Can't Do The Language, Eat The Food, Or Work Legally, So....

[PeaceBlondie]

Should I bother to stay in Thailand if it's obvious that I will never speak or read Thai, never hold an in-depth conversation with many Thais? Cannot eat the food, although I like the climate and the people? And after four years, it seems unlikely or impossible that I will work legally?

In other words, without having compelling reasons to stay here (such as being destitute, having wife or children here who can't leave, performing work that I cannot do anywhere else, etc.), why stay here, especially if there are other countries just as warm, more welcoming to strangers, closer to home, where I can work and hold conversations and eat most of their food?

Am I the only one who meets the above criteria, or are others realizing they could be happier outside of Thailand? I haven't even mentioned the baht/US$ exchange ratio, or loved ones living an average of 10 time zones from me, or the possibility that some day the retirement visa criteria will be revised so that I don't qualify when I'm 69 or 77 years old and infirm.

Can anybody give me a convincing reason to stay, or shall I take the advice that if I don't like it, I can just leave?

Thanks in advance for your responses, even those I don't want to read.

[JimmyTheMook]

Should I bother to stay in Thailand if it's obvious that I will never speak or read Thai, never hold an in-depth conversation with many Thais? Cannot eat the food, although I like the climate and the people? And after four years, it seems unlikely or impossible that I will work legally?

In other words, without having compelling reasons to stay here (such as being destitute, having wife or children here who can't leave, performing work that I cannot do anywhere else, etc.), why stay here, especially if there are other countries just as warm, more welcoming to strangers, closer to home, where I can work and hold conversations and eat most of their food?

Am I the only one who meets the above criteria, or are others realizing they could be happier outside of Thailand? I haven't even mentioned the baht/US$ exchange ratio, or loved ones living an average of 10 time zones from me, or the possibility that some day the retirement visa criteria will be revised so that I don't qualify when I'm 69 or 77 years old and infirm.

Can anybody give me a convincing reason to stay, or shall I take the advice that if I don't like it, I can just leave?

Thanks in advance for your responses, even those I don't want to read.

The fact you are contemplating these thoughts means you deeply want to be here.

[Mid]

come on PB ,

only you can give you a convincing reason to stay ,

all I got to say about the game of life is that it's quality not quanty that counts .

[DragonQuest]

PB im like you, 50% wants me outta here 50% wants me to stay, my girlfriend is on and off with me, so If she doesnt change I think Ill go, she was the only reason for me to be here in the first place, goodluck.

[Neeranam]

Should I bother to stay in Thailand if it's obvious that I will never speak or read Thai

Get to a school and learn! Do it full time for 6 months- an excellent investment - just think you'll be able to walk into a bank and talk to them, chat with someone at a bus stop, ask directions, get a boyfriend, etc etc etc. Your time here will be so much better. Don't procrastinate.

Here's your first lesson - don't procrastinate = ya plaat wan bpragan pruung sorry not allowed to write the Thai.

[GuestHouse]

You are asking the wrong question.

You should be asking what do you want out of life and are you getting that in Thailand?

If you are then the food, language and work issues will not matter.

If you are not, then those issues will take on more significance.

I speak the language, I love the food and I was working legally in Thailand, but moved on because there were other things that we as a family needed that Thailand could not give us.

Think about what you want in life, and don't fixate on Thailand as being the only option - things will become clearer that way.

[JUDAS]

With respect to JimmyTheMook, I would say that if you are asking yourself this question, the seeds of doubt are already in place. I've read many of your posts here over the last few months but have no real idea as to your age PB. I am 41 years old and I find myself asking the same thing from time to time. It's certainly true that in our home countries we would virtually all have a greater sense of security as far as home owenership, financial stabilty and healtcare are concerned etc etc, but, would we be happier? For me, thats the ultimate question and, I'm going to stay in LOS.

Advice can be helpful but we always make our own decision at the end of the day, good luck

p.s. Good if you stick around. I enjoy reading your posts, usually

[pointofview]

cant eat the food - poor excuse. Do you prefer american non food?

[ZukiSuzuki]

cant eat the food - poor excuse. Do you prefer american non food?

He does not need to have any 'excuse', he asked a very reasonable question and made a very honest post about the way he feels at the moment. You on the other hand made a stupid one line grunt and made yourself sound stupid and un-reasonable.

