Ukraine ... Enlighten yourself

[KhunLA]

 

[retarius]

I'm already enlightened. 

[Hummin]

19 minutes ago, KhunLA said:

 

Even he have some points, he is far off the truth when it comes to Putin. Putin fights for the same as us, and trust me, we do not want Putin to become stronger, especially through a war capturing valuable resources in Ukraine. 

 

 

[Will B Good]

Utter rubbish from Kennedy as usual......

 

In November 2013, protests erupted in Ukraine’s capital, Kyiv, after then-President Viktor Yanukovych suspended preparations to sign an Association Agreement with the European Union (EU). Many Ukrainians, especially in the western part of the country, supported closer ties with the EU.

 

The protests, known as Euromaidan, began as a peaceful movement advocating for Ukraine’s European integration but quickly escalated as Yanukovych’s government responded with force.

 

Over the months, the movement grew into a larger protest against government corruption, police brutality, and authoritarianism.

[KhunLA]

11 minutes ago, Hummin said:

Even he have some points, he is far off the truth when it comes to Putin. Putin fights for the same as us, and trust me, we do not want Putin to become stronger, especially through a war capturing valuable resources in Ukraine. 

He's spot on IMHO, and mirrors all my thought & research on the subject.   I knew all that before seeing the vid.  Just thought it might open some eyes. 

 

 Apparently not 😎

 

A nice 'reader's digest' of the truth, instead of MSM BS being spoon fed to the masses.  It also mirrors what Putin explained in the Tucker Carlson interview.  Amazing how the facts in both align perfectly.

 

The truth right in front of people, from two completely different sidelines, but people still believe the MSM BS 

[Hummin]

The truth can be right and wrong, just depending on what we want the end result going to be. As said, we do not want Putin and Russia to become stronger, to quick, but eventually China, Russia and Allies, will win the war on available resources. 

 

So? What do you want? Hoping Musk solve the Mars colonization? 

[riclag]

3 hours ago, KhunLA said:

He's spot on IMHO, and mirrors all my thought & research on the subject.   I knew all that before seeing the vid.  Just thought it might open some eyes. 

 

 Apparently not 😎

 

A nice 'reader's digest' of the truth, instead of MSM BS being spoon fed to the masses.  It also mirrors what Putin explained in the Tucker Carlson interview.  Amazing how the facts in both align perfectly.

 

The truth right in front of people, from two completely different sidelines, but people still believe the MSM BS 

Bingo ,thanks for sharing that,

According to Kennedy ,Threats of moving Nato to the east!

Makes sense!

[RayC]

4 hours ago, Will B Good said:

Utter rubbish from Kennedy as usual......

 

In November 2013, protests erupted in Ukraine’s capital, Kyiv, after then-President Viktor Yanukovych suspended preparations to sign an Association Agreement with the European Union (EU). Many Ukrainians, especially in the western part of the country, supported closer ties with the EU.

 

The protests, known as Euromaidan, began as a peaceful movement advocating for Ukraine’s European integration but quickly escalated as Yanukovych’s government responded with force.

 

Over the months, the movement grew into a larger protest against government corruption, police brutality, and authoritarianism.

 

You are, of course, completely correct.

 

I got as far as Kennedy "explaining" that Gorbachev bargained German unification for Baker's assurance of no eastwards NATO expansion, before giving up: Complete and utter nonsense.

 

Firstly, Baker was not in a position to give such assurances. Secondly, Gorbachev had no real say in the matter wrt East Germany. It was not a question of what Russia wanted to do with East Germany, rather would West Germany accept reunification, on what terms and would West Germany's allies in the EU, notably France and the UK, be supportive of reunification (initially at least, both Mitterrand and Thatcher had reservations and were lukewarm in their support).

 

Oh, by the way Ted. The Berlin Wall fell in 1989, not 1991 as you stated. How can anyone take seriously a man who can't even get the basic facts regarding dates correct?

[Cameroni]

Absolutely brilliant analysis by Kennedy.

 

4 hours ago, Will B Good said:

Utter rubbish from Kennedy as usual......

