Teenagers and Foreigner Injured in Pattaya Motorcycle Crash

[Ralf001]

2 minutes ago, SAFETY FIRST said:

Yes, I read the report, the girls are under 16yo. 

 

You don't know Thai law? 

 

 

What is the Thai law ?

[G_Money]

For the presumed farang on the thread that are driving a motorbike.

 

If you own the bike ensure it’s properly registered with current tax.

 

Obtain a Thai motorcycle license or a license from your home country with motorcycle endorsement and IDP.

IMO first class insurance from a reputable agent is a must.  If I’m involved in an accident I call a number provided, the agent sends a Thai speaking representative to the site.  I tell him my version of what happened.  Admit no fault to anyone else.
 

He/she handles all negotiations or dealings with the other parties and police.

 

That is how it should work in theory.  Hopefully I’ll never have to put it into practice.

 

 

 

[NoshowJones]

7 minutes ago, richard_smith237 said:

 

But it seems you don't have medical insurance.....     I agree with you, firstly, given the numbers of motorcyclists riding down the pavement here your scenario isn't far fetched...  in such circumstances the BiB should make the culprit pay for your medical bills etc..

 

But, its unlikely the 'culprit' has any money to pay in the first place, so what can you do then ?

 

But, I don't know about you, but I wouldn't be in a government hospital unless I had to... so the only option is to ensure we have our own cover to protect ourselves when authorities can't.

 

 

I do not trust Thai insurance companies, according to what I have read and heard, they have a bad record of paying out, yes I have good medical insurance for my motorbike, but I was warned about it by a very good source here on Asian Now. I am not sure if I will renew it when the time comes.

I did have life insurance for two years then I was advised to cancel it by another very good source on this forum it was years ago so I cannot remember all the reasons why.

[brianthainess]

1 hour ago, richard_smith237 said:

 

But it seems you don't have medical insurance.....     I agree with you, firstly, given the numbers of motorcyclists riding down the pavement here your scenario isn't far fetched...  in such circumstances the BiB should make the culprit pay for your medical bills etc..

 

But, its unlikely the 'culprit' has any money to pay in the first place, so what can you do then ?

 

But, I don't know about you, but I wouldn't be in a government hospital unless I had to... so the only option is to ensure we have our own cover to protect ourselves when authorities can't.

 

 

Not everyone can get medical insurance, There is a lot of false info on government hospitals, I have been treated well and charged reasonably, and all the 'Specialists' come from the BKK hospital nearby anyway. 

[richard_smith237]

1 hour ago, NoshowJones said:

I do not trust Thai insurance companies, according to what I have read and heard, they have a bad record of paying out, yes I have good medical insurance for my motorbike, but I was warned about it by a very good source here on Asian Now. I am not sure if I will renew it when the time comes.

I did have life insurance for two years then I was advised to cancel it by another very good source on this forum it was years ago so I cannot remember all the reasons why.

 

You have good 'medical insurance for your motorbike' ???   - thats rather confusing.

 

Its seems you do not have 'good medical insurance'  (as in good international Medical Insurance i.e. provided by Cygna International, or LUMA international etc)...  

 

IF anyone has any concerns that they could at some point incur medical costs through not fault of their own - this is exactly what medical insurance is for...  OR enough funds to self insure of course. 

 

Whether or not you trust Thai Policies is of course an individual choice, I too am sceptical as to the ease of which a Thai Underwriter would pay for medical treatment at a time I might not be in a very good physical mental condition to argue with them and that is an additional stress I wouldn't want.

 

 

 

 

[richard_smith237]

6 minutes ago, brianthainess said:

Not everyone can get medical insurance, There is a lot of false info on government hospitals, I have been treated well and charged reasonably, and all the 'Specialists' come from the BKK hospital nearby anyway. 

 

Yep, thats the tricky part... looking to my long term future here, I have concerns regarding level of medical cover I can secure as I age.

 

But.. we are also discussing 'emergency medical costs'...  and not elective care... in an emergency situation we may not even be conscious and have any impact on where we are taken or how much it could cost.

 

Without decent medical cover our costs could well be significant...    and this would sting somewhat, especially in a 'no fault' incident.

 

On the private vs government care - obviously I have a preference... and those who don't undergo private treatment argue their case well... but they always argue that it 'was as good as private care'... same doctors etc - but not always and the level of nursing care is different etc (we could debate this ad nauseam - but private care is just better, more comfortable, less waiting etc etc - but obviously more expensive).

