Dont Buy A Bike From Tesco

[mr_hippo]

You will be surprised at the number of well known and respected marques that now use Chinese made frames - lower end Trek, Raleigh, Dawes to name but three.

Not long ago, they were all made in Taiwan. Should have stuck with them.

Why? You can get a bad frame made anywhere!

My giant's frame is made in Taiwan.

Just got it back 2 months waiting for the parts

221euro bastards.

The Giant company is Taiwanese!

[Dakhar]

Mr. Hippo

I am talking margin to cost ratios as "mark up." Believe it or not, I too have been in to bikes, I have owned Trek, Giant, K2, & Cannondale. In my younger days I rode all over the mountains of Taiwan, and rode about 20 miles a day.

Those days are over, I got over the urge... but I was around bikes enough to see huge mark ups on parts that are essentially the same in quality if not the same from a DX to XT. Any how, enjoy your bikes.

Yet in an earlier post, you said "It is just my un-educated opinion..." - so which is it?

That was sarcasim.

I never went to school for "bikes" I just worked on them growing up. As a kid we had to repair it ourselves if we wanted a bike that functions. While living in Taiwan, that is all I had for transportation, other than public. While there I owned Trek, Giant, Fuji and some other bike by "Jim "something" I forgot. That particular bike did not last long due to a taxi cab runing a red light. Ran right over the bike, the bike got stuck under the cab even. Me... nothing broken. The Trek was top of the line, but I wrecked that too at the bottom of a mountain when a car went through an intersection. He had a stop sign, he thought he was in the clear. It was dark, and I am not surprised he did not see me. That colapsed the frame. I took the parts and baught a Giant frame and built that one up. The fuji, I broke that bike too, by hitting a deep pot hole one night. The hole was well marked, the warning cone was in the hole.... out of sight out of mind. I saw the hole but I thought is was a man hole cover.... ripped the forks right off the bike. I am a strong believer in bike helmets. I have broken 2, and I wear one while scooting around the village on a scooter. The K2 was an E-bay project. I bought the frame and built it up off of parts I bought over time on E-bay. In the end I spent about 600, on a bike that would probably run twice that at a store. The Cannondale was a rode bike with campy parts.

I rode a bike because I had too, that is all I had for transportation not because I wanted the Yellow Jersey or something.

[nidge]

Dahkar,

I fail to see any reasoning for your arguments. You continue to go on about your 'experiences' with bikes but it seems totally irrelevant. Owning lots of bikes does not mean you have experience.

Have you actually visually compared an XTR component and a basic Deore or even LX? There is a massive difference between the two. I am an engineer and i positively dribble over the quality and performance of the XTR components. They are expensive because of the R & D and production of these parts. Slowly the cheaper parts get the benefits but this is the same in all forms or engineering. I always buy XTR when i have the choice. Not because i want to 'pimp' my bike or show off but because the performance benefits are huge.

Totally opposite to you i do not ride a bike because i have to, i ride because it is my passion and it has been for the last 31 years and i ride at least 200km per week whether it's the middle of summer or the wettest rainy season.

Nidge.

P.s. Mr Hippo, how are you Issan tour plans going?

[Neeranam]

I bought a bike 3 years ago from Tesco for 1090 baht. No problems. Great value.

[mr_hippo]

I rode a bike because I had too, that is all I had for transportation not because I wanted the Yellow Jersey or something.

I ride a bike for pleasure but I have also commuted on one and I did have a car at the time, it was quicker by bike! I have never won a yellow jersey either but I have held a world record for almost 20 years! If more people commuted by bike in Bangkok then we cut cut traffic and pollution down.

Judging by your post, you seem to have had your fair share of incidents.

I bought a bike 3 years ago from Tesco for 1090 baht. No problems. Great value.

Unfortunately, there is a lot of snobbery in the cycling world! A cheap, basic single-speed roadster could give you many years service for pottering around the village. Just look at all the bikes around and you will see some horrendous examples of machines held together by rust and duct tape but they still keep rolling along.

P.s. Mr Hippo, how are you Issan tour plans going?

Due to lack of commercial sponsorship, I'm modifying my plans - more news later!

