I am BORN AGIN. Braize the MAN.

I have TRULY seen the Light

I believe in President George W. Bush.

I believe the president invaded Iraq to secure liberty and democracy for the Iraqi people. I believe he had compelling evidence that Iraq was a significant threat to America and the world, and presented that evidence in a complete and balanced manner. Like 42 percent of Americans – and 62 percent of Republicans – I believe Saddam Hussein was involved in the September 11 attacks.

I believe we have enough troops on the ground in Iraq to ensure stability. I believe the rising American fatality rates, the rising casualty rates, and the rising American share of those coalition fatalities and casualties testify to the undeniable progress we're making there. I believe it is inappropriate and traitorous, however, for the media to broadcast pictures of American flag-draped caskets returning from Iraq.

I believed then-candidate Bush when he said during the 2000 campaign that America should not nation-build, and believe him now when he says our nation was divinely chosen for this task. I believe, as the president claims, that "free societies are peaceful societies," but that the political and civil rights in oppressive, undemocratic countries like Saudi Arabia and Pakistan are exempt from this standard. I believe Iraqis view Americans as liberators, and that once this swift, cheap war concludes the world will be more stable, our allies more cooperative, and our enemies fewer and less threatening.

I believe the best response against an Islamic fundamentalist network operating from a South Asian cave which used boxcutters to attack us is to invade a secular Arab dictator living in 11 palaces in a Middle Eastern country whose (supposed) weapon of choice was nuclear, chemical and biological weapons. I further believe that the best way to accomplish that mission was to land on air aircraft carrier in military garb and stand in front of a banner declaring it so.

I believe the president when he says he would have moved "heaven and earth" had he any "inkling" that terrorists were planning to attack America with hijacked airplanes. I believe the security briefing the president read five weeks before the attacks – which was entitled "Bin Laden Determined to Strike Inside United States," and specifically mentioned hijacked airplanes and New York City as a target – was an inkling-free, "historical" document. I believe we should re-double our investments in a missile defense system, which could have prevented the 9/11 attacks and will prevent future attacks like it from occurring.

I believe the president was right to oppose the formation of the 9/11 Commission, to change his mind but then oppose fully funding it, to change his mind but then oppose granting its request for an extension, to change his mind but refuse to testify for more than an hour, to change his mind but then testify alongside Vice President Dick Cheney so long as transcripts and note-taking were prohibited. I believe the investigation into the Abu Ghraib prison scandal shows it was the fault of a handful of misguided underlings who simply misunderstood a memo signed by the Secretary of Defense which authorized the use of dogs to interrogate prisoners.

Domestically, I believe income tax cuts for the wealthiest Americans are the solution to budget surpluses or deficits, high or low inflation, stable or unstable interest rates, expanding or shrinking trade deficits, widening or narrowing wealth gaps, increasing or decreasing poverty rates, rising or falling unemployment, prosperity or recession, wartime or peace. I believe record-setting budget deficits, record-setting trade deficits, and a burgeoning national debt are examples of the president's fiscally-conservative economic leadership.

I believe that a president who insists that hard-working Americans deserve tax breaks should continue to stand fast against cutting payroll taxes – the direct tax on hard work. Clearly, I do not believe that payroll taxes coupled with income taxes on work constitute "double taxation," but the dividend tax on assets does. I believe those who complain that one third of American children live in poverty, or that the wealthiest nation on the planet should feel sheepish about having 45 million uninsured citizens, deserve California Gov. Arnold Schwarzenegger's ridicule as "economic girlie men."

I believe the best way to improve local-run schools is to spend billions of dollars on a massive, federal testing program to tell us our schools are failing. I do not believe, however, that requiring local school districts to meet new, federal standards without resources is an example of an "unfunded mandate." I believe the president's education initiative will leave no child behind, much as his "clear skies" and "healthy forests" initiatives will make skies clearer and forests healthier.

Finally, I believe a white man of privilege who was accepted to Yale University despite a middling performance in prep school; was accepted to Harvard Business School despite a middling performance at Yale; was admitted to the Texas Air National Guard despite no flight background and an entrance exam score in the bottom quartile; was given funds by Osama bin Laden's father to start a failed oil company; and was chosen to serve as Texas governor and 43rd President of the United States despite a lifelong record of mediocrity, is a man with the moral authority to criticize affirmative action as a policy that gives opportunities to the undeserving.

Make no mistake: I believe that President Bush, just as he promised he would, has restored honor and integrity to the White House and united us as Americans

I also believe the following charts are a communist conspiracy, even though they are displaying the true exit poll and final tally results.

Furthermore, I believe this chart is another conspiracy by long-haired, bare-foot lefties, who should all be put against the wall and shot, after being used for bayonet practice.

