Gaza Paramedics Shot ‘With Intent to Kill,’ Red Crescent Demands International Probe

[zmisha]

9 hours ago, jimmybcool said:

 

Not sure what has changed since the last time the entire Muslim middle east attempted to push the Jews into the sea.  Except the Egyptians and Saudis have both decided it isn't worth the effort.  It's actually only Iran and it's proxies that are still at it and I'd bet on Israel against Iran any day and twice on Sunday. 

But the previous historical attempt to create a Jewish state took place without the support of a powerful ally from the other side of the ocean and ended in failure.

[Evil Penevil]

 

On 4/10/2025 at 8:00 PM, Eloquent pilgrim said:

Just as it is impossible to tell when a swimming fish is drinking water, so it is impossible to tell when a Palestinian medic or aid worker is actually a terrorist.

 

You'll always reap just what you sow

 

 

 Here's what the IDF is up against when it comes to Hamas and "medics."  A man wearing a medic's vest rushes to the body of a wounded or dead combatant,  grabs his automatic rifle and tosses it to another combatant.  The second the "medic" touches the rifle, he becomes a legit military target.  The encounter took place in Jenin about one year ago.

 

 Better quality video at the links below:

https://www.reddit.com/r/CombatFootage/comments/17rff07/west_bank_medic_takes_weapon_from_downed_militant/

 

https://www.reddit.com/r/2ndYomKippurWar/comments/17rfxtb/palestinian_medic_taking_the_weapon_from_a_dead/

 

I have no idea how many members of AN have actually been in military combat, but some of the pro-Palestinian posters don't seem to realize  combat is the most chaotic situation you can imagine, especially in an urban environment against opponents who aren't uniformed.  You shoot in the direction of whoever's firing at you.  If a non-combatant gets in the way, that's the reality of  urban guerilla war.  It's terrible, tragic, cruel, immoral and every other negative  term of which you can think,  but it's almost impossible to avoid non-combatant deaths, given the nature of war in a dense urban environment.

 

The only way to reduce non-combatant casualties is to reduce the number of armed engagements.   The figures below from the U.N. Office for the Coordination of Humanitarian Affairs show a clear correlation between the number of deaths and major attacks launched by Hamas.  It's not exactly rocket science, but if Hamas doesn't want Palestinians killed, it shouldn't attack Israel.  It's as simple as that.  Note that the UNOCHA data doesn't include Palestinian deaths in Gaza after Oct. 6, 2023.  Those figures will be included once the U.N. has verified them.

 

https://www.ochaopt.org/data/casualties

 

Two factors exacerbate non-combatant deaths in Gaza: 1) the use of human shields by Hamas; and 2)  Hamas' devotion to martyrdom.   The use of  human shields has been discussed dozens of times on AN, but I'll include some info on martyrdom.

For Palestinians, a Rush to Claim ‘Martyrs’ Killed by Israel

In one of the deadliest years for Palestinians, a tradition of political and armed groups claiming Palestinian “martyrs” clouds the distinction between civilian and fighter.     https://www.nytimes.com/2022/12/31/world/middleeast/palestinian-martyrs-israel.html

 

Bottom line:  Palestinian non-combatant deaths aren't due to bloodthirsty tactics by the IDF, but because of the nature urban warfare and Hamas' willingness to sacrifice its own people.

 

[jimmybcool]

8 hours ago, zmisha said:

But the previous historical attempt to create a Jewish state took place without the support of a powerful ally from the other side of the ocean and ended in failure.

What has that to do with what I posted?

[josephbloggs]

On 4/10/2025 at 11:32 PM, Nick Carter icp said:

 

   Hamas have previously used ambulances to move their members, Hamas terrorists , to attack the IDF .

  Just after a deadly firefight , Palestinian  ambulances show up .

IDF not knowing whether they were genuine ambulances or Hamas reinforcements took no chances and killed them all .

   Not taking any chances .

Could be Hamas , could be doctors .

Need to be selfish and think about their own safety.

Hamas are at fault for previously using ambulances for transport  

Those damn paramedics and doctors are at it again!

https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/cjr7l123zy5o

No doubt you'll say this was another legitimate target because.....

[Bkk Brian]

1 hour ago, josephbloggs said:

Those damn paramedics and doctors are at it again!

https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/cjr7l123zy5o

No doubt you'll say this was another legitimate target because.....

No deaths reported, an evacuation order given so that everybody could leave. A building in the hospital was struck because a Hamas rocket was fired from the vicinity before. The same hospital Al-Ahli that Hamas previously claimed 100's were massacred in an Israel strike, turned out to be one of the many Hamas rockets that misfired in Gaza killing there own population. Even the bias HRW reported that.

 

No doubt you'll try and blame Israel deliberately targeting doctors and paramedics because........

 

[josephbloggs]

5 hours ago, Bkk Brian said:

No deaths reported, an evacuation order given so that everybody could leave. A building in the hospital was struck because a Hamas rocket was fired from the vicinity before. The same hospital Al-Ahli that Hamas previously claimed 100's were massacred in an Israel strike, turned out to be one of the many Hamas rockets that misfired in Gaza killing there own population. Even the bias HRW reported that.

