euro made cars face trouble. if theyre not dealt with by tarrifs

10 minutes ago, jvs said:

How many Chinese parts are in your "American? car?

Or Canadian?

lol.

Excellent question, but you are way off, there are 0% Chinese parts and 0% American parts and 0% Canadian parts in my American car, as it was produced at the General Motors Rayong Assembly Plant, right here in Thailand.

This car was entirely engineered and developed by GM's South Korean division (formerly known as GM-Daewoo).

To comply with regional tax benefits and ASEAN trade agreements, the parts for Thai-market Chevies were sourced entirely from South Korea or manufactured by local suppliers within Thailand and Southeast Asia

Edited Friday at 07:56 AM4 days by Cameroni

USA & JP auto market would be crushed if CN was allowed to sell in USA. They might actually wake and realize the crap that's been pushed on them the past few year, while CN auto makers have broke into other markets.

BEV offered in USA are crap & expensive. Someone with experience & knowledge of, At 12:30 of the vid, he sums it up. But start @ 9:30 for a chuckle, if can't be bothered to watch it all ...

7 minutes ago, Cameroni said:

You need to read better, I said it's a myth that the US cannot compete technologically.

In the same topic i also read Chinese cars are junk!

What is it?

What good does it do that you have a great product but no one can afford it or smart people buy the same for half the price?

5 minutes ago, jvs said:

Sure i give you that, remember the junk coming out of Japan?

Not junk anymore and the same will go for the Chinese cars.

In China they can build the same vehicle as in the US but much cheaper!

They pay the workers dirt cheap wages and product quality is just enough to pass. Again, as with all things China cheap, it looks and feels good until a closer look and long term examination is taken. Though to each their own, if cheap is a priority then cheap it is.

1 hour ago, Cameroni said:

Very true. I could not say if these Chinese cars are good or bad, though I have low confidence and given the choice between a German/Japanese/Korean/American/British/French car or a Chinese one, there is no chance in hell I would buy a Chinese car.

It's not just about cars, the car industry is the backbone of the British and German and French economy, anyone who buys a Chinese car is basically a traitor to their own country.

Oh, now this is a truly magnificent comment for the Joke thread. At last, someone has raised the intellectual standard to absolutely ridiculous levels.

1 minute ago, KhunLA said:

USA & JP auto market would be crushed if CN was allowed to sell in USA. They might actually wake and realize the crap that's been pushed on them the past few year, while CN auto makers have broke into other markets.

BEV offered in USA are crap & expensive. Someone with experience & knowledge of, At 12:30 of the vid, he sums it up. But start @ 9:30 for a chuckle, if can't be bothered to watch it all ...

Yes! Time to move on! I have driven a few different EV's and there is no comparing with the old style cars.

Call it what you will but saying EV's are terrible is just ignoring the facts.

1 minute ago, jvs said:

In the same topic i also read Chinese cars are junk!

What is it?

What good does it do that you have a great product but no one can afford it or smart people buy the same for half the price?

I suppose it is much like with women. You have to go on case by case basis.

Meet the first car to earn a Zero-Star result on the 2021-2025 version of the New Car Assessment Program for Southeast Asian Countries (ASEAN NCAP), a result that is as bad as it sounds: The Chinese made Neta V.

If you want to die, the Neta V is your car of choice.

https://carbuzz.com/neta-v-achieves-zero-stars-safety/

I understand some other Chinese cars are not quite as bad. But none could ever come close to a Porsche Taycan.

If, if the Chinese cars make it to the USA, it won't be long till our US companies sell out to China. Just like Ford sold Volvo to Geely Motors. Then there's a slew of others who quietly became Geely Motors. Like Polestar, Lotus, Smart and they even own 10% of Mercedes.

Just now, novacova said:

They pay the workers dirt cheap wages and product quality is just enough to pass. Again, as with all things China cheap, it looks and feels good until a closer look and long term examination is taken. Though to each their own, if cheap is a priority then cheap it is.

Maybe review a couple of Tesla Trucks?

The Chinese do not have to pay their workers a high wage,therein lies the whole concept.

