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When they find out you can speak Thai..

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51 minutes ago, MalcolmB said:
1 hour ago, Stressed Eric said:

when you take a normal office girl out for lunch, everyone in said ghettos presumes that the girl is a bar girl.

Most Thais can tell the difference after a few sentences.

 

True - they can tell in an instant - just from the look and they way she carries herself - the speech just provides a conformation of of socio-economic status and education levels.

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2 minutes ago, richard_smith237 said:

 

True - they can tell in an instant - just from the look and they way she carries herself - the speech just provides a conformation of of socio-economic status and education levels.

Mrs Eric has brown skin and a PhD.

 

Locals (especially males) still seem to think she is a hooker.

 

They stereotype to the max. A product of falling asleep in school during adolescence imo.

 

Eric.

4 minutes ago, Stressed Eric said:

Usually it changes for the worse

In my experience its usually for the better...but in most circumstances  once they have shown the 'bad attitude'  I'll just avoid them as much as possible  so no chance to get worse...obviously some times they can not be avoided then it is bite your tongue and

put up with it to get what you need in the given situation.

7 minutes ago, Stressed Eric said:
10 minutes ago, richard_smith237 said:

 

True - they can tell in an instant - just from the look and they way she carries herself - the speech just provides a conformation of of socio-economic status and education levels.

Mrs Eric has brown skin and a PhD.

 

Locals (especially males) still seem to think she is a hooker.

 

They stereotype to the max. A product of falling asleep in school during adolescence imo.

 

Eric.

 

My mates wife is a University Educated Accountant - she dresses less conservatively than the norm one would expect in a Shopping Mall or Restaurant etc - this combined with accompanying a foreigner leads for some to draw to a negative conclusion - at least until she speaks.

 

Had the same women been accompanied by a Thai make - those same judgments may not have been reached. 

 

Meanwhile - another friend whose Wife is also well educated (Masters from a top tier Thai Uni) dresses impeccably well, elegant yet very fashionable - even when accompanied by her foreign husband, she / they are treated very respectfully right of the bat - she has 'elevated him' (in the Thai totem-pole pecking order).

 

Thai's stereotype and judge everyone - they don't act on it and are always polite - but one of the key facets of Thai society is knowing where they fit and where everyone else fits around them - Its why when being introduced to a Thai in a social setting you will know a lot about them, their job etc very quickly - its about finding out out where deference is shown and is 'part of culture' - especially when the lines might be blurred.

 

 

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I once went into a small clothing shop with my then Thai girlfriend, and the female Thai proprietor approached her and started talking to her in English.

 

I said to the shop owner: She doesn't speak English.

 

Owner: Then how do you communicate?

 

Jerry: We both speak Swahili.

 

 

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1 minute ago, jerrymahoney said:

I once went into a small clothing shop with my then Thai girlfriend, and the Thai proprietor approached her and started talking to her in English.

 

I said to the shop owner: She doesn't speak English.

 

Owner: Then how do you communicate?

 

Jerry: We both speak Swahili.

 

 

Classic.

 

Eric.

1 hour ago, Stressed Eric said:

and another thing, when you take a normal office girl out for lunch

 

Are you able to provide us with any credible evidence that you have ever dated a "normal girl", or taken one to lunch?

 

Furthermore, is there any such thing as normal, when not directly referring to the normal curve?

 

Also, would it not be far more interesting to take an abnormal girl to lunch?

 

I once dated a bulimic girl, and took her to lunch, many times.

 

She enjoyed the lunch buffets at hotels, mostly.

 

I enjoyed her company, but also knew she was not completely normal.

 

I never understood why she never gained weight though, until years later.

 

In my life, I have never dated a normal girl who could not speak Thai with me.

 

Speaking Thai to normal girls is not unusual for me, and I have experienced no problems, so far.