 

In November 2013, protests erupted in Ukraine’s capital, Kyiv, after then-President Viktor Yanukovych suspended preparations to sign an Association Agreement with the European Union (EU). Many Ukrainians, especially in the western part of the country, supported closer ties with the EU.

 

The protests, known as Euromaidan, began as a peaceful movement advocating for Ukraine’s European integration but quickly escalated as Yanukovych’s government responded with force.

 

Over the months, the movement grew into a larger protest against government corruption, police brutality, and authoritarianism.

 

"An explosive New York Times exposé by Adam Entous and Michael Schwirtz sheds light on major developments preceding the full-scale invasion of Ukraine. According to the report, the Ukrainian government entered into a wide-ranging partnership with the CIA against Russia. This cooperation, which involved the establishment of as many as 12 secret CIA “forward operating bases” along Ukraine’s border with Russia, began not with Russia’s 2022 invasion, but just over 10 years ago.

 

Within days of the February 2014 Euromaidan Revolution that culminated with the ouster of President Viktor Yanukovych and ushered in a firmly pro-Western government, the newly appointed head of the Security Service of Ukraine (SBU), Valentyn Nalyvaichenko, reportedly proposed a “three-way partnership” with the CIA and MI6, the UK’s foreign intelligence service. Ukrainian security officials gradually proved their value to the U.S. by feeding the CIA intelligence on Russia, including “secret documents about the Russian Navy,” leading to the establishment of CIA bases in Ukraine to coordinate activities against Russia and various training programs for Ukrainian commandos and other elite units.

 

A graduate of one such CIA training program, then-Lt. Col. Kyrylo Budanov, went on to become the chief of Ukrainian military intelligence.

Kyiv routinely pushed this relationship’s boundaries, violating the Obama administration’s red lines around lethal operations by carrying out assassinations of high-profile Russian fighters on territory controlled by Russian-aligned separatists. The Kyiv-CIA partnership deepened under the Trump administration, yet again putting the lie to the baseless idea that former President Trump was somehow amenable to Russia’s interests while in office."

 

https://responsiblestatecraft.org/cia-ukraine-russia/

[KhunLA]

28 minutes ago, riclag said:

Bingo ,thanks for sharing that,

According to Kennedy ,Threats of moving Nato to the east!

Makes sense!

I'm actually surprised, most people, my age, especially Yanks, didn't know that, as we grew up, watching on the news, and was explained at the time, (before most of the MSM was owned by 6 corporations) and just as Kennedy & Putin stated.

 

At least up until Crimea was annexed by RU.  And the why, easily found by researching, if you weren't paying attention.  Even MSM can't change the facts, though they certainly hide & spin it .. and people actually believe it.

 

That's the sad part 

[KhunLA]

14 minutes ago, RayC said:

 

You are, of course, completely correct.

 

I got as far as Kennedy "explaining" that Gorbachev bargained German unification for Baker's assurance of no eastwards NATO expansion, before giving up: Complete and utter nonsense.

 

Firstly, Baker was not in a position to give such assurances. Secondly, Gorbachev had no real say in the matter wrt East Germany. It was not a question of what Russia wanted to do with East Germany, rather would West Germany accept reunification, on what terms and would West Germany's allies in the EU, notably France and the UK, be supportive of reunification (initially at least, both Mitterrand and Thatcher had reservations and were lukewarm in their support).

 

Oh, by the way Ted. The Berlin Wall fell in 1989, not 1991 as you stated. How can anyone take seriously a man who can't even get the basic facts regarding dates correct?

Really ... and yet .. we have this

 

 

and this ... short version

 

Edited October 1 by KhunLA

[riclag]

11 minutes ago, KhunLA said:

I'm actually surprised, most people, my age, especially Yanks, didn't know that, as we grew up, watching on the news, and was explained at the time, (before most of the MSM was owned by 6 corporations) and just as Kennedy & Putin stated.

 

At least up until Crimea was annexed by RU.  And the why, easily found by researching, if you weren't paying attention.  Even MSM can't change the facts, though they certainly hide & spin it .. and people actually believe it.