Have you seen bikejournal? Keep a record of your stats. I had a bad start to the year due to shingles but I'm moving up the rankings slowly and so is Thailand, I am the only active rider at the moment and there is a good possibility of moving up a place by the end of the month and if more Thailand based cyclists join in, we could move ahead a lot more!

[pampal]

I prefer Low/Mid level Shimano groupsets. Alivio is just fine as far as I am concerned, although on my other bikes I have everything ranging from Altus to XT. I have gotten the most use out of my Alivio and lower equipped bikes.

[madjbs]

Well designed full suspension bikes don't sap your power, although they can be heavier. When it comes to proper mountain biking (not just dirt trails) there is just no comparison these days, full suspension is the only way to go!

[pumpuiman]

Well designed full suspension bikes don't sap your power, although they can be heavier. When it comes to proper mountain biking (not just dirt trails) there is just no comparison these days, full suspension is the only way to go!

I disagree, but could be wrong. I worked as a bicycle mechanic for a year or so. The owner (a racer and complete bike nerd) explained to me the importance of rigidity in a bicycles frame. The transfer of energy is more economical with a rigid frame. Shocks and springs or big comfy seats...all sap energy..as well as tire tread (a slick silk tire makes a world of difference)

I had a mountain bike....because it was stylish. When biking with people with road bikes...I got blown away. I would watch as they coasted, drafting off one another....as I pedaled endlessly trying to keep up. They went much faster going down hills as well, my knobby tires were like dragging an anchor. I switched to a road bike and would never go back (unless off road)

I wouldn't suggest the racing silk tires though...not for everyday use, they puncture very easily.

A high pressure(important...rigidity again) tubeless tire with a decent tread will have you flying.

[madjbs]

It's all in the technology, designs these days are so good that very very little pedaling energy is absorbed into the suspension. They achieve this through multi linkage systems and other confusing things. Obviously if you are not going to be riding on rocky, bumpy terrain, it would be better to get a hard tail or a rigid frame as they will be lightly and easier to pedal uphill etc..

[mr_hippo]

I prefer Low/Mid level Shimano groupsets. Alivio is just fine as far as I am concerned, although on my other bikes I have everything ranging from Altus to XT. I have gotten the most use out of my Alivio and lower equipped bikes.

Both of my Trek bikes are Shimano equipped but my road bike has Campagnolo. I decided on Campagnolo for two reasons. The first is that with drop bars, the cables are hidden: the second is, as a young lad, we had a choice of Sachs Huret, Benelux or Campagnolo. On a paperboys wages, Campag was out of the question but I promised myself one day that I would have a Campag equipped bike! (For American readers - Camag=Campy!)

Adding to Pampal's post - it is only when you get into the higher levels of racing or very serious touring that you 'need' the top of the range groupsets. I would be quite happy to do an extended tour on an Alivio equipped bike.

I can't really comment on full suspension bikes as most of my experience is on the road plus some rough stuff on a tourer. I would agree with madjbs that on the road a hard tail with city tyres would be far better than full suspension with knobblies.

I wouldn't suggest the racing silk tires though...not for everyday use, they puncture very easily.

A high pressure(important...rigidity again) tubeless tire with a decent tread will have you flying.

Have you seen the price of silk tubs recently? You are right about the pressure, I always have mine to the manufacturer's max - sometimes just a touch more!

[astral]

This is true of all the cheap bikes in LOS.

You get what you pay for.

Much better to pay more and get a safe machine, especially when

buying for the younger members of the family.

[mr_hippo]

This is true of all the cheap bikes in LOS.

You get what you pay for.

Not only here but worldwide!

[pampal]

I will stay out of the suspension discussion, but I must admit a fully rigid MTB is more aesthetically pleasing than any of the suspension models I have seen.

[nidge]

I will stay out of the suspension discussion, but I must admit a fully rigid MTB is more aesthetically pleasing than any of the suspension models I have seen.

Although i only have full suspension bikes i have to agree with you there, my main bike is one of the ugliest velocipedes i have ever seen!

[Dakhar]

I rode a bike because I had too, that is all I had for transportation not because I wanted the Yellow Jersey or something.

I ride a bike for pleasure but I have also commuted on one and I did have a car at the time, it was quicker by bike! I have never won a yellow jersey either but I have held a world record for almost 20 years! If more people commuted by bike in Bangkok then we cut cut traffic and pollution down.

Judging by your post, you seem to have had your fair share of incidents.