They can build the same or even better for half the price,there is no competing against that!

That is also why Apple phones are being build in China,that same phone build in the US would not be affordable.

2 minutes ago, EVENKEEL said:

If, if the Chinese cars make it to the USA, it won't be long till our US companies sell out to China. Just like Ford sold Volvo to Geely Motors. Then there's a slew of others who quietly became Geely Motors. Like Polestar, Lotus, Smart and they even own 10% of Mercedes.

Actually it's much worse than that. A Chinese individual and a Chinese company EACH hold 10 % of Mercedes, so 20% of Mercedes is owned by the Chinese, almost.

5 minutes ago, novacova said:

Chinese vehicle manufacturers don’t have a long term record like Japanese and other manufacturers do, though Chinese manufacturing companies do have a long history of producing cheap junk and flooding as much as possible into other countries.

When Japanese car companies entered Western markets in the 60s, they had about 4 decades of manufacturing experience. Those first cars were appalling death traps, for the most parts. They weren't all Honda S800 jewels. Prior to the 60s, Japanese cars were either licenced copies of European (British models), or straight ripoffs of American cars. Those early Datsuns used engines copied from Mercedes.

The first Chinese designed cars to hit Western markets was about 10-15 years ago, with Chinese built MGTFs and the MG6, which was based on the old Rover 75 platform; its actually amazing how many of those you still see about on Thai roads, indicating it was basically a competent design, and the Chinese had sorted out, with Ricard's help, the K-series HGF issue.

The marques that got into the Western markets then, like MG, GWM, Chery (Volvo) and to a less extent BYD, have used that experience to develop very competent designs. The Tank 300 is somewhat of a cult car in Australia. The latest Tank 500 is being compared positively to Landcruisers. Meanwhile Korea still builds junk, but now its expensive junk.

Detroit is well known for being an industrial ruin, full of derelict car factories, as a result of not foreign cars, but domestic car makers making terrible business decisions. Detroit lobbyied for federal bumpers and emissions kit, ruining a generation of European cars (BMWs with gopping bumpers, MGBs riding on stilts), which resulted not in brilliant American cars, but things like the Ford Granada (American), Dodge Aspen etc.

Open up Detroit to Chinese transplant factories. Japanese car companies taught Americans to work like the Chinese , turn up to work smart etc. Would be interesting to see Bubba and Leroy in blue Mao suits.

1 minute ago, Roadsternut said:

Meanwhile Korea still builds junk, but now its expensive junk.

What a lot of nonsense, the Koreans built some exceptionally fine cars.

1 minute ago, jvs said:

In the same topic i also read Chinese cars are junk!

What is it?

What good does it do that you have a great product but no one can afford it or smart people buy the same for half the price?

Just walked back from the park about half a mile away from my Tianjin apartment. Saw lots of Tesla's even though they cost a lot more than an equivalent BYD. And lots of the other cars that are the higher end models that cost even more than Teslas.

I'm not sure the Chinese cars would be as cheap in the USA if they had to set aside a reserve for the lawsuit happy USA, or had to meet NHTSA crash standards. Of course, they wouldn't have the legacy costs like union pensions, (and political kickbacks) which are a big chunk of what we pay in the US for cars.

I'm a fan of BYD and even more a fan of Wuling who sell a city car (MiniEV) for about $4000 USD. I wouldn't take it on a 3 day road trip, but it would have been great on Galveston Island where I lived and never got over 50 MPH, and the island was about half an hour end to end. Sadly, I doubt it would pass the crash tests.

11 minutes ago, jvs said:

In the same topic i also read Chinese cars are junk! ... What is it? ... What good does it do that you have a great product but no one can afford it or smart people buy the same for half the price?

In USA, yea, they are silly priced. Here, TH, where most on AN are vocal about vehicles, if you can't afford an EV, then you really can't afford an ICEV, as will cost more buying, then then even more operating & maintaining.

Have a look at this and don't forget to compare the prize!

