Samak Sundaravej was elected

[Old Man River]

And the beat goes on and on and on.

Moral issues aside, is Samak even legally qualified to be a PM?

http://www.bangkokpost.com/breaking_news/b...s.php?id=126098

[John K]

Looking more and more like we know what is keeping Thaksin from returning early. Do the math here people, not good at all.

Source: Samak meets secretly with army boss over reshuffle

Prime Minister Samak Sundaravej met in secret with army chief Gen Anupong Paojinda yesterday amid rumours that the meeting was about a reshuffle of commanders of key military units by mid-year, an army source said.

The source said Mr Samak, also the defence minister, drove his personal car to army headquarters quietly without a motorcade.

The source said Mr Samak cancelled his scheduled meeting with the defence permanent secretary, the navy commander, the airforce commander at the Defence Ministry the same day.

The source said Mr Samak wanted to have a discussion with Gen Anupong about the mid-year military reshuffle, which is to be finalised by March 15.

More: http://www.bangkokpost.net/News/23Feb2008_news01.php

[John K]

This was predicted long ago that Thaksin would do this. Just a quick look at things, it appears when Thaksin returns the country will be fulling in his control and all opposition that has the ability to stop him will have been neutralized. After that watch how fast things go south.

And before you can ask me, Yes I too have noted the anti junta bunch has fallen deafly silent.

[younghusband]

This was predicted long ago that Thaksin would do this. Just a quick look at things, it appears when Thaksin returns the country will be fulling in his control and all opposition that has the ability to stop him will have been neutralized. After that watch how fast things go south.

And before you can ask me, Yes I too have noted the anti junta bunch has fallen deafly silent.

The anti-junta bunch as you call it, to the extent I understand your post, probably includes the majority of the Thai people.I don't know about this forum and frankly in the overall scheme of things does it really matter what we -expats with too much time on our hands- think? Anyway actions have consequences and those perceived to be have been unduly accomodating with the illegal junta are now being purged or moved to inactive posts.I don't like it and I don't much like this mediocre government but it is true that Thaksin is gradually gaining control.Bangkok Pundit thinks he will be back within the month.Thereafter it will be diffferent for Thaksin while being many things is not mediocre.Then the real battle begins and the stakes are very high.

And all this flows from the illegal coup, a catastrophic mistake by the Premocracy.

[chownah]

Source: Samak meets secretly with army boss over reshuffle

More: http://www.bangkokpost.net/News/23Feb2008_news01.php

Does anyone besides me see the oxymoron character of publishing this headline....once its published it can hardly be truthfull described as meeting "secretly"!!!!!

Chownah

P.S. Isn't the "anti junta bunch" runnning the gov't now.....they have hardly "fallen deafly silent"....nor even "deathly silent" either.

Chownah

[sriracha john]

Bangkok Pundit thinks he will be back within the month.

Always good to hear of another avid reader of Thaivisa...

Yet another change to the grand entrance return date.... pushing it up three months

Justice Minister voices concern for Thaksin safety

Justice Minister Sompong Amornwiwat expressed concern for safety of ousted PM Thaksin Shinawatra if he is to return to Thailand. He said Thaksin is loved and hated by different groups of people, so anything can happen to him. He also said that he believes Thaksin will not inform anyone prior to his return. His statement came amid reports that the deposed PM may come back earlier than expected. Panthongtae, Thaksin's son, told media at a launch of an entertainment magazine on Tuesday that his father will return to Thailand next month. He said he has spoken to Thaksin last week, and that he is in good health. The deposed PM also said he misses Thailand, according to his son. Deputy PM Somchai Wongsawat, Thaksin's brother-in-law, said he did not know that the ousted PM plans to return in March. He admitted, however, that he has not

Continued here:

http://www.bangkokpost.com/breaking_news/b...s.php?id=126038

[sriracha john]

Bangkok Pundit thinks he will be back within the month.

Always good to hear of another avid reader of Thaivisa...

Yet another change to the grand entrance return date.... pushing it up three months

Justice Minister voices concern for Thaksin safety

Justice Minister Sompong Amornwiwat expressed concern for safety of ousted PM Thaksin Shinawatra if he is to return to Thailand. He said Thaksin is loved and hated by different groups of people, so anything can happen to him. He also said that he believes Thaksin will not inform anyone prior to his return. His statement came amid reports that the deposed PM may come back earlier than expected. Panthongtae, Thaksin's son, told media at a launch of an entertainment magazine on Tuesday that his father will return to Thailand next month. He said he has spoken to Thaksin last week, and that he is in good health. The deposed PM also said he misses Thailand, according to his son. Deputy PM Somchai Wongsawat, Thaksin's brother-in-law, said he did not know that the ousted PM plans to return in March. He admitted, however, that he has not

Continued here:

http://www.bangkokpost.com/breaking_news/b...s.php?id=126038

geez...I'm sorry... it seems it's been so long since he's posted, I actually forgot that he really is a valid member and not a reading guest.

hey, c'mon... bkkpundit , please post more often...