I bought a bike 3 years ago from Tesco for 1090 baht. No problems. Great value.

Unfortunately, there is a lot of snobbery in the cycling world! A cheap, basic single-speed roadster could give you many years service for pottering around the village. Just look at all the bikes around and you will see some horrendous examples of machines held together by rust and duct tape but they still keep rolling along.

P.s. Mr Hippo, how are you Issan tour plans going?

Due to lack of commercial sponsorship, I'm modifying my plans - more news later!

Have you seen bikejournal? Keep a record of your stats. I had a bad start to the year due to shingles but I'm moving up the rankings slowly and so is Thailand, I am the only active rider at the moment and there is a good possibility of moving up a place by the end of the month and if more Thailand based cyclists join in, we could move ahead a lot more!

If I were in the shape I was back in the days I rode, I would love to be a part of this.... but those days are far gone.

[Dakhar]

Dahkar,

I fail to see any reasoning for your arguments. You continue to go on about your 'experiences' with bikes but it seems totally irrelevant. Owning lots of bikes does not mean you have experience.

Have you actually visually compared an XTR component and a basic Deore or even LX? There is a massive difference between the two. I am an engineer and i positively dribble over the quality and performance of the XTR components. They are expensive because of the R & D and production of these parts. Slowly the cheaper parts get the benefits but this is the same in all forms or engineering. I always buy XTR when i have the choice. Not because i want to 'pimp' my bike or show off but because the performance benefits are huge.

Totally opposite to you i do not ride a bike because i have to, i ride because it is my passion and it has been for the last 31 years and i ride at least 200km per week whether it's the middle of summer or the wettest rainy season.

Nidge.

P.s. Mr Hippo, how are you Issan tour plans going?

I used XT to DX as a comparison, I did not mention the XTR to DX. Look, when I played with bikes, that was 16 years back, and I bought my bikes from a whole sale distributor in Taiwan. He would buy his parts from over stock situations out of Japan. I got to know the guy pretty well and helped him secure a long term financial deal worth A LOT of money.

He explained to me, that the difference between the DX series and the XT was negligible, at best the difference was a stamp. Now, again that was 16 years back. Things have probably changed since then.

When I rode, I rode because that was my only choice, but I also made sure I did not ride junk.... I always used XT or DX and I could be wrong but I think at that time the XTR series was just begining to be introduced by Shimano. So in other words, XT was the best at the time. Technology has changed a lot since then....

[Dakhar]

Well designed full suspension bikes don't sap your power, although they can be heavier. When it comes to proper mountain biking (not just dirt trails) there is just no comparison these days, full suspension is the only way to go!

I disagree, but could be wrong. I worked as a bicycle mechanic for a year or so. The owner (a racer and complete bike nerd) explained to me the importance of rigidity in a bicycles frame. The transfer of energy is more economical with a rigid frame. Shocks and springs or big comfy seats...all sap energy..as well as tire tread (a slick silk tire makes a world of difference)

I had a mountain bike....because it was stylish. When biking with people with road bikes...I got blown away. I would watch as they coasted, drafting off one another....as I pedaled endlessly trying to keep up. They went much faster going down hills as well, my knobby tires were like dragging an anchor. I switched to a road bike and would never go back (unless off road)

I wouldn't suggest the racing silk tires though...not for everyday use, they puncture very easily.

A high pressure(important...rigidity again) tubeless tire with a decent tread will have you flying.

You can get "slicks" for your mountain bike if one wanted. Or at least some thinner trail tires would help out in the transfer of energy loss. For me, full suspension was better while going down hill because my kidneys would hurt from all of the vibration. Full Suspension has gotten a lot better too these days... Still for a good bike.... UGGHHH the money!

[mr_hippo]

If I were in the shape I was back in the days I rode, I would love to be a part of this.... but those days are far gone.

I, too, wish I was back in my prime but I have to work with what the years and the genes have given me!

I'm 59 years young, weigh over 300lbs with the weight going to the waist! I lost three months due to shingles and my first ride this year was on the 2nd of March. I only rode 9 days in March and covered 248.3kms, so far this month I covered 375.74kms and ridden 13 days (I took a three day rest over Songkran!) Considering the heat, the weight and the traffic, I'm happy with my progress. Now, why do you say that "those days are far gone"? I think you hit the nail on the head when you said "when I played with bikes" - bikes are not toys and the road or the trail is not for playing on!

