Why Doesnt "Me Too" Apply to Democrats?

[BangkokReady]

9 minutes ago, SS1 said:

If you look at the video, that is not fast-moving traffic at all. The cars are moving very slowly. The biker is not very going fast either, probably 40km/h max, and his speed difference to the cars is not even big. Most bikers would typically go much faster than that. It's the sudden sideways movement of the car driver that throws him out. 

 

I wouldn't have said very slowly.  The thing is, the speed of the rider is enough that he suddenly appears, and he has no time to make any kind of evasive manoeuvre.  So, by the nature that the car could hit him, he was filtering too fast.  Filtering is not the same as normal riding, because you are very close to the other cars, far less visible, and your speed makes a big difference.

[Digitalbanana]

15 hours ago, snoop1130 said:

shows the motorbike rider travelling in the middle lane behind a car.

That's not what I saw in the video. I saw a motorbike white-lining or lane filtering, always a risky endeavor. I'd surmise both drivers at fault and probably more so the car driver.

[JBChiangRai]

41 minutes ago, SS1 said:

 

One of the special circumstances includes roads with two or more lanes going into the same direction. So it's perfectly legal to undertake on a 3 lane highway, as per section 45 (2) of the traffic act.  

 

No, you missed the qualification, it can only be done when there is no other vehicle behind, there were lots of vehicles behind, even the dashcam.

 

Section 45. No driver shall overtake other conveyance by the left side of the overtaken conveyance, except in the following cases: (1) the conveyance which is going to be overtaken is turning right, or gives right turning signal; (2) such road is divided into two or more lanes of the same direction. The overtaking by the left side of the overtaken conveyance under (1) or (2) may be done only when there is no other conveyance following behind.

Edited 3 hours ago by JBChiangRai
add RTA

[richard_smith237]

21 minutes ago, JBChiangRai said:

 

No, you missed the qualification, it can only be done when there is no other vehicle behind, there were lots of vehicles behind, even the dashcam.

 

Section 45. No driver shall overtake other conveyance by the left side of the overtaken conveyance, except in the following cases: (1) the conveyance which is going to be overtaken is turning right, or gives right turning signal; (2) such road is divided into two or more lanes of the same direction. The overtaking by the left side of the overtaken conveyance under (1) or (2) may be done only when there is no other conveyance following behind.

 

Thai law does not explicitly state that lane splitting (or filtering between cars) is legal. The Land Traffic Act, B.E. 2522 (1979), which governs traffic laws in Thailand, does not contain provisions that either legalize or specifically mention lane splitting for motorcycles.

In essence:

• The law does not explicitly allow lane splitting.
• The law does not explicitly prohibit lane splitting either.

This lack of clarity creates a gray area where the practice is tolerated and widely accepted in everyday traffic. However, it is up to law enforcement's discretion to determine whether specific behaviors while lane splitting, such as reckless or dangerous driving, might violate other general traffic rules (e.g., unsafe driving or not staying in lanes).

In summary, lane splitting is neither clearly legal nor illegal under Thai law—it exists in a regulatory gap.

 

That grey area exists for many issues in Thailand and is the source of many arguments and misunderstandings on this forum. 

 

 

 

 

[KhunBENQ]

15 hours ago, OneMoreFarang said:

There are a couple of problems here.

Indeed. The risky forbidden manouver of the bike rider didn't cost him his life. So he should just stay quiet.

A proper investigation would not be in his favor and he would have to carry his cost alone.

The car driver did a careless lane jump to win some meters and will also take his own cost. But in this country you need a 360 degrees view to notice all the gamblers.

[KhunBENQ]

16 hours ago, Watawattana said:

Attempted murder. 

Attempted suicide.

Just not enough wheels and weight on the opponent.

[khunpin]

From watching the attached vid it looks very intentional. 

Waiting until the bike was right beside, hitting it - and immediately back to the left. 

[OneMoreFarang]

9 minutes ago, richard_smith237 said:

 

Thai law does not explicitly state that lane splitting (or filtering between cars) is legal. The Land Traffic Act, B.E. 2522 (1979), which governs traffic laws in Thailand, does not contain provisions that either legalize or specifically mention lane splitting for motorcycles.

In essence:

• The law does not explicitly allow lane splitting.
• The law does not explicitly prohibit lane splitting either.