That said, If paying for myself and not insurance, I'd seek out a good Government facility every time though, as private costs are astronomical.

 

 

[richard_smith237]

1 hour ago, G_Money said:

For the presumed farang on the thread that are driving a motorbike.

 

If you own the bike ensure it’s properly registered with current tax.

 

Obtain a Thai motorcycle license or a license from your home country with motorcycle endorsement and IDP.

IMO first class insurance from a reputable agent is a must.  If I’m involved in an accident I call a number provided, the agent sends a Thai speaking representative to the site.  I tell him my version of what happened.  Admit no fault to anyone else.
 

He/she handles all negotiations or dealings with the other parties and police.

 

That is how it should work in theory.  Hopefully I’ll never have to put it into practice.

 

 

Thats how it works with cars - and it works quite well...   the difference of course is than in a standard 'fender bender' no one is hurt.

 

When there is an injury, things usually get a little more complicated as one side will usually want some form of compensation and medical bills paid, and that side is usually the poorer party even if they are the cause of the incident... (as they often will not accept or even understand they are the cause).

 

So.. when there is an injury, the Police usually get involved and they can dictate fault, but we don't have to agree with that.

It could get pushed up to the next level. 

 

 

 

[fredwiggy]

2 hours ago, SAFETY FIRST said:

Yes, I read the report, the girls are under 16yo. 

 

You don't know Thai law? 

 

 

This is one case where an underage driver caused a fatal accident and was ordered to pay. I'm assuming this follows your Thai law question.........................https://www.nationthailand.com/in-focus/30374272

[brianthainess]

20 minutes ago, richard_smith237 said:

 

Yep, thats the tricky part... looking to my long term future here, I have concerns regarding level of medical cover I can secure as I age.

 

But.. we are also discussing 'emergency medical costs'...  and not elective care... in an emergency situation we may not even be conscious and have any impact on where we are taken or how much it could cost.

 

Without decent medical cover our costs could well be significant...    and this would sting somewhat, especially in a 'no fault' incident.

 

On the private vs government care - obviously I have a preference... and those who don't undergo private treatment argue their case well... but they always argue that it 'was as good as private care'... same doctors etc - but not always and the level of nursing care is different etc (we could debate this ad nauseam - but private care is just better, more comfortable, less waiting etc etc - but obviously more expensive).

That said, If paying for myself and not insurance, I'd seek out a good Government facility every time though, as private costs are astronomical.

 

 

One advantage to me for govt. hospital is that my wife can stay 24/7 go and fetch me some decent food, pillow, fan or whatever, she will quite happily eat the hospital food they give me, Although some have said wife can stay in private hospitals with you too but I don't think they can, and as I've said here before if 3m baht don't fix me then it'll be all over anyway. Private hospitals are Now obligated to treat emergencies whether you have insurance or not then transport you to a Govt. hospital. 

[KhunBENQ]

On 1/27/2024 at 5:49 AM, scubascuba3 said:

No McDonald's on Central Pattaya road

Yes. But no one (if not overlooked) cares to say that it happened on Sukhumvit road northbound and to me it looks like the crash was on the inner lane?!

Kids changed lane?

Maybe to the right as you are forced to do to reach a U-turn or turn right.

Driving on this race track with a small bike is a problem from the start.

When in Pattaya I avoid it whenever possible.

Did Igor go fast on the inner lane?

 

Edited January 28 by KhunBENQ

[brianthainess]

24 minutes ago, richard_smith237 said:

 

Thats how it works with cars - and it works quite well...   the difference of course is than in a standard 'fender bender' no one is hurt.

 

When there is an injury, things usually get a little more complicated as one side will usually want some form of compensation and medical bills paid, and that side is usually the poorer party even if they are the cause of the incident... (as they often will not accept or even understand they are the cause).

 

So.. when there is an injury, the Police usually get involved and they can dictate fault, but we don't have to agree with that.

It could get pushed up to the next level. 

 

 

 

This is where if you have a car a Dash cam is a must, anybody driving without one must be nuts.

[richard_smith237]

23 minutes ago, brianthainess said:

This is where if you have a car a Dash cam is a must, anybody driving without one must be nuts.

 

100% agree... I have fwd and rear facing on both my Car and Motorcycle... 

 

Its still not 360 degrees coverage of course, but covers 120 degrees to the front and 120 degrees to the rear, is hard-wired and always on whenever the ignition is on.

 

While I've been here long enough not to be concerned with unfair treatment from the Police etc, I'm well aware that it may not always be possible for them to know exactly what happened and establish genuine fault...  In most cases its not a big deal and just let the insurance company handle it... BUT.. there are very rare cases where cam footage could be essential.