1 minute ago, impulse said:

Just walked back from the park about half a mile away from my Tianjin apartment. Saw lots of Tesla's even though they cost a lot more than an equivalent BYD. And lots of the other cars that are the higher end models that cost even more than Teslas.

I'm not sure the Chinese cars would be as cheap in the USA if they had to set aside a reserve for the lawsuit happy USA, or had to meet NHTSA crash standards. Of course, they wouldn't have the legacy costs like union pensions, (and political kickbacks) which are a big chunk of what we pay in the US for cars.

I'm a fan of BYD and even more a fan of Wuling who sell a city car (MiniEV) for about $4000 USD. I wouldn't take it on a 3 day road trip, but it would have been great on Galveston Island where I lived and never got over 50 MPH, and the island was about half an hour end to end. Sadly, I doubt it would pass the crash tests.

I'm a fan of Conqing. Conqing noodles. Doesn't mean I want to eat them every day. I certainly wouldn't eat them before a date.

Much like a Porsche has its right time of day, a sunset, an early evening, a Chinese car too has its right time of day. 4 am, when nobody's looking.

1 minute ago, jvs said:

Have a look at this and don't forget to compare the prize!

Liberated from the shackles of price I would still buy the Ferrari. Every. Single. Time.

Not even close.

People would laugh at me if I drive a Xiaomi car.

7 minutes ago, Roadsternut said:

When Japanese car companies entered Western markets in the 60s, they had about 4 decades of manufacturing experience. Those first cars were appalling death traps, for the most parts. They weren't all Honda S800 jewels. Prior to the 60s, Japanese cars were either licenced copies of European (British models), or straight ripoffs of American cars. Those early Datsuns used engines copied from Mercedes.

The first Chinese designed cars to hit Western markets was about 10-15 years ago, with Chinese built MGTFs and the MG6, which was based on the old Rover 75 platform; its actually amazing how many of those you still see about on Thai roads, indicating it was basically a competent design, and the Chinese had sorted out, with Ricard's help, the K-series HGF issue.

The marques that got into the Western markets then, like MG, GWM, Chery (Volvo) and to a less extent BYD, have used that experience to develop very competent designs. The Tank 300 is somewhat of a cult car in Australia. The latest Tank 500 is being compared positively to Landcruisers. Meanwhile Korea still builds junk, but now its expensive junk.

Detroit is well known for being an industrial ruin, full of derelict car factories, as a result of not foreign cars, but domestic car makers making terrible business decisions. Detroit lobbyied for federal bumpers and emissions kit, ruining a generation of European cars (BMWs with gopping bumpers, MGBs riding on stilts), which resulted not in brilliant American cars, but things like the Ford Granada (American), Dodge Aspen etc.

Open up Detroit to Chinese transplant factories. Japanese car companies taught Americans to work like the Chinese , turn up to work smart etc. Would be interesting to see Bubba and Leroy in blue Mao suits.

Lame and a bit dated. In the US there’s a lot of old vehicles still on the roads, mostly restored collector items of which the engines are still operating, mostly American and some Japanese and European. Never seen a restored Chinese vehicle though and doubt anyone ever will.

5 minutes ago, Cameroni said:

Liberated from the shackles of price I would still buy the Ferrari. Every. Single. Time.

Not even close.

People would laugh at me if I drive a Xiaomi car.

One's a million smackeroos. The other is about $75K. ($50K for the base model).

I'd buy the SU7 Ultra and let people laugh. I could probably pay it off in street races with Mustangs, Challengers and Camaros.

BTW, if I had Ferrari money burning a hole in my pocket, I'd go with Leno and still not buy one. I'd go for the YangWang U9. I saw one at QSNCC a couple of years back, but I thought YangWang was a fly by night. It's actually a division of BYD. It's being held out as the fastest street legal car ever.

Edited Friday at 08:36 AM4 days by impulse

17 minutes ago, jvs said:

Maybe review a couple of Tesla Trucks?

The Chinese do not have to pay their workers a high wage,therein lies the whole concept.

They can build the same or even better for half the price,there is no competing against that!

That is also why Apple phones are being build in China,that same phone build in the US would not be affordable.

