1 minute ago, Patong2021 said:

I am providing a disinterested neutral observation, neither endorsing, nor condemning. Put your bias aside and consider the pattern.

Bankruptcy is used as a financial tool. It is more frequent in some industries such as transportation and real estate. If you had any experience or knowledge of investment banking or real estate, you would understand this characteristic.

And as you just love relying on AI generated answers, why not ask

Is bankruptcy common in the real estate sector

You won't like the answer. 😄

It's such a good tactic that Banks won't lend you to you anymore?

It is to laugh.

2 hours ago, Wingate said:

Goodness! Karoline Leavitt couldn't have spun Trump's evil insanity any better!

By any measure---including the Dept of Defense in response to Russia's invasion of Ukraine in 2022---going after a nation's infrastructure is a war crime. Will you say, if Trump follows through, that it's Iran's fault Trump committed a war crime and will be indicted by the ICC in the Hague? That would be a flimsy defense.

BTW, in his expletive-filled Tweet where Trump said he would "reign (sic) Hell down", he finished it by what is likely to be perceived as making fun of Islam. That is unlikely to bring GCC allies any closer to the US. It is also likely to encourage fanatics to attack Westerners. Iran could even use it to foment rebellion in Gulf monarchies against leadership seemingly okay with the US president both making fun of Islam and killing Moslems. How about an Arab Spring 2.0, with the monarchies of Saudi, Qatar and Kuwait falling? It is not entirely out of the question.

The Arab press is getting increasingly critical of the blind eye being afforded the US and Israel attacking Iran and Lebanon by GCC leaders. That criticism will resonate through Gulf societies. It would only take a single spark---like a fruit seller in Tunisia that was the start of the original Arab Spring---to make a bad situation even worse.

Trump is evil, when threatening to punish all 93,000,000 Iranians. That makes the US evil. That makes Americans evil, as we'll all be tarred by the same brush.

You will get an indication of the Arab world's position later this week. If there is a general consensus of support for the GCC victims of Iran and a movement of Arab military assets, then you will know. 🫢

And no, I am not making any predictions. There was supposed to be an agreement last week, and it did not materialize, so my takeaway is that the UAE, Kuwait and Saudi Arabia are working overtime to build support. Qatar and Oman are the holdouts. My bet is on the Saudis. They are shrewd, experienced and excellent negotiators. IMO, an effective group of foreign diplomats who usually get what they need.

Attacking civilian infrastructure, like power stations or water-treatment plants, is a war crime. The US is a founding signatory of the Geneva Accords. So, the POTUS is bleating profanity while threatening war crimes that will accompany mass civilian deaths. 25th Amendment.

If he does not TACO, Iran could take out the oil-refineries all along the Gulf Coast and really bring the global economy down.

9 minutes ago, Patong2021 said:

I am providing a disinterested neutral observation, neither endorsing, nor condemning. Put your bias aside and consider the pattern.

Bankruptcy is used as a financial tool. It is more frequent in some industries such as transportation and real estate. If you had any experience or knowledge of investment banking or real estate, you would understand this characteristic.

And as you just love relying on AI generated answers, why not ask

Is bankruptcy common in the real estate sector

You won't like the answer. 😄

How can you stay neutral when you know they are manipulating the markets, exploiting loopholes, and using mafia tactics? Where is the morality in calling yourself neutral in the face of that, especially when innocent lives are at stake worldwide? It is not only Iran or the Middle East. It is also the blockade of Cuba, the pressure to force countries into line with U.S. interests, and a pattern of chaos that seems to follow wherever he turns his attention

2 hours ago, Patong2021 said:

It's called psychological pressure, and;

It is also demonstrating an attempt to offer a way out for Iran. All it takes is Iran to say, ok, let's talk and the next step in escalation can be avoided. The USA is fulfilling the legal requirements to show that it made an effort to avoid escalation. Should Iran decline to consider the opportunity for a peaceful resolution, then the USA gets the green light to continue. As a self appointed international law expert, surely, you understand this principle. Trump is being given legal advice on how to proceed.