 

 

 

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Yes the locals get angry when a foreigner can speak Thail. Because that means that the foreigner is in Thailand long enough and cannot be cheated. On the other hand when dealing with the Thais and the usual giggling and looks start when it's a foreigner, I turn on my google translate to understand what they are making fun about. Once it's translated, I show it and make them loose face. The Thais need to learn to respect a bit more the foreigner who brings in the money in this country. Not surprising that those well off are choosing other countries in Asia to spend winter, where the foreigner is a bit more considered. Thank you. 🙏

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4 minutes ago, Sigmund said:

Yes the locals get angry when a foreigner can speak Thail. Because that means that the foreigner is in Thailand long enough and cannot be cheated. On the other hand when dealing with the Thais and the usual giggling and looks start when it's a foreigner, I turn on my google translate to understand what they are making fun about. Once it's translated, I show it and make them loose face. The Thais need to learn to respect a bit more the foreigner who brings in the money in this country. Not surprising that those well off are choosing other countries in Asia to spend winter, where the foreigner is a bit more considered. Thank you. 🙏

Somebody give this man a medal, now!

 

Well put my friend!

 

Eric.

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9 minutes ago, Sigmund said:

Yes the locals get angry when a foreigner can speak Thail. Because that means that the foreigner is in Thailand long enough and cannot be cheated. On the other hand when dealing with the Thais and the usual giggling and looks start when it's a foreigner, I turn on my google translate to understand what they are making fun about. Once it's translated, I show it and make them loose face. The Thais need to learn to respect a bit more the foreigner who brings in the money in this country. Not surprising that those well off are choosing other countries in Asia to spend winter, where the foreigner is a bit more considered. Thank you. 🙏

 

So where ever you go - you are surrounded by locals who want to cheat you - then show annoyance that they can't because you speak Thai ??...     

 

And.. when you deal with Thai's they giggle and you have to use 'Google translate to understand them' - which indicates you can't actually speak Thai !!!

 

There is a perfectly normal amount of respect towards foreigners here no more or less than Thai's give each others - thats one of the great things about Thailand - its easy to just be normal.

 

But - mileage varies and much of that I guess depends on where you are and who you are interacting with - in area's where 'transactional interaction' is more the norm - then you may be right in your attitudes - but in more normal area's, outside of the 'high-tourist-footfall-transactional' areas - normal behavior prevails and you'll be treated solely on your individual merits i.e. how you behave, how you interact and also your appearance....

 

 

So - if you are getting giggled at - its because you've done something or made a faux-pas (usually harmless).

... If annoyance is being shown that you can speak Thai - its because you are in a 'transactional' area (i.e. on of Thailands 'entertainment' districts)... 

... and if you are finding it common that Thai's are treating you with disrespect - then it might be time to question why and look inwards - because even in the 'harshest and cold-blooded of entertainment areas - mutually respectful interaction' is still the norm unless giving off negative vibes.

 

 

 

 

 

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You do realise most of this only happens in the same few tourist strips you keep haunting, right? If you stay in the neon loop, you get neon-loop behaviour. That’s not Thailand. That’s the Thailand built for people who order beer like it’s a military command.

 

The staff aren’t switching from smiles to scowls because you speak Thai. They’re switching because you’ve signalled you’re about to overthink a simple interaction. They see it coming a mile off.

People assuming your date is a bar girl isn’t some deep cultural issue. It’s just lazy thinking in areas where half the foot traffic is middle-aged men staggering around with short-term “soulmates”. You pick the venue; you get the vibe.

And on the farang who’s been here 40 years and still can’t speak Thai… he picked the perfect environment not to learn. In that zone, he doesn’t need a single Thai word. Is he a bit lazy? Sure. But he’s also practical. It works for him, so he sticks with it. No drama. No mystery.

 

You keep walking a thin line between raising a point and looking for something to bash. Step out of the tourist loops for a week. These “strange behaviours” don’t follow you around. You’re following them.

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2 minutes ago, CharlieH said:

You do realise most of this only happens in the same few tourist strips you keep haunting, right? If you stay in the neon loop, you get neon-loop behaviour. That’s not Thailand. That’s the Thailand built for people who order beer like it’s a military command.

 

The staff aren’t switching from smiles to scowls because you speak Thai. They’re switching because you’ve signalled you’re about to overthink a simple interaction. They see it coming a mile off.

