Where Best Location To Buy Bar In Thailand

[dmax]

hi i am seriously thinking of moving to los for good,well at least untill y money lasts,im no millionaire and ive no pension or any other money from home to fall back on.....ive looked at a few possibilities in issarn because thats where i want to livebut making a living up there is going to prove very difficult-impossible from what i hear...also ive heard so many horor stories about falang owning bars in thailand,it seems everyone loses thier money rite? ....im a little more optimistic about owning a bar /restraunt as i am about making money up north.....i have no choice as this country is driving me nuts,,everyday i dream oof living in los,,i like to wake in the morning with the sun on my face etc etc......i have been to los 13 times and speak a little thai lol or so im told!! anyway as i say where is best-most tourist area to buy bar or restraunt,,,pattaya has the single guys...throwing thier money about on bar girls for 2 weeks of the year,where as phuket has the family who still spend a lot of money but dont go near the lady bars...koh chang has the back packers who will spend very little.....i hear the tourism is down in pattaya but busuiness /bar owners in phuket are up on their yearly takings....i would love to hear from some of you guys who are in the know,,any advice would be much appreciated...im very serious about making the move,,i have 70,000 uk pounds to invest and am going to wait maybe at least 6-7 months before jumping in and wait for the pound to rise or the thai baht to fall....

thanks guys

[churchill]

You have to live in a location , 1 year plus , and do a lot of research before you consider buying . very very difficult in Phuket , Samui and pattaya to make money and not to loose everything you invested - I don't know about issan but also I would think very difficult .

[thaimate]

70000 pounds to invest? ime sure there are lots of us here in l.o.s who have many idias for you to make money, havnt we boys.

[sgunn65]

Be very careful. 70K will not go far and unless you have a lot of experience running a bar and doing business in Thailand I fear you could find your 70K gone very quickly.

Read all the forums about bar ownership and take on board the horror stories.

That said you can do well in business here. I came here 18 months ago with less and have a successful business established so I don't want to be the portend of doom. But tourism is down so that means less customers the pound is weak so that means less customers. And opening another bar just like all the others won't cut it. You need to be different. I have had a couple of ideas about bars that could work here that aren't currently being done. So if I can think of some you can too. Or PM me and I will let you have the ideas free!!

The other thing to remember is the only way to succeed is hard work. That means long hours so waking with the sun on your face and the prospect of a lazy day in paradise are going to be distant memories for quite some time.

Maybe you should look to see whether there are investment opportunities that will give you a return on your 70K whilst you save more. Or try and co,e up with a business idea that is different, does not rely on the tourist trade or Thai trade. They are out there, I know because i have done it.

[juniorboysown]

Wait until the house prices completely bottom out in the UK then buy a house cash rent it out and move over here. You will have your rent, bills, food paid from that and some left over. In the meantime think of a business that doesn't cost much money to start up and if it fails so what try again you haven't lost anything.

Do not invest 70 grand into a bar in Thailand get that out of your head... you could invest 5 grand marketing a website (correctly) that's more then enough, that would top up your income, you could start to learn that now it takes 6 months to a year to do it the right way anyhow, then you can put as much sun on your face as you wanted instead of looking tired, pasty and miserable which is what you will end up like running a bar here.

Be smart and think of what would happen if you lost all your 70 grand you will NEVER EVER get that back again, don't put yourself in that position.

[khundon]

Here is what you do pal

Take your 70 grand, put it on the floor, take a match and set fire to it, and watch it burn.

The resulting fire, will last longer than your bar will, anywhere in LOS.

And you will have a pile of ashes left over, which is more than you will have left of your bar.

Stay in Ireland, at least you will get handouts and some state aid, you get Sweet FA here, and if you blow your 70k, what are you going to do then? walk back to Ireland!

Use the 70k to holiday every year here, but DO NOT, REPEAT, DO NOT BUY A BAR.

Bottoms up.

[taxexile]

hi i am seriously thinking of moving to los for good,well at least untill y money lasts,im no millionaire and ive no pension or any other money from home to fall back on.....

....i have no choice as this country is driving me nuts,,everyday i dream oof living in los,,i like to wake in the morning with the sun on my face etc etc......

i have 70,000 uk pounds to invest

forget the bar , try to get your other brain cell working properly and then go into stand up comedy , you'll make a fortune.

[steelepulse]

I've been considering setting up a "future bar owners" insurance policy and that is to exact half of what you want to invest into a bar upon arriving in Thailand.  I'll hold your money for 1 or two years, then upon your leaving broke, I'll give you half of your insurance premium back.  This plan would surely work well for all wanna be bar and restaurant owners. Everyone would come out ahead except for the jilted gf of the broke bar owner.

