English Teachers Only Get Stuck With Bar Girls?

[Storekeeper]

Nemisis,

You're about three articulation levels above that Smeg/smyth fella the Brits pick on over at ajarn.com

[Savage]

The point is if he thinks that by being a teacher he is restricted to bar girls then he is wrong, I'm not trying to show off my wife just reply about his theory of not being able to get it on with middle class poonani

But I think you know that already geezer

[meemiathai]

Would you date a girl from 7/11 from your home country?

Sorry, but that sucks!

Getting a bit sick of this class issue.

[Savage]

Would you date a girl from 7/11 from your home country?

Sorry, but that sucks!

Getting a bit sick of this class issue.

I agree 200%

Many of my friends Mums work in Sainsburys or Martins.

And hey I worked in a newspaper shop. When I was 13 I had a paper round. If you think dating somebody who works in a shop back home is below you then you are a bit of a <deleted>

[duke69]

Would you date a girl from 7/11 from your home country??

yes no problem

[MadFrankie]

Would you date a girl from 7/11 from your home country??

yes no problem

would depend on how big her rack was

[bkkmadness]

(meemiathai @ Mon 2004-09-06, 16:07:34)

Would you date a girl from 7/11 from your home country?

Sorry, but that sucks!

Getting a bit sick of this class issue.

I agree 200%

Many of my friends Mums work in Sainsburys or Martins.

And hey I worked in a newspaper shop. When I was 13 I had a paper round. If you think dating somebody who works in a shop back home is below you then you are a bit of a <deleted>

Yeah, my Mum works at superdrugs, Dad's a bus driver, so I'm from a working class family off a council estate, both decent hard working people, although I'm a complete slacker .

This guy sounds like he is more of a class snob than the middle/upper class Thais he's moaning about. He's either middle class himself and gutted because he now thinks he has to sink down a class to get a gf, or he's working class and trying to get himself up a notch by getting a gf from above him.

And sorry if this sounds personal and should I should have said 'english teachers' instead of pointing the finger at you Nemesis, but I do think that the original post was about you and based on your personal experiences, and if it wasn't, then why worry about it?

Whatever man, shouldn't be so shallow as to be thinking about money and class when trying to find some loving in your life.

Tits and arse always good guidelines by my book.

[meemiathai]

QUOTE=meemiathai,Mon 2004-09-06, 16:07:34]

Would you date a girl from 7/11 from your home country??

yes no problem

Sorry mate, but please don't give people an impression that this was my question!

[bkk barney]

well i for one wouldnt date a 7 11 gal, i mean she has been educated to maybe a 13 year olds standard, i couldnt see that educationally that we would have much in common, and as the thai education system isnt the best in the world u could say that she has the education of a uk 11 year old, or an american 16 year old, or an aussie 13 year old, yep i cant see these sort of relationships standing the test of time...

[meemiathai]

Go <deleted> the books, then!

[Harry Palmer]

What we don't hear much about are English teachers marrying decent Thai women and raising a family.

what can i tell you... i'm a qualified english teacher & madame palmer is a decent Thai woman (well, she was afore she met me ) ... baby palmer is doing ok & can already count to 5...

of course i haven't always been a teacher, cos i didn't see it as a way of providing a firm financial base that a decent standard of living would provide me with... no it's more like a hobby or an outside interest

money & a decent piece of ass is everything i ever wanted... yipee!

[bkkmadness]

Sorry meemiathai, I am still trying to get the hang of these quote boxes.

well i for one wouldnt date a 7 11 gal, i mean she has been educated to maybe a 13 year olds standard, i couldnt see that educationally that we would have much in common, and as the thai education system isnt the best in the world u could say that she has the education of a uk 11 year old, or an american 16 year old, or an aussie 13 year old, yep i cant see these sort of relationships standing the test of time...

Maybe she could self educate herself, I know I have on many things. Perhaps if you took a chance to find out about the girl in 7/11 you would know about her education and then judge her, not just by the job she does. I know Uni students that have passed uni and work in Maccy Ds.

My gf graduated in Politics, and I just got educated to a 16yr old level, does that mean we are not compatible educationally? And on the point, just because you are not educated at the same level, does that mean you aren't compatible for a relationship? Is education level, class level and financial background the only thing that you can match yourselves on. Sad.

[meemiathai]

Sorry meemiathai, I am still trying to get the hang of these quote boxes.

I was referring to duke69 only. And nothing serious really.