[Dakhar]

If I were in the shape I was back in the days I rode, I would love to be a part of this.... but those days are far gone.

I, too, wish I was back in my prime but I have to work with what the years and the genes have given me!

I'm 59 years young, weigh over 300lbs with the weight going to the waist! I lost three months due to shingles and my first ride this year was on the 2nd of March. I only rode 9 days in March and covered 248.3kms, so far this month I covered 375.74kms and ridden 13 days (I took a three day rest over Songkran!) Considering the heat, the weight and the traffic, I'm happy with my progress. Now, why do you say that "those days are far gone"? I think you hit the nail on the head when you said "when I played with bikes" - bikes are not toys and the road or the trail is not for playing on!

Well see you may have a point, because I essentially do not like to work. I like to play, and if I find something to be work, I lose interest in it. For example, raquete ball, I love the sport, but if someone told me it was excercise, I probably would dislike the game.

Yea, the last time I went on a rode trip, after returning from Taiwan, I went out with some "experts" that felt the same way"bikes are not a toy" it really took the fun out of it. They probably didn't like some young buck with a suspension MTB keeping up with their rode bikes either, and at the end of the 20 mile rode trip on flat roads, I was out front.... But again that was 16 years back.

But I only attribute that to 2 years of real mountain bikeing, climbing steep mountains, steep enough to break chains. The mountains in Taiwan are very steep.... but very intertaining too. The flat roads of SE Texas really had nothing to offer. So I lost interest in it... no real partners to ride with, (they were all experts) and the rodes were a bore. Now, 50 pounds heavier... I would say I should have stayed on the bike.

[tahaan]

Chapeau! Mr Hippo. I wish I could motivate myself to dust off my road bikes (both Campy ) and join you. My last meeting with Nidge convinced me that I'm not an "off road" type I'm back in the UK soon but hope to come back bursting with enthusiasm and a few inches off the waist. Hopefully by then the road works here will be finished and I won't have to fight for space with sugar and quarry trucks.

[mr_hippo]

tahaan, yes, it is sometinmes difficult to motivate yourself and here is how I do it. I keep a check on my rides on bikejournal and cyclogs.

bikejournal has 5516 active cyclists, the leader has logged 9535.4 kms this year and the bottom has logged just 0.8 kms. I have been keeping more detailed records and from my fifth ride, I have been noting my position in the table. I started in 3455 and after logging in yesterday's ride, I have moved up to 2669 - moved up 786 places! OK, other riders logged in after me so now I'm at 2683 but with another 26kms today, I will move up to around 2630. I tend to slip behind at the weekend when others do some serious riding! Supposing you decided to ride just 10kms/day, that would put you in at about 5429 out of 5516; your next 10kms would see you at 5313 and your next at 5166 so in three 10km rides you have risen 350 places! Would that motivate you?

The cyclogs site runs things a bit different with monthly not yearly stats and has fewer riders (174). 60 riders logged their rides yesterday, when I logged in I was 54th but slipped to 62nd but it's the weekend so I expect that. When I log today's ride in I will have risen to about 56 but should make up a few more places during the week! By the end of the month, I hope to be in the low 40s.

Dakhar, I cycle for pleasure, yes it is also exercise and can be hard work at times! I never force myself to go out; if I feel like having a 'day-off', I have a 'day-off'! Now that it is getting hotter, I limit myself to 25kms/day. I use two 25km circuits. One takes me down Lat Phrao Road, it's mainly downhill to the Mall, Bangkapi so it's a nice easy 8.5 kms and then I turn left into Soi Happyland1. If I feel like a rest for a few minutes, I'll stop at the motorcycle taxi stand at Old Happyland market - nice comfortable chairs there! Then it's up Nawamin Road to Kasert-Nawamin and turn at Lat Plakhoa Road and a stop - sometimes - at a petrol station almost opposite Tesco, Wang Hin - a nice, easy 14kms and finally the last 3kms to home including the short climb known as Lat Phrao canal bridge. Can I do the route without stopping? I have done many times but I normally take it easy!