[neverdie]

I must admit that I once thought about owning a bar, the thought lasted for about 2 seconds at which time I gave myself a massive uppercut....if you could pool up just 10% of the money lost in los bars YOU would be able to bail the US out of its financial troubles

[angiud]

Please, don't open a bar! You'll loose your money (anyway a 70.000 pound is quite a money!)

Why don't you think something else, if you really want to move to Thailand? Something like a restaurant, a guesthouse, etc etc?? It's difficult as well, but with some more hope. Don't mess to much with girls and alcool, work hard, seriously, ready to criticize yourself for the mistakes, wait some year and at that point you should have a fairly good business.

Good luck, and think good what you doing!

[patklang]

Forget it,but maybe think about a bar in Buriram or somewhere that has plenty of farangs.do your homework and you have to travel there,go on the Buriram,khon kaen etc websites/forums and ask questions.

[jackdanielsesq]

A bunch of folks think they need to buy a green grocer because they eat watermelons a couple times per year. Aint so.

Keep your money and your job - ad another zero to your capital and by then you will have figured its smarter to keep on doing what you do best.

Then come to the LOS on vacations - enjoy it to its fullest - maybe every 3 months!!

I made a lot of money and took a sabbatical - after 6 months I went nuts & went back to work

There is only so much Champagne & Steak one can consume every day. I spent $1,000.00 cash every day on junk.

$100k will buy you a used car and no gas.

Keep the dream alive and work hard, pray harder, then work smart.

Bar ownership is a loser - period.

Ask the watermelons.

BR>Jack

[RAZZELL]

Some people make a lot of money with a bar. But they are invariably Thai and have had it for 20 years

Although The Islanders in Phuket and Koh Samui make a lot of money.

Koh Chang only has a 6 month season. A Thai gf of mine had a bar there and it was impossible to get staff...and even harder to get customers!

If you just want the lifestyle...what do you do in your home country? Could you not do it in LOS?

Alternatively, rent a guest house/hotel on a long lease and add some value to enable a higher room rate. It still amazes me how many few small hotels don't have

free wi-fi etc.

RAZZ

[keestha]

Rather than buying a bar, rent premises and fit them out as a bar yourself. Be aware that a rent contract in Thailand is always for a limited period of time, and when the lease expires, you might loose everything. Don't rely on options to renew the lease, often the contract in Thai will state that the lease can be extended if the two parties agree, in other words you cannot count on the extension.

And most important......spend one night in a bar, keep your eyes off the ladies, and just keep track exactly how much turnover they make. You will see it is a joke compared with the turnover a neighbourhood bar in your native country makes, and it still would be if the drinks prices in Thailand would be the same as in your native country.

Location is of the utmost important for a tourist oriented bar or restaurant. The few steps into that side street will kill you.

Edited February 17, 2009 by keestha

[Mattchu9999]

Well dmax, I hope you learned your lesson about asking for advice on these forums.

So far, I count only 3 posts out of 14 in response to your question that actually try to give you some positive advice.

You'd have better chance at operating a successful bar in LOS then getting a straight answer on these forums

There are plenty of people on these forums that have all the reasons in the world why something wont work, yet it's neigh impossible for them to come up with ways something will work.

Take a poll of the responders, how many do you think have actually owned a bar? How many have actually owned any sort of business? (and of those was the business actually successful?)

I'll give you my 2 cents or pence or whatever tiny denomination of advice you want to correlate it to.

I have owned a bar back in the states. Does that qualify me as an expert on owning a bar in LOS? NO.

But I can throw some advice your way that may help you determine if that's what you want to do.

1) Come to LOS with expectations of yourself, but have none of the country or its people...be open minded, with an understanding your in their country and will have to play by their rules.

2) The rules/laws in LOS apply differently to different people. One rule that seems to be true more than any other is the goledn rule: he whom has the gold makes the rules.

3) Corruption is a part of life here so factor that in to your thinking and your balance sheet, it may or may not be a cost of doing business.

4) When researching a potantial purchase of an existing bar, or starting one remember a very important rule: Your get what you INSPECT not what you EXPECT. Dont rely on financials provided by a seller, nor by any sorts of proof anyone involved provides. Remember you get what you INSPECT which means if your looking to by an existing bar, you sit across the street or in the bar itself, and count the patrons EVERY NIGHT from start to close....how many drinks serverd (on average), who's buying what or playing what games...you must do this for at the very least a full week so you get an idea of the traffic.

5) Controll. What controlls can you put in place to ensure your know whos got whos hands in your cookie jar. Are you willing to be there every night working (not drinking or partying it up)? Cameras on the registers/tills? What type of ownership entity are you going to have for the bar? Perhaps you need to structure your investment as a loan so that you have a surviving lein on the property or business should something amiss happen. Tax laws and consequences etc. Alcohol.... is you bar tender(s) wasting bottles? How much are they pouring per drink? Are they selling under the table?