 

That's the sad part 

 Soviet Union cold war threat after Gorbachev left was replaced  with,Putin , Putin Putin !

If Trump gets elected  even before his inauguration ,a peace deal gets done .

Where is the left we grew up with?

Peacenix’s are devoid in this war.

Edited October 1 by riclag

[riclag]

16 minutes ago, Cameroni said:

Absolutely brilliant analysis by Kennedy.

 

 

"An explosive New York Times exposé by Adam Entous and Michael Schwirtz sheds light on major developments preceding the full-scale invasion of Ukraine. According to the report, the Ukrainian government entered into a wide-ranging partnership with the CIA against Russia. This cooperation, which involved the establishment of as many as 12 secret CIA “forward operating bases” along Ukraine’s border with Russia, began not with Russia’s 2022 invasion, but just over 10 years ago.

 

Within days of the February 2014 Euromaidan Revolution that culminated with the ouster of President Viktor Yanukovych and ushered in a firmly pro-Western government, the newly appointed head of the Security Service of Ukraine (SBU), Valentyn Nalyvaichenko, reportedly proposed a “three-way partnership” with the CIA and MI6, the UK’s foreign intelligence service. Ukrainian security officials gradually proved their value to the U.S. by feeding the CIA intelligence on Russia, including “secret documents about the Russian Navy,” leading to the establishment of CIA bases in Ukraine to coordinate activities against Russia and various training programs for Ukrainian commandos and other elite units.

 

A graduate of one such CIA training program, then-Lt. Col. Kyrylo Budanov, went on to become the chief of Ukrainian military intelligence.

Kyiv routinely pushed this relationship’s boundaries, violating the Obama administration’s red lines around lethal operations by carrying out assassinations of high-profile Russian fighters on territory controlled by Russian-aligned separatists. The Kyiv-CIA partnership deepened under the Trump administration, yet again putting the lie to the baseless idea that former President Trump was somehow amenable to Russia’s interests while in office."

 

https://responsiblestatecraft.org/cia-ukraine-russia/

Outstanding article!

 

[KhunLA]

From link I posted above ... for the lazy folks ...

... facts can't be ignored 

 

... "With the exception of RT in Russia and a handful of online opinion articles (see below), no major media outlet has so far reported on the release of these newly declassified documents. In ending the Cold War by breaking promises to Gorbachev, the attitude of the revived Russia of today should not come as a surprise."

 

1960 ... RU's missiles on Cuba, and how did the USA react.   

 

Just think if they, RU's missiles were on the border of the USA, in CA & MX, how would the USA react ?

Edited October 1 by KhunLA

[Cameroni]

What is breathtaking is the active role Ukraine has played in involving the US and UK intelligence services in their dispute with Russia.

 

The Ukraine situation has echoes of Poland 1939, with Boris Johnson flying in to persuade Zelensky not to sign the peace treaty with Russia that was on the table.

 

And of course the US and UK pledging their support for Ukraine, which turns out to be useless.

 

 

[Inderpland]

Whatever happened to the old GOP, the strong defense party? See above. It's tragic. 

To those who have contributed so far in this thread;

 

Putin thanks you from the bottom of his black heart!

 

PS. Do you guys have the same standing in your respective families as RFK Jr 'enjoys' in his (i.e. everyone detests him)?

Edited October 1 by Inderpland

[Rimmer]

A troll post has been removed

[Jingthing]

RFK Jr. is a crackpot useful idiot for Putin but yeah do enlighten yourself.

 

 

[RayC]

46 minutes ago, KhunLA said:

Really ... and yet .. we have this

 

 

and this ... short version

 

 

40 minutes ago, KhunLA said:

 

 

And you consider these non-contextualised snippets to be sufficient proof of what exactly?

 

Rhetorical question: They say and prove absolutely nothing.

[RayC]

41 minutes ago, Cameroni said:

What is breathtaking is the active role Ukraine has played in involving the US and UK intelligence services in their dispute with Russia.

 

The Ukraine situation has echoes of Poland 1939, with Boris Johnson flying in to persuade Zelensky not to sign the peace treaty with Russia that was on the table.