This lack of clarity creates a gray area where the practice is tolerated and widely accepted in everyday traffic. However, it is up to law enforcement's discretion to determine whether specific behaviors while lane splitting, such as reckless or dangerous driving, might violate other general traffic rules (e.g., unsafe driving or not staying in lanes).

In summary, lane splitting is neither clearly legal nor illegal under Thai law—it exists in a regulatory gap.

 

That grey area exists for many issues in Thailand and is the source of many arguments and misunderstandings on this forum. 

 

In this case it was illegal for that bike to be on that road. That's it.

After that fact, does it really matter is any additional behavior from the rider was legal or not?

 

 

[richard_smith237]

4 hours ago, LivinLOS said:

Just to be pedantic as a rider who refuses to follow this. 

Thailand doesnt have a law that says bikes must ride in the slow lane, but the police, lawyers, judges and courts seem to think it is the law and apportion blame accordingly. 

Go through the road traffic act and code with a fine tooth comb and no such law exists. There is one line which applies equally to cars bikes and any other road user which says something like 'all vehicles should remain in the leftmost lane unless overtaking'. 

 

I agree with this observation, particularly in reference to roads like Sukhumvit Road in Bangkok. Around a decade ago, motorcyclists were frequently stopped and fined for not staying in the leftmost lane, which was often congested with buses and taxis. As a result, riding in the middle lane became both safer and more practical, with even the rightmost lane being preferable at times. Moreover, in the context of city traffic, the rightmost lanes no longer serve strictly as overtaking lanes, as they would on highways; instead, they have become additional lanes to accommodate the increasing volume of vehicles.

 

However, there are 'certain' roads, underpasses and bridges on which motorcyclists are not permitted. 

 

Regarding this incident - south of Don Muang Airport the central area is a no-go for motorcyclists, at some point north of the Airport motorcyclists are permitted in the central lanes - but I'm not sure at which point this starts. 

 

About eight years ago, I was pulled over and fined 100 baht (after some negotiation) on Vibhavadi Road. I had been riding in the central lanes, coming from the north, and simply stayed there instead of moving to the left. The police officer who stopped me was stationed near one of the signs indicating the lane restrictions, leaving me with no defense. It was clear I was in the wrong lane and should not have been riding in the central lanes at that point.

 

 

 

 

[818Pilot]

As someone that’s been riding for 50+ years and is also a licensed pilot, the issue with most people is they have no Situational Awareness! I blame this on their lack of drivers education and how simple it is for those with licenses to get them.

 

I see this not only with Thai drivers but also with foreigners, expats, and tourists. Growing up in California where lane splitting is legal, there’s a right way and wrong way to do it and this was definitely not the right way. 
 

I'm glad the rider is ok, but both drivers are at blame in this one. 

[JBChiangRai]

20 minutes ago, richard_smith237 said:

 

Thai law does not explicitly state that lane splitting (or filtering between cars) is legal. The Land Traffic Act, B.E. 2522 (1979), which governs traffic laws in Thailand, does not contain provisions that either legalize or specifically mention lane splitting for motorcycles.

In essence:

• The law does not explicitly allow lane splitting.
• The law does not explicitly prohibit lane splitting either.

This lack of clarity creates a gray area where the practice is tolerated and widely accepted in everyday traffic. However, it is up to law enforcement's discretion to determine whether specific behaviors while lane splitting, such as reckless or dangerous driving, might violate other general traffic rules (e.g., unsafe driving or not staying in lanes).

In summary, lane splitting is neither clearly legal nor illegal under Thai law—it exists in a regulatory gap.

 

That grey area exists for many issues in Thailand and is the source of many arguments and misunderstandings on this forum. 

 

 

 

 

I don’t agree, the law describes where you can overtake and it’s almost always the right lane, it can be the left lane under specific circumstances. You are breaking the RTA by passing in the middle because you’re not following the law. I accept you can ride lane splitting, but you must not pass any vehicle if there is traffic behind you.

[richard_smith237]

5 minutes ago, OneMoreFarang said:

 

In this case it was illegal for that bike to be on that road. That's it.

After that fact, does it really matter is any additional behavior from the rider was legal or not?

 

 

It depends on which part of Vibhavadi Road you're referring to. Further north, there is no restriction on motorcyclists using the central lanes. Similarly, when passing Don Muang Airport, the frontage road vanishes, leaving motorcyclists with no other option but to remain in the main lanes.