At a bar association gathering I went to back in the states, one of the speakers told a story of his being unable to figure out how he was losing money in one of his bars. He hired an investigator whom sat in the bar every night. The investigator came back with nothing....he said "Your bar tender puts the cash from every sale in one of the three cash registers, I cant figure it out" That was the scam....there we're only 2 cash registers in the bar... the third one was one brought in by the bar tender.

You will have to assume because it's Thailand, your employes will try to rip you off. No, that does not mean that they will....there are plenty of storys of exemplorary Thai employess whom would bend over backwards to do good, but assuming the opposite of your employes stealing, will gaurntee you wont catcth them if they do.

Learn to test your employees. Greed is a powerful weapon you can use to root out potential theives.

Owning a bar is work, and so you need to search your sould to find out if you can have fun watching others have fun in your establishment while you consentrate on running it and providing a fun atmosphere. This is key. I had fun watching others have fun knowing I was making money.

Good luck, and remember the old war addage, "The more you bleed in training the less you bleed in battle" Do your research....you can never do enough.

[johnnyk]

555

[citizen33]

Sadly, I think the people who say a bar is a sure way to lose money are right, certainly for BKK, Pattaya, the islands etc. I did wonder if the poster who suggested a town like Buriram, with a small captive expat clientelle, might have a point, providing that you are not expecting a big return. The problem with Buriram though is that it already has a couple of bars. Indeed there are farang-style bars or bar/restaurants in most Isaan cities, including Ubon, Udon, KK, Nong Khai, Sisaket and Roi Et. Martin at the FC in Surin seems to do very well (sponsor Isaan forum) and has successfully diversified his business down several paths. What I would be looking for is a medium-sized Isaan city that (a) does not already have a farang-style bar/restaurant, (b ) has a reasonable number of expats and (c ) also has a good-sized population of students who might want to sample something different. One that springs to mind is the city of Mahasarakham. Perhaps better to hang on to your 70K though.

Edited February 17, 2009 by citizen33

[chiangmaibruce]

I nominate Chinatown. This bar requires no work permit, employee hassles, landlord or maintenance problems, corruption payments - at least a 50% chance of profit or breakeven - and you can cash out & bail out with just a day's notice.

Edited February 17, 2009 by chiangmaibruce

[daveman]

Sorry no advice for you, Only in the same boat myself, would love to move form Ireland, to somewhere around Udon T

And I got nowhere neer 70grand. I thought i could sell my car and possisions (I dont own a house to sell)

I figured things are so cheap there, I could open a minimart or somthing like that. How much money would that take. And i couldnt own it in my own name right? are there 7-11 franchises or anything like that?

[Owain]

Get yourself a 7/11 franchise and you will make money for sure.

[ChiefMonkey]

The name of the place you are looking for is "no where".

Keep your money in your pocket.

[PhilHarries]

Well Mattchu9999 makes some very good points about running a bar and I'm not going to argue with any of them. I have never run a bar, worked in one yes - bluddy hard work it was - but never owned/run one.

However I have known a good few guys who did run bars in Thailand, note the use of the word did. Not one of them drove a fancy car, nor had a flash house, nor wore fancy clothes etc. What they did do was work bluddy hard every day from mid morning until the early hours of the following morning. Some were just bars, some were bars/restaurants and some were bars/guest houses/restaurants. What is their common denominator, apart from the hard work? None of them is still either in the business or in Thailand. In many cases the whole experience cured them completely of the Thailand rose tinted spectacle syndrome and some to the point where they are very bitter about the place.

Running a business of any kind is completely different from what you see when you are on holiday. Sure it appears to be great fun and a 24/7 party. But that only lasts for, if you are lucky, the tourist season. Then you have six to nine months of mind numbing boredom with no customers and that fridge of beer and it's continous subliminal message "Driiinnnnnkkkkk meeeeee". There lies another problem. Say you are successful and your bar gets a good farang trade throughout the day. Many farangs expect the bar owner to join them in a drink or two. Good for business you may think. Bad, though, for your state of health after you have sat with a few groups of them during the day, it's now 7pm and the bar is just gearing up for the evening and you are half pished. That now is bad for business as, apart from gaining an unwelcome reputation, you will not be alert to the scams your staff will almost certainly try to put over on you.

It is possible to open a successful bar in Thailand but, in my view, the single most important thing you will need, apart from a truckload of luck, is a Thai partner who you can trust 100% if not more. Without that you will for sure get shafted.

btw £70k is a lot of money to lose and the bar business in Thailand, irrespective of the positive vibes from Mattchu9999, is probably the quickest way to lose it unless you hit Vegas.