They were always an interesting read when I did so in the past...

btw, what do you make of this whole Oak thing anyway? So you think he's being truthful when he says Dad's back in a month? But then again, it is, Oak , afterall that is saying this.

I certainly wouldn't be suprised, however, if it actually does occur and likely other confirmations of his return will come out soon, if they already haven't.

and when it does occur... then, it will real interesting around here...

anyway, post here once in a while, besides, the more you post here, the more it saves on having to visit multiple sites.

[Plus]

This was predicted long ago that Thaksin would do this. Just a quick look at things, it appears when Thaksin returns the country will be fulling in his control and all opposition that has the ability to stop him will have been neutralized. After that watch how fast things go south.

And before you can ask me, Yes I too have noted the anti junta bunch has fallen deafly silent.

The anti-junta bunch as you call it, to the extent I understand your post, probably includes the majority of the Thai people.I don't know about this forum and frankly in the overall scheme of things does it really matter what we -expats with too much time on our hands- think? Anyway actions have consequences and those perceived to be have been unduly accomodating with the illegal junta are now being purged or moved to inactive posts.I don't like it and I don't much like this mediocre government but it is true that Thaksin is gradually gaining control.Bangkok Pundit thinks he will be back within the month.Thereafter it will be diffferent for Thaksin while being many things is not mediocre.Then the real battle begins and the stakes are very high.

And all this flows from the illegal coup, a catastrophic mistake by the Premocracy.

He probably meant TV posters. As for the rest of the country - 60+% voted for various junta backed parties.

And I disagree that the current lame attempt at the government is somehow junta's fault. For all Samak and Co deficiencies, the country is peaceful now, unlike in September 2006 when it was on the brink of a new round of street protests and Thaksin has run out of all options to negotiate his way out of the political crisis. This peaceful transition was junta's main achievement.

[John K]

Plus is correct, the anti junta Thais are in power now doing their very best to neutralize the military in short order so they can continue their rape and pillage of Thailand unhindered. Thaksin is being very sure not to repeat the same mistake before he sets foot inside Thailand. The military, the police, and anyone else who can stop him must be under his control. He does not care that he is banned, he does not care about the law. The comments about not being able to protect Thaksin are very valid. If he can not be stopped legally, that leaves few options for the Thais.

[John K]

END OF EXILE

Thaksin 'on the brink of return'

Ex-PM calls up supporters in Chiang Rai from Cambodia

Thaksin Shinawatra appears to be on the verge of returning to Thailand after living in exile since he was deposed as prime minister in the September 19, 2006 coup.

Thaksin reportedly arrived in neighbouring Cambodia on Friday at the invitation of Prime Minister Hun Sen for a round of golf. About 1,000 of his supporters yesterday attended an event in the northern province of Chiang Rai, dubbed "We Miss Thaksin".

During the affair, in a downtown area, Thaksin phoned in and announced before the crowd that he would know by next Tuesday exactly when to stage his comeback. For the people who forgot that is the day the EC is set to rule on Mr. Yongyuth. It also says he is a coward and not willing to face justice unless it is fixed in his favor.

Thaksin also told his supporters in Chiang Rai that he had no plan to stay in Thailand for a long period after returning because he has to travel overseas for business.

Thaksin also extended his congratulations to Chiang Rai residents during his phone-in, as Yongyuth Tiyapairat - a Chiang Rai politician - was recently elected as the president of Parliament.

According to TNN, a cable-TV station, Yongyuth was reportedly with Thaksin during the phone-in.

Sources from the ruling People Power Party (PPP) said Thaksin would stay in Cambodia until today before heading to Beijing, his next stop. Thaksin's arrival in Phnom Penh came ahead of Prime Minister Samak Sundaravej's planned official visit to the neighbouring country on March 3. Speculation was rife that Thaksin, who chose Samak to head the PPP, which won the most seats in the December general election, could have a meeting with Samak in Phnom Penh. However, Samak said he was not aware of Thaksin's trip and he would have to be informed in advance if there would be such a meeting.

Phromsak Saempoh, chairman of the Northern Grassroots Network, who organised the gathering in Chiang Rai for Thaksin, said no one had been paid to attend.

He said if Thaksin really returned to his home town in the adjacent province of Chiang Mai, some 20,000 members of his group would rally to welcome the former premier.

