Tai Yai & Driver's License

[noise]

A Tai Yai legal resident carrying an ID card identifying them as (or grouping them with) a Thai hilltribe person (i.e., they are a legal resident) said they are not allowed to get a driver's license. Does anyone have any experience or knowledge about this?

I intend to go ask at the DMV but thought I would ask on this forum first.

[Johpa]

A Tai Yai legal resident carrying an ID card identifying them as (or grouping them with) a Thai hilltribe person (i.e., they are a legal resident) said they are not allowed to get a driver's license. Does anyone have any experience or knowledge about this?

I intend to go ask at the DMV but thought I would ask on this forum first.

I don't know about prohibiting the obtaining of a drivers license, but I do know that the first number of the Thai ID card does encode people into various levels of 'Thainess'. In the past, the categorization was done by color coding the card. There is a professor at CMU, Achaan Pinkaew I believe, that gave a talk on the subject at a seminar that I eavesdropped on.

[PeaceBlondie]

What about someone, age 24, with a Thai ID card, raised as Tai Yai, but with a Thai father from Chiang Mai, and a Tai Yai mother from Mae Hong Son?

[noise]

What about someone, age 24, with a Thai ID card, raised as Tai Yai, but with a Thai father from Chiang Mai, and a Tai Yai mother from Mae Hong Son?

Are you asking if they would be classified as Tai Yai or Thai? I would assume it all depends on how the father registered the birth.

My question was about a Tai Yai who was not born here but is now a legal resident with an ID card identifying them as a Thai hill tribe member; said card must be renewed yearly (but no 90 day reporting requirement). I would think that would qualify them for a driver's license if we foreigners on year visas can get them.

[PeaceBlondie]

Sorry, I asked my question wrong. In my novel, I have a recently arrived Tai Yai family arriving from the Shan State about 1981, with an infant who would get Thai nationality only by bribes. Would even a baby born in Thailand of Tai Yai (Burmese, Shan) parents not be entitled to Thai citizenship? Would only a baby born of a Tai Yai and a Thai parent easily have citizenship?

[Ajarn]

What about someone, age 24, with a Thai ID card, raised as Tai Yai, but with a Thai father from Chiang Mai, and a Tai Yai mother from Mae Hong Son?

Are you asking if they would be classified as Tai Yai or Thai? I would assume it all depends on how the father registered the birth.

My question was about a Tai Yai who was not born here but is now a legal resident with an ID card identifying them as a Thai hill tribe member; said card must be renewed yearly (but no 90 day reporting requirement). I would think that would qualify them for a driver's license if we foreigners on year visas can get them.

It sounds like you think it should be fair.. Fairness is not a consideration when it comes to Burmese Thai Yai and the Thai Government in my experience here. Why don't you contact someone from the Driver License place and ask them?

[Johpa]

Sorry, I asked my question wrong. In my novel, I have a recently arrived Tai Yai family arriving from the Shan State about 1981, with an infant who would get Thai nationality only by bribes. Would even a baby born in Thailand of Tai Yai (Burmese, Shan) parents not be entitled to Thai citizenship? Would only a baby born of a Tai Yai and a Thai parent easily have citizenship?

Minority people are not automatically bestowed Thai citizenship, even if born on Thai soil. And even though that child was born on Thai soil, marries, and has a second generation Thai born child, that child too is not automatically bestowed Thai citizenship. And if citizenship is bestowed, it can revoked as happened last year up in Amphoe Mae Ai, north of Fang, which led to some protests. For better details on the Thai Yai you should stop and have some noodles up at Baan Mai Mok Jaam, the large Tai Yai town a few kms northeast of Thaton along the Kok River.

A minority woman can usually marry a male Thai national and obtain citizenship for her children by listing them on his house registration (tabian baan). I am not sure about the ease of the less common Thai female marrying a minority male. It really all depends upon the mood of the people working at the local Amphoe, and especially the disposition of the District Head (naay amphoe).

Fact is that although many of the Kham Muang people are comfortable and at ease living alongside the northern upland minority folks, the same is simply not true for the vast majority of Thais, especially the folks from Bangkok, who hold all those traditional global negative stereotypes of minorities.

[noise]

Why don't you contact someone from the Driver License place and ask them?

I intend to do that, but it is in Hang Dong and I live just 3 kms south of Mae Jo. Having no reason to go that far south for months at a time, I thought I would see what the wealth of knowledge residing on TV would produce if I asked the question. Apparently this is a new issue. When I get up enough energy to persue it further, I will document the results as they pertain to this one specific individual.

And, yes, as I wrote the comparison to farang on yearly visas I knew I was trying to draw an analogy that might be completely inappropriate (e.g., the difference between justice and the law).

[lannarebirth]

What about someone, age 24, with a Thai ID card, raised as Tai Yai, but with a Thai father from Chiang Mai, and a Tai Yai mother from Mae Hong Son?

Are you asking if they would be classified as Tai Yai or Thai? I would assume it all depends on how the father registered the birth.

My question was about a Tai Yai who was not born here but is now a legal resident with an ID card identifying them as a Thai hill tribe member; said card must be renewed yearly (but no 90 day reporting requirement). I would think that would qualify them for a driver's license if we foreigners on year visas can get them.

You were informed correctly. No drivers license (thoughmany drive and own motorbikes anyway) and ID cardmust berenewed annually by their employer. Some qualify for 5 year cards and some pay bribes to obtain cards and some carry forgeries.

[PeaceBlondie]

Okay, I just rewrote those parts of the novel. Nittipat now has a Tai-Yai mother with Thai citizenship, a Tai-Yai father born in the Shan State, and Thailand birth for himself. Nittipat will become too famous to have his citizenship revoked, and will be Thailand's first world-famous gay superstar... prompting Thongchai "Bird" McIntyre to come out of the closet. That's what I like about writing fiction: just realistic enough to be believable, just absurd enough to be entertaining.

[dr_Pat_Pong]

Okay, I just rewrote those parts of the novel. Nittipat now has a Tai-Yai mother with Thai citizenship, a Tai-Yai father born in the Shan State, and Thailand birth for himself. Nittipat will become too famous to have his citizenship revoked, and will be Thailand's first world-famous gay superstar... prompting Thongchai "Bird" McIntyre to come out of the closet. That's what I like about writing fiction: just realistic enough to be believable, just absurd enough to be entertaining.

It'd take political influence I reckon PB.

[PeaceBlondie]

No problem, Doctor PP. In my novel, this 6 foot-1 inch katoey has the strongest political influence in Thailand. I dare not say more, except that his husband arrives in Thailand aboard Thaksin's Airbus with somebody who becomes even more influential.

[Johpa]

Okay, I just rewrote those parts of the novel. Nittipat now has a Tai-Yai mother with Thai citizenship, a Tai-Yai father born in the Shan State, and Thailand birth for himself. Nittipat will become too famous to have his citizenship revoked, and will be Thailand's first world-famous gay superstar... prompting Thongchai "Bird" McIntyre to come out of the closet. That's what I like about writing fiction: just realistic enough to be believable, just absurd enough to be entertaining.

If Thongchai is living in a closet it must be a closet made of clear glass.