Good luck whichever road rises up to meet your feet.

[HankChinasky]

What a load of bullshit....

I know many foreigners who opened bars in Thailand and did, or still do pretty well.

Everybody was saying the same to me when I first came to Thailand and wanted to open my business (not a bar BTW)...

"It will fail, won't work, you'll lose everything" Giving me thousands of very good and convincing reasons why I shouldn't do it.

Good I didn't listened, 3 years later, I'm still in business, doing very well and will open another one next year, I make more money here than what I could expect in my home country and have a much better lifestyle.

The problem in Thailand is that there's so many farangs who have failed, been betrayed, are embittered and disappointed, that they feel the need to discourage anyone who want's to try anything.

What I would say to the OP is:

-Spend a few month in every place you consider opening a business before doing anything.

-Always keep some money on the side in case you fail and you have to go back to your home country (at least 50% of these 70'000 would be reasonable IMO)

-Read ThaiVisa, because even if there are loads of clueless peoples who spend 12h a day writing about things they don't know, there is also some very good infos.

-Don't trust anybody in terms of business here, get everything written down clearly, be as legal as you can.

If you do things properly, you can build a successful business in Thailand, you only have one life, don't listen to peoples telling you it's way better to keep a shitty job you don't like in your home country and go on with your 4 weeks of holiday/year 'til you retire.

Maybe good for them and not for you. In my case, I'm glad I didn't listened...

Good luck.

[JimSiam]

After trying to get a tooth fixed in Pattaya and going to the clinics along near tuk com in Pattaya and all of them been fully booked for like a week ahead I would say buy a dental clinic not a bar.

[PhilHarries]

Also beware of those that tell you "What a load of bullshit, I arrived in Thailand with 25 Stang in my pocket now I'm a multi millionaire". For sure these type exist but for the most part it is only in their imagination.

Of course it alll depends on what you want to do with your life and your £70k. If you are happy scratching out an existance going nowhere in a small backwater then a small bar may be the thing for you. Also a lot depends on your age, qualifications, skills and demeanour. Some people are naturally gregarious and outgoing and make good bar owners but some are miserable, bitter and twisted old sods that should have stayed the customer's side from which they can be barred.

The best bit of advice above is to leave sufficient of the money behind to start over should you change your mind or your venture goes belly up. If all goes well the money will still be there ( Insh Allah) and you can draw on it later.

[Briggsy]

Assuming your post is for real.

Go to a hardware store. Buy a small iron bar.

With the rest of your cash, invest wisely in 2 or 3 low-risk differing strategies such as government bonds or fixed-term deposits.

Do not buy a bar in Phuket or Pattaya because you will lose all your money.

[JimsKnight]

Given the world economy and possible depression that's looming I'd say anything to with bars is a shaky foundation.

Do your homework, recce the bar you want to go for and take it from there. Baby steps, not big ones and then see what you think.

[t.s]

do you have any bar/restaurant experience?

[mommysboy]

hi i am seriously thinking of moving to los for good,well at least untill y money lasts,im no millionaire and ive no pension or any other money from home to fall back on.....ive looked at a few possibilities in issarn because thats where i want to livebut making a living up there is going to prove very difficult-impossible from what i hear...also ive heard so many horor stories about falang owning bars in thailand,it seems everyone loses thier money rite? ....im a little more optimistic about owning a bar /restraunt as i am about making money up north.....i have no choice as this country is driving me nuts,,everyday i dream oof living in los,,i like to wake in the morning with the sun on my face etc etc......i have been to los 13 times and speak a little thai lol or so im told!! anyway as i say where is best-most tourist area to buy bar or restraunt,,,pattaya has the single guys...throwing thier money about on bar girls for 2 weeks of the year,where as phuket has the family who still spend a lot of money but dont go near the lady bars...koh chang has the back packers who will spend very little.....i hear the tourism is down in pattaya but busuiness /bar owners in phuket are up on their yearly takings....i would love to hear from some of you guys who are in the know,,any advice would be much appreciated...im very serious about making the move,,i have 70,000 uk pounds to invest and am going to wait maybe at least 6-7 months before jumping in and wait for the pound to rise or the thai baht to fall....

thanks guys

Well if you invest in a bar in Thailand you'll certainly wake up with the sun on your face as you'll very likely not have a roof over your head before too long.

Best to wait awhile as property prices could fall. Then buy a condo at a great price and hopefully then invest in a worthwhile business on the back of a stronger exchange rate and a Thai economic recovery in a couple of years time.

[dmax]

hey exile,,,wots so funny you fuc_kin prick ???