People assuming your date is a bar girl isn’t some deep cultural issue. It’s just lazy thinking in areas where half the foot traffic is middle-aged men staggering around with short-term “soulmates”. You pick the venue; you get the vibe.

And on the farang who’s been here 40 years and still can’t speak Thai… he picked the perfect environment not to learn. In that zone, he doesn’t need a single Thai word. Is he a bit lazy? Sure. But he’s also practical. It works for him, so he sticks with it. No drama. No mystery.

 

You keep walking a thin line between raising a point and looking for something to bash. Step out of the tourist loops for a week. These “strange behaviours” don’t follow you around. You’re following them.

I have stepped out of the tourist areas for much longer than a week, and it was even worse!

 

Talk about boring.

 

What is there to do in such places except count the hours down until the next bus outta there??

 

Eric.

Just now, Stressed Eric said:

I have stepped out of the tourist areas for much longer than a week, and it was even worse!

 

Talk about boring.

 

Eric.

Must be you, sunbeam..............:post-4641-1156694572:

no and no, the people appreciate i made the effort to learn, and they can tell the difference between a bar girl and a hi so girl from a mile away, unlike most falangs

1 minute ago, Stressed Eric said:

I have stepped out of the tourist areas for much longer than a week, and it was even worse!

 

Talk about boring.

 

What is there to do in such places except count the hours down until the next bus outta there??

 

Eric.

 

Perhaps 'name' the area's outside of the tourist areas you've stepped to... 

 

What interactions have been negative and anger has been shown towards you when you have engaged using your fluent Thai ???

 

Something is not adding up....   because you are not being treated negatively in a 'mom & pop' restaurant up-country, or even on many places in Bangkok and many Towns around Thailand without unwittingly inviting some form of negativity...   

 

... because, its almost a universal trait of Thais - they give out what they get - and in many cases any negativity received is an indication of our own behaviour (except of course when the person we're dealing with simply has an issue - which also happens from time to time) - and with repeated experiences it surely comes to a point when its time to address "whether its you, not them"... 

 

 

 

 

 

I would give my right arm to speak other languages, but find it intensely annoying that people face criticism for not speaking the language for the country in which they find themselves.

 

They could have been posted, retired, moved due to marriage, work posting, seeking asylum.....I've lived and worked in five different countries....there is no way on God's earth I have the capacity or inclination to learn five very different languages.

4 minutes ago, mordothailand said:

no and no, the people appreciate i made the effort to learn, and they can tell the difference between a bar girl and a hi so girl from a mile away, unlike most falangs

 

Most of us Westerner's who've been here any reasonable about of time can also easily identify the differences - it doesn't take deep sociological dive to recognise the 'give-aways'... 

 

Its only really the newbies or those who don't really escape the bubble of area's of high-tourist footfall not to have a handle on this.

 

 

11 minutes ago, Stressed Eric said:

I have stepped out of the tourist areas for much longer than a week, and it was even worse!

 

Talk about boring.

 

What is there to do in such places except count the hours down until the next bus outta there??

 

Eric.

Hot chicks love me. 

2 minutes ago, Will B Good said:

I would give my right arm to speak other languages, but find it intensely annoying that people face criticism for not speaking the language for the country in which they find themselves.

 

They could have been posted, retired, moved due to marriage, work posting, seeking asylum.....I've lived and worked in five different countries....there is no way on God's earth I have the capacity or inclination to learn five very different languages.

 

Of course not - but there are two very different attitudes that come with that.

 

a) I'll find it a struggle but do my best to pick things up and learn / interact and show politeness.

b) Its not my language, its too hard, why should I bother learning.

 

... and the 'vibe' those attitudes 'give off' impacts the standard of interaction people will face in every day life here.

1 minute ago, richard_smith237 said:

 

Of course not - but there are two very different attitudes that come with that.

 

a) I'll find it a struggle but do my best to pick things up and learn / interact and show politeness.

b) Its not my language, its too hard, why should I bother learning.

 

... and the 'vibe' those attitudes 'give off' impacts the standard of interaction people will face in every day life here.

 

 

Profoundly deaf in one ear and 40dB down in the other, with a life expectancy of 4/5 years doesn't inspire me to make a supreme effort......555

1 hour ago, Stressed Eric said:

Mrs Eric has brown skin and a PhD.