 

The use of a 'dash cam' is to shut down false conclusions immediately before they get a chance to grow arms and legs. 

[NoshowJones]

1 hour ago, richard_smith237 said:

 

You have good 'medical insurance for your motorbike' ???   - thats rather confusing.

 

Its seems you do not have 'good medical insurance'  (as in good international Medical Insurance i.e. provided by Cygna International, or LUMA international etc)...  

 

IF anyone has any concerns that they could at some point incur medical costs through not fault of their own - this is exactly what medical insurance is for...  OR enough funds to self insure of course. 

 

Whether or not you trust Thai Policies is of course an individual choice, I too am sceptical as to the ease of which a Thai Underwriter would pay for medical treatment at a time I might not be in a very good physical mental condition to argue with them and that is an additional stress I wouldn't want.

 

 

 

 

I am covered for hospital insurance for up to 200,000 Bt for accidents involving my motorbike. Maybe  I have worded it wrongly. This is part of my 1st Class motorbike insurance.

[richard_smith237]

3 minutes ago, NoshowJones said:

I am covered for hospital insurance for up to 200,000 Bt for accidents involving my motorbike. Maybe  I have worded it wrongly. This is part of my 1st Class motorbike insurance.

 

Ah got you...    Is that you, passenger or anyone else covered ? (i.e. if you injure someone else your insurance covers them up to 200,000 baht medical bills ?

 

And, is that 200,000 baht cover at any hospital, private or government ? (any idea ?)

 

200,000 baht would cover most 'bumps'...   but a serious accident could easily exceed that.

[NoshowJones]

2 minutes ago, richard_smith237 said:

 

Ah got you...    Is that you, passenger or anyone else covered ? (i.e. if you injure someone else your insurance covers them up to 200,000 baht medical bills ?

 

And, is that 200,000 baht cover at any hospital, private or government ? (any idea ?)

 

200,000 baht would cover most 'bumps'...   but a serious accident could easily exceed that.

Yes to everything you have said, but you have no choice about the hospital, whoever picks you up will take you to the hospital that pays him most. If I was conscious I would refuse to go to a private hospital. This is Thailand where money rules.

[brianthainess]

3 hours ago, Ralf001 said:

What is the Thai law ?

At 15 can drive M/C 110cc or under. 14 can't drive any M/B

[Ralf001]

2 minutes ago, brianthainess said:

At 15 can drive M/C 110cc or under. 14 can't drive any M/B

Yeah I know, trying to establish the dribble about under16.

[richard_smith237]

19 minutes ago, NoshowJones said:

Yes to everything you have said, but you have no choice about the hospital, whoever picks you up will take you to the hospital that pays him most. If I was conscious I would refuse to go to a private hospital. This is Thailand where money rules.

 

Yep.. Obviously if we are unconscious we have no control over where we are taken. 

I keep my insurance card in my wallet, and another thats in the pocket of my bike with my licence.

 

What I wouldn't want to happen of course is what happened to a guy recently who was critical yet still turned away from a private hospital because they couldn't identify if he has funds to pay or not (illegal)... 

 

 

And sadly - people here judge your economic status very much by your appearance - and its judged that those on motorbikes can't afford a car...  ergo may not be able to afford to pay for private treatment !.. 

 

 

 

[NanLaew]

On 1/27/2024 at 2:27 PM, Bangkok Barry said:

 

Did you read the report? The kids attempted to change lanes. And, on top of that, they were too young to be riding a motorcycle. So why is Igor to blame>

 

Are you new here or what?

[richard_smith237]

8 minutes ago, Ralf001 said:

11 minutes ago, brianthainess said:

At 15 can drive M/C 110cc or under. 14 can't drive any M/B

Yeah I know, trying to establish the dribble about under16.

 

The 'dribble' as you so call it...   is the point made by Safety First that the girls were very likely to be 'riding illegally' as they were underage for the size of motorcycle they were riding, and thats if they were even licensed in the first place. 

 

The 'dribble' as you so call it is regarding underaged and unlicensed riders causing accidents when they shouldn't be on the road in the first place... 

 

[richard_smith237]

Just now, NanLaew said:

On 1/27/2024 at 9:27 AM, Bangkok Barry said:

 

Did you read the report? The kids attempted to change lanes. And, on top of that, they were too young to be riding a motorcycle. So why is Igor to blame>

 

Are you new here or what?