State Avg. IQ 2004

1 Connecticut 113 Kerry

2 Massachusetts 111 Kerry

3 New Jersey 111 Kerry

4 New York 109 Kerry

5 Rhode Island 107 Kerry

6 Hawaii 106 Kerry

7 Maryland 105 Kerry

8 New Hampshire 105 Kerry

9 Illinois 104 Kerry

10 Delaware 103 Kerry

11 Minnesota 102 Kerry

12 Vermont 102 Kerry

13 Washington 102 Kerry

14 California 101 Kerry

15 Pennsylvania 101 Kerry

16 Maine 100 Kerry

17 Virginia 100 Bush

18 Wisconsin 100 Kerry

19 Colorado 99 Bush

20 Iowa 99 Bush

21 Michigan 99 Kerry

22 Nevada 99 Bush

23 Ohio 99 Bush

24 Oregon 99 Kerry

25 Alaska 98 Bush

26 Florida 98 Bush

27 Missouri 98 Bush

28 Kansas 96 Bush

29 Nebraska 95 Bush

30 Arizona 94 Bush

31 Indiana 94 Bush

32 Tennessee 94 Bush

33 North Carolina 93 Bush

34 West Virginia 93 Bush

35 Arkansas 92 Bush

36 Georgia 92 Bush

37 Kentucky 92 Bush

38 New Mexico 92 Bush

39 North Dakota 92 Bush

40 Texas 92 Bush

41 Alabama 90 Bush

42 Louisiana 90 Bush

43 Montana 90 Bush

44 Oklahoma 90 Bush

45 South Dakota 90 Bush

46 South Carolina 89 Bush

47 Wyoming 89 Bush

48 Idaho 87 Bush

49 Utah 87 Bush

50 Mississippi 85 Bush

Lastly, I believe we should impliment the following and enshrine them in our glorious comstitution.

Bring back slavery and take away racial minorities' and women's right to vote.

Criminalize homosexuality, being Arab, and having Democratic or "librul" views.

Make it a law that everyone must be a Christian, have their foreheads branded with a cross and watch Mel Gibson's The Passion of the Christ every night before sleeping.

Outlaw abortions so that even women who get raped have to carry those children. And if women die during child birth, well, that's just God's will, right?

Do away with environmental regulations so they can drink more polluted water, breathe more contaminated air, live next to nuclear power plants and gain higher rates of cancer.

Do away with taxes on the rich and big businesses and impose higher taxes on the middle class to fund their invasions of other countries.

Outlaw unions and minimum wage and child labor laws so companies can go back to paying kids ten cents an hour to slave away 12 hours a day.

Do away with companies paying for health insurance but keep a few clinics around where lower income people go, while making established hospitals only for the wealthy.

Do away with Social Security, Medicare, Medicaid, welfare and any social program that helps needy people.

Pull out of the UN, break all international treaties and start any ###### war they please.

Bring back public hangings on courthouse steps that must be watched by every citizen, including children.

Implement Big Brother cameras everywhere to spy on people, even in their own homes.

God Save Our Magnificent Preznid - May He Rule Forever.

you conspiratal nut job, commie, nazi.

sorry i was taken over by the spirit of georgie porgie

you conspiratal nut job, commie, nazi.   

sorry i was taken over by the spirit of georgie porgie 

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Have another.

Forgot to add at the bottom.

I am deeply indebted to "Michael Dare" for his help in bringing me to a true redemption.

Dooby Dooby Doo - Save us All.

One for the price of two for the next four years. Braize the man!

Total US National Debt as at 08th November 23:59:03 was a mere $7,437,054,834,146.98 - Braize the man!

The estimated population of the United States is 294,747,521 - so each citizen's share of this debt is a mere $25,231.95.

Braize the man!

Dubya Uber Alles

Braize the man!

US National Debt Clock is running HERE.

Braize the man!

Dubya Uber Alles

Braize the man!

you conspiratal nut job, commie, nazi.   

sorry i was taken over by the spirit of georgie porgie 

Have another.

Forgot to add at the bottom.

I am deeply indebted to "Michael Dare" for his help in bringing me to a true redemption.

Dooby Dooby Doo - Save us All.

One for the price of two for the next four years. Braize the man!

Total US National Debt as at 08th November 23:59:03 was a mere $7,437,054,834,146.98 - Braize the man!

The estimated population of the United States is 294,747,521 - so each citizen's share of this debt is a mere $25,231.95.

Braize the man!

Dubya Uber Alles

Braize the man!

US National Debt Clock is running HERE.

Braize the man!

p1p~

Boy oh boy! Do admire your spirit of tenacity!

Spend a little time on those two posts, did you? Man, you are obsessed with the election and that's not healthy! Only four, count 'em, four years to go and by that time you and the Gent may run out of steam on this subject!

On the fly here so I'll refer you to that NY Times article again with the addendum that there was no conspiracy or fraud or anything else other than the will of the people acting on November 2nd.!

To be continued... :)http://www.nytimes.com/2004/11/06/opinion/06brooks.html?ex=1257483600&en=b4613533d9a1bdde&ei=5090&partner=rssuserland

For all you Lemmings of the Left, (& you know who you are) - not a bad read...

How Not To Win Red AmericaBy George F. Will

Tuesday, November 9, 2004; Page A27

In 2000 Americans were reminded that electoral votes select presidents. In 2004 Democrats were reminded that Bruce Springsteen does not. Other Nov. 2 epiphanies include:

In 1984 Walter Mondale's running mate was Rep. Geraldine Ferraro, a Catholic woman from New York. Ronald Reagan carried Catholics, women, New York -- and even Ferraro's district. Vice presidential nominees rarely sway this or that national demographic group. However, a running mate should help carry his or her state. But last week Bush carried North Carolina, getting 295,026 more votes than in 2000, and carried John Edwards's home county, as he did four years ago. Edwards was supposed to cut Bush's appeal in rural America. He did not.

On election night, news organizations were hesitant to call a winner in Ohio, where Bush led all night and won by 136,483 votes. They were less hesitant about calling Pennsylvania, where Kerry led all night and won by only 127,927 votes.

Republicans should send a thank-you note to San Francisco's mayor, Gavin Newsom -- liberalism's George Wallace, apostle of "progressive" lawlessness. He did even more than the Supreme Judicial Court of Massachusetts to energize the 11 state campaigns to proscribe same-sex marriage.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/ac2/wp-dyn/A...anguage=printer

Some may see that photo as racist.