According to the organiser, Confederation for Democracy leader Weng Tojirakarn and Thaksin's son Panthongthae were among those invited for yesterday's gathering.

Some Thaksin supporters said they heard the ousted premier might fly in directly to his home-town province of Chiang Mai, bypassing Bangkok's Suvarnabhumi Airport.

Surapong Towichakchaikul, a Chiang Mai MP under the PPP banner, said Thaksin's supporters wished they could welcome Thaksin by Songkran, the Thai New Year, in April.

Sources said residents of Chiang Mai had started to prepare for Thaksin's homecoming as rumours abound that he could be back sooner than expected.

Thaksin also reportedly got his red diplomatic passport back after his former legal adviser, Noppadon Pattama, was named foreign minister.

The Nation

[John K]

If Thaksin is that concerned about controlling the military, that can only be read as he plans to go to and beyond the point that triggered the last coup. If Thaksin was planning to be Mr. Nice he would not have this concern at all.

[sriracha john]

END OF EXILE

Thaksin 'on the brink of return'

Ex-PM calls up supporters in Chiang Rai from Cambodia

Thaksin Shinawatra appears to be on the verge of returning to Thailand after living in exile since he was deposed as prime minister in the September 19, 2006 coup.

Thaksin reportedly arrived in neighbouring Cambodia on Friday at the invitation of Prime Minister Hun Sen for a round of golf. About 1,000 of his supporters yesterday attended an event in the northern province of Chiang Rai, dubbed "We Miss Thaksin".

During the affair, in a downtown area, Thaksin phoned in and announced before the crowd that he would know by next Tuesday exactly when to stage his comeback. For the people who forgot that is the day the EC is set to rule on Mr. Yongyuth. It also says he is a coward and not willing to face justice unless it is fixed in his favor.

Thaksin also told his supporters in Chiang Rai that he had no plan to stay in Thailand for a long period after returning because he has to travel overseas for business.

Thaksin also extended his congratulations to Chiang Rai residents during his phone-in, as Yongyuth Tiyapairat - a Chiang Rai politician - was recently elected as the president of Parliament.

According to TNN, a cable-TV station, Yongyuth was reportedly with Thaksin during the phone-in.

Sources from the ruling People Power Party (PPP) said Thaksin would stay in Cambodia until today before heading to Beijing, his next stop. Thaksin's arrival in Phnom Penh came ahead of Prime Minister Samak Sundaravej's planned official visit to the neighbouring country on March 3. Speculation was rife that Thaksin, who chose Samak to head the PPP, which won the most seats in the December general election, could have a meeting with Samak in Phnom Penh. However, Samak said he was not aware of Thaksin's trip and he would have to be informed in advance if there would be such a meeting.

Phromsak Saempoh, chairman of the Northern Grassroots Network, who organised the gathering in Chiang Rai for Thaksin, said no one had been paid to attend.

He said if Thaksin really returned to his home town in the adjacent province of Chiang Mai, some 20,000 members of his group would rally to welcome the former premier.

According to the organiser, Confederation for Democracy leader Weng Tojirakarn and Thaksin's son Panthongthae were among those invited for yesterday's gathering.

Some Thaksin supporters said they heard the ousted premier might fly in directly to his home-town province of Chiang Mai, bypassing Bangkok's Suvarnabhumi Airport.

Surapong Towichakchaikul, a Chiang Mai MP under the PPP banner, said Thaksin's supporters wished they could welcome Thaksin by Songkran, the Thai New Year, in April.

Sources said residents of Chiang Mai had started to prepare for Thaksin's homecoming as rumours abound that he could be back sooner than expected.

Thaksin also reportedly got his red diplomatic passport back after his former legal adviser, Noppadon Pattama, was named foreign minister.

The Nation

well there it is....

but, with all due respect...

perhaps this post is best suited for movement to the thread that is more specific to its contents.... which is, Thaksin's return.

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=160602

Prosecutors Vow To Arrest Thaksin Upon His Return To Thailand

[aaaaaa]

It's not easy running an organisation packed with criminals.

yes, indeed

however it is nothing new. rather it's become some sort of a Thai tradition

for example, one man clearly involved in Hok Tulaa:

Sudsai Hasadin

Thai army major general in 1974 founded the Red Gaur, a right-wing movement that killed

and assaulted leftists during stormy revolution and counterrevolution

The Red Gaur, made up mostly of vocational school students, served as shock troops in attacking left-wing activists and breaking up their meetings. The group also took part in a raid on Thammasat University in 1976, when students were protesting the return of toppled military dictator Thanom Kittikachorn from exile. About 100 protesters were lynched, shot or burned to death, and the disorder was used as an excuse for the military to oust a democratically

(From: The Washington Post

Date: August 18, 2001)

video clips

and

BTW interesting piece of info - that here Washington Post says that there were about 100 victims - number twice bigger than mentioned nowadays. and I saw this number in some other articles elsewhere, dated about the same time.

so, this guy Hasadin definitely was there and his "Red Bulls".

also, some accuse Samak's predecessor Surayud for "Black May":

During Bloody May, the violent crackdown 1992 on anti-government protestors, Surayud's men were seen shooting protesters and dragging them through the bloody lobby of the Royal Hotel. He later claimed that he never gave orders for his soldiers to shoot...