Edited April 20, 2008 by mr_hippo

[Dakhar]

tahaan, yes, it is sometinmes difficult to motivate yourself and here is how I do it. I keep a check on my rides on bikejournal and cyclogs.

bikejournal has 5516 active cyclists, the leader has logged 9535.4 kms this year and the bottom has logged just 0.8 kms. I have been keeping more detailed records and from my fifth ride, I have been noting my position in the table. I started in 3455 and after logging in yesterday's ride, I have moved up to 2669 - moved up 786 places! OK, other riders logged in after me so now I'm at 2683 but with another 26kms today, I will move up to around 2630. I tend to slip behind at the weekend when others do some serious riding! Supposing you decided to ride just 10kms/day, that would put you in at about 5429 out of 5516; your next 10kms would see you at 5313 and your next at 5166 so in three 10km rides you have risen 350 places! Would that motivate you?

The cyclogs site runs things a bit different with monthly not yearly stats and has fewer riders (174). 60 riders logged their rides yesterday, when I logged in I was 54th but slipped to 62nd but it's the weekend so I expect that. When I log today's ride in I will have risen to about 56 but should make up a few more places during the week! By the end of the month, I hope to be in the low 40s.

Dakhar, I cycle for pleasure, yes it is also exercise and can be hard work at times! I never force myself to go out; if I feel like having a 'day-off', I have a 'day-off'! Now that it is getting hotter, I limit myself to 25kms/day. I use two 25km circuits. One takes me down Lat Phrao Road, it's mainly downhill to the Mall, Bangkapi so it's a nice easy 8.5 kms and then I turn left into Soi Happyland1. If I feel like a rest for a few minutes, I'll stop at the motorcycle taxi stand at Old Happyland market - nice comfortable chairs there! Then it's up Nawamin Road to Kasert-Nawamin and turn at Lat Plakhoa Road and a stop - sometimes - at a petrol station almost opposite Tesco, Wang Hin - a nice, easy 14kms and finally the last 3kms to home including the short climb known as Lat Phrao canal bridge. Can I do the route without stopping? I have done many times but I normally take it easy!

I have seen a few people dressed to the max (riders jersey & cute shorts etc) around here, & I just think to myself.... Wow that guy is awfully brave. I live in the Rangsit area and it just seems like the traffic would not allow a person to be able to ride... too dangerous.

If you ever get the chance, you should ride in Taiwan.... they have roads that circle up the mountains and you never see a car, just pure beauty. I did all those rides with big knobbies, being young, dumb and stubborn, I never discovered trail tires. Speaking young dumb & stupid, the fasted clocked speed (down hill) was 58 mph. I am not bragging.... there was a guy in front of me!!!!!!!! He did not have a clock, but he had to be hitting at least 60 mph. We were young.... and crazy.

300lbs and yet you ride like 50 miles a day. Simply amazing.... and in this heat... I would think you would be a twig.

[lioness]

Careful what you say about Tesco, they will start a case for libel.

[Neeranam]

Last week I cycled in Melbourne which has cycle lanes everywhere and a great cycle track along the bay. I wouldn't cycle in Thailand exept up to the local 7/11. Far to dangerous. Why did I see so many there wearing those shiny suits - are they really that concerned about streamlining or just posing?

It was weird having to wear a helemt too but practical I guess. Mr Hippo - buy a excerise bike then you could do it in an air-con room.

[tahaan]

Thanks for the links Mr Hippo. I'll have to give that a try. One of the problems (excuses?) I have is that I've only managed to find one decent loop here that I can do on 23mm tyres. It's often out on the same straight stretch of highway and that gets a bit dull after awhile. Sometimes I'm able to set goals like trying to catch one of the slower moving motorbikes or tuck in behind a samlor and draft for a bit to relieve the monotony. I always feel better for having gone out though. Hmmm ...endorphins.

[Gertrude]

Don't generalise. My Tesco bike is still going strong after 3 years, not even a puncture.

The bikes in Tesco are cheap, and are probably aimed at the 5 minute wonder cyclists.

You get what you pay for.

[wilko]

This is a Thai customer service issue;

If you buy a new bike NO MATTER WHAT THE PRICE, it should perform reasonably as a bike for a reasonable period of time. Furthermore if it is set up "to go" it should be properly and safely set up.