Long weeks days and hours and dirt cheap wages, you must lean left. Chinese have no shame when it comes to slave labor.

21 minutes ago, jvs said:

Maybe review a couple of Tesla Trucks?

If Chinese ev’s are so great then why would there ever be a market for Tesla anywhere in SEA or east Asia.

1 minute ago, novacova said:

If Chinese ev’s are so great then why would there ever be a market for Tesla anywhere in SEA or east Asia.

Because they are not scared of competition ?

The Tesla sold in China is also made in China!

No one would buy one if it was imported from the US!

Too expensive!

Sure there are a few grey ones just like there are some grey ones in the US but that is not a major market.

Tesla sales in Asia is just 4%,and falling.

12 minutes ago, novacova said:

Long weeks days and hours and dirt cheap wages, you must lean left. Chinese have no shame when it comes to slave labor.

Since we are also talking phones?

Apple (americans) have no shame when it comes to using slave labor in another country.

Have you seen the netting around the factories?

Talking about slave labor,who are picking your crops ?

If they allowed Chinese cars entry into the US market American car manufacturing would dry up overnight. Many of these cars with Superior on every level and at a considerably lower price point. China makes a dozen luxury brands that we've never even heard of, that have a multitude of features that beat the pants off of any Mercedes or BMW, much less inferior American slop.

12 minutes ago, jvs said:

Because they are not scared of competition ?

The Tesla sold in China is also made in China!

No one would buy one if it was imported from the US!

Too expensive!

Sure there are a few grey ones just like there are some grey ones in the US but that is not a major market.

Tesla sales in Asia is just 4%,and falling.

Tesla is 2-3x’s the price in China yet there’s still a market for it, go figure.

10 minutes ago, jvs said:

Since we are also talking phones?

No we’re not, only you are. Anyway go raise hell at your country folks who keep buying stuff built in China.

1 hour ago, SunnyinBangrak said:

When this happened did the liberal hivemind throw a wobbly and claim it was "just a tax on Americans"?

Liberals🤣

Yes, plenty of criticism of it at the time.

1 hour ago, jvs said:

Sure i give you that, remember the junk coming out of Japan?

Not junk anymore and the same will go for the Chinese cars.

In China they can build the same vehicle as in the US but much cheaper!

Of course it's cheaper if you remove the R&D stage and simply steal someone else's IP.

It also helps if you pay your staff a pittance and deny them worker's rights.

Not having to adhere to environmental regulations greatly reduces the cost as well.

Being propped up by the Chinese Communist Party is always a bonus.

So all you White Guys For Harris can feel virtuous as you drive around in your fake Porsches with stolen tech, built on virtual slave labour, in environment destroying factories sponsored by the CCP, while moaning about Trump.

Well done. Don't forget your #bekind bumper sticker in case anyone was in doubt. 😄

1 hour ago, novacova said:

They pay the workers dirt cheap wages and product quality is just enough to pass. Again, as with all things China cheap, it looks and feels good until a closer look and long term examination is taken. Though to each their own, if cheap is a priority then cheap it is.

Rubbish, just a pre-conception that is force fed to you by your government.

Even the CEO of Ford drives a Chinese EV because he says they are light years ahead of American cars in terms of tech and quality.

https://www.automotivemanufacturingsolutions.com/electrification/ford-ceos-personal-chinese-ev-exposes-its-tech-gap/2669791

https://insideevs.com/news/686532/wall-street-analysts-tear-down-byd-seal-say-tesla-should-worry/

https://www.cnbc.com/2024/03/22/byd-seagull-ev-puts-global-auto-execs-politicians-on-edge.html

The US auto industry is toast. And it is well deserved, it has been ripping you off with outdated technology for decades. Europe has been laughing at them forever, but now the European marques are also in trouble.

Fair enough to ban them, or tax them into the next century, as each car probably is sending mapping information and economicall useful user habits etc. back to Beijing.

Why not? Especially as it is all coming from a country that won't even allow Google or Facebook etc. to operate in their country... can't have it both ways China.