(from Wiki)

On May 17, 1992, soldiers fired on a crowd of pro-democracy protesters in Bangkok, killing 52 and wounding more than 100. Surayud was then commander of the élite special forces. He had been lobbying his superiors to resolve the situation without using force, but his men had also been seen dragging protesters through the lobby of the Royal Hotel. Days later he told a national television audience that he deplored the loss of life and that he had not given any orders to shoot, an account that was never disputed.

(from Time)

some video footage is

and

so, perhaps the degree of Samak's involvement in 1976 was not much different than Surayud's in 1992

[plachon]

I am not sure what to say about the Eucalyptus except it goes without saying there is a cut in it for Samak and probably Thaksin too. As far as Eucalyptus being another crop, I don’t see it as a bad thing as it is used in so many products. It probably will be added to the Fire Trucks, Scanners, Rubber trees, computers list soon.

I understand that Thaksin used to have a rather large share in pulp and paper company Advanced Agro, whose trucks one sees Isaan-wide loading up with eucalyptus logs for the drive to the pulp mills in Nakhon Nayok. The network of AA agents and economic reach around the region rivals that of the defunct, but very much alive in spirit TRT party. Anyone know if the Shins still have their share in AA, or did that go to Temasek? I guess with the rapid announcement to push eucalyptus plantations as a policy, they still very much have an interest in the business, along with numerous other PPP politicians.

I guess one could say is "Vote PPP and get monocrop pulpwood plantations countrywide" as easily as one could say "Plant eucalyptus and line the pockets of Toxon and buddies".

[younghusband]

I am not sure what to say about the Eucalyptus except it goes without saying there is a cut in it for Samak and probably Thaksin too. As far as Eucalyptus being another crop, I don’t see it as a bad thing as it is used in so many products. It probably will be added to the Fire Trucks, Scanners, Rubber trees, computers list soon.

I understand that Thaksin used to have a rather large share in pulp and paper company Advanced Agro, whose trucks one sees Isaan-wide loading up with eucalyptus logs for the drive to the pulp mills in Nakhon Nayok. The network of AA agents and economic reach around the region rivals that of the defunct, but very much alive in spirit TRT party. Anyone know if the Shins still have their share in AA, or did that go to Temasek? I guess with the rapid announcement to push eucalyptus plantations as a policy, they still very much have an interest in the business, along with numerous other PPP politicians.

I guess one could say is "Vote PPP and get monocrop pulpwood plantations countrywide" as easily as one could say "Plant eucalyptus and line the pockets of Toxon and buddies".

You are completely misinformed.Thaksin never was a significant shareholder in Advance Agro, which incidentally is shortly to be delisted.

[younghusband]

If Thaksin is that concerned about controlling the military, that can only be read as he plans to go to and beyond the point that triggered the last coup. If Thaksin was planning to be Mr. Nice he would not have this concern at all.

If I remember rightly Thaksin was removed by a military coup.If he was to return it would obviously make sense to ensure "his" people were in place in the military.Any capable politician does the same in a third world country.I am sure he has no intention of being "Mr Nice" by the way.

Edited February 24, 2008 by younghusband

[plachon]

I am not sure what to say about the Eucalyptus except it goes without saying there is a cut in it for Samak and probably Thaksin too. As far as Eucalyptus being another crop, I don’t see it as a bad thing as it is used in so many products. It probably will be added to the Fire Trucks, Scanners, Rubber trees, computers list soon.

I understand that Thaksin used to have a rather large share in pulp and paper company Advanced Agro, whose trucks one sees Isaan-wide loading up with eucalyptus logs for the drive to the pulp mills in Nakhon Nayok. The network of AA agents and economic reach around the region rivals that of the defunct, but very much alive in spirit TRT party. Anyone know if the Shins still have their share in AA, or did that go to Temasek? I guess with the rapid announcement to push eucalyptus plantations as a policy, they still very much have an interest in the business, along with numerous other PPP politicians.

