Tax Filing Experience: Jomtien [March-2025]

[andre47]

25 minutes ago, rough diamond said:

Which country's bank statements are you talking about?

I assume they can get Thai statements but they cannot get, for example, UK statements without a court order. 

Thai statements - of cause

If the taxpayer claims that their remittances to Thailand originate from assets earned in previous years, the tax office may request evidence/receipts. Foreign bank statements may also be required. If these requirements are not met, the tax office may assess the taxpayer's taxable income. Of course, legal action can be taken against the assessment, but the court will also want to see the receipts.

[digger70]

On 3/11/2025 at 6:21 PM, aldriglikvid said:

Hi, 

 

Tax Situation: 

 

- Became a Tax Resident according to the 180 day rule late 2023 

- Transferred a 8 digit number to acquire a condo in early 2024

- Said sum existed, and had been taxed, in 'home country' bank account and brokerage account pre-2024 (2020, 2021, 2022, 2023 etc.) 

- The only income in 2024 is dividends from Thai companies, held in a Thai brokerage - and which withholding tax has already been deducted 

 

From my understanding, there's no assessable income here. (there seems to be contradicting info: if the transfers are sizable enough, they need to be disclosed regardless earned pre-2024?) 

 

Anyhow. Went to the Tax Office today, in Jomtien (Chonburi). I was immediately asked for my banking statements to even process my filing or getting a TIN. She kept hitting this subject, aggressively so, about my banking statements for 2024. Furthermore, she asked if I owned property that I rent out - and if I traded crypto. Hadn't mentioned any of it. Very uncomfortable setting. Essentially, my experience mirrored the most cynical and satirical approach created on this forum. 

 

As I didn't have the banking statements printed (nor wanted to show them), the meeting was over. 

 

I'm now left with two options: 

 

- Not file at all.

 

- Produce end-of-year banking & brokerage statements from my home country and hope that would be sufficient. My hesitation is rather large right now, after the meeting today. 

 

Don't worry Be Happy .

Don't file tax Return ,Wait. for a few years than they may have sorted out this mess and maybe they know by then what they are suppose to be doing regarding what one can do /or not. 

I  wait ,and see what happens .  🙏

[motdaeng]

8 hours ago, aldriglikvid said:

I had the prepared withholding tax document from my Thai bank and the withholding tax from my Thai broker with me. And a copy of my bankbook, TM30, visa and passport. I don't know how to make this much clearer: they wouldn't even entertain giving me or anyone else a TIN without showing my banking statements first. It was literally posted on the wall at several places. 

The post said: 

"Foreigner that want a TIN need to supply the following documents: Banking Statements 2024, TM30, Visa, Passport"  

 

thanks for your response! it looks like you went very well-prepared with all documents ...

 

maybe try a different tax office or the main TRD office in your province ... good luck!

 

btw, in more than 10 years, my family (4 separate tax filings) has never had to submit a "bank statement" to the TRD,

only the bank documents of the withholding tax ...

[mudcat]

14 hours ago, khunPer said:

The official tax rules for foreigner's income tax...

 

 

 

The training and ability of front-line Thai Revenue Department employees is abysmal.  The initial person we interacted with took the leap between determination of whether our income is assessible and beginning to fish for our U.S. income and  pulling out her calculator. I blame the above power point presentation that simplifies an enormously complex area of tax law together with the apparent inability to read either the Thai or English version of the applicable treaty.  

 

After an unpleasant back and forth with her including providing our English/Thai extracts of the Thai-U.S. tax convention she continued to maintain that somehow we owed taxes on our income and remittances.  We demanded to see her supervisor whom we had interacted with before when we were considering moving pre-2024 savings who, after consulting with one of their staff attorneys recognized that my U.S. Social Security and local U.S. government pension were in fact as described in Sections 20 and 21 of the aforementioned treaty and not subject to Thai taxes, and were further more carved out for the standard savings clause in Section 1 paragraph 3a and 3b.  I attach the relevant sections from the Thai-U.S. treaty.

 

Once we were all on the same pages, smiles all around except for her minion who kept her head down as we left.   

[Andycoops]

16 hours ago, timendres said:

My situation is not the norm. I have a TIN and filed tax returns for 10 years due to being employed.

Now retired, my social security from the US is not assessable.

I had 90,000 THB of royalty income, which is less than my deductions - so I owe no tax.

I am filing anyway.

Why? Because I am half convinced that within a year or two, you will need to show a tax filing to get an extension.

 

I used the same accountant I have had for years. She completed the form and submitted it for me.

 

That said, I wish every foreigner would go to the revenue department and tie up their resources for hours on end asking the most inane questions known to man. Because I do not think they will get the revenues they think they are going to get, and thus will abandon the experiment post haste.