 

No doubt you'll try and blame Israel deliberately targeting doctors and paramedics because........

 

Ah right, because someone phoned in a 20 minute warning it is perfectly fine to flatten a hospital - the last fully functioning one in Gaza. Got it.

[Bkk Brian]

38 minutes ago, josephbloggs said:

Ah right, because someone phoned in a 20 minute warning it is perfectly fine to flatten a hospital - the last fully functioning one in Gaza. Got it.

Why lie? the hospital is not flattened and there were no deaths so the evacuation worked. Sounds like your disappointed its not the propoganda coup for Hamas. It also exposes there shameful lies about the previous incident there when they claimed Israel massacred hundreds.

 

 

Why are you not condemning Hamas for having a command and control center there? Using it for military purposes, causing it to lose its protected status?

 

IDF says it hit a Hamas command center embedded in Gaza City hospital

Al-Ahli shut down, says terror group; no casualties reported after Israel gives early warning; at least 21 said killed in other strikes, including on Deir al-Balah Hamas site

https://www.timesofisrael.com/idf-says-it-hit-a-hamas-command-center-embedded-in-gaza-city-hospital/

 

This is also nothing to do with the topic is it?

[coolcarer]

12 hours ago, josephbloggs said:

Ah right, because someone phoned in a 20 minute warning it is perfectly fine to flatten a hospital - the last fully functioning one in Gaza. Got it.

But its perfectly fine to spread misinformation of a flattened hospital? In what was a precision strike on a terrorist cell using the hospital as cover.

 

Rinse and repeat with the biased BBC and posters on here. Accusations and innuendos before the facts become apparent. Especially if its to do with a hospital or ambulance.

 

Media Learned Little from Last Year’s Al-Ahli Arab Hospital Strike Misinformation

"Journalists seem to have learned little from the Al-Ahli Arab Hospital debacle last year. In that incident, media outlets reported the destruction of a hospital, attributing it to an Israeli airstrike, when in fact it was later found that rockets from a Palestinian terrorist group had exploded nearby. The story, fueled by activists posing as journalists, was too sensational to be checked thoroughly."

 

"The New York Times and NPR, among others, failed to corroborate the Gaza Health Ministry’s claims, presenting them unchallenged and condemning Israel in the court of public opinion. This repeats the mistakes made during the Al-Ahli Arab Hospital incident, where the media was misled by sensational, unchecked reports."

 

https://aseannow.com/topic/1328969-media-learned-little-from-last-year’s-al-ahli-arab-hospital-strike-misinformation/

[MicroB]

Autotopsies of the killed Gaza medics show shots to the head and chest. Some appear to have been bound.

 

https://www.nytimes.com/2025/04/15/world/middleeast/gaza-medics-autopsies-israel.html

 

https://www.haaretz.com/israel-news/2025-04-16/ty-article-live/hamas-rejects-israeli-proposal-for-gaza-cease-fire-and-hostage-deal-official-tells-bbc/00000196-3c5f-d78d-a1de-3c5fa76b0000

 

https://www.seattletimes.com/nation-world/autopsies-of-gaza-medics-killed-by-israeli-troops-show-some-shot-in-the-head/

 

https://www.timesofisrael.com/liveblog_entry/report-autopsies-reveal-some-of-medics-killed-by-idf-in-ambulance-incident-were-shot-in-the-head/

[jimmybcool]

8 hours ago, MicroB said:

Autotopsies of the killed Gaza medics show shots to the head and chest. Some appear to have been bound.

 

https://www.nytimes.com/2025/04/15/world/middleeast/gaza-medics-autopsies-israel.html

 

https://www.haaretz.com/israel-news/2025-04-16/ty-article-live/hamas-rejects-israeli-proposal-for-gaza-cease-fire-and-hostage-deal-official-tells-bbc/00000196-3c5f-d78d-a1de-3c5fa76b0000

 

https://www.seattletimes.com/nation-world/autopsies-of-gaza-medics-killed-by-israeli-troops-show-some-shot-in-the-head/

 

https://www.timesofisrael.com/liveblog_entry/report-autopsies-reveal-some-of-medics-killed-by-idf-in-ambulance-incident-were-shot-in-the-head/

 

When I read these things I have trouble believing anything that comes out of Hamas. 

[josephbloggs]

1 hour ago, jimmybcool said:

 

When I read these things I have trouble believing anything that comes out of Hamas. 

Yeah, the IDF however always tells the truth.

[Nick Carter icp]

10 hours ago, MicroB said:

 Some appear to have been bound.

 

 

   That isn't reported in any of the links you provided .

One of your links says  

 

so pathologists were unable to definitively determine whether they were shot at close range or whether their hands had been tied beforehand

 

 

Which contradicts your claim .

Did you write the claim yourself ?

Made it up ?

 

 

 

[Bkk Brian]

17 hours ago, MicroB said:

Autotopsies of the killed Gaza medics show shots to the head and chest. Some appear to have been bound.