I guess one could say is "Vote PPP and get monocrop pulpwood plantations countrywide" as easily as one could say "Plant eucalyptus and line the pockets of Toxon and buddies".

You are completely misinformed.Thaksin never was a significant shareholder in Advance Agro, which incidentally is shortly to be delisted.

"Completely" misinformed? So you don't deny that he was a shareholder, only "not significant"? Like how many shares did he, or his wider family, hold in AA; as you seem to be so well informed YH?

And why is AA being delisted pray tell?

[younghusband]

I am not sure what to say about the Eucalyptus except it goes without saying there is a cut in it for Samak and probably Thaksin too. As far as Eucalyptus being another crop, I don’t see it as a bad thing as it is used in so many products. It probably will be added to the Fire Trucks, Scanners, Rubber trees, computers list soon.

I understand that Thaksin used to have a rather large share in pulp and paper company Advanced Agro, whose trucks one sees Isaan-wide loading up with eucalyptus logs for the drive to the pulp mills in Nakhon Nayok. The network of AA agents and economic reach around the region rivals that of the defunct, but very much alive in spirit TRT party. Anyone know if the Shins still have their share in AA, or did that go to Temasek? I guess with the rapid announcement to push eucalyptus plantations as a policy, they still very much have an interest in the business, along with numerous other PPP politicians.

I guess one could say is "Vote PPP and get monocrop pulpwood plantations countrywide" as easily as one could say "Plant eucalyptus and line the pockets of Toxon and buddies".

You are completely misinformed.Thaksin never was a significant shareholder in Advance Agro, which incidentally is shortly to be delisted.

"Completely" misinformed? So you don't deny that he was a shareholder, only "not significant"? Like how many shares did he, or his wider family, hold in AA; as you seem to be so well informed YH?

And why is AA being delisted pray tell?

I only used the word "significant" because the SET records do not give details of very tiny shareholdings, so I could not give a categorical undertaking that no shares were owned at all.

I have no idea what the reasons are for delisting.My guess is that the controlling family which owns the great majority of the shares sees the advantages of public ownership outweighed by the restrictions imposed.Nothing unusual in that.

There were incidentally many other errors in your post.For example AA doesn't send logs to be pulped at Nakhon Nayak, having its own facilities.Your linking of the AA network to the TRT party is baldly stated but just doesn't make any sense.The debate on fast growing hardwoods, pros and cons, is a decades old one in Thailand:your summary is not really very lucid.All in all I'm afraid confused and muddled information from you but if you want background on AA check the SET website or talk to any stockbroker, Thai or Farang.It's true AA comes from the Soon Hua Seng conglomerate which was involved in alleged land scandal about 20 years ago but for reasons that have nothing to do with Thaksin.

Edited February 24, 2008 by younghusband

[marshbags]

The Nation, Sun, February 24, 2008 : Last updated 8:44 hours SIDELINES

Arrogance of power returns sooner than expected

The testy words spoken in the House had hardly lost their stench when key Cabinet members loaded with hubris displayed their arrogance of power. Published on February 24, 2008

Their first exercise was the speedy removal of senior officials considered major obstacles to the quick fixes needed to serve their patrons.

The director of the Department of Special Investigation and the police chief in Chiang Rai's Mae Chan district were the first two to get the axe on the sacrificial alter of the People Power Party.

The first had a crucial role in pursuing criminal cases mostly related to Thaksin Shinawatra, his family and cronies. The soft-spoken, mild-mannered officer was seen as a real threat if those cases are packed with strong evidence and brought up for indictments. He saw the abrupt transfer as a simple fact of life.

The second had been a pain in the neck of House Speaker Yongyuth Tiyapairat, whose car and residence, as well as those of his canvassers, were searched by a joint team of police and soldiers in the district. His transfer to a less significant area was regarded as a mild punishment for having served the Council for National Security too well.

Of course, more heads will roll when politicians see what they can achieve with resolve and swiftness facing no resistance. Never mind some critical comments in the media. They are merely pipsqueaks to be dealt with using an iron hand later.

Here comes a new era of political arrogance without any sense of shame. In fact, it is just like turning the clock back five years. We can treat the Surayud government's time as a sheer waste of time. What is to be seen from now on is whether the level of arrogance and greed will exceed previous levels.

Cabinet members have shown that they will try hard to compensate for their incompetence with brash ideas and clowning. Tainted characters, who don't care about their limitations, queue up to fill various positions. It is a way of rewarding them after the easy task of lying to voters to win House seats.

Which era will prove more dangerous - Thaksin's regime or the present one under his self-confessed nominee? It is still too early to gauge the ruthlessness of those currently carrying out vendettas for their patrons.