Edited October 27, 2007 by ZukiSuzuki

[maipleur]

working illegally as a teacher? (not rubbishing teachers, just interested.)

I would say by the sounds of thing, you have already got the answer.

[YoungFarangNa]

I speak the language, I love the food and I was working legally in Thailand, but moved on because there were other things that we as a family needed that Thailand could not give us.

Think about what you want in life, and don't fixate on Thailand as being the only option - things will become clearer that way.

What things?

[johnnyk]

PB,

it sounds like going back to your native country is not what you want to do.

It does seem that Siam is getting on your nerves so alternatives must be considered. If it is bothering you why stay?, unless there is a "je ne sais quoi" factor.

Maybe an extended stay away from LoS woulod help clarify your thoughts.

Some place warm, reasonable cost of living, perhaps a language that's easier to learn (western alphabet & script helps) and food you like.

Maybe Latin America? Mexico isn't really cheap any more and neither is CR but friends have told me Nicaragua is on its way up.

Good luck.

[Naam]

cant eat the food - poor excuse. Do you prefer american non food?

He does not need to have any 'excuse', he asked a very reasonable question...

that's correct. i love thai food but i accept that other people can't take the spices or don't like the taste or the smell of it.

[JimsKnight]

My take on the 'Uncertain Expat' conundrum is this,

I'm a semi permanent kind of expat.

I work in my home country and live in Thailand. For me this is cool. Being single or with others is no problem for me. For some dudes it is and they get a woman or party hard or just go into their own little world and never come out.

I think it takes a certain mentality to stick it out here long term. Some can and thrive, some can and cruise along. Others must face the crossroads and decide which way to turn. We can't make that decision for you.

Any time I have doubts about LOS or Asia in general I think ' What would my quality of life be if I was back in the UK?'

The answer, my friends, is it would and is a whole lot better in LOS (for me anyway) than back home. If LOS ever loses its funky-happy-go-lucky factor I know I can dance on to somewhere else here in Asia that has that.

Most of us are in clover here and a lot seem to forget that!

For me the thai food is excellent, yes it's not weighty food but it's healthy food, and I think it's a whole lot better as it's home-grown and not imported/frozen like it is back home.

I'm getting along ok with the language, I'm not excellent, but I can get usually contribute to conversation if enough familiar words spring up.

Working legally? Gave up on that years ago, decided to make a go of making my fortune back home instead. Bring in the reserves from overseas and chill the fck out instead while here in LOS:) A few of the other expat brothers do that.

Someone else on TV put it better than I did but basically he said that all what you can get in LOS is not what you can get back home where the Rat Race is on-going etc.

Edited October 27, 2007 by JimsKnight

[Jingthing]

Everyone has their own reasons to come here, stay, or go. I find Thai food a feature as I almost never ate American food in America, unless you count Mexican (and Vietnamese?).

I agree other counties are more welcoming, of course some are less welcoming.

I also question whether speaking Thai makes it that much easier to fit in; I get the impression the general sentiment is that once a farang, always a farang, you are just different, deal with it.

PB, have you considered Ecuador? They're on US dollars and the costs to stay for retirement are very low.

Edited October 27, 2007 by Jingthing

[onethailand]

Food shouldn't be a factor - I don't particularly care for Thai food either (everyone I know gives me a ton of stick about this and tell me how they just HAVE to have Thai food every week). But I have no problem eating most other food, and there are Thai dishes that I am plenty happy to eat.

Speaking the language - well, I guess I am fortunate in that I now speak passable Thai. But that was not a factor when I moved here and didn't speak a word - nor was the fact that I couldn't really have an in-depth discussion in Thai. Strangely enough, I discovered that many of the people I was interested in talking to were more interested in speaking/practicing their English with me rather than me speaking Thai to them - though this has now changed and usually they speak to me in English and I answer in Thai Needless to say, one can hold a pretty good conversation in English if necessary.

Work - now that might be more of an issue, though I suspect you can find many ways to earn a living online if you put your mind to it.

The answer, as many others have said - really lies with you, and only you. You'll weigh your own pros and cons and come to the right decision - and if not, and you have to reverse course, it's only a flight away.

[cobra]

Maybe a brief respite somewhere else will give you some fresh perspective,

Take some time off out of country if possible, see how you feel,

Maybe you'll find things (in your life) will either stay pretty much the same, worse or better.