Some may see that photo as racist.

Fail to see how?

I don't know. A black baby crying while Bush and Brother Bush laugh at all the Floridian (Floridean?) black people they shat on. Or perhaps....it's a white baby and I should get back on my meds.

I don't know.  A black baby crying while Bush and Brother Bush laugh at all the Floridian (Floridean?) black people they shat on.  Or perhaps....it's a white baby and I should get back on my meds.

Looks like a young Colon Powell to me.

(I know that's not how you spell his name but that's how they pronounce it)

Swet Jesus you're right! That is the spitting image of Conan 'Late show the barbarian' Powell

Swet Jesus you're right! That is the spitting image of Conan 'Late show the barbarian' Powell

Naw..it's the animation that makes the nose appear bigger.

I am BORN AGIN. Braize the MAN.

I have TRULY seen the Light

I believe in President George W. Bush.

p1p~

I knew you'd come around to some clear objective thinking with time but didn't expect it so soon!

A little something I ran across by Tom Wolfe to pass your way...

The liberal elite showed it was way out of touch even before the election. I was at a dinner party in New York and when everyone was wondering what to do about Bush I suggested they might do like me and vote for him. There was silence around the table, as if I’d said “by the way, I haven’t mentioned this before but I’m a child molester”.

Now, like Chicken Licken after an acorn fell on his head, they think the sky is falling. I have to laugh. It reminds me of Pauline Kael, the film critic, who said, “I don’t know how Reagan won — I don’t know a soul who voted for him.” That was a classic and reflects the reaction of New York (and elsewhere) intellectuals now. Note my definition of “intellectual” here is what you often find in this city: not people of intellectual attainment but more like car salesmen, who take in shipments of ideas and sell them on.

(italics mine)

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/article/0,,20...47653_1,00.html

boon me , theonion is a satirical ezine.

this is why the world is worried about the americans....this evangalical born again trend has the potential to be as bad as muslim fundamental fanaticism. Examine your patriot act and muse on how it could be implemented.

g0d says NO

UN nears stem cell showdown

From correspondents in the United Nations

November 12, 2004

TALKS at the United Nations appear to have failed to avert a new UN confrontation over a US-led drive to ban all cloning of human embryos including for stem cell research, diplomats said today

http://www.theaustralian.news.com.au/commo...55E1702,00.html

boon me , theonion is a satirical ezine.

this is why the world is worried about the americans....this evangalical born again trend has the potential to be as bad as muslim fundamental fanaticism. Examine your patriot act and muse on how it could be implemented.

g0d says NO

UN nears stem cell showdown

From correspondents in the United Nations

November 12, 2004

TALKS at the United Nations appear to have failed to avert a new UN confrontation over a US-led drive to ban all cloning of human embryos including for stem cell research, diplomats said today

http://www.theaustralian.news.com.au/commo...55E1702,00.html

stumonster~

I'm aware of it being a satirical 'zine but was hoping p1p would bite. Now you've ruined the wind-up!

To calm your fears, not all you hear in the press is "end-of-the-world" right-wing church-crazed fanatics running amok in America.

Cool heads do prevail...

Cool heads do prevail...

the recent nationwide survey seemed to indicate the majority of the american public are more concerned about homosexual marriage than the ability of a bureaucrat to lock you up in a concentration camp with out any recourse to anything, under the patriot act.

Braize the man!

Dubya Uber Alles

Braize the man!

They can't leave our hero alone, can they?

KERRY WON OHIO

JUST COUNT THE BALLOTS AT THE BACK OF THE BUS

In These Times

Friday, November 12, 2004

Most voters in Ohio chose Kerry. Here's how the votes vanished.

This February, Ken Blackwell, Ohio's Secretary of State, told his State Senate President, "The possibility of a close election with punch cards as the state's primary voting device invites a Florida-like calamity." Blackwell, co-chair of Bush-Cheney reelection campaign, wasn't warning his fellow Republican of disaster, but boasting of an opportunity to bring in Ohio for Team Bush no matter what the voters wanted. And most voters in Ohio wanted JFK, not GWB. But their choice won't count because their votes won't be counted.

The ballots that add up to a majority for John Kerry in Ohio -- and in New Mexico -- are locked up in two Republican hidey-holes: "spoiled" ballots and "provisional" ballots.

OHIO SPOILED ROTTEN

American democracy has a dark little secret. In a typical presidential election, two million ballots are simply chucked in the garbage, marked "spoiled" and not counted. A dive into the electoral dumpster reveals something special about these votes left to rot. In a careful county-by-county, precinct-by-precinct analysis of the Florida 2000 race, the US Civil Rights Commission discovered that 54% of the votes in the spoilage bin were cast by African-Americans. And Florida, Heaven help us, is typical. Nationwide, the number of Black votes "disappeared" into the spoiled pile is approximately one million. The other million in the no-count pit come mainly from Hispanic, Native-American and poor white precincts, a decidedly Democratic demographic.

Ohio Republicans, simultaneously in charge of both the Bush-Cheney get-out-the-vote drive and the state's vote-counting rules, doggedly and systematically insured the spoilage pile would be as high as the White House.

