So the U.S. elected an autocrat -- what to expect next from a Hungarian perspective

[Jingthing]

The Trump / Maga autocratic (anti-democratic) movement is modeled after the success of Orban of Hungary to destroy democracy there. So now that the U.S. voters have done what they have done, it's wise to not only learn from history in a general sense, but more specifically to learn from recent Hungarian history.

 

I Watched Orbán Destroy Hungary’s Democracy. Here’s My Advice for the Trump Era. - POLITICO

 

Many believed that after his first term as president, Donald Trump would end up in the dustbin of history. Now Trump is back, and the United States is about to be ruled for the second time by a right-wing populist.

 

Trump’s goal this time is to remake the American government to enhance his power. He isn’t the first modern right-wing populist to attempt this — he is following a playbook pioneered by Hungary’s Viktor Orbán. I lived through Orbán’s power grab as a member of Hungary’s parliament and have been researching populism since. I’ve learned a few things along the way that might help Trump’s opponents understand how he won and how they can fight back.

[KhunLA]

Dude, you really need to get a life, away from Trump.

 

You are comparing a career politician, presently the longest running PM, and at that one position, for 14 years.

 

Apples & oranges beyond belief.  USA president, 2 terms at the most, which very few serve.  That's why Yanks have term limits.  Unfortunately, it doesn't extend to Congress.

 

His last term, if he finishes, as he'll be 82, and done with politics.   Wasn't into politics before the first term, and didn't change much.  A few SCOTUS appointments, but no different if it would have been another Rep in office.

 

He's one person, and as seen, Congress has to agree with anything he does, or he can try to lead by 'executive orders', which have expiration dates, or simply voided by the next administration.  

 

Unless re-elected (not in his case again), and sadly it does happen, but idiot presidents only serve 1 administration of 4 years, which you know, so really can't change much.

 

You know all this, so why do you persist with your silliness ?

[Gsxrnz]

It's the denial of the existence of left-wing authoritarianism that has caused the Leftists to get their knickers in an almighty twist. They are in absolute denial that left-wing authoritarianism is a "thing", despite the overwhelming historical evidence.

 

They also fail to realize that right-wingers absolutely detest pervasive authority of any kind. Leftists require rules and authority to govern their lives, because they are incapable of successfully managing their lives - indeed they are incapable of managing their own emotions, as is self-evident.

 

Ironically, it is the right-wingers detest for authority that would prevent any authoritarian government from going too far. The latest election proves it. Oh wait...authoritarianism can't exist on the left. A circular conundrum.

 

Sic semper tyrannisc. 

 

Edit: Some reading material for the OP. 0% chance it will be read, but...

 

How Experts Overlooked Left-Wing Authoritarianism - The Atlantic

Edited 4 hours ago by Gsxrnz

[oxo1947]

36 minutes ago, KhunLA said:

Dude, you really need to get a life, away from Trump.

 

 

I seriously agree mate--he needs to take a small holiday or something  because he is being consumed by it all.  And the mad thing is he had 4 years under Trump survived ---try to reflect on that, and the fact that no one on here reads a posting about Dem's Vs Reps and suddenly says  "Oh yer never thought of it that way---think I'll change my mind on it all"

[Captain Flack]

Some troll posts attacking the OP has been removed. Discuss the topic, if you have an opinion, not the poster.

[Gsxrnz]

3 minutes ago, oxo1947 said:

 

 

I seriously agree mate--he needs to take a small holiday or something  because he is being consumed by it all.  And the mad thing is he had 4 years under Trump survived ---try to reflect on that, and the fact that no one on here reads a posting about Dem's Vs Reps and suddenly says  "Oh yer never thought of it that way---think I'll change my mind on it all"

 

Total agreeance from me.  It would be understandable if an intelligent argument was opined. But it's just emotive rants.  The Left need the Right, and vice-versa. Without a counterbalance, either side can and do resort to tyranny - but this is counterintuitive to dyed in the wool over emotional Leftists.

 

 

[Yagoda]

The Hungarian people knowingly and fairly elected Orban. His policies have the approval of the people.