I agree, I am only filing (next week) because I too can see that proof of filing a tax return if you are here as a expat on yearly extensions is more likely than not, to be a future requirement to obtain said 1 year extension.

[bamnutsak]

1 hour ago, mudcat said:

Once we were all on the same pages, smiles all around

 

What was your Accessible Income deemed to be, by the supervisor after the acceptable exclusions?

 

Did you end up having to pay any tax?

 

 

[hunkidori]

On 3/11/2025 at 9:19 PM, offset said:

Is the interest earned on savings before 2024 in the UK taxable in Thailand 

Just wondered why you would tell them anything to do with your UK affairs. Nothing to do with them at all.

[anrcaccount]

On 3/11/2025 at 6:42 PM, petermik said:

Forget about it...let them contact you 👍

Well said.

I suspect he'll be waiting a long time, for a call that will never come!

 

[mudcat]

All my U.S. income is exempt from taxes as both my Social Security benefit and local government district pension are taxable only in the source country (in the U.S. Section 20.2  and Section 21.2a) both of which are excluded from Article 1's savings clause under 1.3a and 1.3b.  

 

I have been retired for more than 10-years and we live comfortably on my non-assessible U.S. income. 

 

My direct deposited Social Security benefit, which as it's source is taxable only in the U.S. is not taxable in Thailand when remitted and its exemption flows from the source and is not determined by its remittance mode or destination, in our case our living expenses here. 

My local government pension is likewise taxable only in the U.S. and its exemption flows from its source and is not determined by its remittance mode or destination when I make ATM withdrawals, credit card purchases here or there, or any other use or mode.

 

We move all of our pre-2024 cash savings here last year and confirmed that these two transfer were not assessible - we did keep meticulous records of the source and paths to our respective Thai bank accounts (one in Baht, one in Dollars.)

 

We have simplified our U.S.  investment accounts into two accounts that I have no need to touch until either I leave or die (when they are non-assessable either under the Inheritance Tax Act or the Revenue Code.  

 

One of the reasons we went to the TRD provincial office was to have my wife understand the steps she will need to take to reclaim any withheld interest in subsequent years (none was withheld in 2024, so no need to file this year).  

 

I believe that the TRD has left their staff with a misleading document that appears to instruct their agents to use the Credit method to determine taxes due (see p.6 of the power point).  The correct instruction for U.S. persons (and probably others) is to describe both the exemption and credit methods as shown below.  Possibly the font size was too small, or there were too many words on a single page.

 

[bamnutsak]

3 minutes ago, mudcat said:

I have been retired for more than 10-years and we live comfortably on my non-assessible U.S. income. 

 

 

 

6 minutes ago, mudcat said:

so no need to file this year

 

 

So, in summary...

 

Did you file a return?

 

 

[mudcat]

3 minutes ago, bamnutsak said:

 

 

 

 

So, in summary...

 

Did you file a return?

 

 

Not necessary - wanted to have my wife start with a better understanding of filing when the banks start to withhold interest.  Also wanted to confirm that the largish ($60K) transfer were correctly documented and I was applying the Thai-U.S. DTA and my LTR exemptions correctly.

[bamnutsak]

Just now, mudcat said:

Not necessary

 

Thank you.

 

Did you receive any documentation that might satisfy the requirement to prove - to Immigration, which we're told by some here may demand proof of tax compliance, during an annual extension of stay.

 

 

[worgeordie]

Who willingly goes to see the tax man or woman in this case

 

regards worgeordie

[mudcat]

6 minutes ago, bamnutsak said:

 

Thank you.

 

Did you receive any documentation that might satisfy the requirement to prove - to Immigration, which we're told by some here may demand proof of tax compliance, during an annual extension of stay.

 

 

I am going to file jointly with my wife - which should show I believe I am in compliance and that return has been accepted

.I am on a long term resident visa - my obligation to Immigration is limited to annual reporting (if I do not leave the Kingdom) and a re-qualification at five-years.  

[mudcat]

8 minutes ago, worgeordie said:

Who willingly goes to see the tax man or woman in this case

 

regards worgeordie

Someone who has a strong position, but whose wife is easily bullied by Thai officialdom.    

[bamnutsak]

3 minutes ago, mudcat said:

I am going to file jointly with my wife

 

15 minutes ago, mudcat said:

Not necessary

 

 

OK, I'm confused.

 

 

5 minutes ago, mudcat said:

I am on a long term resident visa

 

Aren't LTR Visa holders exempt from tax?

[mudcat]

43 minutes ago, bamnutsak said:

 

 

 

OK, I'm confused.