Going after infrastructure with a definite dual use, or which is primarily used by the military may not be a war crime, provided civilian pain is kept to some (undefined) minimum.

However, there is intent that makes actions a war crime. When Trump and his minions state, as they have, 'send them back to the Stone Age', that is not differentiating military from civilian, which would make it a war crime.

Trump, Hegseth, and any military person who follow illegal orders, will be war criminals, deserving of whatever punishment the civilized world can mete out.

When Dems retake the House and Senate, ideally they will extradite Trump, Hegseth and all of Trump's Carnival people to the Hague. If not, stick them all in Leavenworth. May they all rot in jail until the Grim Reaper calls them.

7 minutes ago, IsmeUno said:

No...you are not.

Only because it. does not fall into the group think as demonstrated by a small collection of people who are biased.

3 minutes ago, Patong2021 said:

You will get an indication of the Arab world's position later this week. If there is a general consensus of support for the GCC victims of Iran and a movement of Arab military assets, then you will know. 🫢

And no, I am not making any predictions. There was supposed to be an agreement last week, and it did not materialize, so my takeaway is that the UAE, Kuwait and Saudi Arabia are working overtime to build support. Qatar and Oman are the holdouts. My bet is on the Saudis. They are shrewd, experienced and excellent negotiators. IMO, an effective group of foreign diplomats who usually get what they need.

You might get an indication of Arab leaders, i.e., unelected monarchs. That is not the Arab or Moslem street.

It's high time psychopaths like MbS got Qaddafi'd.

3 minutes ago, Alan Zweibel said:

It's such a good tactic that Banks won't lend you to you anymore?

It is to laugh.

Taking the bank hostage has long been one of Trump’s tactics: lenders knew they could lose even more if they refused revised terms or fresh loans whenever he came up short. And once they finally got out from under him, many wanted nothing more to do with him or his next projects

1 hour ago, Nick Carter icp said:

Iran funding freedom fighters throughout the Middle East gives the terrorists the right to fight against them .

I’m not sure what that’s got to do with the illegal Israeli/US war of aggression against Iran, but I’m sure you’ll imagine something.

7 minutes ago, Patong2021 said:

Only because it. does not fall into the group think as demonstrated by a small collection of people who are biased.

Group think? Like his top army General, also the Head of Army Chaplains. We are all part of that small collection? Those of us who still have a moral compass? Those who still have some belief in the constitution of the United States? Trump and his band of thieves are corrupt kleptomaniacs and fake fundamentalists. Neutral and disinterested is nonsense. Seemingly just a shill for the corrupt.

Are we biased because we don't agree with the lies and the corruption?

1 minute ago, Hummin said:

How can you stay neutral when you know they are manipulating the markets, exploiting loopholes, and using mafia tactics? Where is the morality in calling yourself neutral in the face of that, especially when innocent lives are at stake worldwide? It is not only Iran or the Middle East. It is also the blockade of Cuba, the pressure to force countries into line with U.S. interests, and a pattern of chaos that seems to follow wherever he turns his attention

I don't know if "they" are manipulating the markets. I have previously stated that I believe oil and gas prices are being played with though. And I do know that Russia is rather pleased with some of the events. It has the Europeans begging for its oil and it is making windfall profits. Canada's oil patch is having an orgasm because many of the people who were opposed to oil development and pipelines are having a change of heart now that they are seeing CAD @2$/liter (equivalent in AUS$, USD$5.40/gal) The UK has now reversed course and will visit the North Sea. Europeans are falling over themselves to befriend Nigeria.

The US trade policies are intended to benefit the USA. The US government is supposed to do that. It is not there to address the inadequate trade and energy policies of other countries.

Cuba has long been implicated in the support of groups and nations which acted against US interests. It is neither a social democracy nor a place of political freedom. There is no inherent right of habeas corpus in Cuba, so dissidents disappear. Why do you think millions of cubans fled the country and wanted to live in the USA? There will be a change in Cuba, and hopefully it will be peaceful. The Berlin Wall came down because of the economic pressures brought to bear back in an era when there was a common resolve to free people. Tell you what, let Cuba have free elections and see what happens.