[meemiathai]

I have met quite a few uni-graduates who have the lowest IQ, who have not a clue what is right/wrong, why things happen! Some who would scream like the sky is falling just because a god-###### cockroach is crawling around 10 metres away.

Isn't it easy to get a degree if one has the money? So....?

I would want to say, if someone would think of a person as stupid or whatever just because he/she is working in 7/11, I would doubt how smart this someone could really be.

[Ijustwannateach]

Nemisis,

You're about three articulation levels above that Smeg/smyth fella the Brits pick on over at ajarn.com

Heh heh heh... Nem's harmless enough. This is a new kind of thread for him, though, which is impressive considering that of a few hundred thousand posts over on ajarn virtually all of them were either about his version of Christian fundamentalism, UFOs (Nem believes in them), extremist conspiracy theory politics, misogynist anti-woman tirades based on his family history, with minor notes in homophobia and Jewish conspiracy theory.

He's fun to tease once in awhile. Say, Nem, it seems pretty gutsy of you to admit in public that you're out there charming them bar women [despite being an English teacher]- after all, you're the rabid fundamentalist Christian, right? Isn't being proud that the devil is tempting you some kind of special sin? just asking!

"Steven"

[bkk barney]

Sorry meemiathai, I am still trying to get the hang of these quote boxes.

well i for one wouldnt date a 7 11 gal, i mean she has been educated to maybe a 13 year olds standard, i couldnt see that educationally that we would have much in common, and as the thai education system isnt the best in the world u could say that she has the education of a uk 11 year old, or an american 16 year old, or an aussie 13 year old, yep i cant see these sort of relationships standing the test of time...

Maybe she could self educate herself, I know I have on many things. Perhaps if you took a chance to find out about the girl in 7/11 you would know about her education and then judge her, not just by the job she does. I know Uni students that have passed uni and work in Maccy Ds.

My gf graduated in Politics, and I just got educated to a 16yr old level, does that mean we are not compatible educationally? And on the point, just because you are not educated at the same level, does that mean you aren't compatible for a relationship? Is education level, class level and financial background the only thing that you can match yourselves on. Sad.

it must be so sad being you...

yep i cant live with gals that have had 6 years education, i actually need to talk to then sometimes, u know get answers like, but getting answers about thai from a gal that has 6 years education is probably pretty hard..

[dsukhumvit]

Well, Nem, from the English teachers I know, if you're only making 25-30,000 a month, you're either a lazy <deleted>, in which case you might deserve a bit of 'scorn,' or residing in buffalo country where that mighe seem like twice as much as similar Bangkok wages, in which case you are far outstripping the locals wages, probably the teachers also.

I've yet to hear any Thai's, hi-so or otherwise disparaging farang English teachers or any other farang for that matter. I know you might not believe this, but they really don't have a whole lot of interest in you either way unless you happen to be involved with their little child, I am sure. Most of the hi-so's, rich Thais or others whom I meet are usually quite charming and inocuous, so much so, that the few that are <deleted> stand out as representing the whole group and the others, being very Thai, simpy go about their business creating no fuss. Sorry, but you matter to them little in either a positive or negative way.

Hence, you getting stuck with a bar girl is an active choice as you, I can only guess, have either decided you will not venture into normal society or are to inept to do so.

From the other tones of your missives; dissing 7/11 girls and such, I'd say, yes, you're a <deleted> for sure I'd wager. Though, in person I'm sure you're a charming, sensitive, intelligent and well-rounded gentleman.

Besides, at the end of it all, who is really getting stuck with whom? I'd wager the bg isn't necessarily getting the better end of the deal.

[Neeranam]

Most Thai women know this. That is why we rarely see a middle-class to upper-middle class Thai woman interested in a foreign teacher as a possible marriage partner.

You must be hanging out at the wrong places man. It does happen. I have 3 good friends, who are English teachers and they are happily married to hi-so Thai ladies. All three were educated in England, and two had those long names, indicating desecndency from some of the Royal Family. The Prince was even at one of their weddings. You don't find these woman frequenting Nana Plaza etc.

You can better yourself in many areas, not just by increasing your salary. You would be better trying instead of wasting your time posting your resentments against yourself, bargirls, and those of higher class than yourself.

[meom]

I thought teachers by definition prefer bargirls since it is the only outlet where they can play the role of a student instead of a teacher.

[RDN]

... and they are happily married to hi-so Thai ladies....