Vote spoilage comes in two flavors. There are "overvotes" -- too many punches in the cards -- and "undervotes." Here we find the hanging, dimpled and "pregnant" chads created by old, dysfunctional punch card machines, in which the bit of paper covering the hole doesn't fall out, but hangs on. Machines can't read these, but we humans, who know a hole when we see one, have no problem reading these cards ... if allowed to. This is how Katherine Harris defeated Al Gore, by halting the hand count of the spoiled punch cards not, as is generally believed, by halting a "recount."

Whose chads are left hanging? In Florida in 2000 federal investigators determined that Black voters' ballots spoiled 900% more often than white voters, mainly due to punch card error. Ohio Republicans found those racial odds quite attractive. The state was the only one of fifty to refuse to eliminate or fix these vote-eating machines, even in the face of a lawsuit by the ACLU.

Apparently, the Ohio Republicans like what the ACLU found. The civil rights group's expert testimony concluded that Ohio's cussed insistence on forcing 73% of its electorate to use punch card machines had an "overwhelming" racial bias, voiding votes mostly in Black precincts. Blackwell doesn't disagree; and he hopes to fix the machinery ... sometime after George Bush's next inauguration. In the meantime, the state's Attorney General Jim Petro, a Republican, strategically postponed the trial date of the ACLU case until after the election.

Fixing a punch card machine is cheap and easy. If Ohio simply placed a card-reading machine in each polling station, as Michigan did this year, voters could have checked to ensure their vote would tally. If not, they would have gotten another card.

Blackwell knows that. He also knows that if those reading machines had been installed, almost all the 93,000 spoiled votes, overwhelmingly Democratic, would have closed the gap on George Bush's lead of 136,000 votes.

JIM CROW'S PROVISIONAL BALLOT

Add to the spoiled ballots a second group of uncounted votes, the 'provisional' ballots, and -- voila! -- the White House would have turned Democrat blue.

But that won't happen because of the peculiar way provisional ballots are counted or, more often, not counted. Introduced by federal law in 2002, the provisional ballot was designed especially for voters of color. Proposed by the Congressional Black Caucus to save the rights of those wrongly scrubbed from voter rolls, it was, in Republican-controlled swing states, twisted into a back-of-the-bus ballot unlikely to be tallied.

Unlike the real thing, these ballots are counted only by the whimsy and rules of a state's top elections official; and in Ohio, that gives a virtually ballot veto to Secretary of State Blackwell.

Mr. Blackwell has a few rules to make sure a large proportion of provisional ballots won't be counted. For the first time in memory, the Secretary of State has banned counting ballots cast in the "wrong" precinct, though all neighborhoods share the same President.

Over 155,000 Ohio voters were shunted to these second-class ballots. The election-shifting bulge in provisional ballots (more than 3% of the electorate) was the direct result of the national Republican strategy that targeted African-American precincts for mass challenges on election day.

This is the first time in four decades that a political party has systematically barred -- in this case successfully -- hundreds of thousands of Black voters from access to the voting booth. While investigating for BBC Television, we obtained three dozen of the Republican Party's confidential "caging" lists, their title for spreadsheets listing names and addresses of voters they intended to block on any pretext.

We found that every single address of the thousands on these Republican hit lists was located in Black-majority precincts. You might find that nasty and racist. It may also be a crime.

Before 1965, Jim Crow laws in the Deep South did not bar Blacks from voting. Rather, the segregationist game was played by applying minor technical voting requirements only to African-Americans. That year, Congress voted to make profiling and impeding minority voters, even with a legal pretext, a criminal offence under the Voting Rights Act.

But that didn't stop the Republicans of '04. Their legally questionable mass challenge to Black voters is not some low-level dirty tricks operation of local party hacks. Emails we obtained show the lists were copied directly to the Republican National Committee's chief of research and to the director of a state campaign.

Many challenges center on changes of address. On one Republican caging list, 50 addresses changed from Jacksonville to overseas, African-American soldiers shipped Over There.

You don't have to guess the preferences registered on the provisional ballots. Republicans went on a challenging rampage, while Democrats pledged to hold to the tradition of letting voters vote.

Blackwell has said he will count all the "valid" provisional ballots. However, his rigid regulations, like the new guess-your-precinct rule, are rigged to knock out enough voters to keep Bush's skinny lead alive. Other pre-election maneuvers by Republican officials -- late and improbably large purges of voter rolls, rejection of registrations -- maximized the use of provisional ballots which will never be counted. For example, a voter wrongly tagged an ineligible "felon" voter (and there's plenty in that category, mostly African-Americans), will lose their ballot even though they are wrongly identified.

KERRY BLACKS OUT

It was heartening that, during his campaign, John Kerry broke the political omerta that seems to prohibit public mention of the color of votes not counted in America. "Don't tell us that in the strongest democracy on earth a million disenfranchised African Americans is the best we can do." The Senator promised the NAACP convention, "This November, we're going to make sure that every single vote is counted."

But this week, Kerry became the first presidential candidate in history to break a campaign promise after losing an election. The Senator waited less than 24 hours to abandon more than a quarter million Ohio voters still waiting for their provisional and chad-spoiled ballots to be counted.

While disappointing, I can understand the cold calculus against taking the fight to the end. To count the ballots, Kerry's lawyers would, first, have to demand a hand reading of the punch cards. Blackwell, armed with the Supreme Court's Bush v. Gore diktat, would undoubtedly pull a "Kate Harris" by halting or restricting a hand count. Most daunting, Kerry's team would also, as one state attorney general pointed out to me, have to litigate each and every rejected provisional ballot in court. This would entail locating up to a hundred thousand voters to testify to their right to the vote, with Blackwell challenging each with a holster full of regulations from the old Jim Crow handbook.