6 minutes ago, IsmeUno said:

Group think? Like his top army General, also the Head of Army Chaplains. We are all part of that small collection? Those of us who still have a moral compass? Those who still have some belief in the constitution of the United States? Trump and his band of thieves are corrupt kleptomaniacs and fake fundamentalists. Neutral and disinterested is nonsense. Seemingly just a shill for the corrupt.

Put your bias aside. The Chaplaincy change was announced months ago and was recommended years ago. Did you read the announcement from last December? The change is not sudden. The Chaplaincy had departed from its specified task into a "self help" and social advocacy format.

https://www.justice.gov/opa/blog/statement-department-wars-strengthening-chaplain-corps

The head of the Chaplaincy wasn't up to the task of delivering chaplaincy services as per the specified mandate. Now someone better capable will do it.

18 minutes ago, Chomper Higgot said:

I’m not sure what that’s got to do with the illegal Israeli/US war of aggression against Iran, but I’m sure you’ll imagine something.

Until there is a judicial finding of illegality, you have no basis on which to describe the intervention as illegal.

4 minutes ago, Patong2021 said:

I don't know if "they" are manipulating the markets. I have previously stated that I believe oil and gas prices are being played with though. And I do know that Russia is rather pleased with some of the events. It has the Europeans begging for its oil and it is making windfall profits. Canada's oil patch is having an orgasm because many of the people who were opposed to oil development and pipelines are having a change of heart now that they are seeing CAD @2$/liter (equivalent in AUS$, USD$5.40/gal) The UK has now reversed course and will visit the North Sea. Europeans are falling over themselves to befriend Nigeria.

The US trade policies are intended to benefit the USA. The US government is supposed to do that. It is not there to address the inadequate trade and energy policies of other countries.

Cuba has long been implicated in the support of groups and nations which acted against US interests. It is neither a social democracy nor a place of political freedom. There is no inherent right of habeas corpus in Cuba, so dissidents disappear. Why do you think millions of cubans fled the country and wanted to live in the USA? There will be a change in Cuba, and hopefully it will be peaceful. The Berlin Wall came down because of the economic pressures brought to bear back in an era when there was a common resolve to free people. Tell you what, let Cuba have free elections and see what happens.

Yes, the USA Cuba history is long and brutal, and Cuba did become another entrenched us enemy through decades of intervention, sanctions, and hostility.

So, as every attempt to intervene and control, Cuba is a good example in the neighbourhood, right there in your back yard,

3 minutes ago, Patong2021 said:

Put your bias aside. The Chaplaincy change was announced months ago and was recommended years ago. Did you read the announcement from last December? The change is not sudden. The Chaplaincy had departed from its specified task into a "self help" and social advocacy format.

https://www.justice.gov/opa/blog/statement-department-wars-strengthening-chaplain-corps

The head of the Chaplaincy wasn't up to the task of delivering chaplaincy services as per the specified mandate. Now someone better capable will do it.

Are you drunken sir? You are simply making my case for me. That Hegseth was behind the fundamentalist agenda. To send other people's sons and daughters off on 'holy wars' by filling their heads with nonsense.

22 minutes ago, Patong2021 said:

You will get an indication of the Arab world's position later this week. If there is a general consensus of support for the GCC victims of Iran and a movement of Arab military assets, then you will know. 🫢

And no, I am not making any predictions. There was supposed to be an agreement last week, and it did not materialize, so my takeaway is that the UAE, Kuwait and Saudi Arabia are working overtime to build support. Qatar and Oman are the holdouts. My bet is on the Saudis. They are shrewd, experienced and excellent negotiators. IMO, an effective group of foreign diplomats who usually get what they need.

You’re betting on 'shrewd diplomacy' in a room where the door has already been kicked down.The Iranians aren't just 'shrewd'; they’re survivors. While the Gulf States spent decades hoisting their wagons to the US and buying a 'security umbrella' that is currently leaking like a sieve, Iran built resilience. You call the Gulf rulers negotiators, but they’ve effectively become high-end hostages. They’ve watched the US back Israel to the hilt while their own oil facilities in Fujairah and Ras Tanura get bombed by drones and missiles.