Could be helpful on more than one level.

No matter how idyllic the environment, without daily structure, routine, and a meaningful way to fill the day, life can become stale quickly, and of course the unrelenting feeling that you are and will always be just a stranger in a strange land doesn't help either.

And old Swede confided in me that his life in the LOS was perfect except for the loneliness, the most substantial conversation he had in a while, albeit brief was with a stranger having a beer next to him, me.

Anyway best of luck.

[Spee]

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[garro]

Hi PB, I remember you mentioning similar concerns in some of your other posts recentlly.

So this seems to be something that you have been thinking about for a while.

I would suggest that if you can, take a holiday to wherever you would consider living next. Maybe this will help you reach some conclusion. Maybe you will see that you are just going through a bad stage at the moment or maybe you will see that Thailand just isn't for you.

Life is too short to waste it spending time in a place where you're not really happy.

[Tinkelbell]

quoted.........."although I like the climate ......

PB, it's nice to know that you enjoy the climate, although yours is a very rare case.

The only thing that holding me from moving back to the land of my birth is the extreme high humidity air. I'm a outdoors person, life in air-conditioned is dreadful for me.

For that reason I choose to come to TL in the month of Dec. and Jan. only, at least during these two months, the weather is quite bearable. I'm particular enjoy Chiengmai during winter.

Where ever you choose to call a new home, I wish you long life and happiness.

[ttthailand]

PB,

I can relate with you in many ways. I have worked international and lived in Thailand for over 13 years. My work and also Thailand was great in the 90's. My work started to slow down and now my cash flow is getting tight. Aside from work Thailand has also changed, crime is up, prices are up, Thai's are not as friendly as before ( now all ) and my US dollars don't buy as much.

I am now at a point where moving back to the US is perhaps a good idea. I have spent a few months back in the states and guess what, It's not so bad. I am now looking at bringing my Thai gf back and basically starting over. Even if the cashflow was not a problem I think it was time to re-adjust my life.

Don't be worried about going back or moving on. My old friends and family love the idea of me returning. No one thinks I have failed or anything like that. It is the start of another adventure in my life.

Perhaps someday I will return to retire in Thailand. Who Knows ???

Remember, You can always come back !

[BalthazarBeefheart]

Should I bother to stay in Thailand if it's obvious that I will never speak or read Thai, never hold an in-depth conversation with many Thais? Cannot eat the food, although I like the climate and the people? And after four years, it seems unlikely or impossible that I will work legally?

In other words, without having compelling reasons to stay here (such as being destitute, having wife or children here who can't leave, performing work that I cannot do anywhere else, etc.), why stay here, especially if there are other countries just as warm, more welcoming to strangers, closer to home, where I can work and hold conversations and eat most of their food?

Am I the only one who meets the above criteria, or are others realizing they could be happier outside of Thailand? I haven't even mentioned the baht/US$ exchange ratio, or loved ones living an average of 10 time zones from me, or the possibility that some day the retirement visa criteria will be revised so that I don't qualify when I'm 69 or 77 years old and infirm.

Can anybody give me a convincing reason to stay, or shall I take the advice that if I don't like it, I can just leave?

Thanks in advance for your responses, even those I don't want to read.

i think i recall seeing you on another topic being rather critical of Thailand and see now as I have seen with others it is because you are dis-illusioned with your life here.

I think if you were to learn Thai then your experience will improve - I have learnt enough to get by and the Thais really warm to you when they see you make the effort. I had a phone call last week from a thai company and conversing in English couldn't get any agreement - I switched to thai saying exactly the same thing and straight away it was resolved.

I feel your experience also would greatly improve - I wonder as a moderator if you can get a discount with one of the sponsors Walen in Bangkok.

I think for anyone living in Thailand life is greatly improved by having Thai friends. There are many who come here and have an almost identical life to that they left behind - going to the pub meeting their mates putting the world to rights etc. For me I wanted to leave all that behind - I find it far more interesting to spend an evening with a Thai and just learning how differently they view things to us and find many of my own problems disappear.

I see you are concerned about the USD - well the consensus is that is certainly not going to get better - so you have to accept it or find a more suitable alternative.