 

His opponents do not.

 

Same with Trump.

 

There are winners and there are losers.

[Gsxrnz]

This is how Leftism works.

 

My Mum is Welsh, My Dad is Hungarian.

 

I identify as well hung. 

[Jingthing]

24 minutes ago, Gsxrnz said:

It's the denial of the existence of left-wing authoritarianism that has caused the Leftists to get their knickers in an almighty twist. They are in absolute denial that left-wing authoritarianism is a "thing", despite the overwhelming historical evidence.

 

They also fail to realize that right-wingers absolutely detest pervasive authority of any kind. Leftists require rules and authority to govern their lives, because they are incapable of successfully managing their lives - indeed they are incapable of managing their own emotions, as is self-evident.

 

Ironically, it is the right-wingers detest for authority that would prevent any authoritarian government from going too far. The latest election proves it. Oh wait...authoritarianism can't exist on the left. A circular conundrum.

 

Sic semper tyrannisc. 

 

Edit: Some reading material for the OP. 0% chance it will be read, but...

 

How Experts Overlooked Left-Wing Authoritarianism - The Atlantic

I find your post bizarre, disingenuous, and off topic as it's obviously a fact that autocratic regimes can occur from the left and the right. It would be total idiocy for anyone to deny that.

This topic certainly doesn't deny that.. 

However the fact in question here is about autocratic regimes in the USA and Hungary both of which happen to be right wing movements.

[Hummin]

1 hour ago, Jingthing said:

The Trump / Maga autocratic (anti-democratic) movement is modeled after the success of Orban of Hungary to destroy democracy there. So now that the U.S. voters have done what they have done, it's wise to not only learn from history in a general sense, but more specifically to learn from recent Hungarian history.

 

I Watched Orbán Destroy Hungary’s Democracy. Here’s My Advice for the Trump Era. - POLITICO

 

Many believed that after his first term as president, Donald Trump would end up in the dustbin of history. Now Trump is back, and the United States is about to be ruled for the second time by a right-wing populist.

 

Trump’s goal this time is to remake the American government to enhance his power. He isn’t the first modern right-wing populist to attempt this — he is following a playbook pioneered by Hungary’s Viktor Orbán. I lived through Orbán’s power grab as a member of Hungary’s parliament and have been researching populism since. I’ve learned a few things along the way that might help Trump’s opponents understand how he won and how they can fight back.

The most interesting part is not Trump himself, but who he brings to the table. 

 

Trump denied he had any relations to Project 2025, and now ? 

 

Trump’s cabinet is filling up with Project 2025 authors despite him saying he has ‘no idea’ what it is

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/us-politics/trump-project-2025-russell-vought-brendan-carr-b2650943.html

 

Quite interesting, or? 

 

 

[Yagoda]

8 minutes ago, Jingthing said:

I find your post bizarre, disingenuous, and off topic as it's obviously a fact that autocratic regimes can occur from the left and the right. It would be total idiocy for anyone to deny that.

This topic certainly doesn't deny that.. 

However the fact in question here is about autocratic regimes in the USA and Hungary both of which happen to be right wing movements.

Nothing wrong with right wing movements, they arent necessarily authoritarian like Leftist movements are. A true democratic republic by its very nature is right wing. American democracy is "right wing". 

 

After all, most of the death, hate, violence and destruction in this world is the result of the Left. 

[Yagoda]

5 minutes ago, Hummin said:

The most interesting part is not Trump himself, but who he brings to the table. 

 

Trump denied he had any relations to Project 2025, and now ? 

 

Trump’s cabinet is filling up with Project 2025 authors despite him saying he has ‘no idea’ what it is

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/us-politics/trump-project-2025-russell-vought-brendan-carr-b2650943.html

 

Quite interesting, or? 

 

 

Or.

 

The conspiratorial based Left have wild imaginations as usual.

[Hummin]

6 minutes ago, Yagoda said:

Or.

 

The conspiratorial based Left have wild imaginations as usual.

How can it be conspiratorial when he denies knowing what project 2025 is, and then the first thing he do, is to hire them for key roles in his stab? 