 

We're all aware this 'stuff' happens..    But the discussion concerned whether 'Igor' should pay for damages as someone suggested he may get 'stiffed for this'    (i.e. his medical bills and that of the girls - as well as potential repair costs)....        

 

After all, the girls who caused the accident were very likely riding illegally...  

 

But... IF the rider was licensed and the Motorcycle was less than 110cc and they were on the road legally (i.e. with Por-Ror-Bor - tax and insurance) then that Por-Ror-Bor insurance should be paying for the medical costs... 

 

... Does it also pay for the repair costs to Igor's bike ?

[Ralf001]

3 minutes ago, richard_smith237 said:

 

ware this 'stuff' happens..    But the discussion concerned whether 'Igor' should pay for damages as someone suggested he may get 'stiffed for this'    (i.e. his medical bills and that of the girls - as well as potential repair costs).... We're all a       

 

After all, the girls who caused the accident were very likely riding illegally...  

 

But... IF the rider was licensed and the Motorcycle was less than 110cc and they were on the road legally (i.e. with Por-Ror-Bor - tax and insurance) then that Por-Ror-Bor insurance should be paying for the medical costs... 

 

... Does it also pay for the repair costs to Igor's bike ?

speaking of dribble...........were they 14 or 15 ?

[NanLaew]

On 1/27/2024 at 3:57 PM, Ralf001 said:

 

Barry is correct.

My insuranace would be chasing the girls/bike owner.

Insert bwah-hah-hah-hah-hah emoji [here]

[richard_smith237]

12 minutes ago, Ralf001 said:

speaking of dribble...........were they 14 or 15 ?

 

The girls were 14... so riding illegally.

 

But you knew that already.....   and then failed to comprehend other points made.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited January 28 by richard_smith237

[Bangkok Barry]

1 hour ago, NanLaew said:

 

Are you new here or what?

 

Maybe I'm not as cynical as you, and CCTV will show the kids riding illegally were also to blame. Hard to argue with a birth certificate.

[NoshowJones]

13 hours ago, richard_smith237 said:

 

Yep.. Obviously if we are unconscious we have no control over where we are taken. 

I keep my insurance card in my wallet, and another thats in the pocket of my bike with my licence.

 

What I wouldn't want to happen of course is what happened to a guy recently who was critical yet still turned away from a private hospital because they couldn't identify if he has funds to pay or not (illegal)... 

 

 

And sadly - people here judge your economic status very much by your appearance - and its judged that those on motorbikes can't afford a car...  ergo may not be able to afford to pay for private treatment !.. 

 

 

 

I do the same. I know personally of a guy who was taken to a public hospital and his insurance refused to pay out because the hospital never tested him for his alcohol consumption.

 

Edited January 28 by metisdead
Underlining removed.

[Irish star]

On 1/27/2024 at 6:38 AM, ezzra said:

More than half of the riders in Pattaya are foreigners, young and all and couples, many of them are women,

that probably its the only times they ride a motorbike in their life, how many are insured in case of a mishaps?

not many, if at all, i would venture a guess...

I see so many men riding on the back and a woman driving,  No WAY 

[richard_smith237]

 

12 hours ago, NoshowJones said:

I do the same. I know personally of a guy who was taken to a public hospital and his insurance refused to pay out because the hospital never tested him for his alcohol consumption.

 

 

Wow...   An insurance failed to pay out because an alcohol test was not administered ?...  that ridiculous - we should know which insurance so we can all avoid.

 

I have heard of insurance policies not paying out because someone was drunk - but not because they were no proof that someone wasn't drunk...   Definitely a case to file an appeal with 'the Ombudsman'.....   

 

 

 

 

 

 

[NoshowJones]

1 hour ago, richard_smith237 said:

 

 

Wow...   An insurance failed to pay out because an alcohol test was not administered ?...  that ridiculous - we should know which insurance so we can all avoid.

 

I have heard of insurance policies not paying out because someone was drunk - but not because they were no proof that someone wasn't drunk...   Definitely a case to file an appeal with 'the Ombudsman'.....   

 

 

 

 

 

 

PM sent.

[brianthainess]

14 hours ago, richard_smith237 said:

 

The 'dribble' as you so call it...   is the point made by Safety First that the girls were very likely to be 'riding illegally' as they were underage for the size of motorcycle they were riding, and thats if they were even licensed in the first place. 

 

The 'dribble' as you so call it is regarding underaged and unlicensed riders causing accidents when they shouldn't be on the road in the first place... 

 

That was not MY quote about dribble.