Given the odds and the cost to his political career, Kerry bent, not to the will of the people, but to the will to power of the Ohio Republican machine.

We have yet to total here the votes lost in missing absentee ballots, in eyebrow-raising touch screen tallies, in purges of legal voters from registries and other games played in swing states. But why dwell on these things? Our betters in the political and media elite have told us to get over it, move on.

To the victors go the spoils of electoral class war. As Ohio's politically ambitious Secretary of State brags on his own website, "Last time I checked,” Blackwell said, “Katherine Harris wasn't in a soup line, she's in Congress."

NEW MEXICO GOES KERRY - BUT WHO'S COUNTING?

Why single out Ohio? So it also went in New Mexico where ballots of Hispanic voters (two-to-one Kerry supporters) spoil at a rate five times that of white voters. Add in the astounding 13,000 provisional ballots in the Enchanted State -- handed out "like candy" to Hispanic, not white, voters according to a director of the Catholic Church's get-out-the-vote drive -- and Kerry wins New Mexico. Just count up the votes ... but that won't happen.

Investigative reporter Greg Palast is author of The Best Democracy Money Can Buy (Penguin 2004).

Braize the man!

Dubya Uber Alles

Braize the man!

Fair gave me a headache reading that there post......

They had to throw Kerry a bone or two. It's all a complete joke. America is at a critical turning point in its nationhood. If the people and law makers, both Democrat and Republican, allow this election to stand, then they will have allowed true dictatorship to reign. If they stand up and demand justice, then things will change. If the Green Party or Democrat parties voice up and demand investigations, nobody is going to listen and nobody is going to care. It will take Republicans, who are fully aware of how the country has been hijacked by lunatic neo freaks, to demand investigations and indictments. They have to save the country from themselves.

apparently the one true g0d is a white boy.

mindless freedom is all you require.

right, now back on your heads.

Fair gave me a headache reading that there post......

Me too.

Sad thing is p1p & mbkudu may be serious with their position...

stumonster sees some humor in this whole thing!

They had to throw Kerry a bone or two. It's all a complete joke. America is at a critical turning point in its nationhood. If the people and law makers, both Democrat and Republican, allow this election to stand, then they will have allowed true dictatorship to reign. If they stand up and demand justice, then things will change. If the Green Party or Democrat parties voice up and demand investigations, nobody is going to listen and nobody is going to care. It will take Republicans, who are fully aware of how the country has been hijacked by lunatic neo freaks, to demand investigations and indictments. They have to save the country from themselves.

I'm sorry to say this, but I think you're in denial. Bush likely won the election fair and square. I think you can't come to terms with this one thing: how bloody stupid your fellow countrymen are. Over 50 percent of the population voted this retard in...for a second time no less! This is what hurts.

I think it is a combination of stupidity (brainwashing) and a gross manipulation of the election system. One of the four CIA men who resigned 5 days ago was just on 60 Minutes and openly stated that the administration has deliberately undermined the safety of the US by consistently allowing Osama Bin Ladin to remain free. In other words, 911 COULD HAVE been avoided if the CIA was allowed to do its job. A pity. Yes, it is a case of mass stupidity and much more.

A Legitimate Recount Effort in Ohio

An effort led by Common Cause and the Alliance for Democracy is underway in Ohio to conduct a statewide recount.

Efforts to launch an official statewide recount of the Ohio presidential vote are underway. While it's unclear if a recount will result in a Kerry victory, it's likely to highlight many flaws in Ohio elections that may have tilted results toward Republicans and against Democrats.

Common Cause of Ohio and the Alliance for Democracy, a progressive coalition, Thursday announced they were launching a recount campaign for Ohio. Columbus, Ohio attorney Cliff Arnebeck, who represents both groups, said both the Green Party and Libertarian Party presidential candidates would seek a recount if the $110,000 filing fee could be raised. "Common Cause and the Alliance for Democracy are not partisan. The purpose of the recount is to verify the honesty of the process," Arnebeck said. "That is in the interest of anyone who would be declared the winner."

A coalition of progressive groups will hold a public hearing on election abuses this Saturday in Columbus calling on the Kerry campaign to pay for the recount. Meanwhile, they have created a Web page to collect donations at the Alliance for Democracy site. The Kerry campaign reportedly was sending lawyers to Ohio to look into election irregularities, but Arnebeck said only the public interest groups were now committed to a recount.

While there have been many accounts of problems associated with the Ohio vote, from reports of 90,000 spoiled ballots, to software glitches resulting in more votes tallied than the number of registered voters, to new voters not being notified where their polling places were, to too few voting machines in Democratic strongholds, the only legal process that could immediately address some of these concerns is a recount.

The recount would be just that: a recounting of all the votes cast. If the results change, meaning more votes are added to Kerry's total – then the official result, what the secretary of state certifies, is changed.

"It's re-certified," Arnebeck said. "If Kerry emerges victorious, he's president." Of course, a certification in Kerry's favor for Ohio won't take away the fact that Bush won the popular vote by 3.5 million votes.

And the clock is ticking on the Ohio process. In coming days, the Ohio secretary of state is expected to announce that the provisional ballots have been counted. A losing candidate for president then has 5 days to request a recount, filing the paperwork and filing fee. That cost is $10 per precinct, which comes to slightly more than $110,000. As of Friday morning, $35,000 had been raised. There is a possibility that not all Ohio counties will finish the provsional ballot count, which would prompt those seeking the recount to pursue other actions, Arnebeck said.