Let's be real: the average Iranian has lived through decades of 'civilized' Western meddling and resource theft, and they finally said enough. They built a complex, ancient society that doesn't rely on being a US proxy.

If the 'Jewish immigrant' state in the belly of the Middle East didn't have the power over the US state with 'US Whisperer' Netanyahu pulling the strings, no one would give a spit about them. It’s always been about the oil. Now, Trump’s April 6 deadline expires tonight, and his solution is to blow up the power and water for 80 million people. If that’s what your 'shrewd' Saudis and the US call a 'conclusive outcome,' then they haven't learned a thing from history.

They’ll get what they need, alright a region that will be burning for the next fifty years - so come on Trump - follow through in you adderall soaked nappy. You're full of sh$t - the real victims here are the whole damn world that US/Israel have held hostage for their own pernious ends. Never forget that. You don't get to burn down the hosue and then get praise for calling the fire brigade.

1 minute ago, IsmeUno said:

Are you drunken sir? You are simply making my case for me. That Hegseth was behind the fundamentalist agenda. To send other people's sons and daughter off on 'holy wars' by filling their heads with nonsense.

Patong "I don't really support Trump I am my own man , yes sir" 2021 - the cured sophistry of the mobster's lawyer.

1 hour ago, Alan Zweibel said:

4D Chess!

Not even chess, back gammon is the closest I can admit, pure random strategy, with no idea how to play the game

34 minutes ago, Patong2021 said:

Until there is a judicial finding of illegality, you have no basis on which to describe the intervention as illegal.

Hogwash.

The UN Charter exists and defines what constitutes a right to wage war and what dies not.

It doesn’t suddenly exist only after a ‘judicial finding’

1 hour ago, Patong2021 said:

You will get an indication of the Arab world's position later this week. If there is a general consensus of support for the GCC victims of Iran and a movement of Arab military assets, then you will know. 🫢

And no, I am not making any predictions. There was supposed to be an agreement last week, and it did not materialize, so my takeaway is that the UAE, Kuwait and Saudi Arabia are working overtime to build support. Qatar and Oman are the holdouts. My bet is on the Saudis. They are shrewd, experienced and excellent negotiators. IMO, an effective group of foreign diplomats who usually get what they need.

We’ll get an indication of the messaging from the leaders of the GCC and other ‘Arab/Persian’ nations.

But don’t fool yourself that those leaders are as secure in their positions as they were before Israel and the U.S. embarked on this illegal war of aggression or that the leaders of these nations represent the views of their wider populations.

The whole region is a tinderbox, this illegal Israeli/US war of aggression is fast running out of control.

3 hours ago, Wingate said:

Goodness! Karoline Leavitt couldn't have spun Trump's evil insanity any better!

By any measure---including the Dept of Defense in response to Russia's invasion of Ukraine in 2022---going after a nation's infrastructure is a war crime. Will you say, if Trump follows through, that it's Iran's fault Trump committed a war crime and will be indicted by the ICC in the Hague? That would be a flimsy defense.

BTW, in his expletive-filled Tweet where Trump said he would "reign (sic) Hell down", he finished it by what is likely to be perceived as making fun of Islam. That is unlikely to bring GCC allies any closer to the US. It is also likely to encourage fanatics to attack Westerners. Iran could even use it to foment rebellion in Gulf monarchies against leadership seemingly okay with the US president both making fun of Islam and killing Moslems. How about an Arab Spring 2.0, with the monarchies of Saudi, Qatar and Kuwait falling? It is not entirely out of the question.

The Arab press is getting increasingly critical of the blind eye being afforded the US and Israel attacking Iran and Lebanon by GCC leaders. That criticism will resonate through Gulf societies. It would only take a single spark---like a fruit seller in Tunisia that was the start of the original Arab Spring---to make a bad situation even worse.

Trump is evil, when threatening to punish all 93,000,000 Iranians. That makes the US evil. That makes Americans evil, as we'll all be tarred by the same brush.

And one can only hope and pray after the midterms when Trump gets his butt whomped, that the Democrats go after him and Petie. The dream scenario would be that they both ended up in prison, although we know America does not have the fortitude to ever lock up an ex-president. Such a shame. Don richly deserves a cell of his own. Think of what a trophy he would be!

