Drink the well dry in Thailand and get some clarity.

[GinBoy2]

18 hours ago, thaibeachlovers said:

That's great, for him. Win win for everyone.

Yeah it actually worked out great for everyone.

 

This year we all got together in Denver where my eldest daughter and Thai son live.

 

Aunts and uncles, nephews and nieces. 

 

Added to the party this year, my youngest daughter and her new son, Thai son and his new daughter, then both my cousins adopted daughters both with twins, plus all the associated significant others.

 

Life sometimes does actually work out for the best

[Celsius]

On 1/3/2024 at 9:00 PM, Elkski said:

see a doctor about your low libido ASAP so you can enjoy things fully.  Its normal for a man's sex drive to be strong into his 90s.

 

No it is not. Otherwise they would not need to see a doctor and get choked on viagra. Give me a break. 

[cavallerio]

1 hour ago, Celsius said:

No it is not. Otherwise they would not need to see a doctor and get choked on viagra. Give me a break

Side effect of medication...happy to sacrifice some libido to keep my heart in good shape 🙂

[cavallerio]

8 hours ago, Banana7 said:

encounters. There is no benefit for you to send money. Most Thais don't celebrate Christmas and don't exchange presents, so why send Christmas presents? - Did they send you a present?

She's a single mum raising two kids on a low wage, I'm a single guy with no commitments, earning a decent wage, house paid for, money in the bank, final salary pension...I don't expect reciprocity. If I can help out a little, I'm ok with that. It's not going to bankrupt me, and no plans to transfer assets from the UK anytime soon

[thaibeachlovers]

9 hours ago, Banana7 said:

I found  in my past relationships, a women can hide her true personality, behaviour and attitude for up to 2 or 3 weeks, if you are together 24/7.

I was with my wife for a year before we got married. She hid her true character all that time. Changed once she had the bit of paper.

[thaibeachlovers]

1 hour ago, cavallerio said:

She's a single mum raising two kids on a low wage, I'm a single guy with no commitments, earning a decent wage, house paid for, money in the bank, final salary pension...I don't expect reciprocity. If I can help out a little, I'm ok with that. It's not going to bankrupt me, and no plans to transfer assets from the UK anytime soon

You miss the point that your opinion and hers are very different. By giving her anything you give her expectation of more.

You can't expect Thai women to think like a western woman. Roses and Daisies are both flowers, but very different.

 

Many, too many western men come to Thailand thinking they are knights on a white horse going to rescue some poor Thai woman from her misfortune, and end up losing their fortune. Suckers all. I don't claim to have been better that them either. Lessons learned the hard way.

[thaibeachlovers]

3 hours ago, Celsius said:

 

No it is not. Otherwise they would not need to see a doctor and get choked on viagra. Give me a break. 

LOL. You confuse sex drive and ability. Sex drive is not the same as a stiffy.