 

You guys lives in denial, 

 

This is nothing about leftism, it is about what he do or not do, and what he says and not say. Everything you guys have for defence, is leftism, and it is kind of making the whole debate stupid, and more stupid

Edited 3 hours ago by Hummin

[connda]

You people who hate Trump with a vengeance are so butt-hurt that just like between 2016 to Jan 2021, all we are going to hear from you is "Trump Is Literally Hitler." 

Had Harris won, I really would not have liked it, just like when Biden won.  Not because I'm a Trump supporter, but because I detest the type of progressive liberalism that these people represent and promote.  But!  I didn't have a meltdown and lose my sh*t over the Biden win, and had Harris/Waltz won I wouldn't have lost my sh*t over that either.

Very honestly.  Do you people suffer from some kind of deep-seated psychological issues that manifest in this almost suicidal angst and loathing when everything doesn't go your way? This is what spoiled little children do - throw temper tantrums when they don't get their way. That's an honest question because your reactions are not those of mature adults who can cope.  Your reactions are infantile to the point of absurdity.

Trump won, Harris lost.  A Trump administration will government, probably with a Republican Senate and House for the next 2 to 4 years.  House elections are again in 2026 and presidential elections in 2028 (if this planet isn't a smoking frozen post-nuclear holocaust ball of ice).

I mean really - grow up and act like mature adults.

[Hummin]

5 minutes ago, connda said:

You people who hate Trump with a vengeance are so butt-hurt that just like between 2016 to Jan 2021, all we are going to hear from you is "Trump Is Literally Hitler." 

Had Harris won, I really would not have liked it, just like when Biden won.  Not because I'm a Trump supporter, but because I detest the type of progressive liberalism that these people represent and promote.  But!  I didn't have a meltdown and lose my sh*t over the Biden win, and had Harris/Waltz won I wouldn't have lost my sh*t over that either.

Very honestly.  Do you people suffer from some kind of deep-seated psychological issues that manifest in this almost suicidal angst and loathing when everything doesn't go your way? This is what spoiled little children do - throw temper tantrums when they don't get their way. That's an honest question because your reactions are not those of mature adults who can cope.  Your reactions are infantile to the point of absurdity.

Trump won, Harris lost.  A Trump administration will government, probably with a Republican Senate and House for the next 2 to 4 years.  House elections are again in 2026 and presidential elections in 2028 (if this planet isn't a smoking frozen post-nuclear holocaust ball of ice).

I mean really - grow up and act like mature adults.

You really add to an healthy debate, great contribution to prove my point. You guys see ghosts where there is no ghosts, and the only thing left, is to see what Trump actually do, or not do. 

 

And it seems he started just as we thought he would, hiring people to key roles from the authors behind project 2025. Congratulatios 😄

 

One lie more to come

oh forgot,  stop the war with a phone call after 24 hours after he won the election

 

Next he hires another putin lover Tulsi Gabbard, and more to come

Edited 3 hours ago by Hummin

[Yagoda]

25 minutes ago, Hummin said:

How can it be conspiratorial when he denies knowing what project 2025 is, and then the first thing he do, is to hire them for key roles in his stab? 

 

You guys lives in denial, 

 

This is nothing about leftism, it is about what he do or not do, and what he says and not say. Everything you guys have for defence, is leftism, and it is kind of making the whole debate stupid, and more stupid

I dont live in denial of anything, because I have READ and studied history and politics and dont live in a media bubble.

 

There isnt one person here who has read Project 2025 and can point to one thing that is objectionable from the perspective of a decent, normal human being.  All we get is regurgitated propaganda.

 

So you tell me, whats wrong with Project 2025. In your own words (ha, watch).

 

Here is how it apparently works: Joe Scarbourough or Whoopi Goldberg or Hillary Clinton the DNC or some other substantiated liar says Project 2025 is bad. Some Leftist cadre repeats that on a message Board. Now they all shout it. None have ever read it. None can tell you why it is bad. But when Trump hires someone who wrote a footnote in the document, who the Left will compare to Jeffrey Dahmer Torquemada, that means he is about to reimpose slavery and forced conversion of homosexuals.