 

 

 

Aren't LTR Visa holders exempt from tax?

Well, that is what the BoI maintains, but the language in Section 5 is not as clear as I would want to rely on exclusively.

[bamnutsak]

6 minutes ago, mudcat said:

Well, that is what the BoI maintains, but the language in Section 5 is not as clear as I would want to rely on exclusively.

 

I was confused about whether you're going to file a return or not.

 

You said it was "not necessary", and then said you were "going to file with your wife".

 

 

 

IMO, the most important questions to answer in an "RD Trip Report" are

 

What was your Assessible Income? Including what was excluded.

 

Did you file a return?

 

Did you owe tax?

 

Do you have proof that you satisfied your tax filing obligation? (If you did not file.)

 

[mudcat]

42 minutes ago, bamnutsak said:

 

I was confused about whether you're going to file a return or not.

 

You said it was "not necessary", and then said you were "going to file with your wife".

 

 

 

IMO, the most important questions to answer in an "RD Trip Report" are

 

What was your Assessible Income? Including what was excluded.

 

Did you file a return?

 

Did you owe tax?

 

Do you have proof that you satisfied your tax filing obligation? (If you did not file.)

 

I was speaking proactively as to filing with my wife next year - my name will be on the return
 

[OJAS]

7 hours ago, Andycoops said:

I agree, I am only filing (next week) because I too can see that proof of filing a tax return if you are here as a expat on yearly extensions is more likely than not, to be a future requirement to obtain said 1 year extension.

 

It is conceivable that the necessary proof might take the form of a tax clearance certificate. If so, applying for and obtaining one would clearly mean yet more bureaucratic hoops needing to be jumped through at annual extension of stay time if this link is to be believed!

 

https://magnacarta.co.th/home/faq-section-2/thailand-tax-clearance-certificate/

 

[khunPer]

21 hours ago, jwest10 said:

No need to fill in a tax form and your personal allowances is 500 K and inxome much less than that!!

Actually your need to file a tax return form – I've even had a meeting this week with the Revenue Office director where I live about it – but you don't need to pay tax of the first 500k baht if you are retired and 65+ years old. That is also what the official images I shared and your refer to, says. It is fairly easy to do it with online E-filling, as long as you don't have to offset already paid foreign tax, which the online system cannot handle (seems to be a system error, according to the revenue director, he was surprised that it didn't work).

[bamnutsak]

21 minutes ago, khunPer said:

Actually your need to file a tax return form – I've even had a meeting this week with the Revenue Office director where I live about i

 

 

If you have ZERO accessible income are you required to file a return?

[jwest10]

7 minutes ago, bamnutsak said:

 

 

If you have ZERO accessible income are you required to file a return?

Just we agree to disagree and have neen told the complete reverse many times too

[bamnutsak]

Just now, jwest10 said:

Just we agree to disagree and have neen told the complete reverse many times too

 

Mine was an honest question.

 

Yes

No

I don't know

 

are all potential answers.

[jwest10]

31 minutes ago, khunPer said:

Actually your need to file a tax return form – I've even had a meeting this week with the Revenue Office director where I live about it – but you don't need to pay tax of the first 500k baht if you are retired and 65+ years old. That is also what the official images I shared and your refer to, says. It is fairly easy to do it with online E-filling, as long as you don't have to offset already paid foreign tax, which the online system cannot handle (seems to be a system error, according to the revenue director, he was surprised that it didn't work).

You simply can not without a Tin and in any case I do not need to by our local Revenue Office.

[jwest10]

Just now, bamnutsak said:

 

Mine was an honest question.

 

Yes

No

I don't know

 

are all potential answers.

Let's face it no one knows and even the experts of which there are many and this very ill thought process so very poor indeed.

[jwest10]

33 minutes ago, khunPer said:

Actually your need to file a tax return form – I've even had a meeting this week with the Revenue Office director where I live about it – but you don't need to pay tax of the first 500k baht if you are retired and 65+ years old. That is also what the official images I shared and your refer to, says. It is fairly easy to do it with online E-filling, as long as you don't have to offset already paid foreign tax, which the online system cannot handle (seems to be a system error, according to the revenue director, he was surprised that it didn't work).

Where is your Director then and it seems very different view coming all over.

[jwest10]

5 hours ago, bamnutsak said:

 

Thank you.

 

Did you receive any documentation that might satisfy the requirement to prove - to Immigration, which we're told by some here may demand proof of tax compliance, during an annual extension of stay.

 

 

No link whatsoever and on extension in January not even mentioned.

[khunPer]

28 minutes ago, jwest10 said:

Where is your Director then and it seems very different view coming all over.

Koh Samui, under Surat Thani Province.