This is a Thai-style of democracy that was quickly admired by the West without waiting for these politicians to show their true colours and arrogance. They waste no time in making their presence felt, together with the familiar shamelessness.

The West should by now see that Thailand is reliving the Thaksin era. Democracy existed on election day; the rest has been tyranny in disguise. Cabinet members are mainly Thaksin's cronies and nominees who made it known pretty fast that they would not tolerate too much criticism.

To ensure they maintain their firm grip of power and avoid making the same mistakes as the old regime, this new bunch will solidify their power base by putting their cronies in key positions for self-serving purposes.

Judging from the fact that several of them still have criminal charges pending, nobody should remind them of their consciences and sense of shame for fear of risking their wrath. Our gutter politics does not require politicians to prove their honesty and integrity. Laws are not a sufficient deterrent for politicians to subdue their greed.

Another horrifying aspect of this is that we stand to face a new round of extrajudicial killings now that the war against drugs will be revived with gusto.

Extrajudicial killings during the Thaksin years claimed more than 2,800 victims, though the actual number of cases was said to exceed 8,000. The investigation into the killings shows evidence of a massive abuse of power, but Surayud chose to dilute its content for unexplained reasons.

The revival of the war against drugs, with tentative targets as high as 5,000, should garner the attention of human-rights groups and Western governments that do not profess hypocrisy.

If the official figure of past killings is 2,800, then the unofficial figure of this new war should end up far surpassing the stated target. This is not hypothetically or idly mentioned - the hissing was from the mouths of power-mad politicians.

Yet they are no fools. They are dangling carrots in the form of multimillion-baht mega-projects and whatnot to entice foreign suppliers and contractors so that their governments will be more than willing to turn a blind eye to whatever misdeeds and corruption is involved in the wheeling and dealing.

What will the consequences of this new round of arrogance of power and mischief be? Hard to predict, yet it will be bolder, and will aim for optimum results in making the most out of self-serving political investments. Aside from political uncertainty, there are inherent risks in the way they handle the national economy.

The greenhorns and fumbling amateurs in powerful positions managing affairs of state rely on their advisers, who also have tainted track records and criminal pasts, not to mention a streak of failures causing severe damage to national interests.

There are few options for those who care about the future of the country.

They can either accept fate and destiny, or, after a while, go back on the streets if the miscreants show the potential of again wreaking havoc on the national economy.

Sopon Onkgara

The Nation

marshbags

Edited February 24, 2008 by marshbags

[John K]

If Thaksin is that concerned about controlling the military, that can only be read as he plans to go to and beyond the point that triggered the last coup. If Thaksin was planning to be Mr. Nice he would not have this concern at all.

If I remember rightly Thaksin was removed by a military coup.If he was to return it would obviously make sense to ensure "his" people were in place in the military.Any capable politician does the same in a third world country.I am sure he has no intention of being "Mr Nice" by the way.

They should not be touching the military. They were put in power to take care of the people. This is action is a very clear warning of what Thaksin plans. There is no grey area here, Thaksin plans to be dictator, and from the looks of things he is only a few steps away from seeing that. It is exactly what was due to happen around September 20 something 2006 had there not been a coup. As I remember it was Thaksin’s last instructions to Sonthi before he left Thailand.

If you recall when Sonthi did a unscheduled shuffle a few months before the coup, Thaksin came out and said, “It is military business and I have no concern over it.” or something very close to that. It was about the only thing Thaksin said that was democratically proper. As it turned out is hindered his plans to become dictator and that is why he very improperly stepped in and ordered his people in positions to control the military just before he left.

This also sets up a huge division in the military as to where their loyalty lies. That brings up the point of Prem’s speech. It also moves Thailand into further division being completely opposite of what was requested repeatedly by someone who cant be mentioned.

Bottom line this is a very bad thing for Thailand, and particularly so only a few weeks after the new government has been seated. Unless Thailand was under attack and at war the government should have no legitimate reason to dabble. They have the work for the people to do and not work for Thaksin.

[chownah]

60+% voted for various junta backed parties.

Did the junta back political parties?....seems like it would be interfering with democracy for the military to back certain political parties.....should the EC dissolve the military for meddling in the elections?

Chownah

[John K]

Good post Marshbags, it only underscores the importance of the EC ruling Tuesday. I can only imagine what level of inappropriate influence they are being subject to by Thaksin and the PPP.

[John K]

60+% voted for various junta backed parties.

Did the junta back political parties?....seems like it would be interfering with democracy for the military to back certain political parties.....should the EC dissolve the military for meddling in the elections?