 

And of course the US and UK pledging their support for Ukraine, which turns out to be useless.

 

 

 

The parallel with 1939 is that trying to appease an expansionist, tyrannical dictator is doomed to failure.

 

The rest of your post is absolute tosh as usual.

[Cameroni]

10 minutes ago, RayC said:

 

 

And you consider these non-contextualised snippets to be sufficient proof of what exactly?

 

Rhetorical question: They say and prove absolutely nothing.

 

Lol, they're from a website that details in exruciating details the promises by the West not to expand NATO to the East.

 

They prove in detail how Russia was lied to and misled.

 

Absolutely disgusting to claim clear evidence like the one KhunLa provided proves nothing, when it proves things beyond the measure of a doubt.

 

 

[Inderpland]

4 minutes ago, Cameroni said:

 

Lol, they're from a website that details in exruciating details the promises by the West not to expand NATO to the East.

 

They prove in detail how Russia was lied to and misled.

Yes, Russia is the victim here!

 

And in other news brought to you by RT............

[johng]

25 minutes ago, Inderpland said:

Yes, Russia is the victim here!

It can be argued they are.

(NATO expansion despite the promises not to)

 

The certain victims are the Ukrainians, lied to that they could defeat Russia ! the largest country "in the world"   reclaim all "their land"  fight to the last man  we have your back...but you can't join NATO why ?  well because that would be WWIII  !!!

whilst edging closer and closer to that outcome now  its frankly quite insane !!   no dialogue no negations  Russia must surrender unequivocally ?  the country with the largest nuclear arsenal 

will just give up  when really pushed ?

Edited October 1 by johng
spellins

[KhunLA]

38 minutes ago, RayC said:

 

 

And you consider these non-contextualised snippets to be sufficient proof of what exactly?

 

Rhetorical question: They say and prove absolutely nothing.

The underlined texts in my post are links to the source.  Been here 5+ years, and haven't figured that out yet.

Edited October 1 by KhunLA

[Inderpland]

3 minutes ago, KhunLA said:

The underlined texts in my post are links to the source.  Been here for almost 5 years, and haven't figured that out yet.

I could make a looooong list of things you haven't figured out yet, and I'm gonna go out on a limb and guess you're far older than five years.

[Inderpland]

6 minutes ago, johng said:

It can be argued they are.

(NATO expansion despite the promises not to)

 

The certain victims are the Uranians lied to that they could defeat Russia ! the largest country "in the world"   reclaim all "their land"  fight to the last man  we have your back...but you can't join NATO why ?  well because that would be WWIII  !!!

whilst edging closer and closer to that outcome now  its frankly quite insane !!   no dialogue no negations  Russia must surrender unequivocally ?  the country with the largest nuclear arsenal 

will just give up  when really pushed ?

Yes, Ukraine should obviously have just put their arms up and gone completely surrender monkeys because Russia's got nuclear arms.

Everyone, put your weapons down. Putin is knocking on the door and we cannot resist him - he's got nukes!

[johng]

1 hour ago, Inderpland said:

PS. Do you guys have the same standing in your respective families as RFK Jr 'enjoys' in his (i.e. everyone detests him)?

 

More rubbish !

Some of his family don't agree with his opinions

I'm sure some of your family don't agree with your opinions either.

[Inderpland]

6 minutes ago, johng said:

 

More rubbish !

Some of his family don't agree with his opinions

I'm sure some of your family don't agree with your opinions either.

Some?

 

Every Kennedy family member that opposes RFK Jr.'s presidential campaign

[johng]

1 minute ago, Inderpland said:

Everyone, put your weapons down. Putin is knocking on the door and we cannot resist him - he's got nukes!

So has the US,UK,Israel,North Korea,China  etc etc etc  its supposed to be a deterrent  MAD  ( Russia has the most BTW)

don't mess with me and I won't mess with you (or else) except certain participants seen to have forgotten that principle  thinking that one side is just "bluffing"  

 

It is not about "resisting" its about negotiation.

[johng]

3 minutes ago, Inderpland said:

Some?

 

He has a large family   some of them disagree with his policies

do all of your family agree with everything you believe in ?