 

And yes, this distinction matters - because regardless of the legality of the motorcyclist's position, the car driver's actions were still reckless. If the issue you're highlighting is the car's dangerous driving, then the question of whether the motorcyclist was technically in the correct lane becomes less relevant. The real problem lies in the car making an erratic, unsafe lane change without checking for others, which is dangerous regardless of the motorcyclist's lane.

 

Its the same issue when people were blaming the 'riders' (when the Thai pop star) hit the 3 people who'd stopped on the Bridge - regardless of where they stopped, it was still his fault for hitting a stationary object that he 'should have seen' - regardless of whether it was legal for motorcycles to be on that bridge and regardless of whether it was legal to stop on that bridge. 

The motorcyclists 'fault' was separate from the van drivers 'fault' in that example.

 

 

The photo below illustrates a section of southbound Vibhavadi Road, near Don Muang Airport, where there is no frontage road, and motorcyclists are therefore permitted to ride on the main road, which would otherwise be considered the central lanes.

The issue with Vibhavadi Road, however, lies in the inconsistent rules regarding motorcyclists' permission to use the main lanes. The "permission status" seems to switch back and forth along different parts of the road. This lack of consistency is quite characteristic of Thailand's roads and often catches both motorists and motorcyclists off guard.

 

 

 

 

[231778_1469957276]

This is what happens when you have untrained people driving vehicles 

[richard_smith237]

7 minutes ago, JBChiangRai said:

I don’t agree, the law describes where you can overtake and it’s almost always the right lane, it can be the left lane under specific circumstances. You are breaking the RTA by passing in the middle because you’re not following the law. I accept you can ride lane splitting, but you must not pass any vehicle if there is traffic behind you.

 

Which makes no sense, because in almost every situation there is 'traffic behind you'... 

 

Thus: as pointed out, there no specific mention in the Land Traffic Act that makes the act of lane splitting illegal, though neither is there a mention that makes the act of lane splitting legal - thus, that style of riding remains within the 'grey area' of police discretion.

 

In other countries where lane splitting is legal, it is so below certain speeds - i.e when traffic starts to alter from free flowing to queueing traffic etc. 

 

For example the law varies in the United States:

California: Lane splitting is legal, and while there is no specific speed limit, it is advised that motorcyclists should not exceed the speed of surrounding traffic by more than 10 mph (16 km/h) and should not exceed 30 mph (48 km/h) in total.

 

In Other States: Some other states allow lane splitting under certain conditions, but it varies widely, local state laws apply.

 

In Australia: New South Wales and Queensland: Lane filtering is legal, with speed limits generally set at 30 km/h (about 18.6 mph) when filtering through stationary or slow-moving traffic.

[Liverpool Lou]

17 hours ago, Watawattana said:

Attempted murder. 

Nonsense.

[OneMoreFarang]

4 minutes ago, richard_smith237 said:

If the issue you're highlighting is the car's dangerous driving, then the question of whether the motorcyclist was technically in the correct lane becomes less relevant. The real problem lies in the car making an erratic, unsafe lane change without checking for others, which is dangerous regardless of the motorcyclist's lane.

 

I disagree.

If the car driver looked regularly in his mirrors, then then he saw for some time the same car in the lane to the right behind him.

10 time looking, 10 times it was there, maybe with the same distance.

One more time looking, and the car was still in the same location, but in the last second or so a bike squeezed into the location, which is not visible with normal mirrors, the dead spot.

Obviously, the car driver should have turned his head before changing the lane. But I have to admit, I am not sure how many of us would have done that in this situation. I give myself a 50/50 chance. 

 

I didn't find a better picture. The biker was in that dead zone.

 

 

 

[Liverpool Lou]

3 hours ago, ronster said:

Looks pretty deliberate as the sudden speed increase to the right and back again doesn't really match the speed or way someone would move if going to the next lane .

What "sudden speed increase" does the cam show?  Do you mean "swerve"?

[mdr224]

When i was there i often thought the dangerous maneuvers they do there were intentional, i later realized nope theyre just bad at driving

[ronster]

1 minute ago, Liverpool Lou said:

What "sudden speed increase" does the cam show?  Do you mean "swerve"?

Yes , but in doing so it speeds up compared to all the surrounding traffic and the speed of it doesn't resemble speed of someone just moving into the next lane .

[Watawattana]

9 minutes ago, Liverpool Lou said:

Nonsense.

Calm down...

[Liverpool Lou]

2 hours ago, Robbkk said:

Nobody going to mention that the driver just casually sped away after hiting the motorbike?

Several posters mentioned it, as did the OP.