In Florida in 2000, before the Supreme Court interceded in the election outcome, there was no statewide recount conducted. A coalition of newspapers later analyzed the vote, in essence, doing their own recount. They found Al Gore had won. That result was spun by those defending George W. Bush, however, saying that the smaller number of counties where Gore wanted a recount would not have made Gore president.

There is a big difference between this effort and what Bev Harris and Black Box Voting are doing. That group, which is investigating computer voting fraud, is making Freedom of Information Act requests. That does not have the force of law behind it to change election results, unless it is entered as evidence in litigation sparked by a recount. The recount sought by the Ohio groups can revise the official state count.

There are three new areas where votes can come from in Ohio: absentee ballots, provisional ballots, and computer errors. Arnebeck said he has evidence how in one rural county more computer votes were counted than there were registered voters. Arnebeck said that the issue has been referred to the FBI. Arnebeck also said that the provisional ballots are also thought to favor Kerry, adding that this week the Ohio Republican Secretary of State Ken Blackwell was issuing new orders to disqualify provisional ballots if the voter did not enter their dates of birth. That shows how political a supposedly mechanical process already has become.

On the other hand, there are aspects of Ohio's vote that a recount is not likely to resolve. Questions such as what happened to people who did not vote – because they never received notifications after registering by mail, or because of long lines and too few voting machines in their precincts, may not get addressed, as a recount is a formal procedure where local election officials redo the count.

In Franklin County, where Columbus is located, for example, there was a clear pattern of a shortage of voting machines in Democratic inner city precincts, where new registrations skyrocketed, compared to the more middle-class white, GOP-dominated suburbs. Deliberately putting too few machines would violate the national Voting Rights Act. But that's hard to prove – especially because the county's election supervisor has said all the local boards are bipartisan. On the other hand, Ohio activists point out that people with longtime GOP ties supervised the county's election.

Still, there are many things that a recount could yield – apart from the possibility of Kerry victory. There is a tremendous need for a plausible explanation of what actually happened on Election Day in Ohio. Kerry's Wednesday morning concession pre-empted that explanation.

"Many people are saying, why bother to do this? The answer is we have not gathered all the facts," Arnebeck said. "Until you recount the votes, and look at the possibility of a sophisticated computer fix, you cannot draw conclusions. Whatever it costs to properly analyze this is nothing in terms of enabling the country to move forward. They just have to raise the money to officially file the recount request. The case is ready."

By Steven Rosenfeld, November 12, 2004.

A Legitimate Recount Effort in Ohio

An effort led by Common Cause and the Alliance for Democracy is underway in Ohio to conduct a statewide recount.

Efforts to launch an official statewide recount of the Ohio presidential vote are underway. While it's unclear if a recount will result in a Kerry victory, it's likely to highlight many flaws in Ohio elections that may have tilted results toward Republicans and against Democrats.

Common Cause of Ohio and the Alliance for Democracy, a progressive coalition, Thursday announced they were launching a recount campaign for Ohio. Columbus, Ohio attorney Cliff Arnebeck, who represents both groups, said both the Green Party and Libertarian Party presidential candidates would seek a recount if the $110,000 filing fee could be raised. "Common Cause and the Alliance for Democracy are not partisan. The purpose of the recount is to verify the honesty of the process," Arnebeck said. "That is in the interest of anyone who would be declared the winner."

A coalition of progressive groups will hold a public hearing on election abuses this Saturday in Columbus calling on the Kerry campaign to pay for the recount. Meanwhile, they have created a Web page to collect donations at the Alliance for Democracy site. The Kerry campaign reportedly was sending lawyers to Ohio to look into election irregularities, but Arnebeck said only the public interest groups were now committed to a recount.

While there have been many accounts of problems associated with the Ohio vote, from reports of 90,000 spoiled ballots, to software glitches resulting in more votes tallied than the number of registered voters, to new voters not being notified where their polling places were, to too few voting machines in Democratic strongholds, the only legal process that could immediately address some of these concerns is a recount.

The recount would be just that: a recounting of all the votes cast. If the results change, meaning more votes are added to Kerry's total – then the official result, what the secretary of state certifies, is changed.

"It's re-certified," Arnebeck said. "If Kerry emerges victorious, he's president." Of course, a certification in Kerry's favor for Ohio won't take away the fact that Bush won the popular vote by 3.5 million votes.

And the clock is ticking on the Ohio process. In coming days, the Ohio secretary of state is expected to announce that the provisional ballots have been counted. A losing candidate for president then has 5 days to request a recount, filing the paperwork and filing fee. That cost is $10 per precinct, which comes to slightly more than $110,000. As of Friday morning, $35,000 had been raised. There is a possibility that not all Ohio counties will finish the provsional ballot count, which would prompt those seeking the recount to pursue other actions, Arnebeck said.

In Florida in 2000, before the Supreme Court interceded in the election outcome, there was no statewide recount conducted. A coalition of newspapers later analyzed the vote, in essence, doing their own recount. They found Al Gore had won. That result was spun by those defending George W. Bush, however, saying that the smaller number of counties where Gore wanted a recount would not have made Gore president.

There is a big difference between this effort and what Bev Harris and Black Box Voting are doing. That group, which is investigating computer voting fraud, is making Freedom of Information Act requests. That does not have the force of law behind it to change election results, unless it is entered as evidence in litigation sparked by a recount. The recount sought by the Ohio groups can revise the official state count.