Edited 3 hours ago by Yagoda

[300sd]

Reading some of the crying on here, and elsewhere, because of 4 years of a 

Trump administration reminds me of this joke, or is it a joke:

 

"Mom, I think when I become a man I want to be a liberal. Well you'll have to decide, you can't be both",

 

 

[Captain Flack]

Another off topic personal attack on the OP has been removed.

 

If you can’t post your opinion on the topic and only choose to attack the OP, I will not only removed the post, but also start giving time outs.

[Hummin]

7 minutes ago, Yagoda said:

I dont live in denial of anything, because I have READ and studied history and politics and dont live in a media bubble.

 

There isnt one person here who has read Project 2025 and can point to one thing that is objectionable from the perspective of a decent, normal human being.  All we get is regurgitated propaganda.

 

So you tell me, whats wrong with Project 2025. In your own words (ha, watch).

 

Here is how it apparently works: Joe Scarbourough or Whoopi Goldberg or Hillary Clinton the DNC or some other substantiated liar says Project 2025 is bad. Some Leftist cadre repeats that on a message Board. Now they all shout it. None have ever read it. None can tell you why it is bad. But when Trump hires someone who wrote a footnote in the document, who the Left will compare to Jeffrey Dahmer Torquemada, that means he is about to reimpose slavery and forced conversion of homosexuals.

you really do not get my point do you ? 

 

 

[dinsdale]

When will this constant anti-Trump rhetoric be done with. The radical progressive woke left, the entirety of the legacy media and all who repeat their anti-Trump messaging along with all those who said Trump will never win (including on here) have been completely demoralized. I would have thought it's now time for introspection rather than a continuance of the same asinine ramblings which in part helped Trump to victory.

[Yagoda]

11 minutes ago, Hummin said:

you really do not get my point do you ? 

 

 

No, what is your point?

[mokwit]

1 hour ago, Gsxrnz said:

It's the denial of the existence of left-wing authoritarianism that has caused the Leftists to get their knickers in an almighty twist. They are in absolute denial that left-wing authoritarianism is a "thing", despite the overwhelming historical evidence.

 

They also fail to realize that right-wingers absolutely detest pervasive authority of any kind. Leftists require rules and authority to govern their lives, because they are incapable of successfully managing their lives - indeed they are incapable of managing their own emotions, as is self-evident.

 

Ironically, it is the right-wingers detest for authority that would prevent any authoritarian government from going too far. The latest election proves it. Oh wait...authoritarianism can't exist on the left. A circular conundrum.

 

Sic semper tyrannisc. 

 

Edit: Some reading material for the OP. 0% chance it will be read, but...

 

How Experts Overlooked Left-Wing Authoritarianism - The Atlantic

Not only this but the capture of the institutions is undemocratic, we are having political extremism forced upon us by undemocratic means.

[Hummin]

3 minutes ago, dinsdale said:

When will this constant anti-Trump rhetoric be done with. The radical progressive woke left, the entirety of the legacy media and all who repeat their anti-Trump messaging along with all those who said Trump will never win (including on here) have been completely demoralized. I would have thought it's now time for introspection rather than a continuance of the same asinine ramblings which in part helped Trump to victory.

Again we who have an healthy critical view on Trump is no woke leftist, and it is making the whole debate shift to a level where there is nothing to debate about anymore. It is all about what Trumps says he will do, and what he actually do. If you want to contribute to make this debate more stupid, and show your real face, please do, but seriously, it doesnt contribute to anything else than a bull pie contest. 

[dinsdale]

2 minutes ago, Hummin said:

Again we who have an healthy critical view on Trump is no woke leftist, and it is making the whole debate shift to a level where there is nothing to debate about anymore. It is all about what Trumps says he will do, and what he actually do. If you want to contribute to make this debate more stupid, and show your real face, please do, but seriously, it doesnt contribute to anything else than a bull pie contest. 