 

https://www.nytimes.com/2025/04/15/world/middleeast/gaza-medics-autopsies-israel.html

 

https://www.haaretz.com/israel-news/2025-04-16/ty-article-live/hamas-rejects-israeli-proposal-for-gaza-cease-fire-and-hostage-deal-official-tells-bbc/00000196-3c5f-d78d-a1de-3c5fa76b0000

 

https://www.seattletimes.com/nation-world/autopsies-of-gaza-medics-killed-by-israeli-troops-show-some-shot-in-the-head/

 

https://www.timesofisrael.com/liveblog_entry/report-autopsies-reveal-some-of-medics-killed-by-idf-in-ambulance-incident-were-shot-in-the-head/

Autopsies carried out by Hamas-run Gaza health ministry, some in the infamous Nasser Hospital. The one where numerous hostages were held for months in rooms and their medications sent from relatives left in a separate room and withheld from them.

 

Of course there were some shots to the head (certainly not all), over 100 shots were fired! However your pure misinformation on some appearing to be bound is just that. Misinformation. There is zero evidence of that and would not fit in with the distances estimated by BBC verify on how far away the soldiers were when they shot which was from 43 meters down to 12 meters.

 

 

 

 

[Evil Penevil]

The Hamas medics were shot while seated in vehicles, so it's likely they were hit in the head or upper body.  

[Jeff the Chef]

More waffle and misinformation from both sides doesn't alter the facts that 15 Emergency Workers met their deaths after exiting from Red Crescent marked Ambulances who had fully functioning emergency lights deployed.

The Emergency Workers exited their vehicles in high-vis tabards/jackets and were met with approximately 5 minutes or more of small arms fire from the IDF, the verified clips only showed about 25 seconds, the only people who can confirm the number of shots fired are the IDF. 

I am more than willing to wait for the IDF report, which the IDF confirmed 10 days ago.

 

[Bkk Brian]

14 minutes ago, Jeff the Chef said:

More waffle and misinformation from both sides doesn't alter the facts that 15 Emergency Workers met their deaths after exiting from Red Crescent marked Ambulances who had fully functioning emergency lights deployed.

The Emergency Workers exited their vehicles in high-vis tabards/jackets and were met with approximately 5 minutes or more of small arms fire from the IDF, the verified clips only showed about 25 seconds, the only people who can confirm the number of shots fired are the IDF. 

I am more than willing to wait for the IDF report, which the IDF confirmed 10 days ago.

 

the only people who can confirm the number of shots fired are the IDF. 

 

So we should ignore BBC verify audio of the shots? Oh wait, scrub that, this is the second time you stated you'll wait for the IDF report. 

 

Until Israel’s investigation is completed, it is worth remembering that Hamas is on the same international terror lists as ISIS and Al Qaeda: organizations whom the world has never trusted for reliable information, and for good reason. Responsible countries vigorously investigate themselves and their militaries when a need arises, as Israel is doing now. Such investigations, when properly conducted, take time: certainly more time than it takes for a terror organization’s propaganda arm to release a PR statement.

In the meantime, only one thing is certain from years of evidence: that Hamas violates both international law, and all codes of basic human morality, by habitually using ambulances, hospitals, and medical staff as weapons of war.

https://www.algemeiner.com/2025/04/10/hamas-uses-ambulances-in-combat-the-truth-about-whats-happening-in-gaza/

[Jeff the Chef]

1 hour ago, Bkk Brian said:

So we should ignore BBC verify audio of the shots? Oh wait, scrub that, this is the second time you stated you'll wait for the IDF report. 

 

Where do I imply ignoring any verified audio or video?

 

If you like, I can/will remind you daily that we are waiting for the official inquiry by the IDF, do you have a problem with that?

[Bkk Brian]

25 minutes ago, Jeff the Chef said:

 

Where do I imply ignoring any verified audio or video?

 

If you like, I can/will remind you daily that we are waiting for the official inquiry by the IDF, do you have a problem with that?

It was a question however I scrubbed it. Read my post. 

 

1 hour ago, Bkk Brian said:

the only people who can confirm the number of shots fired are the IDF. 

 

So we should ignore BBC verify audio of the shots? Oh wait, scrub that, this is the second time you stated you'll wait for the IDF report. 

 

Until Israel’s investigation is completed, it is worth remembering that Hamas is on the same international terror lists as ISIS and Al Qaeda: organizations whom the world has never trusted for reliable information, and for good reason. Responsible countries vigorously investigate themselves and their militaries when a need arises, as Israel is doing now. Such investigations, when properly conducted, take time: certainly more time than it takes for a terror organization’s propaganda arm to release a PR statement.

In the meantime, only one thing is certain from years of evidence: that Hamas violates both international law, and all codes of basic human morality, by habitually using ambulances, hospitals, and medical staff as weapons of war.

https://www.algemeiner.com/2025/04/10/hamas-uses-ambulances-in-combat-the-truth-about-whats-happening-in-gaza/