I like lo-so too :

http://www.thailandguru.com/culture-journa...nment-loso.html

[medicinebox]

There is a saying:

When looking for friends go up the ladder, when looking for a wife go down the ladder.

just my tuppenys worth.

[phormio]

English teacher's salaries at most government schools here in LOS,  are not enuf to support a steady girlfriend, never mind a family.  Certainly not enough to provide for the usual expenses, such as a car and a savings account.

Most Thai women know this.  That is why we rarely see a middle-class to upper-middle class Thai woman interested in a foreign teacher as a possible marriage partner.

What we don't hear much about are English teachers marrying decent Thai women and raising a family.

...

I get tired of hearing about how good English teachers have it here in Thailand.  The bottom line is we are used by Thai people to educate their young people but basically the better off Thai don't want anything to do with us and considered us low class because, frankly, that's what we are in Thai society.

Don't forget the lowest rungs of American Society - the cannon fodder used to "liberate" the petroleum resources of planet earth for the land of the free and the home of the brave. (Sorry , couldn't resist)

Seems like Nemmy's determined to strongly discourage anyone considering emigrating to the LoS to teach (regardless of their motivation ).

Nemmy seems to be hostile to any positive aspects to teaching in Thailand. He posted in partial response to a post I made (on the Business forum) where I advised a soon-to-be retiree who wanted to emigrate to the LoS that he could probably get a job earning 40,000 baht teaching(and thus be able to stay and work in the LoS until he wanted to retire a few years later). Nemmy strongly stated this was unrealistic (he is wrong, of course) .

Nonetheless, he comes up with some very good points and makes them well.

... My comments are about what the Thais think about English teachers in general. Not all Thais of course for you literalists, but most of middle to upper class Thai society, especially Chinese/Thais.

This is absolutely spot-on; status is a major factor in Thai society (much more so than in the US, my home port) - particularly for the middle/upper-middle and professional classes- overwhelmingly populated by the Sino-Thai ruling elite. This is where consideration of the status of women in Thai society, particularly in the Chinese subculture, comes in - which puts women at the very bottom .

This leaves a major opening for anyone from outside the Chinese culture who might be interested in accomplished Thai women. To put it mildly, a high percentage of these women are treated like crap and are disaffected by their roles in their romantic relationships, families, professions, culutre and society in general. Their is a huge pool of accomplished but resentful women who would no doubt be quite open to romantic relationships with farang .

Of course , by the same standard, if they get a "reputation" as a "bad girl", they might easily be disowned by their families. Look at the post in the General forum regarding the concern of Thai teen's interest in Sex and Drugs. Another 20 years , with a new generation running the show, this will all change.

So Nemmy, go get em- might be your last chance.

And no Nemmy, I'm not some rabid emasculated radical feminist.

...

The point I'm trying to make is this: regardless of all the wai kru bullshit, we English teachers are considered lower class workers in Thai society. We can't even afford a car on our salary and yet the number of new cars on the road in Thailand in nothing short of phenomenal.  And please don't tell me about how we make more money than Thai English teachers. They all drive cars.

Phormio's insert: their rich(or long-saving)mommies and daddies bought cars for the kiddies

I'm not too dense to recognize that there are a few decent Thai woman that would marry for "love."  ...  Why should they settle for a low paying English teacher on a rice and noodle salary when there are many other options available?

Phormio's insert:Its not  just a few, its a whole freaking continent full of decent women open to non-traditional(by their standards) relationships. Money does not a happy person make

And buying a car on a teacher's salary - well at lets say 2 million baht and 5% interest(your thai wife will help you get the loan) thats about 100,000 baht per year (9,000 baht per month) payments - something that is not insurmountable(particularly if your splitting the bill with your spouse/gf).

Live and let live. What many farang don't realize is that they sometimes get treated a lot better than local people.

People make their own choices - ... sooner or later a girl from the upper echelons of Thai society will think that is a refreshing enough change and become interested, if that's what you want.

You are unlikely to change any attitudes within the Chinese Thai community, and why bother since you don't seem to like them anyway?

...

Amen, brother !

[boris]

Would you date a girl from 7/11 from your home country?

Sorry, but that sucks!

Getting a bit sick of this class issue.

I agree 200%

Many of my friends Mums work in Sainsburys or Martins.