At least Petie might spend some time making some intimate new friends. Perhaps he could even ride a biography - "How I went from being missile man to a receptacle in one short year".

And how about the sons? They seem to be the conduit for billions of dollars worth of presidential corruption.

10 minutes ago, Chomper Higgot said:

Hogwash.

The UN Charter exists and defines what constitutes a right to wage war and what dies not.

It doesn’t suddenly exist only after a ‘judicial finding’

There's a lot of whining on social media that we can't qoute here of Isralies moaning about international law as their cities get bombed. Never troubled then before with Gaza turned to rubble.

1 minute ago, spidermike007 said:

And one can only hope and pray after the midterms when Trump gets his butt whomped, that the Democrats go after him and Petie. The dream scenario would be that they both ended up in prison, although we know America does not have the fortitude to ever lock up the next president.

At least Petie might spend some time making some intimate new friends. Perhaps he could even ride a biography - "How I went from being missile man to a receptacle in one short year".

I'd settle for a crane and a rope .....

Iranians aren't backing down ....tik tok tik tok

18 minutes ago, beautifulthailand99 said:

You’re betting on 'shrewd diplomacy' in a room where the door has already been kicked down.The Iranians aren't just 'shrewd'; they’re survivors. While the Gulf States spent decades hoisting their wagons to the US and buying a 'security umbrella' that is currently leaking like a sieve, Iran built resilience. You call the Gulf rulers negotiators, but they’ve effectively become high-end hostages. They’ve watched the US back Israel to the hilt while their own oil facilities in Fujairah and Ras Tanura get bombed by drones and missiles.

Let's be real: the average Iranian has lived through decades of 'civilized' Western meddling and resource theft, and they finally said enough. They built a complex, ancient society that doesn't rely on being a US proxy.

If the 'Jewish immigrant' state in the belly of the Middle East didn't have the power over the US state with 'US Whisperer' Netanyahu pulling the strings, no one would give a spit about them. It’s always been about the oil. Now, Trump’s April 6 deadline expires tonight, and his solution is to blow up the power and water for 80 million people. If that’s what your 'shrewd' Saudis and the US call a 'conclusive outcome,' then they haven't learned a thing from history.

They’ll get what they need, alright a region that will be burning for the next fifty years - so come on Trump - follow through in you adderall soaked nappy. You're full of sh$t - the real victims here are the whole damn world that US/Israel have held hostage for their own pernious ends. Never forget that. You don't get to burn down the hosue and then get praise for calling the fire brigade.

A line that has stayed with me ever since I saw David Lean's brilliant film Lawrence of Arabia ;

Prince Feisal: But you know, Lieutenant, in the Arab city of Cordoba (in Spain) were two miles of public lighting in the streets when London was a village?

T.E. Lawrence: Yes, you were great.

Prince Feisal: Nine centuries ago.

T.E. Lawrence: Time to be great again, my lord.

Centuries before streetlamps became a common sight in London or Paris, oil lamps already lined the main roads and alleys of the Abbasid capital. Baghdad’s night was never truly dark. The city lit itself with precision, care, and a touch of urban pride that echoed its role as the heart of Islamic civilisation.

This war is in large part a fight for dominance; of the Arabs trying to assert their dominance in the region, pushing out former colonial occupiers; Iran and Turkiye. The Arabs previously got rid of the Europeans. Saudi wants to dominate in the Gulf and having Iran mucking about interferes with that. Egypt wants to be the central pivot of influence bridging the Arab worlds of Africa and the Middle East.

The disdain shown for the Arab diplomacy is remarkable for its arrogance. For example, Trump's previous 5 day pause on more direct action termed as a TACO by several of the biased members of the anti US group here. It was in fact a direct result of Egyptian mediation efforts. For people who claim to be so knowledgeable, how is it that you ignore the role and impact of Egypt in this affair? Egypt is pledged to defend the Gulf states. It also has an interest in helping Israel. As unpopular as Israel may be with Arabs, there is to a degree, a mutual benefit and need for their co-operation.