As far as the retirement visa, I think it is very likely that the amount needed to deposit in a bank each year is going to substantially increase - what I dont know is what will become of us already here - if you are concerned perhaps you should be asking the question to Sunbelt.

Finally, I have great affection for the Thai people and on occasion have been amazed by the kindness and generosity shown by some with so little themselves. If you know of countries more welcoming to strangers etc then why are you wasting your time here.

Good Luck BB

[Heng]

Here's your first lesson - don't procrastinate = ya plaat wan bpragan pruung

ya plaat wan bpragan pruung = don't miss out on insurance day seasoning?

[jimmym40]

Wide range of replies here.

For those of thinking of returning back to the USA because of the baht/US dollar: Here's a few reasons NOT TO: (Cost of Living) (Not in any specific order)

Housing Expense: $1,000 - 1500 monthly (own or rent)

House/Rental Insurance: $30 - 40 monthly

Car Insurance: $80 - 100 monthly

Car Repairs (rip-offs): $100 monthly

Health Insurance : VERY HIGH

Dental Costs: VERY HIGH

Cable TV: $30 - 75 monthly

Utilities: Electric - $80

Gas - $60

Water - $30

Sewer - $20

Telephone (landline) - $25

DSL - $40

(Above costs taken just three months ago (Las Vegas) for a 1400 sq ft home

Cell Phone: $40-50

I probably missed a couple expenses, I just took these off the top of my head. I owned my home free and clear and it was still costing me $500 a month just to keep things active while I spent 3-4 months here in Thailand. I was lucky to get my house sold 10 months ago and made the permanent move here in CM.

Oh yes, one other think I forgot. The cost of FOOD. Spend 100 baht here in Thailand for fresh vegetables or spend for a comparable amount of vegies in the states over $10. PLUS, the cost of tips at restaurants (remember, Vegas is also the tipping capital of the world). Leaving a $5.00 tip for a breakfast meal sounds outrageous does'nt it. $20 or more tip for a steak dinner. Forget it...

For those of you complaining about the baht worth less, can you afford to pay these prices back home???

I won't get in to it, but the work ethic back home (USA) is the pits. Try reaching a real live person when you call a government agency or business (forget it). Now you have to press 1 or 2, depending if you want to talk in English or Spanish. Need I say more.

Had to add my two cents here for those of you that "forgot" what it's like back home.

Cheers.

[JSixpack]

In other words, without having compelling reasons to stay here (such as being destitute, having wife or children here who can't leave, performing work that I cannot do anywhere else, etc.), why stay here, especially if there are other countries just as warm, more welcoming to strangers, closer to home, where I can work and hold conversations and eat most of their food?

You have a reasonable case for leaving. Why some people are so desperate to live in Thailand, I'll never understand. However, do you really, really want to work? How about just doing some personal projects of interest? Can you find some kind of online work? And what will be the quality of the conversations you think you will hold elsewhere? Substantially better than that you’re having here in English? If so, why? Many who have learned Thai well say that most Thais are still not worth talking to, unless you just want to hear variations on the same stories and narrow concerns. The more interesting Thais have learned English. As for the food, in most places you will not want to eat the common local food, because it is like common food everywhere these days: too fattening, too salty, or too sugary. You’ll generally prefer to eat your own food and sometimes eat your favorite unhealthy meals out, which might not be local meals anyway.

Nonetheless, there’s much to be said for a more international, cosmopolitan yet still affordable environment. I’d say Malaysia is a step up because of a more diverse population and emphasis on English, but working there would be similarly difficult. After that, you have Central and Latin America. I do like Mexico a lot myself.

And then there's Florida . . . .

Edited October 28, 2007 by JSixpack

[naka]

I came to Asia straight from college and worked for multinationals for thirty years in

various countries, some of them really difficult countries to work and live in.

When I decided I no longer needed to continue working, I decided to live in Thailand,

not so much because ‘it had to be Thailand’ more like I was terrified of returning to farangland because it would be so foreign to me after all these years.

I have never contemplated working in Thailand, no need.

I have never seriously attempted to learn Thai, I have had to learn four languages during my career and could not be bothered learning yet another.

I never eat Thai food, I like spicy food but cannot handle chilies.

If things became untenable in Thailand I would walk out the door with nary a backward glance, just another country I lived in once … you get used to this after working for companies which tell you to start packing as you are relocating to (country name) next week.