Edited 1 hour ago by Liverpool Lou

[richard_smith237]

5 minutes ago, OneMoreFarang said:

 

I disagree.

If the car driver looked regularly in his mirrors, then then he saw for some time the same car in the lane to the right behind him.

10 time looking, 10 times it was there, maybe with the same distance.

One more time looking, and the car was still in the same location, but in the last second or so a bike squeezed into the location, which is not visible with normal mirrors, the dead spot.

Obviously, the car driver should have turned his head before changing the lane. But I have to admit, I am not sure how many of us would have done that in this situation. I give myself a 50/50 chance. 

 

I didn't find a better picture. The biker was in that dead zone.

 

 

Regardless - the car driver is still at fault...  no checking of the blind spot (as you highlighted).

 

I do agree with your earlier comment, when driving and especially when riding minimal time should be spend in the blind spot of any driver.

 

 

Regarding checking our blind spots - its easy to become complacent and I'm sure there are times, when under similar circumstances, I chance lanes and a 'motorcyclist' could have sped into the 'blind zone' without my noticing.

However, I do remind mself to 'shoulder check'....  in motorcycling terms its called a life saver... and has saved me, but also nearly caused me an accident when I 'shoulder checked' (on a motorcycle) turned my forwards again and the car I was following was braking hard, middle lane, no apparent reason...   clear traffic... he just slammed on his brakes for some reason.

I was able to stop, but i was lucked I'd carried out the 'shoulder check' as there was another car speeding up the right most lane into which I was about to lane change. 

 

One rule when driving (and riding a motorcycle) in Thailand that I learned very early on - never make and fast or sudden lane changes....   this allows the other motorcyclists who want to continue to pass you, to flow around you 'like water' as they say.

 

[RethairedJarhead]

23 years investigating traffic accidents and fatalities in the States.
 

My take: Fault 50-50 (causual)

 

Driver- failed to signal lane change.

Rider- unsafe movement for conditions.

Many people, assuming the driver never stopped… that information is not available in the clip or this article. Uninformed accusation or withholding information?

 

Ignoring 100% of any blame, the lucky rider finished in the bushes rather than oncoming traffic… wise to change his riding style (and perhaps his underwear)… and driver signal before changing lanes. 
 

Bikes have it tougher and require a higher level of situational awareness because at the end of the day, when two objects try to occupy the same space, bikes get the worst of it 99% of the time!

Edited 1 hour ago by RethairedJarhead

[Tarteso]

Hit and run.. Classic!

[Liverpool Lou]

2 hours ago, Elkski said:

Bikers lucky.  Mostly bikers fault.  Car did fail to signal for appropriate time, distance, or at all.  

What is the required time and distance for signalling under Thai law?

[richard_smith237]

7 minutes ago, ronster said:

Yes , but in doing so it speeds up compared to all the surrounding traffic and the speed of it doesn't resemble speed of someone just moving into the next lane .

 

The driving behavour of the MG changing lanes, seems to be that of someone 'diving into the space' - it does appear to accelerate into the space and swerve more quickly than drivers tend to change lanes....  

... I think its just very poor driving...  I don't think he was aware the motorcyclist was there at all. 

 

BUT... with certainty, after the 'reckless; manoeuvre the driver knew they'd caused an accident, it is the response afterwards which is despicable. 

 

5 meters later on and the motorcyclists would have flipped into the concrete at 40kmh - deadly perhaps. 

Props to the mini-truck driver for stopping and getting out to help. 

....And....   The motorcyclist himself - that was quite a spiderman-esque dismount into the bushes, quite athletic !

[richard_smith237]

Just now, Liverpool Lou said:

What is the required time and distance for signalling under Thai law?

 

Under the Traffic Act B.E. 2522 (1979): Turning and Lane Changes: Drivers must signal at least 30 meters (approximately 100 feet) before making a turn or changing lanes. 

[NoDisplayName]

17 hours ago, Watawattana said:

Attempted murder. 

 

Attempted suicide.

 

Lane splitting at high speed on a highway where bikes are banned.

 

Hopefully the police will catch the bike rider and he can pay for any damage to the car.

[denishuahin]

UK , Look, indicate & action.  Thai : don't look , action and sometimes indicate after.

This could also be " I'm important" , you can't overtake me. 

[rocketboy2]

A normal hit and run, it's a daily occurrence on the roads of Thailand.

No one cares at all. 

 

 

Edited 53 minutes ago by rocketboy2