How many of you know or appreciate the interconnection now between Egypt and Israel? Egypt's power grid is fueled by natural gas. It's two major suppliers are Qatar and Israel. The supply from Qatar cannot get to Egypt. Israel was supplying 1billion cu. ft per day to Egypt through the Mediterranean pipeline. That supply was all but cutoff. Last August Egypt signed a US $35billion gas supply contract from the Israeli offshore Leviathan field. Egypt and Jordan had a reliable gas source in Israel. Israel signed its development contracts with Egypt and the UAE bypassing Turkiye. This left the Turks furious as Egypt asserted its role as the region's big brother pushing Turkiye to the side. The war is interfering in the supply of affordable gas to Egypt and Jordan. They want it back.

The Arabs had Israel contained and managed. They didn't need or want the Iranians stirring up turmoil. Iran wants to retain its power and the Arabs want it neutralized once and for all. It's all about who will control the region.

22 minutes ago, beautifulthailand99 said:

I'd settle for a crane and a rope .....

Just like the Iranians do to the dissidents and gay kids.

Your true nature is showing comrade.

27 minutes ago, Chomper Higgot said:

We’ll get an indication of the messaging from the leaders of the GCC and other ‘Arab/Persian’ nations.

But don’t fool yourself that those leaders are as secure in their positions as they were before Israel and the U.S. embarked on this illegal war of aggression or that the leaders of these nations represent the views of their wider populations.

The whole region is a tinderbox, this illegal Israeli/US war of aggression is fast running out of control.

Where has this intervention been adjudicated as illegal?

Until you can show a judgement, from a court with jurisdiction, your claim of illegality is a LIE. An intentional falsehood. If and when there is a valid final adjudication I will join you in declaring the action illegal. Until then it is not.

Does nobody learn anything from history?

The Iran-Iraq War lasted for nearly eight years, beginning on September 22, 1980, and ending with a ceasefire on August 20, 1988. It was the longest conventional war of the 20th century, totalling 7 years, 10 months, 4 weeks, and 1 day, resulting in roughly one million casualties and a stalemate with no territorial changes.

Iraqi leader Saddam Hussein sought to exploit post-1979 Iranian political instability, settle border disputes (specifically the Shatt al-Arab waterway), and prevent the spread of Iran's Islamic revolution.

The war was characterized by trench warfare, human-wave attacks, chemical weapons usage by Iraq, and tanker attacks in the Persian Gulf.

Yet, the US/Israel, think bombing the hell out of the place will get them where they want to be.

Iran has permitted China, Russia, India, Pakistan, Iraq, Thailand, Bangladesh, Malaysia, and the Philippines to transit.

Vessels belonging to nations attacking Iran or supporting such attacks (specifically US and Israel) are blocked.

To me, this is nothing more than a money grab about oil.

29 minutes ago, Chomper Higgot said:

We’ll get an indication of the messaging from the leaders of the GCC and other ‘Arab/Persian’ nations.

But don’t fool yourself that those leaders are as secure in their positions as they were before Israel and the U.S. embarked on this illegal war of aggression or that the leaders of these nations represent the views of their wider populations.

The whole region is a tinderbox, this illegal Israeli/US war of aggression is fast running out of control.

We'll see. The Arabs do have an ability to disappoint the colonial minded westerners who still believe that they know best.

26 minutes ago, Patong2021 said:

Just like the Iranians do to the dissidents and gay kids.

Your true nature is showing comrade.

You Saudi mates are pretty much the same - it's was bitter pointed irony pickled in anger at what the US/Israel agression has brought to the wrold - Irainian gays get the option of transitioning but not in Saudi. Enough though I don't support Iran I just oppose US/Israel agression and imperiiasm. And in Isarel's case they treat borders as fluid entities - the land thieves who keeps moving the fence because they can. Mussolini and his mates were hung by Italian partisans upside down from a petrol (gas) station I'll swap the crane for that. You seem to basically support Trump and that's pretty much all I need to know. Like I said the mobster's lawyaer and you know what happened to him ....

Happy Easter - Christ has Risen !