Naka.

[ProThaiExpat]

PB" Knowing just a tad about your background, I suspect you are ready for another adventure. The negatives you posted are shared by me and in addition, I abhor the climate, except in "season" in Chiang Mai.

Having lived in many countries and had many adventures of living, you may well be used to the excitement and challenges of new places to live and your current angst suggests Thailand has lost its adventure for you. Perhaps you are a adventurous by nature and are destined to move on to a new country after a few years as a pattern of life.

You may have not built a home here or have a love interest which are big impediments to moving on, especially when you can't take the love interest along.

As you get older, family may well become more important, I find the lure of Australia greater every year as my daughter has had my first grandchild and with one in the oven. I was there for the first one and will go back for the second.

As some have suggested, perhaps a bi-country approach should be considered. Six months in one country and six months in another. Since weather is a big one for me, winters in Australia which coincide with summer here is a very attractive alternative. But as has been posted, it may require saving money during my six months here, so I can afford to live for six months there. By the way, online visas for six months are a big attraction of Australia.

Someone suggested you go on an extended vacation to another country that intrigues you and I agree that is an excellent idea. After six months, re-evaluate and perhaps you will end up being a "snow bird" or, better yet, a "weather bird" like me and be "bi", as to countries that is!.

[Ulysses G.]

Should I bother to stay in Thailand if it's obvious that I will never speak or read Thai, never hold an in-depth conversation with many Thais? Cannot eat the food, although I like the climate and the people? And after four years, it seems unlikely or impossible that I will work legally?

You seem very intelligent to me and if I could learn Thai, almost anyone could and I am fairly fluent now. You just have to sign up for classes and keep on going and eventually you will get it.

As far as Thai food goes, I never have liked it much, but now there are lots of foreign restaurants here; a real choice of decent food from all over the globe and the longer you stay here, the more you find Thai dishes that you do like to make your food budget cheaper.

Work is a whole different story, but when I first came here, almost NOBODY was working legally or could get long term visas.

I guess that only you can decide if the good points outweigh the bad ones here, but I know that I rather live here than anywhere else!

[onzestan]

Can anybody give me a convincing reason to stay, or shall I take the advice that if I don't like it, I can just leave?

Dear PeaceBlondie,

Nobody except you yourself can answer this question.

Fact is, when you're homesick, be it for loved ones, places, food and/or other things, you start to idolize the things that you're missing.

Don't forget that the time you have spent here has changed you, and so have the persons, things that you've left behind.

Also there's always the question, will my partner be happy where I want to go and stay.

Take a leave and open your eyes and take a good look at the things you're missing.

Works for me EVERYTIME !

Good luck

Onzestan

[geriatrickid]

If you have doubts sufficient enough to vocalize them, then they are real enough to demand attention. even if you decide to stick it our a few months, those doubts will come back. Time for a break as other contributors advise.

Leaving Thailand doesn't necessarily mean a return to the "west", but you may wish to consider a place with less extremes in your environment. Places that come to mind are Panama & Costa Rica. In point form, here's what Costa Rica offers versus Thailand;

- less than 3hrs to Miami and from there, anywhere in the USA.

- Highest literacy rate in latin America @ 96%. Free highschool education.

- Locals as friendly as Thais.

- Lower residency financial requirements

- Easier to get permanent residency (2 yrs.). With that you can get a job. Even without a job, you an operate a business with less paperwork than in Thailand.

- Comparable cost of living

- Predominately "middle class" with less extremes in poverty.

- Government tuned into the needs and requirements of foreign residents.

- The army was abolished

- Corruption is not as stifling

- Robust spirit of democracy and a free press

- Massive tourism industry which government protects and invests in.

- Water and electricity supplies are reliable.

- Environmental protection is a priority and a source of national pride

- Boasts a stong Chinese, Indian and European presence that goes back over a century

- A diversity of food and customs that will leave you with a spoilt palate.

- No religious strife. No one is running around beheading anyone.

- Best of all, one of thebest community health networks in Latin America.

A social service network that provides effective health care, education and pensions. It's health care system exceeds some european nations and regions in North America.

Costa Rica is what Thailand could have been had the Thai government chosen a different root for development. In Costa Rica, its actions, not empty slogans.

Bet you can tell where I'm headed eventually.