If you voted for Harris or supported Harris then you supported the radical progressive woke agenda that the Democrats represent.  If they do not move back to the centre and try to regain the working and middle classes their chance of re-election is nil. As for all the negative projection toward Trump it's pure speculation and a continuation of the legacy media "message". Nothing wrong with a "healthy critical view" as long as it's founded and not simply speculative.

[Hummin]

4 minutes ago, dinsdale said:

If you voted for Harris or supported Harris then you supported the radical progressive woke agenda that the Democrats represent.  If they do not move back to the centre and try to regain the working and middle classes their chance of re-election is nil. As for all the negative projection toward Trump it's pure speculation and a continuation of the legacy media "message". Nothing wrong with a "healthy critical view" as long as it's founded and not simply speculative.

I didnt vote for anything, and same as many trump voters, voted for trump even they did not agree, they saw two evils, but had to chose one. 

 

American politics is pretty much as an american wrestling match with two opponements who speaks bull pie, and it is all ending in bull pie, and it is you guys who vote who create the beast, and politicians perform for you to win your vote. Basically you get what you deserve 

[dinsdale]

59 minutes ago, connda said:

You people who hate Trump with a vengeance are so butt-hurt that just like between 2016 to Jan 2021, all we are going to hear from you is "Trump Is Literally Hitler." 

Had Harris won, I really would not have liked it, just like when Biden won.  Not because I'm a Trump supporter, but because I detest the type of progressive liberalism that these people represent and promote.  But!  I didn't have a meltdown and lose my sh*t over the Biden win, and had Harris/Waltz won I wouldn't have lost my sh*t over that either.

Very honestly.  Do you people suffer from some kind of deep-seated psychological issues that manifest in this almost suicidal angst and loathing when everything doesn't go your way? This is what spoiled little children do - throw temper tantrums when they don't get their way. That's an honest question because your reactions are not those of mature adults who can cope.  Your reactions are infantile to the point of absurdity.

Trump won, Harris lost.  A Trump administration will government, probably with a Republican Senate and House for the next 2 to 4 years.  House elections are again in 2026 and presidential elections in 2028 (if this planet isn't a smoking frozen post-nuclear holocaust ball of ice).

I mean really - grow up and act like mature adults.

I've quoted you @connda because this is very worthy of being repeated. 

[Yagoda]

30 minutes ago, mokwit said:

Not only this but the capture of the institutions is undemocratic, we are having political extremism forced upon us by undemocratic means.

Exactly. And on others. On the world. To OUR detriment as a nation. Like our Government spending millions of our tax dollars to promote homosexuality and abortion in deeply religious countries. Makes us look not only evil, but stupid.

[Yagoda]

17 minutes ago, Hummin said:

I didnt vote for anything, and same as many trump voters, voted for trump even they did not agree, they saw two evils, but had to chose one. 

 

American politics is pretty much as an american wrestling match with two opponements who speaks bull pie, and it is all ending in bull pie, and it is you guys who vote who create the beast, and politicians perform for you to win your vote. Basically you get what you deserve 

Sure, but as I should have mentioned before (again) you as a non American dont have the basic knowledge or information necessary for you to make an informed judgement on US politics, so all you have left is to insult us.

[Jingthing]

57 minutes ago, 300sd said:

Reading some of the crying on here, and elsewhere, because of 4 years of a 

Trump administration reminds me of this joke, or is it a joke:

 

"Mom, I think when I become a man I want to be a liberal. Well you'll have to decide, you can't be both",

 

 

With no due respect that is dumb.

A person's political ideology and their gender identity.are separate matters 

I do understand the Trumpist efforts to associate support of him with toxic masculinity though. 

[save the frogs]

22 minutes ago, Hummin said:

American politics is pretty much as an american wrestling match with two opponements who speaks bull pie

 

No, that's only what is presented in the daily rags.

But behind the scenes, it doesn't work that way.

 

Not sure why they do that. Maybe they don't have much respect for the average voter so they just feed them bread and circuses.

 

Again, I'm not sure any average person knows what Trump will do or what Harris would have done. 

But keep arguing if it makes you feel better. 

 

Also, if you put a gun to most people's heads, they wouldn't know where to begin on how to run a country. 

 

Edited 2 hours ago by save the frogs