 

Locals (especially males) still seem to think she is a hooker.

 

They stereotype to the max. A product of falling asleep in school during adolescence imo.

 

Eric.

Perhaps they are judging that not on her appearance and the way she carries herself but on yours?

28 minutes ago, CharlieH said:

You do realise most of this only happens in the same few tourist strips you keep haunting, right?

You do realize this is just Bob winding us up?

1 minute ago, MalcolmB said:

You do realize this is just Bob winding us up?

Well, then it makes a change from yourself...........🤔

1 hour ago, richard_smith237 said:

I find this notion to be a ridiculous myth, likely propagated by those who don’t speak Thai and are trying to justify their own ignorance.

99% correct but occasionally they prefer mushrooms to keep in the dark and feed sหit.

Speaking Thai doesn't make you immune from attempts to overcharge. If someone is determined to overcharge you, they can use small talk to size you up and butter you up with flattery before going in for the kill. You just have to aware of prices, and ask what the price is before you commit to buying if you're not sure.

22 minutes ago, Will B Good said:

Profoundly deaf in one ear and 40dB down in the other, with a life expectancy of 4/5 years doesn't inspire me to make a supreme effort......555

 

Its an excuse - but no one that should stop you from making an effort...  Even it just to learn the very basics - hello, how how are you, thank-you, the number etc...    (which I'm sure you have already).

 

... I get that the 'time to learn might feel wasted' but isn't that same time wasted on here or watching TV etc ?...   

... in the grand scheme of things, its all wasted time...    thus improving interactions with those around us so life is more enjoyable may even have short-term gains... 

 

Perhaps you make a very basic effort already - and thats all thats required really...

 

.... its the people who are outright 'grumps' and dead set against using any Thai at all, dead set against making any effort at all who are doing themselves a disservice and may also find circumstances less favourable - usually because of the very vibe they give off...

 

 

11 minutes ago, Gecko123 said:

Speaking Thai doesn't make you immune from attempts to overcharge. If someone is determined to overcharge you, they can use small talk to size you up and butter you up with flattery before going in for the kill. You just have to aware of prices, and ask what the price is before you commit to buying if you're not sure.

 

Given half a chance - Thai's will over-charge each other !!!   Nothing makes us immune from being overcharged etc... 

 

Speaking Thai just makes everything easier thats all...  But in an area where everyone speaks English (i.e. Markets in tourist areas etc) the prices are likely already inflated !!... 

 

Speaking Thai doesn't just come with the sole 'bonus' of having less chance of being taken advantage of - the primary benefit is that it just makes general interaction easier for a multitude of reasons....

When people hear me speaking Thai, they appear to breathe a sigh of relief and start gabbing away in Thai. Whenever I don't remember a word I say it in English and it makes me sound like a Thai educated in America - Dr. Thaksin used to do it all the time when I worked for him (see how I slipped that in?) and it made him feel soooo well-educated.

 

1 minute ago, Purdey said:

When people hear me speaking Thai, they appear to breathe a sigh of relief and start gabbing away in Thai. Whenever I don't remember a word I say it in English and it makes me sound like a Thai educated in America - Dr. Thaksin used to do it all the time when I worked for him (see how I slipped that in?) and it made him feel soooo well-educated.

 

Thats a very valid point...  

 

English 'is a more efficient' language than Thai - and when listening to well educated Thai's speaking with each other there is a lot of English thrown into the mix - thats not out of snobbery, but out of efficiency.

 

Another facet of this is listening to 100% Thai kids who've attended internationals schools hangout and playing with each other -  i.e. both parents are 100% Thai / Kids are 100% Thai - we're at their house with a group of us (my son is 'Thai / British) - all the kids are fluent in Thai - but I'll witness them interact and their primary language is English - they'll flip back and talk to their parents in Thai, then immediately revert back to English with each other....

...   I figure the reason for this is that English is simply a far more efficient language for them to communicate in....

 

My Wife speaks to my Son in Thai (mainly with the importance of keeping up the Thai language), I often  struggle with the length at which simple things need to be communicated.

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