Does Anyone Here Have Any Experience With A "goomantong"?

[submaniac]

Today, I was hanging out with my cousin, and we were talking about how my mother thinks one of my motorcycle jackets is haunted, and that there is a benevolent spirit connected with it. (That's another story, and another post). Anyways we got on the subject of the Thai "GoomanTong" (this is my approximation of the English alphabet spelling of the name (pronounced "Goo-man-Tong"). Sorry about the inprecise spelling, but it is a Thai word (combination of the words for "baby" or "child" and "gold"), and there is no English equivalent for the word. My aunt has several, and my brother had one. Alot of the members of my family have had experiences with it, and I am a firm believer that they are real.

Anyways, I thought it would be fun to post about it on this forum instead of about the usual fodder about politics, problems with bargirls, and the economy. Certain members on this forum fancy themselves experts on Thai culture, and knowledge about this particular subject will separate the wheat from the chaff. So if you are an 'expert' on Thai culture, then you should know what exactly it is I am talking about. For a few years now I was asking to see how I can obtain one.

And you will have some fun when you ask your Thai wife, TG, TBF, partner, friends, or coworkers what a "goomantong" is. I can almost guarantee that there first words will be "why are you asking about that"? Some Thais (my relatives) refuse to even discuss it because it is too frightening. The real fun will be if you ask how exactly a 'goomantong' is made.

For those of you that know, or find out, what this is, let's not be too hasty to spill the beans to everone else on this forum. (I.E. don't post about what it is and keep it to ourselves for a little bit.) For those that don't know what it is, know that it is very creepy, disturbing, frightening...and real.

[Crossy]

Well I know what one is, but I can't for the life of me understand why a foreigner would want one

If you really want one (and are prepared to look after it properly [more demanding than owning a dog]) the shops at Tha Phra Chan and behind Wat Rachanadda usually have them, they are hot sellers.

EDIT to remove spoiler

Edited October 19, 2008 by Crossy

[pampal]

it's nonsense superstition

[pumpuiman]

Spoiler alert. Don't click here if you want to remain clueless.

Some very interesting info on it's origins.

[lambretta]

I was told if a bars takings start to dip then the owner might first look to see if any of his/hers staff are pregnant and not said anything. The reason being that Goomantong is playing with the baby and not calling customers in.

Not really the answer is it, but hey who am I to judge Thai superstition!

[phaethon]

Well I know what one is, but I can't for the life of me understand why a foreigner would want one

Don't they do the washing up while you're out?

[CarlBkk]

Interesting stuff. In all my time here I have never heard of this. At first I thought you were going to talk about Lek Lai, which gets a similar response from Thais.

I might like to obtain one of these mysterious little things and take it back to UK with me to give to a paranormal group (consisting of mediums) without telling them anything, and see what they deduce.

[submaniac]

Interesting stuff. In all my time here I have never heard of this. At first I thought you were going to talk about Lek Lai, which gets a similar response from Thais.

I might like to obtain one of these mysterious little things and take it back to UK with me to give to a paranormal group (consisting of mediums) without telling them anything, and see what they deduce.

I have been wanting to find one for a while (though I do not know how useful it will be to falangs because the goomantong only speaks in Thai.) Some members of my family have them (more than one--so they can 'play' with each other), and other members of my family who have gone to the house that has one have reported 'experiences' with the goomantong. Like tickling their feet while they were resting on the couch, strange noises of children playing, and people speaking to them. (My cousin said while she was looking around for something at my aunt's house, a child's voice asked her what she was looking for.) I do believe they are real.

The hard part is finding a real one. There are alot of fakes, and not many monks/people know how to make a real one. Part of the power is that you have to 'capture' the spirit of a dead child. (This is the creepy part of making it I was talking about--some are actually made from the body of a dead child.) If you read the links, or know about the story, the first goomantong was made by 'roasting' the body of an actual dead child.

But you also have to be careful with one. Crossy is correct, there is alot of effort on the part of the person who has one. It is probably MORE demanding than having a dog. You have to feed it at least every day, make offerings, and tell it where you are going. Basically, you have to treat it if it is alive. The downside of the goomantong is if you do not take care of it, it/he can become restless, and if you really neglect it, it can turn on the owner. And unlike alot of Western superstitions, this ghost has the power to kill.

Another reason I think it is an interesting subject is that it is unique to Thailand. When I say that, I mean that unlike alot of cultural elements which are shared throughout countries of SE Asia (such as Buddhist beliefs). AFAIK, there is nothing similar in any of the other countries.

[mmushr00m]

I know what it is now. But I dont think its unique to just Thailand. I have heard ppl talking about it in HK. But these could be borrowed beliefs or stories that they have heard.

I have also heard similiar beliefs in M'sia. Growing up a child of expats in M'sia/Indo I often heard stories about it.

My wife tells me that her uncle or grand uncle had the knowledge/majick to make them. That he made one for the family. Wife said that when she was young she always had to offer food etc to a banana tree in the yard. The uncle use to make it for ppl who asked until one day he had an ephihany and overcomed by remorse about making such things he ran off to be a forest monk.

Edited October 20, 2008 by mmushr00m

[midasthailand]

it's nonsense superstition

Ha, Ha, pampal I bet you typed that with one hand while your other hand was behind your back with fingers crossed. Really Submaniac, I think your Thai half is taking charge of your US half. Prior to the book being written about the soldier/magician Phaen, it did not exist at all. So based on a work of literature a new benevolent/deadly spirit doll is born, spawning great sales for the monks that make them and false hope/unecessary fear for the uneducated that buy them. So you have decided that you can set the benchmark for knowledge of Thai culture based on Goomantong. Fortunately there is a lot more to Thai culture than childish superstition.

[Payboy]

[AmeriThai]

Basically, you have to treat it if it is alive. The downside of the goomantong is if you do not take care of it, it/he can become restless, and if you really neglect it, it can turn on the owner. And unlike alot of Western superstitions, this ghost has the power to kill.

You mean like this?

[PoorSucker]

กุมารทอง or "KUMAN THONG" is a baby spirit.

The first story related to "KUMAN THONG" was found in the Thai book "KHUN CHANG KHUN PAEN" (ขุนช้างขุนแผน).

The way to get a "KUMAN THONG" is quite horrible: one must get a dead fetus and burn it in order to obtain a small body.

Then dark incantations are cast to insert black magic inside.

The "KUMAN THONG" spirit is supposed to warn and protect his owner in case of danger.

The owner must also feed and protect it.

Nowadays "KUMAN THONG" are made of wood. It often represents a little child with a hair topcut.

If the owner doesn't take care of his "KUMAN THONG", power disappears from the statue.

A few years ago a monk addicted to black magic made a "KUMAN THONG" with a dead foetus. He was disrobed.

Source:ThaiWoldView

[Samuian]

I know what it is now. But I dont think its unique to just Thailand. I have heard ppl talking about it in HK. But these could be borrowed beliefs or stories that they have heard.

I have also heard similiar beliefs in M'sia. Growing up a child of expats in M'sia/Indo I often heard stories about it.

........edit....

As well as some Sufi/Hindu Traditions do know of similar spirits "Hazrat", Helpers in need but, the more often called and the requested help used, the more power they earn about the person calling them, so in turn the person "using" their powers, enslave themselves to these spirits!

There is a lesson there somewhere!