There are three new areas where votes can come from in Ohio: absentee ballots, provisional ballots, and computer errors. Arnebeck said he has evidence how in one rural county more computer votes were counted than there were registered voters. Arnebeck said that the issue has been referred to the FBI. Arnebeck also said that the provisional ballots are also thought to favor Kerry, adding that this week the Ohio Republican Secretary of State Ken Blackwell was issuing new orders to disqualify provisional ballots if the voter did not enter their dates of birth. That shows how political a supposedly mechanical process already has become.

On the other hand, there are aspects of Ohio's vote that a recount is not likely to resolve. Questions such as what happened to people who did not vote – because they never received notifications after registering by mail, or because of long lines and too few voting machines in their precincts, may not get addressed, as a recount is a formal procedure where local election officials redo the count.

In Franklin County, where Columbus is located, for example, there was a clear pattern of a shortage of voting machines in Democratic inner city precincts, where new registrations skyrocketed, compared to the more middle-class white, GOP-dominated suburbs. Deliberately putting too few machines would violate the national Voting Rights Act. But that's hard to prove – especially because the county's election supervisor has said all the local boards are bipartisan. On the other hand, Ohio activists point out that people with longtime GOP ties supervised the county's election.

Still, there are many things that a recount could yield – apart from the possibility of Kerry victory. There is a tremendous need for a plausible explanation of what actually happened on Election Day in Ohio. Kerry's Wednesday morning concession pre-empted that explanation.

"Many people are saying, why bother to do this? The answer is we have not gathered all the facts," Arnebeck said. "Until you recount the votes, and look at the possibility of a sophisticated computer fix, you cannot draw conclusions. Whatever it costs to properly analyze this is nothing in terms of enabling the country to move forward. They just have to raise the money to officially file the recount request. The case is ready."

By Steven Rosenfeld, November 12, 2004.

p1p~

I'd hate to believe you're trolling here with this untenable position you are taking. The election was not "rigged", stolen, circumvented or conducted in a manner other than any than fair. You have to stop reading & believing all those wacko left-wing web sites and get back toward the middle a little bit, buddy!

It is just like you, Boon Mee, to counter a legitimate post with a cartoon. Good job!

It is just like you, Boon Mee, to counter a legitimate post with a cartoon. Good job!

mbkudu~

Sometimes a picture (cartoon) can speak much louder than words!

It's over! Why is anyone still beating this dead horse?

And, who's to say what constitutes a "legitimate" post around here anyway?

If p1p is quoting a specific source, let's see the link. Checked the Alliance for Democracy site and they certainly don't come to the conclusions the author of the article did.

Boon, the old adage, "Where there's smoke' there's fire" is sure to be relevant here in some way. There could not possibly be as many rumours, innuendos and reports of problems unless some, at least, were genuine. Surely it is in everybody’s interest, especially the President, who is currently believed by many to have cheated in some way in winning the election, if everything can be sorted out and the election proven beyond any shadow of doubt to have been fair and honest, or otherwise. It is the only way that critics can be silenced, unless you propose shooting them, or building concentration camps, a new American “Gulag”.

After all, we must not forget: Politics – Poli: Latin Many. Tics: Blood sucking parasites. A truly apt description for today’s goings-on internationally, not just in the US.

However you look at things, unless you are totally brainwashed and blinkered, you can not fail to see that there is a wealth of evidence to show that the political extreme Right could have been dishonest, indeed criminal in their handling of both this last election, and, possibly, the previous one. They are believed by many to have stolen the country, staged a bloodless coup d’etat if you will.

The second Bush administration will, almost certainly, be followed by another, even further to the Right. If the current stories are true, the future president will, like Bush, not be elected in a democratic fashion. He/She will instead, like Bush, have his presidency guaranteed by a small, criminal band of fanatics who control the voting process at local, state and federal level.

If we look at a worse case scenario: as long as this continues, if suspicions are borne out to be fact and nothing done to right the wrongs, then Gaia, my home, my planet, will suffer as the globe’s premier polluter pumps putrid poisons into her vital systems. (Intentional alliteration!)

Florida and the Caribbean island nations will find their infrastructure, agriculture and buildings destroyed by more frequent and powerful tropical storms. The Arctic and Antarctic will continue melting, ever faster, raising sea levels and making many island and low lying nations such as Bangladesh uninhabitable. The level of Ultra Violet reaching the surface of the Earth will continue to rise, leading to vast extinctions of susceptible animals. (Many species of amphibians have disappeared in the last few years; more have become too rare to survive.) My children, their children and grandchildren will need to cover up in the sunshine, like sufferers from Xeroderma Pigmentosum, the Children of the Moon. Insect vectored diseases will place all of the planets citizens at risk with more numerous and frequent, certainly worse new infections.

The Arctic and Antarctic wildernesses will be opened to big oil, polluted and destroyed like most of the rest of the planet.

Global agriculture will suffer greatly. Droughts, floods, insect plagues and extremes in weather will make cropping impossible over much of the earth.

Need I go on? Do you not think this is worth discussing? Or should I simply bend over and take it up the AR5E, without making my worries known or trying to teach my fellow citizens of the dangers of their errant ways.

There will always be some who are either far too blinkered in vision, or who lack the basic brainpower to truly consider, understand and respect views that differ from their own. Those, I am afraid, I have no time for. I hope however that my writings on this and other matters might, in some way, make somebody somewhere sit up and think a little bit. Then, perhaps, my children’s, children’s children might survive and might just have a planet on which life is possible.