Chownah

I think that statement was meant in the light of being smart enough to see what was best for the country and that it matched the direction of the junta. I don’t seem to recall any campaigning by the military.

[younghusband]

They should not be touching the military. They were put in power to take care of the people. This is action is a very clear warning of what Thaksin plans. There is no grey area here, Thaksin plans to be dictator, and from the looks of things he is only a few steps away from seeing that. It is exactly what was due to happen around September 20 something 2006 had there not been a coup. As I remember it was Thaksin’s last instructions to Sonthi before he left Thailand.

If you recall when Sonthi did a unscheduled shuffle a few months before the coup, Thaksin came out and said, “It is military business and I have no concern over it.” or something very close to that. It was about the only thing Thaksin said that was democratically proper. As it turned out is hindered his plans to become dictator and that is why he very improperly stepped in and ordered his people in positions to control the military just before he left.

This also sets up a huge division in the military as to where their loyalty lies. That brings up the point of Prem’s speech.

I agree that in an ideal world the military should be trusted to run their own affairs, subject of course to direction by elected politicians as is the custom in the democratic developed world.Unfortunately in Thailand the military has a very poor record of corruption and inteference in politics.Only the irredeemably naive or apologists for tyranny think the military believe its primary purpose is to serve the people notwithstanding the florid rhetoric.

Prem is a spent force these days.Most Thais couldn't give a dam what the old boy does or says now.It's a great pity he sullied his name in his twilight days but there we go.

Edited February 24, 2008 by Maestro
Off-topic comment removed - Maestro

[chownah]

60+% voted for various junta backed parties.

Did the junta back political parties?....seems like it would be interfering with democracy for the military to back certain political parties.....should the EC dissolve the military for meddling in the elections?

Chownah

....and....additionally.....if MORE THAN 60% of the voters voted for various junta backed parties then I really don't understand how it is that they didn't boycott the PPP's initiatives to create a coalition government?....because if they had then they could have formed their own coalition government.....a coalition government with a supermajority. Is it because they are stupid and didn't realise that they could do this?....or could it be that the statement to which I am replying ("60+% voted for various junta backed parties") is a deluded view of the dynamics of the election?....or is there some other explanation?

Chownah

Edited February 24, 2008 by chownah

[John K]

As long as we are on numbers....

Earth to politicians: Stop bickering!

A large percentage of people want politicians to quit quibbling and start helping the general public, a recent poll indicates.

The Suan Dusit Poll of 3,279 residents last week found that 41 per cent want both government leaders and opposition Democrat party officials to end infighting and work together.

And when it comes to fixing the problem of unemployment and the rising cost of living, 33 per cent said these are the most important and urgent issues that need to be fixed - now.

The poll indicated people were tiring politics, as 38 per cent said they felt quarreling among politicians had become intolerable, and 31 per cent found nothing had improved after the general election.

Four per cent of those surveyed said they feared another militry coup unless government and opposition leaders stop bickering and just embrace the democratic system.

More here: http://www.bangkokpost.com/breaking_news/b...s.php?id=126110

[John K]

Actually the bickering is a normal part of democracy, I guess this is a new experience for Thais. Take a look at the US Congress if you need an example.

[sriracha john]

The international media focus on this issue continues to roll on...

Prime minister's comments on massacre spark outrage among Thailand's academics, media

BANGKOK, Thailand: When Samak Sundaravej became Thailand's prime minister on Feb. 6, pundits wondered how long it would take the right-wing firebrand to put his foot in his month.

Not long at all it turns out.

For the past two weeks, the 72-year-old Samak has turned the spotlight on his past with comments that have shocked Thailand and focused heated debate on a massacre of student protesters three decades ago.

The pugnacious prime minister publicly denied any role in the carnage of Oct. 6, 1976, and told CNN in a recent interview only "one unlucky guy" was killed that day even though historical records show almost 50 perished.

"No deaths, one unlucky guy being beaten and being burned," Samak said of the death toll when asked about the incident. "Only one guy died that day."

Violence was unleashed that day on leftist student demonstrators gathered to protest the return of ousted Prime Minister Field Marshal Thanom Kittikachorn, one of the so-called "Three Tyrants" national leaders who were ousted by a student-led uprising in 1973.

Photographs and video footage from the time shows security forces and right-wing paramilitary troops firing weapons into the campus of Bangkok's Thammasat University. Protesters were shot, beaten, hung, and set ablaze. Bodies were publicly mutilated. Some were dragged around the university's football field.

According to the official record, 46 people were killed and hundreds more were injured. Some human rights groups and witnesses suggest the death toll was in the hundreds.