You MUST return this bike to TESCO and either insist on a refund OR a bike that works (same model or better). Tesco’s have undertaken to supply you with a bike...NOT endanger your life or provide you with a decorative item that looks like a bike, in doing this they have failed and they should now rectify the situation to YOUR satisfaction. A receipt is not necessary, the model number of the bike should prove that it is Tesco stock, and if you paid by card you have proof of payment too, but they should not quibble about any of this anyway.

If the Thai culture prevails they will try and do nothing, if TESCO live up to their obligations as they would in the UK, you should receive some or all of the following....

• Your money back or a replacement bike that is in GOOD RUNNING ORDER (same model or better)

• and some compensation for the hassle they have caused, not to mention the risk to your personal safety.

I would suggest you decide what you want TESCO to do about this situation and pursue the matter vigorously!

.......at the end of the day if TESCO do the right thing, you should be glad that you bought from TESCO rather than any other business they took action to set the problem right.

This should also be the reasoning behind TESCO’s thinking.

[nidge]

This is a Thai customer service issue;

If you buy a new bike NO MATTER WHAT THE PRICE, it should perform reasonably as a bike for a reasonable period of time. Furthermore if it is set up "to go" it should be properly and safely set up.

Yes it should perform reasonably, IF used by the age, size and weight of the person it was designed for.

[geriatrickid]

IMO, suspension on a road bike (or a mountain bike that is to be used on the road) is a complete waste of money, your own energy and it's also extra weight; every cyclist's enemy. A substantial amount of pedalling effort is sapped by suspension; it's only really necessary on downhill mountain biking or very bumpy terrain. The only time that I can think that I would use it on the road is if I were riding the Paris-Roubaix and I don't plan on doing that. My road racing days are long-gone.

But it stands to reason that, on a cheap bike, suspension means that corners will have been cut elsewhere. If you want a cheap bike for just knocking around town, go for a basic granny-shopper with one speed.

Grrr, disagree. Comments might be appropriate for fully suspended but not for front. I have manitous that set me back $600US and they have been a life saver on grates, potholes and debris. True I split time between gravel and mud, but I do pavement also. You get what you pay for in a bike and yes I have stuck with hardtails all my life and avoided the sexy allure of disc brakes because Thailand conditions necessitate heavy maintenance and rotation. I don't know about you but I have shredded a few tires on these roads, so I have given up changing to slicks for the pavement and going back to knobbies for a bit of mud. Under no circumstances should anyone hoping to keep a bike for more than a year purchase a bicycle that costs less than 12,000 baht. Even on a cheap bike like that one is going to have shimano clones and the cabling will be gone after a year. Under no circumstance should an adult be purchasing a bike from a supermarket.They do not know how to assemble or adjust anything on that bike. If I still can't true my rims or change a hub properly despite my basic mechanic skills, how can the grocery clerk know how to put a bike together. Look at those instructions. They are enough to make you want to fly to Taiwan or China where the bike was manufactured and go psycho on the manufacturer.

[wilko]

This is a Thai customer service issue;

If you buy a new bike NO MATTER WHAT THE PRICE, it should perform reasonably as a bike for a reasonable period of time. Furthermore if it is set up "to go" it should be properly and safely set up.

Yes it should perform reasonably, IF used by the age, size and weight of the person it was designed for.

Do you have a problem with that? I don't....are you suggesting the buyer was overweight and should not have bought the bike? If so the salesperson or shop should not have sold him the bike. The apparent "user" is standing in front of them and it would be obvious he/she was intending to ride it, they should advise that the machine was unsuitable.

"reasonably" is basically common sense...however if the bike was sold as "suitable" for the purchaser, then the vendor should still have an obligation to rectify the situation.

There's nothing to suggest that the buyer knowingly bought an unsuitable machine or tyhat he was duped by the shop, it is most likely that the individual bike was not up to standard. If it is that particular model, it cannot be sold as a bike and would have to carry a warning "ornamental use only" or similar.

A case in point in UK would be the domestic range of power tools by Black & Decker – (yes, in UK they make power tools, not kettles) – the range has a “lifetime” guarantee – this actually means about 8 working hours in total, as that is the amount of work the average do-it-himself householder will do in a life time. – This is a “reasonable” parameter for the tool so long as it is used as marketed, NOT for use by professionals, who would achieve that figure in a week.

Edited April 21, 2008 by wilko