Boon, the old adage, "Where there's smoke' there's fire" is sure to be relevant here in some way. There could not possibly be as many rumours, innuendos and reports of problems unless some, at least, were genuine. Surely it is in everybody’s interest, especially the President, who is currently believed by many to have cheated in some way in winning the election, if everything can be sorted out and the election proven beyond any shadow of doubt to have been fair and honest, or otherwise. It is the only way that critics can be silenced, unless you propose shooting them, or building concentration camps, a new American “Gulag”.

After all, we must not forget: Politics – Poli: Latin Many.  Tics: Blood sucking parasites. A truly apt description for today’s goings-on internationally, not just in the US.

However you look at things, unless you are totally brainwashed and blinkered, you can not fail to see that there is a wealth of evidence to show that the political extreme Right could have been dishonest, indeed criminal in their handling of both this last election, and, possibly, the previous one. They are believed by many to have stolen the country, staged a bloodless coup d’etat if you will.

The second Bush administration will, almost certainly, be followed by another, even further to the Right. If the current stories are true, the future president will, like Bush, not be elected in a democratic fashion. He/She will instead, like Bush, have his presidency guaranteed by a small, criminal band of fanatics who control the voting process at local, state and federal level.

If we look at a worse case scenario: as long as this continues, if suspicions are borne out to be fact and nothing done to right the wrongs, then Gaia, my home, my planet, will suffer as the globe’s premier polluter pumps putrid poisons into her vital systems. (Intentional alliteration!)

Florida and the Caribbean island nations will find their infrastructure, agriculture and buildings destroyed by more frequent and powerful tropical storms. The Arctic and Antarctic will continue melting, ever faster, raising sea levels and making many island and low lying nations such as Bangladesh uninhabitable. The level of Ultra Violet reaching the surface of the Earth will continue to rise, leading to vast extinctions of susceptible animals. (Many species of amphibians have disappeared in the last few years; more have become too rare to survive.) My children, their children and grandchildren will need to cover up in the sunshine, like sufferers from Xeroderma Pigmentosum, the Children of the Moon. Insect vectored diseases will place all of the planets citizens at risk with more numerous and frequent, certainly worse new infections.

The Arctic and Antarctic wildernesses will be opened to big oil, polluted and destroyed like most of the rest of the planet.

Global agriculture will suffer greatly. Droughts, floods, insect plagues and extremes in weather will make cropping impossible over much of the earth.

Need I go on? Do you not think this is worth discussing? Or should I simply bend over and take it up the AR5E, without making my worries known or trying to teach my fellow citizens of the dangers of their errant ways.

There will always be some who are either far too blinkered in vision, or who lack the basic brainpower to truly consider, understand and respect views that differ from their own. Those, I am afraid, I have no time for. I hope however that my writings on this and other matters might, in some way, make somebody somewhere sit up and think a little bit. Then, perhaps, my children’s, children’s children might survive and might just have a planet on which life is possible.

p1p~

My Goodness! What a Rant! Where does one start?

How about the Artic wilderness being opened to Big Oil. Sorry buddy, it still ain't gonna happen even with Bush in office. No matter the logic of drilling in the ANWAR, the bill won't clear Congress. Shame really, as all that's up there is a load of mosquitoes and a few caribou. Folks cried that the Alaska Pipeline would ruin the place too and nothing of the sort came about.

p1p - you really are taking all of the topics waaay too personally - actually doing a Chicken Little number in the extreme. Drought, floods, insect plagues have been the status quo for thousands of years. Let's cite one example where the climate was going to he11 recently.

Remember the Ozone Layer controversary? Don't hear too much about that one any more as the dern 'ol thing has gone and closed up again shielding us from UV radiation. Only thing is it was a natural occuring event but to listen to those who believed it was due to jet airplane contrails or the stuff that was in women's hairspray - modern life was creating a doomsday scenario.

On to one of your favorite themes: "Brainwashed & Blinkered"

The only folks who are now even remotely considering the validity of Kerry gaining the White House through an Ohio recount are the ...hate to use this term...Lunatic Fringe...no disrespect intended

MSM (mainstream media) isn't talking about it and you know Dan Blather on CBS News would be all over that one like a bad rash if the story had any accreditation. Some of us accept the facts which doesn't make one "brainwashed" or "blinkered". Only those who believe in conspiracies think the election was "stolen". You want an example of one that was legitimately stolen - the 1960 race where Mayor Daly of Chicago "arranged" for John Kennedy to win over Richard Nixon.

In conclusion, the smoke/fire analogy is stretching it a bit. There were sore losers after the yr 2000 election where Gore lost and real partisan feelings hurt this time too but that does not mitigate the fact Bush legimately won the Electoral vote then and both Electoral & popular vote this time.

Finally, sure you're not trolling here?

Monday's New York Times, page 1:

"American commanders said 38 service members had been killed and 275 wounded in the Falluja assault."

Monday's New York Times, page 11:

"The American military hospital here reported that it had treated 419 American soldiers since the siege of Falluja began."

Questions for the class:

1. If 275 soldiers were wounded in Falluja and 419 are treated for wounds, how many were shot on the plane ride to Germany?

2. We're told only 275 soldiers were wounded but 419 treated for wounds; and we're told that 38 soldiers died. So how many will be buried?

3. How long have these Times reporters been embedded with with military? Bonus question: When will they get out of bed with the military?

Monday's New York Times, page 1:

"The commanders estimated that 1,200 to 1,600 insurgents had been killed."

Monday's New York Times, page 11:

"Nowhere to be found: the remains of the insurgents that the tanks had been sent in to destroy. ...The absence of insurgent bodies in Falluja has remained an enduring mystery."

With thanks to Greg Palast.