Samak's dismissal of one of the country's most traumatic events sparked outrage among the public, academics and relatives of the victims. *and also upset a lot of politicians within his own PPP party, coalition Party members, opposition Party members, and PPP-controlling TRT Party members* It also prompted intense soul-searching in a country where talk of the 1976 massacre is all but taboo, partly because of the failure of any authorities to intervene to stop the brutal spectacle of Thais killing Thais.

Newspapers have seized on the incident to criticize Samak, academics have organized lectures to discuss the rarely mentioned subject, and Samak's remarks have been brought up repeatedly during parliamentary policy debate last week.

Samak should be "ashamed" of "his insensitive, inflammatory and plainly inaccurate comments," the Bangkok Post, one of the country's main English-language newspapers, said in a Feb. 13 editorial. Samak "knows very well what went on because he played a key role."

Critics have said Samak's anti-communist rhetoric on radio and at rallies at the time helped stoke sentiment that prompted the lynching of students. Samak like others in the Thai establishment then subscribed to a motto of the extreme right wing, "It's no sin to kill communists."

As Interior Minister at the time, critics said Samak had hundreds of "leftists" arrested in a witch hunt reminiscent of the anti-communist persecution spearheaded by U.S. Senator Joseph McCarthy in the 1950s.

But Samak has repeatedly denied any involvement in the incident, which came at a time when Indochina had fallen under communist rule and Thailand was deeply polarized between right and left.

"Why did a murderer with blood on his hand receive more than a million votes?" Samak asked rhetorically during parliamentary debate this week, referring to his landslide election victory for Bangkok governor in 2000.

Analysts said Samak's controversial remarks so early in his tenure could undermine his premiership, threatening to turn even his allies against him. *as per above red (no Communist pun intended) comment*

"It has become a hot issue that might be a rallying point, bringing his current political allies and his opposition together," said Kanokrat Lertchoesakul, a professor at Chulalongkorn University. "It's an emotional issue for many people across today's political spectrum."

Finance Minister Surapong Suebwonglee and Chaturon Chaisaeng allies of former Prime Minister Thaksin Shinawatra and now supporters of Samak are among many contemporary politicians who were leftist student leaders in 1976.

On Saturday, Chaturon said Samak "should gather accurate information before speaking" about the incident.

Charnvit Kasetsiri, a former rector of Thammasat University and a historian, said Samak's clumsy remarks could provide the opportunity to re-examine "a traumatic history that hasn't healed," and force others who took part to answer for their crimes.

After the incident, an amnesty was issued that prevented any of those responsible for the massacre from being brought to justice.

"How many people in Thailand actually know about what happened then? It's not even in the history textbooks in our school curriculum," Charnvit said.

- Associated Press

Edited February 24, 2008 by sriracha john

[John K]

I am starting to wonder if this was just a diversion.

[sriracha john]

Samak becomes pale when shown his picture taken with Prapass

Prime Minister Samak Sundaravej became pale when reporters showed him his pictures which he took with Field Marshal Prapass Jarusathien following the massacre of student activists on October 6 1976.

"Is that me? I didn't know I took this picture. I didn't know when I post for this picture and why," Samak exclaimed when seeing the picture.

Reporters showed him the picture when he was giving a weekly interview to Government House reporters. The reporters asked him to comment on the opposition's plan to demand him to tell the House of his role during the October 6 event. Samak insisted that only one student was killed at Sanam Luang and said he could not remember why he told Thai students in France that many students were killed.

The Nation

Old photo gives PM a surprise

PM Samak was caught off guard yesterday when he was confronted with a newspaper picture showing him standing next to the late military strongman Field Marshal Prapass Charusathiara and his son-in-law Col Narong Kittikachorn. An army of reporters told Samak that the opposition Democrat party had been distributing copies of the picture. ''I haven't seen it before. I cannot remember just when and where I was [in the picture],'' replied Samak. In a bid to jog his memory about the uprisings and killings on Oct 14, 1973, and Oct 6, 1976, a reporter showed him a picture published in a newspaper. ''Oh! Is that me? I don't know about it. I have yet to receive this picture,'' said Samak, apparently taken aback. The PM swore in parliament on Monday that he had nothing to do with the events of Oct 14 and Oct 6 when government forces brutally cracked down on student protesters. Field Marshal Prapass was one of three military dictators overthrown in the Oct 14, 1973 uprising. The other two were the late Field Marshal Thanom Kittikachorn and his son Col Narong. The Oct 14 uprising was followed by a brief period of democracy. The two field marshals went into exile abroad. Prapass returned to Thailand in early 1976 but had to flee again after strong protests.

Continued here:

http://www.bangkokpost.com/News/23Feb2008_news02.php

The photo that surpised and paled Samak...

Manager Online