And hey I worked in a newspaper shop. When I was 13 I had a paper round. If you think dating somebody who works in a shop back home is below you then you are a bit of a <deleted>

It's interesting how agitated some people become when the subject of social class crops up.This is a particularly confused contribution, invoking British Mums working in shops back in UK as a reason why farangs should not be concerned about dating young Thai girls in 7/11s.I wouldn't dream of looking down at the people working in shops whether British or Thais, though in both cases they are probably either lower class or possibly lower middle class (so I imagine are many members of this forum).Generally people of roughly the same class end up being together but there are many exceptions.Also many people through education, marriage. work, good looks, personality etc end up rising high and transcending their class of origin.Others don't, for example the coarse featured Chang swigging brutalised Pattaya(but there are plenty elsewhere in Thailand) British riff raff.It's all very fluid and has been for many years.Would I date a sweet young Thai thing from my local 7/11/.You bet I would.Would I have much in common with your friends Mums working in Martins or Sainsburys?I very much doubt it and unfortunately,in contrast to their Thai equivalents, they would be immediately identifiable by their accents.But I wouldn't look down on them at all.Does any of this matter? Not very much.But class distinction lives on.

[Heng]

You let yourself get looked down upon.

Wrong assumption my friend. I don't let myself be looked down upon. My comments are about what the Thais think about English teachers in general. Not all Thais of course for you literalists, but most of middle to upper class Thai society, especially Chinese/Thais.

How can you tell if we're looking down on you or not?

[Heng]

The point I'm trying to make is this: regardless of all the wai kru bullshit, we English teachers are considered lower class workers in Thai society. We can't even afford a car on our salary and yet the number of new cars on the road in Thailand in nothing short of phenomenal.  And please don't tell me about how we make more money than Thai English teachers. They all drive cars.

Class is surely relative. I'd say that some English teachers are definitely considered middle class, such as those who earn quite well off of privates and have years of savings and perhaps investments into a few small businesses. And overall, I think that teachers at least 'class' above prostitutes, garbage collectors, motorcycle taxis, etc. The lower classes are made up of 10-20+ million people (probably more). I'd say the average foreign teacher is at least above that baseline.

Also, owning a car surely doesn't improve your class now does it? That's awfully 'baan nok' thinking don't you think? It might be healthier if you just imagine that all those Thai teachers are in debt and under the strain of car payments (which they all aren't, but many are).

[Foggy Bottom]

Maybe the girl in 7/11 wants a date sometime?

Hope the one in mine does - she's drop dead gorgeous and has the most stunning genuine smile - after 5 years here I'm starting to spot the fake ones

[WISteve]

well i for one wouldnt date a 7 11 gal, i mean she has been educated to maybe a 13 year olds standard, i couldnt see that educationally that we would have much in common, and as the thai education system isnt the best in the world u could say that she has the education of a uk 11 year old, or an american 16 year old, or an aussie 13 year old, yep i cant see these sort of relationships standing the test of time...

I'm thinking the 7-11 girl has far too much class for you, Barney. A presumption of superiority in your eyes might be misplaced in my thinking.

I know a lady who was formerly in the trade who has a degree now and is working for 7-11. While she doesn't work in a retail outlet very often, she's not above it on occasions and I'm proud of her.

This kind of thinking, without regard to the individual involved, is the worst kind of prejudice IMO.

WISteve

Oh. You wouldn't be from the UK just by chance? <deleted>.

[Nemesis]

Nemmy seems to be hostile to any positive aspects to teaching in Thailand.

.....he could probably get a job earning 40,000 baht teaching(and thus be able to stay and work in the LoS until he wanted to retire a few years later). Nemmy strongly stated this was unrealistic (he is wrong, of course) .

Several positive aspects of any thing one undertakes exist, but that's not the topic of discussion herein.

After residing in and looking for teaching positions within Thailand with a degree, TESOL, excellent recommendations and track record, my experience in LOS tells me it will be very difficult to secure a 40,000 baht/month job teaching English in a decent environment/atmosphere/with acceptable hours etc, with a short period of time espceically anywhere outside of noisy, polluted stressfilled Bangkok.

And I wouldn't teach sweaty after lunch Matihom or Prathom boys for 50,000 baht a month.

[Nemesis]

Also, owning a car surely doesn't improve your class now does it? That's awfully 'baan nok' thinking don't you think?

Never said it was. Making enough money to own a car does elevate one's perceived status in society, no?

[Heng]

Also, owning a car surely doesn't improve your class now does it?  That's awfully 'baan nok' thinking don't you think?

Never said it was. Making enough money to own a car does elevate one's perceived status in society, no?

Yeah, sure. I thought you were earning enough to have a car though? Didn't you mention being retired from owning multiple businesses on the other board?